New Libeskind-designed tower in Lower Manhattan

[antinimby]

Libeskind to Build Another Tower in Lower Manhattan


http://nymag.com/daily/intel/20070612libeskind.jpg


6/12/07 (http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2007/06/libeskind_to_build_another_tow.html)

Daniel Libeskind has been busy lately, with a museum opening in Toronto, new residential projects around the world, and a Freedom Tower stubbornly moving nowhere in Lower Manhattan. And now he's got another — more easily built, one presumes — building coming to New York.

The architect told us yesterday he has a commission to design a residential tower somewhere in Lower Manhattan — though he won't say much more than that until paperwork is filed Friday. Here's what he'll reveal: The commission is from a private client, and he hopes to make the building a landmark "by taking the notion of green out from the inside of the building."

It won't be on Liberty Island, as we originally guessed, but Libeskind confirmed it's on a built "historic site, one of the iconic sites of New York City." And, he added, "I guarantee you'll see the Statue of Liberty from there." Hmm. You have any guesses? —Alec Appelbaum

Copyright © 2007, New York Magazine Holdings LLC.

[antinimby]

My guess is the parking garage at 111 Washington St. that's currently undergoing demolition although I don't know if that site is all that historic or not.

[BPC]

Lots of possibilities. Since he's into symbols, maybe we can get him to work the Survivor's Staircase into his design.

[millertime83]

maybe it's on top of the Freedom Tower. . .

[Derek2k3]

Yea, this was mentioned in one of those vague Shvo articles. I'm almost excited...

111 Washington is being designed by Garett Gourlay. No?

[sfenn1117]

Wouldn't it be something if it was Silverstein's site at 99 Church?

[antinimby]

^ I had thought of that but I think that particular project is too far off in the future (tenants won't move out until much later this year) to be in the running.

Libeskind is hinting that he is submitting papers this coming Friday!


Yea, this was mentioned in one of those vague Shvo articles. I'm almost excited...
111 Washington is being designed by Garett Gourlay. No?Yeah, the early articles mentioned them so I'm at a lost as to where this mystery site is.

Either way, Libeskind like him or not, one thing he just doesn't do are boring boxes with four flat sides. This could be very interesting...

How does that song go again? :D


Friday I'm in love (1992) - The Cure

I don't care if monday's blue
Tuesday's grey and wednesday too
Thursday i don't care about you
It's friday i'm in love

Monday you can fall apart
Tuesday wednesday break my heart
Thursday doesn't even start
It's friday i'm in love

Saturday wait
And sunday always comes too late
But friday never hesitate... I don't care if monday's black
Tuesday wednesday heart attack
Thursday never looking back
It's friday i'm in love

Monday you can hold your head
Tuesday wednesday stay in bed
Or thursday watch the walls instead
It's friday i'm in love

Saturday wait
And sunday always comes too late
But friday never hesitate...

Dressed up to the eyes
It's a wonderful surprise
To see your shoes and your spirits rise
Throwing out your frown
And just smiling at the sound
And as sleek as a shriek
Spinning round and round
Always take a big bite
It's such a gorgeous sight
To see you eat in the middle of the night
You can never get enough
Enough of this stuff
It's friday
I'm in love

[Jasonik]

Another?!

Pathetic rodomontade.

[Stern]

I'm excited by this news. Libeskind is one of my favorite architects. Realistically I didn't think he was the right architect for the WTC, too much red-tape, and too much wrangling, he didn't know the system well enough to work it. But for a site where these connotations are absent Libeskind is a great choice and he should be free to design to his vision. Frankly I'm somewhat surprised this is Libeskind's first NYC commission since the WTC debacle.

[antinimby]

I agree. The problem with Libeskind, as with most architects, is that when they are presented with a large tract of land to work with, as in the case of the WTC, their work tend to become too monotonous and single-themed. The focus isn't as intense and the whole vision becomes diluted.

Another example is Gehry at Atlantic Yards. He should just work on Miss Brooklyn and the arena. The rest of the site should be given to other firms to design.

When they are forced to work within a smaller plot and therefore work with the constraints imposed on them, I believe architects like Libeskind will flourish because he will not be able to go over the top, so to speak and the design will be sensible with just the right amount of creativity to be interesting.

[BrooklynRider]

...Since he's into symbols, maybe we can get him to work the Survivor's Staircase into his design.

