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ZippyTheChimp
September 7th, 2009, 12:54 PM
For today's day-night doubleheader, or for how many games it takes, Yankee Universe will be centered on Derek Jeter as he picks up the few remaining hits to reach the mark of most hits by a Yankee, set by Lou Gehrig. The division race and post season thoughts will take a back seat.


September 3, 2009


Jeter Is Approaching Gehrig
With a Sense of the Moment

By TYLER KEPNER

BALTIMORE — The records are piling up for Derek Jeter, and the more he hits, the quicker they come. Most hits at the original Yankee Stadium. Most hits by a shortstop. Most hits in the history of the Yankees.

The last mark still belongs to Lou Gehrig, at least for a few more days. Gehrig had 2,721 hits. Jeter, who had a hit Wednesday against the Orioles, has 2,713. Individual records can be awkward for Jeter, who insists that winning is all that matters. But he said he would appreciate this one.

“I was talking to my parents not too long ago, and they were telling me, ‘You’ve got to learn to enjoy some of these things as they’re happening — there’s nothing wrong with that,’ ” Jeter said. “So I’m sure it’s something that I’ll enjoy if it happens.”

Barring injury, the question for Jeter is not if, but how soon. He had 46 hits in August, his most in a calendar month since August 1998. He is batting .369 since June 25, the day before his 35th birthday.

“He’s got a lot more to go, he really does,” catcher Jorge Posada said. “He’s having probably the best season in his career. He’s doing a lot of things well, and he’s the guy we follow. He’s the guy we look up to.”

Posada marveled at the names Jeter has passed on the hits list — Ruth and DiMaggio, Mantle and Berra, Mattingly and Williams — but said Jeter had never discussed it with him. Yet because it is a Yankees record, and not merely a round number signifying individual greatness, Jeter said it would have extra meaning.

Jeter’s background is well known. Raised in Michigan, he spent summers with his grandmother in New Jersey, where he followed the Yankees on television, rooting for teams that never won the World Series.

He was proud to be part of the group that changed that in 1996, when he was 22, and along the way he has absorbed more of the team’s history. The shadow of Gehrig is hard to miss.

“I just know how he carried himself, how he was respected,” Jeter said. “He went out there, he played every day and he was consistent. Those are all the things that I think players strive to be.”

Jeter is similarly revered around the game, which is why it was startling last month when the Hall of Famer Jim Rice told Little Leaguers that Jeter was a player who set a bad example. More typical was the comment in July from the umpire John Hirschbeck, who praised Jeter after Jeter questioned the call of another umpire.

“In my 27 years in the big leagues, he is probably the classiest person I’ve been around,” Hirschbeck said.

Of course, integrity does not have much to do with a hitter’s ability. The career hits leader, Pete Rose, is barred from the sport for life. More important is Jeter’s approach. He does not swing too hard, he has speed, and he has an extraordinary ability to wait on the ball.

“The two things that make Jeter what he is are the ability to let the ball travel and to stay inside of it,” the hitting coach Kevin Long said. “He’s been able to do that and been real good at it for years and years and years. A ball on the inside part of the plate, most people can’t do what he does with that pitch, stay inside and hit it to right field. He’s got a unique ability to tuck his hands in near his core and rotate.”

Jeter takes fewer swings than many players during early batting practice, Long said, usually 30 to 40, with another 10 or 15 later on the field. But he is always there, and when Long says piernas — the Spanish word for legs — Jeter knows he must concentrate more on the lower half of his body.

Long has worked with Jeter on squaring his feet to the pitcher, giving him a more direct path to the ball. As for other suggestions, Jeter would rather not make them public.

“I’ll tell him some things here and there, but he doesn’t want me to talk about those things,” Long said. “He’d just rather keep that between us, and that’s fine. He just wants it to be known that he goes about his business and comes ready to play every day.”

That workaday ethos is part of the legacy of Gehrig, who played 2,130 consecutive games before A.L.S. ended his career. It is also important to Jeter, the major league leader in games played since 1996.

Long said the Yankees assumed Jeter would not tell them when he is hurt, so they watch for signs in his performance. When his stolen bases decline and he is not driving the ball, they assume something is wrong.

Jeter strained his left quadriceps last April and was hit on the hand in May. He finished at .300, but had only 39 extra-base hits, his fewest in any season besides 2003, when he missed six weeks with a dislocated shoulder. This year, especially in August, Jeter has been spry.

