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View Full Version : Walking through the Lower East Side


MidtownGuy
March 25th, 2007, 03:24 PM
This thread will get ongoing photo updates and additions. I want to document this time of rapid change.

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MidtownGuy
March 25th, 2007, 03:25 PM
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^chinatown encroaches

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/178/430648478_94ee8ab8b4_b.jpg
^Blue rises above the proles.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/182/433741556_137fabb754_b.jpg
^The view, just down the street, from certain units in Blue, I guess.

MidtownGuy
March 25th, 2007, 03:25 PM
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ablarc
March 25th, 2007, 06:58 PM
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http://farm1.static.flickr.com/155/433725661_f787b601a0_b.jpg

Sprawling fatso. Corpulent outcome of height limits. This building is seriously out of scale: that has everything to do with footprint and nothing whatever to do with height.

This will destroy the fine grain and scale of the poor Lower East Side. And the irony of it is that the neighborhood thinks height limits are a good thing. As evidence like this to the contrary rolls in, cognitive dissonance will force them to the wrong conclusion that even greater height limitation is what's needed. In other words, they'll distort the observation ("this building is all wrong") to fit their mistaken theory ("tall buildings are bad").

The theory will survive, the neighborhood will continue its passage down the drain, and the misunderstanding will live on in people's minds to defile yet another neighborhood.

If you're committed to a delusion, no amount of evidence will shake that delusion. That's the meaning of cognitive dissonance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance


By contrast, a perfectly reasonable alternative for the neighborhood:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/154/433734028_e4d55960bc_b.jpg

^ Infinitely more contextual, though not a brick is to be seen.

.

ablarc
March 25th, 2007, 10:42 PM
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/151/433729873_91e22bf405_b.jpg

Amazing they would lavish so much ornament on what was essentially low-income housing. Will that day ever return?

Wait a minute! ... wasn't that the robber baron era?

Explanation?

* * *


Btw, especially looking forward to further installations of this particular chronicle, MidtownGuy. Your usual fine photography.

sfenn1117
March 25th, 2007, 10:58 PM
Great pics midtownguy, I look forward to the rest!

And as always ablarc, love the commentary.

pianoman11686
March 26th, 2007, 01:45 AM
Amazing they would lavish so much ornament on what was essentially low-income housing. Will that day ever return?

Wait a minute! ... wasn't that the robber baron era?

Explanation?

The robber baron era never really ended. It just took on different names. See CEO/executive pay, dealmaker, tycoon, mogul, and captain-of-industry.

ablarc
March 26th, 2007, 07:35 AM
The robber baron era never really ended. It just took on different names.
Then how come we don't build nicely ornamented low-income housing any more? ;)

ZippyTheChimp
March 26th, 2007, 08:22 AM
Amazing they would lavish so much ornament on what was essentially low-income housing. Will that day ever return?

Wait a minute! ... wasn't that the robber baron era?

Explanation?


.
Stock items.

From the Historic Districts Council:Style was not much of a consideration for tenement builders or owners. Usually it was not about keeping up with what was in fashion, but using whatever cornices, lintels, and other elements that were readily available. Early tenements from the 1860's show some signs of the Italianate style, while those built in the 1870's sometimes display Neo-Grec design. A few new law tenements show influence of the Beaux-Arts style. Typically the architects had little or no formal training and were of no particular note. On occasion, a well-connected, upper class property owner would hire someone well-known such as Trowbridge and Livingston or the prominent architect and housing reformer Ernest Flagg.

ablarc
March 26th, 2007, 08:39 AM
^ That explains why it cost not much, but it doesn't explain why the buildings were adorned to begin with. An unadorned building would have cost them less.

Since their altruism couldn't have been motivated by the promise of higher rents, it must have just been civic pride.

Whatever happened to that?

Sam Chang, are you listening?

ZippyTheChimp
March 26th, 2007, 10:13 AM
Maybe it was keeping up appearances. The money was made by what went on in the interior, construction costs being relatively insignificant in the 19th century.

At any rate, do we know the history of those examples? LES housing falls into three time periods: Pre Law, Old Law, and New Law, and not everything was build for the poor.

A more typical tenement for the poor was the museum at 97 Orchard St.

MidtownGuy
March 26th, 2007, 10:20 AM
CIVIC PRIDE. You said the golden words right there!! They don't have ANY.
These guys are already as rich as heck and they don't show any pride in this city. Can't take the money with ya on the way out. I think it's despicable, and every time I see another bad looking development, whose units will rent or sell for outrageous sums, I get more frustrated.

pianoman11686
March 26th, 2007, 04:26 PM
Then how come we don't build nicely ornamented low-income housing any more? ;)

All the reasons given thus far are fine, but one major, more fundamental reason is missing: the influence of prevailing architectural trends.

Ornamentation ceased to exist following the birth and acceptance of Modernism. Coincidental with people losing civic pride and becoming cheaper? I don't think so.

ablarc
March 27th, 2007, 12:15 PM
...one major, more fundamental reason is missing: the influence of prevailing architectural trends.

Ornamentation ceased to exist following the birth and acceptance of Modernism.
True enough, but puritanical Modernism was so boring that the ornamental impulse came back --except now the building's entire form is expected to be ornamental by the ideologues. So you end up with a collection of what Venturi called "ducks": buildings with complicated decorative shapes, like the Westin or the Bank of America or the Blue Condo.

Personally, I'll be happy when ornament goes back where it belongs: adorning a rationally formed building. That's what the Beaux-Arts did so well, and so did Deco.

ZippyTheChimp
March 27th, 2007, 12:27 PM
A thorough analysis of LES tenements:
http://www.tenement.org/documents/Dolkart.pdf

Some examples of architectural style:
http://inet.dkv.columbia.edu/php/website2/slideshow_leshd.html

krulltime
March 29th, 2007, 02:01 AM
Great walk in the Lower East Side MidtownGuy, it has been a while since I have walk in that area. So much has changed indeed. Some of those new buildings are just too boring looking. There is just so much more charm in the old structures. Although I like the Blue building. It came out looking just like the rendering.

NewYorkDragon
April 1st, 2007, 09:20 PM
Great tour. Look at those gas prices!