Laugh out loud moment

[pianoman11686]

Libeskind's a one-trick pony. Sometimes he can produce a good design, like the Royal Ontario Museum. Others, like the Denver Art Museum, are hideous.

Expect another Deconstructivist, sharply-angled building with (maybe) a glass shard as a semi-spire.

[BrooklynRider]

I'm guessing a hot dog kiosk in Battery Park. He's the right architect for it and you can see the Statue of Liberty from there.

Anyone who has visited the Denver Museum of Art knows that this guy is nothing to get excited about.

[Ed007Toronto]

Libeskind's a one-trick pony.
Not necessarily. Here's a condo that he designed for Toronto that's coming to market shortly.

http://chartattack.com/ed/TheLTower.jpg

[sfenn1117]

The only other site I can think of is the Law School site. I think it's going to be a completely different, not yet announced site.

That Toronto building is awesome....as is the one in Covington KY and the proposed tower for Union City. Seems like he's better with highrises.

[Derek2k3]

The other article mentioning this...

http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/113/features-shvo-motion.html

We're riding uptown from 20 Pine in Shvo's chauffeur-driven black Mercedes S500, and Shvo, as ever, is checking his BlackBerry messages while chattering into his cell. Except this is no deal in the works. It's his parents, calling from Israel, to wish their son a happy new year. After a few minutes of animated conversation in Hebrew, he snaps the phone shut: "My mother wants me to get married this year."

It could happen. (He and his girlfriend live in the upper reaches of the Time Warner building overlooking Central Park.) But Shvo can't keep his mind on weddings today, when there's so much opportunity passing by his window. "See this 50-story building? Hotel-retail-condo--we brought Daniel Libeskind to the table." "We're doing a building in the middle of this block in two years." "See this building? We just completed that one." "That one? The Peter Som building? I said from day one that it wouldn't work." What about Balazs's new affluent-horndog project, the William Beaver House? "Balazs's brand doesn't work for a 400-unit building. If I was advising André, I'd tell him to stay true to his brand, which is taking quirky little properties and making them really chic."


Sounds like a totally new site...but maybe it could be 80 Nassau St. It was the conceptually designed 52 story tower by HTO whose site was being marketed. Swig has a 47 story tower planned at 45 Broad Street. There's also a 50 story tower to go up by Allied Works whose site we also do not know.

As far as I know there are 21 planned and U/C 500'+ towers for Downtown alone...more than the total built skyscraper count for all but a few cities.

[ablarc]

http://chartattack.com/ed/TheLTower.jpg
This boot was made for walkin' ...








Somewhere between hideous and ghastly.

No.. Make that "ludicrous."
.

[Luca]

Wow. I know how to become a starchitect.

Write impenetrable rubbish for a few years. Rather than actual drawings and renditions, this would be accompanied by comically rough sketches, a few charcoal lines on a mauve sheet.

Then, I will build a sequence of buildings which either:

a) replicate a basic shape only in building scale or

b) are a box that has been crumpled in some way.

Kewl.

You're all invited to my bash when I win the Pritzker, but you have to wear black clothes only and geeky looking specs.

[TallGuy]

If I were a little old lady, I would love to live there, if only to say 'I'm the little old lady who lives in a shoe'.

[pianoman11686]

Somewhere between hideous and ghastly.

No.. Make that "ludicrous."
.

Thanks for that. I didn't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but it needed to be said.

[BrooklynRider]

This boot was made for walkin' ...

A morning laugh. Thanks.

[antinimby]

Sounds like a totally new site...but maybe it could be 80 Nassau St. It was the conceptually designed 52 story tower by HTO whose site was being marketed. Swig has a 47 story tower planned at 45 Broad Street. There's also a 50 story tower to go up by Allied Works whose site we also do not know.You are probably right. I'd bet it's either 80 Nassau or 45 Broad.

Both of these fit the clues: midblock, can see the Statue at their upper floors, although 45 Broad is probably a little more "historic" than 80 Nassau.

With that, I think I'm leaning towards 45 Broad. Furthermore, the site at 45 Broad is ready to go since more than likely, Libeskind will be submitting permit applications for the design on Friday and not demo permits.

[londonlawyer]

I'd bet it's either 80 Nassau or 45 Broad. Both of these fit the clues: midblock, can see the Statue at their upper floors, although 45 Broad is probably a little more "historic" than 80 Nassau.