“I was comfortable,” Jeter said. “Sometimes you can be comfortable and you’re lining out all the time. You’ve got to be lucky, too. I think it’s a combination of both; that’s what makes for a good month.”

The torrid month has put him close to a record Jeter will cherish, if he takes his parents’ advice. Posada, his close friend, considered their wisdom and laughed.

“It doesn’t come twice, so he could take a step back and look,” Posada said. “That’s a good way to put it, but I don’t think he will.”


Copyright 2009 The New York Times Company



Update: Jeter picked up 5 hits in Toronto, and now stands at 2718. He's also 2nd among active players, behind Ken Griffey, for total career hits.

Baseball Reference - career hits (http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/H_career.shtml)

OmegaNYC
September 7th, 2009, 03:24 PM
Though, I may be a Mets fan, and I HATE the Yankees and Jeter, with all my guts, Jeter is a class act, and one of the best players to ever play the game. What a record to break!

ZippyTheChimp
September 8th, 2009, 09:12 AM
Going to the game tonight.

Rats. It seemed that everything was in alignment to see a little history. But three hits will be tough.

NYatKNIGHT
September 8th, 2009, 11:14 AM
Getting 3 hits isn't as strange as going 0-8 in a doubleheader where everyone else hit - hope you get to see it!

NYatKNIGHT
September 9th, 2009, 09:45 AM
Alas!

(though a walk-off homer doesn't suck)

JCMAN320
September 9th, 2009, 02:44 PM
Yea Jeter just needs to relax. His mechanics we're completely off last night. It'll happen.

I've been a Jeter fan since the age of 9, in 95 when he came up towards the end of the season. I was just starting Little League and I just became a fan of his. It's amazing to see him accomplish so much.

ZippyTheChimp
September 9th, 2009, 02:49 PM
Walk-offs are a great consolation. We watched the last two innings while walking around the concourse. The open stands are the best improvement over the old stadium, where the concourse was isolated from the field.

JCMAN320
September 9th, 2009, 10:15 PM
Derek Jeter has tied Lou Gehrig in the bottom of 7th with a single down the right field line. Also down 2-0 in the bottom of the 8th with runners at 1st and 3rd Posada hits a 3R HR to the short porch in right field to put the Yanks ahead 4-2. How sweet it is!

JCMAN320
September 9th, 2009, 10:18 PM
Ballgame over; Yankees win! TTHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE YANKEES WIN!!!!

Yankees are 91-50!!!

lofter1
September 9th, 2009, 11:39 PM
After the game tonight DJ was completely cool and humble about matching Gehrig's record.

He's a class act all the way.

ZippyTheChimp
September 10th, 2009, 07:43 AM
http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/icons/icon14.gif

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/09/10/alg_jetera.jpg

A connection to fans unchanged for a career. Nothing phony here.

JCMAN320
September 10th, 2009, 05:27 PM
Gotta get that framed; the first iconic image at the new Yankee Stadium.

Jasonik
September 11th, 2009, 09:46 PM
Jeter led off the third inning for his second at-bat, as Tillman started him off with a pair of balls. Jeter lined the 2-0 pitch past first baseman Luke Scott to move past Gehrig, a hit virtually identical to the one that tied Gehrig's mark in the seventh inning on Wednesday. (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/2009/09/11/2009-09-11_the_new_yankees_hit_king.html)

Big ups!

hbcat
December 4th, 2009, 10:07 PM
So I need my baseball fix. It's true, I am obsessed. I'll go to any game, any where, any time, although my preference is for the pinstriped variety.

I just guesstimated that Derek Jeter will get his 3,000th hit on Wednesday, May 25, 2011. My crystal ball actually reads "May 26, 2011," but that is a Thursday, so I moved it back a day. I had added a fudge factor of a few games he'd probably miss sitting out for rest, and merely subtracted one.

TV here has broadcast the playoffs and the World Series again, with Game 6 just shown Wednesday evening. Taiwan is pretty much a one-sport society (we miss Wang), although the kids all seem to be playing basketball in recent years. By the way, baseball dates back to the colonial Japanese-era (1895-1945), but how many of you knew that Japan had its first baseball leagues in the 1870s? Isn't that cool?