With that, I think I'm leaning towards 45 Broad. Furthermore, the site at 45 Broad is ready to go since more than likely, Libeskind will be submitting permit applications for the design on Friday and not demo permits.

I was wondering if 80 Nassau might be the site for Kaufman's Intercontinental.

[antinimby]

^ Unfortunately, I think that sounds about right.

[londonlawyer]

^ Unfortunately, I think that sounds about right.

People initially speculated that it was the large site covering 113-121 Nassau, but a 25 floor (or so) building will go there, and the footprint is much larger than the Intercontinental's. Therefore, I thought that the I/C would go in the empty lot next to that big site, or on the site of 2 empty buildings across from it, or on 80 Nassau. I think that the latter will be the I/C's site.

[NYatKNIGHT]

What about that 8 Stone St. (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12292) site?

[londonlawyer]

What about that 8 Stone St. (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12292) site?

That can't be the site of the I/C because Kaufman's website claims that it will be on Nassau (although it does not state where on Nassau).

[antinimby]

I think 8 Stone is another (ughhh) McSam.

[NYatKNIGHT]

^Oops, right.

Nassau?

[finnman69]

Not necessarily. Here's a condo that he designed for Toronto that's coming to market shortly.

http://chartattack.com/ed/TheLTower.jpg


What has happened to modern architecture!!!!! Too depressing for words!

[sfenn1117]

You are probably right. I'd bet it's either 80 Nassau or 45 Broad.

Both of these fit the clues: midblock, can see the Statue at their upper floors, although 45 Broad is probably a little more "historic" than 80 Nassau.

With that, I think I'm leaning towards 45 Broad. Furthermore, the site at 45 Broad is ready to go since more than likely, Libeskind will be submitting permit applications for the design on Friday and not demo permits.

45 Broad sounds the likeliest candidate right now....it's certainly in a historic area. I still think it might be a new site. Checking the new building permits for CB1 I did find this for the law school site:

http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=2&allisn=0001385896&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=

58 stories, 796' :eek:

We cannot even keep up with the number of 40+ story towers going up downtown anymore. The number is approaching, if not past 20.

[antinimby]

Wow!! Are you kidding, that Law School site is big news.

That's almost 800 feet! :eek:

[sfenn1117]

Don't let the Tribecans know!

[macreator]

That's fantastic! We're getting so many tall towers Downtown it's astounding.

[antinimby]

Don't let the Tribecans know!There's no way they'll allow an 800 footer in their backyards.

I can't believe they won't fight this one with every last breath they've got.

[Derek2k3]

Wow, that's awesome and there's nothing Nimby's can do about it since it's as of right. They are going to be so pissed. I hope that 796' is just the roof height too.



From an old article...

Some neighbors have voiced outrage at the possibility of a high-rise tower landing in their sleepy, Tribeca neighborhood, worrying that a new influx of residents will further burden an already strained public school system. The neighborhood’s only zoned elementary school, P.S. 234, is already at 120 percent capacity.

The area is mostly zoned for low-rise buildings, with heights capped at 120 feet. But the Mendik site has much looser zoning restrictions. A developer could build a 306,000 sq. ft. tower on the 12,500 sq. ft. parcel, an equation that could translate to a 50-story building, some speculate.

“Whatever beef that exists is a beef with the zoning laws of New York City,” said Matasar, noting that the sale is “as-of-right,” or within the zoning laws. “We should be able to maximize the value of our property.”

Community Board 1, which represents the neighborhood, often struggles with developers to reduce the scale of new developments. But in this case, the board has taken a quieter approach, arguing that it has little room to influence a development that will not need to go through any kind of public review process.

“We are not pleased about this at all, but the decision was made years ago to rezone that area… and put the large buildings along Church St. and that leaves us in a very unfortunate situation,” said Julie Menin, C.B. 1 chairperson. The neighborhood’s efforts would be better spent fighting for more public schools to absorb all the new children in the neighborhood, she added.

Not everyone agrees that the options are so limited on an as-of-right development. Former C.B. 1 chairperson Madelyn Wils insists that developers can be influenced and she has organized a group of Leonard St. residents to fight the development.

“When I was chair of the [community] board, I had my head to the ground and I generally knew which developers were being talked to,” she said. “Many times I talked to the developers and I warned them. I tried to take a more proactive approach to it. It’s just a matter of style.”