I am curious to see how close my prediction will turn out to be. Jeter has to stay healthy and consistent. Health hasn't ever been a problem. Except for one separated shoulder in Toronto early in the 2003 season which had him on the bench for weeks, he's never missed more than a few games at a time, but he is getting older. Captain Clutch is also Mr. Consistency. He's average just over 200 hits per year over the last five years.

I am not good at predictions or at evaluating those of others, however. (I scoffed at a London friend in 1998 who said he thought George W. Bush would be the next US president. Him? No way.) There's also the matter of Jeter's pending free agency following 2010. Not much chance the Yankees will let him go or that he'd want to leave, so my crystal ball assumes he will get 3000 in a Yankee uniform.

Chances he'll do it with the Hanshin Tigers: Crystal ball says < 0.0003%, +/- 0%.

Crystal ball is mum on whether he'll get the hit in home pinstripes or road grays. A clean single is predicted, not an extra-base hit, but that's an easy guess.

May 25, 2011. Circle it on your your calendar -- when you get a 2011 calendar, that is.

Cheers --
hb,
WNY's Baseball Desk

ZippyTheChimp
July 9th, 2011, 04:45 PM
July 9, 2011


Jeter Reaches Fabled 3,000, and It’s a Blast

By TYLER KEPNER

The Yankees have won 27 championships with a diverse collection of baseball’s greatest players. From the groundbreaking power of Babe Ruth to the unmatched hitting streak of Joe DiMaggio to a trio of perfect-game pitchers, the Yankees’ starry constellation outshines all others.

But one thing the Yankees never had, until now, was a player with 3,000 hits. A few have passed through on their way to the milestone, but only one has collected 3,000 as a Yankee. He is Derek Jeter, the team captain, who got there in a most improbable way on Saturday at Yankee Stadium.

He hit a home run.

Jeter, who had singled in the first inning, connected in the third off David Price of the Tampa Bay Rays, driving an off-speed pitch with a full count deep into the seats above the left-field wall. It was only the third home run of the season for Jeter, and his first over the fence in the Bronx since last June 12. Including the postseason, Jeter had homered in just one of his last 108 games.

Jeter became the 28th player in history to reach 3,000 hits, but only the second to do so with a home run; the other was Wade Boggs for Tampa Bay in 1999. Only Ty Cobb, Hank Aaron and Robin Yount joined the club at a younger age than Jeter, who turned 37 on June 26.

That puts Jeter ahead of the pace set by Pete Rose, the career hits leader, who retired at age 45 with 4,256. Jeter is signed for two more years, with a player option for 2014, but he said Thursday that Rose was not on his radar.

“You have to play another five years and get 200 hits to get that extra thousand,” Jeter said. “You’re talking about a long, long time. You never say never, but it’s not something that’s on my mind.”

Jeter’s recent performance offers few hints of Rose’s staying power. This has been Jeter’s most trying season, with a career-low .257 average through Friday. He spent almost three weeks on the disabled list with a strained calf muscle, and has hit a higher percentage of ground balls (65.3 percent through Friday) than any other player in the majors.

Naturally, some of the erosion in Jeter’s skills can be traced to age, and, perhaps, to the extra wear and tear from roughly a season’s worth of games — 147 — across 30 postseason series. He has also played no defensive position besides shortstop, the most demanding spot on the field besides catcher.

Only one other player, Honus Wagner, reached 3,000 hits while still a regular shortstop. Wagner did it in 1914.

“Physically, you have a responsibility that can be difficult, and mentally as well, you have to be in every pitch, every game,” Jeter said, referring to shortstop. “So there’s probably a reason why there’s not too many guys that have played the position that have had that amount of hits. I take pride in it. This is my job. This is the only thing I’ve done.”

Jeter was a high school shortstop in Kalamazoo, Mich., in 1992, when the Yankees chose him sixth over all in the draft. He was in the majors within three years, and by 1996 he was there to stay. Jeter never wanted a day off, he said, for fear that George Steinbrenner, the impatient principal owner, would replace him.

There has never been real danger of that, even after last season, when Jeter’s average dipped to .270 just as his contract expired. The Yankees gave him a deal worth at least $51 million over three years, but they did so grudgingly, publicly citing Jeter’s declining performance and challenging him to explore free agency.

Jeter has said he was angered; he had tried to make it clear he only wanted to play for the Yankees. Meanwhile, he worked to improve in the off-season and spring training, eliminating his stride in hopes of having more time to react to each pitch. But Jeter abandoned the adjustment soon after the season started and reverted to his old mechanics — without his old results.

That is hardly unprecedented. Others have reached 3,000 at similarly diminished levels of production — Cal Ripken hit .256 the season he got there, Al Kaline hit .262, Yount hit .264. Jeter, a career .312 hitter, will be known most for relentless consistency, for churning out hits at a rate few have ever matched.

Jeter has seven 200-hit seasons, and 10 with at least 190. Only Rose and Cobb, who rank first and second on the career list, have more 190-hit seasons.

“I take a lot of pride in going out there every single day and to trying to be as consistent as possible,” Jeter said. “I think that’s probably the most difficult thing to do in our sport. Playing well gets you here, consistency keeps you here. That’s the thing that I’ve always tried to focus on.”

After a game in Cleveland last week, Jeter acknowledged that the scrutiny of his struggles had taken some fun from his chase. He has little experience with bad press; few athletes in his era have received such overwhelmingly positive coverage in their careers.

But Jeter has seemed more at ease since returning to Yankee Stadium on Thursday, perhaps sensing that his pursuit was nearing an end. His family and friends have been here, including the former teammates Tino Martinez and Gerald Williams. The scout who signed Jeter, Dick Groch, has been at the ballpark, as has Don Zimmer, an honorary coach for the Rays and Joe Torre’s bench coach in Jeter’s early years.

“I didn’t realize that there was no Yankee that ever got 3,000 hits,” said Zimmer, who has been in baseball 63 years. “And here’s Derek Jeter, the only Yankee that’s going to get 3,000 hits. That’s the thing that blew my mind.”

Jeter’s first hit came at the Seattle Kingdome, a concrete dungeon that was razed years ago. It was only appropriate that his 3,000th come in the Bronx, where Jeter passed Lou Gehrig in 2009 for the franchise record in hits, with 2,722.

That was a stirring moment, even if it had little resonance outside Yankee Stadium. With 3,000 hits, Jeter has matched a revered number in the game’s history, leaving an indelible mark in style.

© 2011 The New York Times Company

hbcat
July 10th, 2011, 07:42 AM
Just got home. What did I miss?

hbcat
July 10th, 2011, 08:14 AM
Only after looking around on MLB.com at the highlights and interviews, etc., for about ten minutes did I learn that the Yankees also won that game.

Jeter is magnificent.

Daquan13
July 10th, 2011, 12:07 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Ortiz


David Ortiz (Big Popi) got mad, lost it the other night at a Red Sox game in Boston, charged after the pitcher and began swinging at him. He was ousted from the game. It was a night of mayhem, as some of the players just weren't happy campers that night.

lofter1
July 10th, 2011, 12:15 PM
yin and yang

OmegaNYC
July 10th, 2011, 12:17 PM
Congrats to Jeter on this milestone. 3K is just amazing.

Does anyone think he can hit 3,500?

ZippyTheChimp
July 10th, 2011, 12:45 PM
Why is there a *@()#)^#*! Red Sox story in this thread? :mad:

eddhead
July 11th, 2011, 11:13 AM
As magnificent as he was, right now Jeter is a .270 hitter with no power and an avg at best obp. If things don't change, they are going to have to move him from the leadoff spot

ZippyTheChimp
July 11th, 2011, 05:30 PM
A fan's view.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARGaJf6oPHA

mariab
July 11th, 2011, 08:06 PM
What a roar. Well deserved too. Reminded me of the Mets win in '86. Bet the stadium rocked.

I'm almost inclined to call him Mr. Baseball, & me & about 5 million other women wouldn't mind congratulating him personally. He not only gets his 3000th at home, it's a homer, plus he went 5 for 5. On top of that, he's a great sprtsman that anyone can admire. There are many athletes that can learn a lesson in class from him. Not to mention that million dollar smile.

hbcat
July 14th, 2011, 04:29 AM
As magnificent as he was, right now Jeter is a .270 hitter with no power and an avg at best obp. If things don't change, they are going to have to move him from the leadoff spot

No, ed, he still is magnificent, quite apart from the numbers and his spot in lineup.