The law school could have been pressured to restrict the terms of its sale because its endowment was enriched with $135 million in public bonds, said Wils. “Given that the public is basically endowing New York Law School… it seems to me they’re taking advantage of the community,” she said.

In 1995, Wils chaired the C.B. 1 committee that worked to rezone the neighborhood. Wils said the school was exempt from the zoning restrictions with the idea that it might one day grow, not so that it could sell off its property to become one of the wealthiest schools in the country. “This isn’t expanding the law school in the spirit of what was given,” she said.

Wils and others in the group of residents started a fundraising campaign and has met with City Councilmember Alan Gerson to discuss their options. Now that the building is sold and the buyer is known, “we can come up with real strategy,” said Leonard St. resident Antonio Convit.

“We are going to explore different avenues of leverage to keep the height to a scale that comports with the community,” said Gerson. “Ultimately, I think they would recognize that with all else being equal, people will want to come in and live in a place where they’re welcome, not where they’re viewed as denigrating a community.”




I'm not too happy about Kondylis being the architect though. He's already done that abomination on the other end of the block, 88 Leonard and has Barclay Tower and 99 Church down the street...enough is enough. No wonder people hate new towers.

I guess we can continue this discussion in the right thread.
http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9831&page=3

[Derek2k3]

People initially speculated that it was the large site covering 113-121 Nassau, but a 25 floor (or so) building will go there, and the footprint is much larger than the Intercontinental's. Therefore, I thought that the I/C would go in the empty lot next to that big site, or on the site of 2 empty buildings across from it, or on 80 Nassau. I think that the latter will be the I/C's site.

I think 109-113 Nassau will be the site of the res. tower. and 115 Nassau the Intercontinental. I don't know anymore, 80 Nassau could just as well be the site of the hotel too.

[londonlawyer]

I think 109-113 Nassau will be the site of the res. tower. and 115 Nassau the Intercontinental. I don't know anymore, 80 Nassau could just as well be the site of the hotel too.

I agree. The I/C could go at 115 Nassau.

[londonlawyer]

I forgot that there's a rendering for 80 Nassau on Thomas O'Hara's website.

[macreator]

I forgot that there's a rendering for 80 Nassau on Thomas O'Hara's website.

Except for the atrocious blank wall on one side, the building isn't actually all that bad for a Thomas O'Hara creation (I know the bar is set pretty low ;))

[Derek2k3]

I forgot that there's a rendering for 80 Nassau on Thomas O'Hara's website.

Well the site and its development rights were put up for grabs after that rendering was released.

From CityRealty

Architect H. Thomas O’Hara has a rendering, shown at the right, of a possible tower for the site on his website.

According to Kari Neering, public relations director of Massey Knakal, James Nelson said “the rendering was just one of many possibilities for the site,” adding that “Hotels are also a possibility, as is a hotel with residential.”

[londonlawyer]

Well the site and its development right were put up for grabs after that rendering was released.

From CityRealty

Architect H. Thomas O’Hara has a rendering, shown at the right, of a possible tower for the site on his website.

According to Kari Neering, public relations director of Massey Knakal, James Nelson said “the rendering was just one of many possibilities for the site,” adding that “Hotels are also a possibility, as is a hotel with residential.”

Thanks. That's good news.

[Derek2k3]

In case anyone was wondering what those 21, now 22 potential 500 footers were...

Freedom Tower
82 stories 1,776'


200 Greenwich Street
78 stories 1,339'


175 Greenwich Street
71 stories 1,155'


80 South Street Tower ...i know, i know.
55 stories 1,123'


Beekman Tower
75 stories 950'?


150 Greenwich Street
61 stories 947'


JPMorgan Chase Tower
42 stories < 871'


240 Church Street
58 stories 796'


Goldman Sachs Tower
43 stories 740'


50 West Street
63 stories 725'


4 Albany Street
53 stories 630'


Barclay Tower Apartments
56 stories 584'


99 Church Street
58 stories


10 Platt Street/217 Pearl Street
52 stories 580'


Intercontinental Hotel
55 stories


161 Maiden Lane
525'?


William Beaver House
44 stories 523'


111 Washington Street
52 stories


80 Nassau Street
52 stories


Allied Works Tower
50 stories


Daniel Libeskind Mixed-Use Tower
~50 stories


45 Broad Street
~47 stories


To think only 3 such buildings were completed in the last decade...