GordonGecko
July 14th, 2011, 12:10 PM
As magnificent as he was, right now Jeter is a .270 hitter with no power and an avg at best obp. If things don't change, they are going to have to move him from the leadoff spot
Plus his image has really gone down the tubes lately, first after he snubbed his supposed idol's funeral (Bob Sheppard), then squeezed the Yankees to grossly overpay for his new contract, and now after (1) he snubbed the All-Star game and (2) didn't give the kid anything who gave him the 3000th hit home run ball for free and is getting hit with a $14,000 tax bill. Jeter doesn't have the same shine he used to

ZippyTheChimp
July 14th, 2011, 12:39 PM
Plus his image has really gone down the tubes lately,I wonder what professional athlete has combined this much success, fame, wealth with as much a positive public image as Jeter.

And done it in a place where so many have crashed themselves against the rocks.

Those that think his image has "gone down the tubes" probably never liked him.

eddhead
July 14th, 2011, 01:34 PM
No, ed, he still is magnificent, quite apart from the numbers and his spot in lineup.

That sounds nice, but it is not going to help the Yankees win a pennant this year.

I have a couple of other issues with him as well, the big one being his refusal to give up playing ss when A-Rod came over (sorry, but A-Rod was the better SS), and not volunteering to move out of the lead-off spot as his skills have declined. On balance though I have great admiration and respect for him.

ZippyTheChimp
July 14th, 2011, 01:49 PM
ARod would not have lasted long at SS. He was already getting too big for the position. Look how battered he's gotten at third. Moving over probably added years to his career.

eddhead
July 14th, 2011, 02:12 PM
That is true. But it is also retrospective; no one could have known at the time that A-Rod would have the physical problems he has today. Also, I want to be clear. I am a Jeter fan. I just don't happen to think he is helping the team today. Maybe he can turn it around.

GordonGecko
July 14th, 2011, 02:34 PM
Maybe he can turn it around.
It's definitely possible, recently guys like Ortiz & Damon were considered to be finished and they've been able to find that second gear

hbcat
July 14th, 2011, 09:19 PM
Sorry, no, but Jeter is still a great shortstop. I wasn't merely being sentimental -- I think he still is a great player. BA is only part of the story. He was more consistent at the plate as a younger player, but he still excels in the field. I just saw him tag a guy out at third to end another ugly inning in Toronto. As David Cone said in the booth, Jeter's always the guy in the right place at the right time. Earlier he tracked down a Bautista hit and threw from left field. Bautista beat the throw by a step, but a mediocre fielder would not have come close.

He is so steady and so mindful all the time. When Nunez or Pena are in his place I cringe ever time a ball is hit their way. Not with Jeter. The plays I just cited will be forgotten because but he does that kind of stuff all the time, every game.

Yes, he may turn it around as a hitter. We won't know if he's in a steady decline until his career is finally over. Superior being, separate species -- normal metrics do not apply.

eddhead
July 15th, 2011, 12:40 PM
^^

He is a steady and consistent shortstop with a great arm and a feel for the game. But he does not have the range he once had; balls he used to get to are getting past him. Don't compare him Nunez or Pena, they are not ready for prime time. In 2010 Jeter ranked 27th / 28 in fielding runs (http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/9067) But even if he is a great shortstop (and I would debate that) he is hurting them more at the plate than he helps them in the field. Maybe he will turn it around, I hope so.

hbcat
July 15th, 2011, 03:50 PM
^ "He is a steady and consistent shortstop with a great arm and a feel for the game." That's all I was saying. Statistics lie. He has a great presence on the field that does not show up in any metric, but you know this and we aren't really arguing.

I agree he is now a 37-year-old Jeter, but he is still Jeter. The great feel for the game means a lot on a team that is always in the spotlight and in the postseason. He cannot carry the team any more, but he doesn't have to. Robinson Cano and CC Sabatthia can do that.

And you are right -- no one would be surprised if he has a resurgence in the second half and into next season. We won't know what the end of his career looks like until we see it all.

ZippyTheChimp
July 15th, 2011, 05:49 PM
Sabermetrics will ruin baseball.

eddhead
July 15th, 2011, 05:58 PM
Sabermetrics is not the be all and end all of baseball, but used judiciously it can be a useful tool when used in the context of other measurements. But the fact is we don't need sabermetrics to conclude that Jeter has lost a step in the field. Gold glove not withstanding, it is obvious that he does not quite have the range he once had. As I mentioned, he has a great feel for the game, and always has, and brings a lot of intangibles including a history of delivering in key moments (except for last year's playoffs).

GordonGecko
July 15th, 2011, 06:31 PM
Sabermetrics will ruin baseball.

Neo-Luddite much?

ZippyTheChimp
July 15th, 2011, 06:52 PM
^
A Beane counter. Explains some of your remarks.

Like...


recently guys like Ortiz & Damon were considered to be finished

GordonGecko
July 15th, 2011, 08:39 PM
Ok so you come in here with a straight face that sabermetrics is the end of baseball (it's actually the extension of it, pro ball has always been about stats this is just the latest iteration), then you make a strange connection between sabermetrics and people watching with their own eyes Ortiz tank for 3 months last year and Damon not hit the ball (before both picked it up again, especially Ortiz), and the best you can do it support it by calling me an accountant?

You're one strange primate Yankee chimp

ZippyTheChimp
July 15th, 2011, 09:12 PM
Another ridiculous statement. You make my point by repeating the silly Ortiz example.

Ortiz had a down year in 2009. He was all of 33 years old. People like you wrote him off, not based on a 3 month tank, but 15 games at the start of 2010. 15 games. His OBP in April was .238 with one HR. In May, it was .424 with 10 HRs, and all the Beanies shut up.

If there's anything worse than a Sabermetric, it's one that doesn't even know the stats.

Maybe next you can explain to us how Jeter "squeezed the Yankees" on his contract.

hbcat
July 15th, 2011, 10:30 PM
Statistics are fun, but you have to let them go after the fun is done. They can seduce us into bad habitual thinking and confirm false assumptions and prejudices. There is no average -- no individual exactly describes the mean.

Dad leaves the stove on at 40 and he's just a busy adult who got distracted by a phone call. Dad leaves the stove on at 75 and the kids are checking into assisted living options. If Jeter went into a prolonged slump as he did in early 2004, his career would be "over". Because he has been so consistent for such a long time any divergence from expectations is taken as a sign of weakness. But older players have down periods too not attributable to diminished skills. He probably is slowing down, but Jeter nearing the end of his career is not average and never mediocre.

eddhead
July 18th, 2011, 11:30 AM
I know this is going to get me in trouble but right now, Jeter is mediocre by any test visually or statistically, and has been for the past 1.5 yrs. He has flashes but so do a lot of mediocre players. He hasn't just left the stove on, this is something that persisted from last year on.

He has not had a medicore careeer, quite the opposite, he has been magnificent throughout. But he is just not playing at that level these days. Believe me, I am rooting for him, but the situation is what it is.

eddhead
July 18th, 2011, 11:39 AM
Another ridiculous statement. You make my point by repeating the silly Ortiz example.

Ortiz had a down year in 2009. He was all of 33 years old. People like you wrote him off, not based on a 3 month tank, but 15 games at the start of 2010. 15 games. His OBP in April was .238 with one HR. In May, it was .424 with 10 HRs, and all the Beanies shut up.

If there's anything worse than a Sabermetric, it's one that doesn't even know the stats.

Maybe next you can explain to us how Jeter "squeezed the Yankees" on his contract.

Sabermetrics is a pretty accurate representation of a player's current value when taken in combination with some of the intangibles we value so much. It is less accurate as a predictor of future performance, but no tool is completely accurate in that regard. Take Ortiz for instance. He was coming off a year where it was discovered that he used steroids. His performance was down significantly. I think most of us (not just those who use Sabermetrics) felt that his career might be over, not on the basis of what he did in 2010, but on the basis of 2009 and the steroids scandal. I doubt our opinion would have been any different if not for Sabermetrics

ZippyTheChimp
July 18th, 2011, 12:19 PM
Maybe I shouldn't have begun the sentence with the word sabermetrics. I'm talking about Sabermetrics with a capital S, the total philosophy of how to run a baseball team. I'm not sure, but GG may have also missed Beane (with the added e), referring to Billy Beane and Moneyball.

Fitting how Moneyball the film is set to debut now, with Oakland having missed the playoffs since 2006, stuck in last place, with the second worst attendance in baseball. for all the hype, Oakland has one one playoff series and no championships for Beane's entire tenure. Their success in the early 200s is due largely to three starting pitchers - Hudson, Mulder, and Zito. Sabermetrics hasn't been able to replace them.

Worst of all, this philosophy creates financially safe, but boring teams that lose when it counts. You need impact players to win key games, and they're expensive. The problem is more that too many baseball teams are owned by investors, who worry about debt service rather than winning championships. In the end, the fans are deprived of the compelling stories that enrich baseball. Would Jeter even be on the team today, or would 3000 hits come somewhere else? Would Rivera have gotten that big 3-year contract at 37 years old.