Seven World Trade Center
52 stories 750'

2 Gold Street
51 stories 543'

Liberty Plaza
45 stories 510'

[antinimby]

^ Do you really think JP Morgan Chase at 42 stories and 1.3 million sf will be 871 ft.?

[pianoman11686]

What has happened to modern architecture!!!!! Too depressing for words!

In Libeskind's case, I blame Pataki - at least partially. Because of him, the guy now has more high-profile commissions, more critical acclaim, and more bravado than he rightfully deserves.

[londonlawyer]

What's the proposal for the Allied Works Tower and where will it be?

[Derek2k3]

^No idea. It's mentioned briefly in a few articles and on their website.
Thread here (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7949)

^ Do you really think JP Morgan Chase at 42 stories and 1.3 million sf will be 871 ft.?
No, that's just the number from Libeskind's master plan. I'd guess it's around the same height as Goldman Sachs. It's only one story shorter and they both have 6 trading floors. If they go with a 100' cantilever, some large structural transfer floors will be necessary. There could also be some kind of crown on top...

[Stern]

If the first article in this thread is correct papers were filed last Friday. Any word on the location of this building, height, size, etc? Anyway to check the DOB knowing only that Libeskind is designing it and that its somewhere in Lower Manhattan?

[ZippyTheChimp]

You can search the DOB by an architect's license number, but I don't know of any way to search by name.

[londonlawyer]

Although there are many possible development sites in Lower Manhattan, it seems like Swig's site at 45 Broad is the most likely one given Liebeskind's characterization of the site as historic.

[sunchild]

Not to veer OT here, but this is the only place I've heard of 80 Nassau being an enormous condominium. Since I live at 71 Nassau, I'd be curious to know a little more... ;)

And, to get back on topic, how could the 1xx Nassau Street locations ever realistically have a view of the Statue of Liberty?

[antinimby]

That's the thing sunchild, we don't know much more than you do.

We are mostly speculating ourselves until more concrete information is available through the media.

Although from time to time, our crack team here does manage to beat the professionals to the punch, so just stick around and you'll likely hear the breaking news here first. ;)

[londonlawyer]

I was thinking that another possible site is Sciame's site on South Street since 80 South Street obviously will not be built. Another possibility is the proposed Seaport tower that initially was described as "tall and iconic," notwithstanding its proposed height of 450 feet!

[macreator]

I was thinking that another possible site is Sciame's site on South Street since 80 South Street obviously will not be built.

It's a shame, but its almost certainly true. You may be right.

[londonlawyer]

It's a shame, but its almost certainly true. You may be right.

It fits the profile that Liebeskind alluded to (i.e., it's in a historic area and it has clear views of the Statue of Liberty). Another possibility is the Zeytuna site on Front Street for which that black, glass box had been proposed.

[Derek2k3]

The seaport tower will not be built for a long time. If Sciame wanted to propose something else at 80 South Street, he wouldn't dump Calatrava and switch to another starchitect. If the project isn't feasible, it'd be cheaper to water it down with the same architect rather than start from scratch...

I doubt it'd be the Zeytuna since Rogers Marvel was already chosen. I'm still thinking this is a totally new site. Downtown still has a lot of loose air rights floating around to support slender residential buildings.

[ablarc]

Downtown still has a lot of loose air rights floating around to support slender residential buildings.
What happens when they run out? Do they just crank up the FAR and start a new cycle?

[Derek2k3]

I doubt it. They'd probably replace those housing projects or upzone Chinatown first.

[ablarc]

Upzoning Chinatown would be a mistake.

[LeCom]

I'm pretty excited about this project. I believe that Libeskind was a horrible choice for a WTC site, but that doesn't mean the architect is a total hack. He has grown on me in the past year or so, since it turns out that he can crunch out pretty decent designs. Best proof came when I saw construction photos of that curvy building somewhere out in the Midwest, you know the one that the renders made look like it's been shat upon with diarrhea. On the photos, however, it looked like a great buildings. Seems like he's just one of those guys whose renders come out worse than his actual buildings. architects that piss me off are those that are the other way around - great renders, shitty buildings. And then there are always people like Kaufman, whose projects stink equally bad on renders and in real life.

[BrooklynRider]

Go visit Liebskind's Denver Art Museum. Anyone who has been there knows how horrid a design architect he is.