How much is that worth to Yankees Inc?

eddhead
July 18th, 2011, 12:23 PM
Agreed, but in fairness to the A's they also have a $65MM payroll, 21st in the league.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/team/salaries/_/name/oak/oakland-athletics

ZippyTheChimp
July 18th, 2011, 11:24 PM
But is low payroll a cause or an effect?

In baseball, the employees are also the product.

eddhead
July 19th, 2011, 09:57 AM
I hear ya, chicken or the egg? I too have always believed small market teams under invest and create their own small market dynamics. On the other hand, it should be noted that at least in part, Beane's focus on non-conventional statistical analysis was a byproduct of his desire to compete with larger market teams on his terms; he could not afford to outbid them, so he searched for hidden value using statistics that were not in vogue at the time. In fact one of Beane's problems is that his methodolgy has been adapted by other GM's most notably the Red Sox, the Rays, and to a far lessor degree, even the Yankess are purported to have increased their focus on statistics (although they do not rely oon Sabermetrics wholly).

hbcat
July 19th, 2011, 10:12 AM
I know this is going to get me in trouble but right now...

Nah, I don't blame you for knowing your own mind. I would never call Jeter mediocre -- he's just older. ;)

Also, I still think he has the potential to be clutch in the post-season or in big games. He and Mo handle tension better than any players I have ever followed.

ZippyTheChimp
July 19th, 2011, 10:45 AM
I too have always believed small market teams under invest and create their own small market dynamics. On the other hand, it should be noted that at least in part, Beane's focus on non-conventional statistical analysis was a byproduct of his desire to compete with larger market teams on his terms; he could not afford to outbid them, so he searched for hidden value using statistics that were not in vogue at the time. In fact one of Beane's problems is that his methodolgy has been adapted by other GM's most notably the Red Sox, and to a degree, even the Yankess.I think in the case of some teams, especially Oakland, small-market is self-defined. They are across the bay from the Giants, who are #8 in payroll. Just south is San Jose with a population of almost 1 million. The SF metro area is 6th largest in the US, and the Giants are #3 in attendance.

Oakland has made themselves small-market by developing a boring product. Who's the face of the franchise, the marquee player?

eddhead
July 19th, 2011, 10:53 AM
I don't disagree, as I mentioned, I think sometimes teams create their own small market dynamics by underinvesting. One thing about Oakland in particular, even when they won with the likes of Reggie, Catfish, Vida Blue et al.... they did not draw, and struggled financially. Still, that was a long time ago, and I agree with your point and often make it while discussing this issue with friends.

hbcat
July 19th, 2011, 11:10 AM
The Oakland Coliseum is the single-worst professional baseball stadium at which I have ever watched a game, including fields in Japan that were not great. It wasn't designed for baseball, and it sure feels like it.

I know the new stadiums are humongous expenditures for their cities, and if I were and Oakland resident I might not like the city investing in a large project for the benefit of a private company, but it is hard for me to believe that the A's will ever big market, however we define it or the team defines itself, if the team does not play in a proper stadium. There's not much chance I would invest in season tickets to see the A's there, for example. I'd prefer to cross the Bay to see the Giants. I imagine a lot of Bay Area people feel the same way.

ZippyTheChimp
July 19th, 2011, 12:26 PM
^
The Oakland stadium issue is a complex problem involving a commissioner who can't make a decision. The owner Wolff doesn't see a future at all for the team in Alameda County. He's been seduced by the offers from San Jose, where corporate giants such as Cisco and Yahoo have backed a move. So far, Selig has blocked a referendum in San Jose for a new stadium. It all goes back 20 years, when the Giants wanted to get out of Candlestick and move to a new stadium in the area. At the time, Santa Clara county was a sleepy suburb of San Francisco, and it was assumed that they would move there. A "handshake agreement" between the A's and the Giants made Santa Clara Giants' territory, but they've since built AT&T Park in SF, so the point is moot.

Wolff isn't going to do anything while the possibility of a move to San Jose still exists.

However, the A's drew over 2 million to crappy County Stadium in the early 2000s, when they had a good team.

The situation is even more pronounced in Cleveland. "The Jake" is a nice ballpark, and when the Indians were good, sold out 455 straight games. At the beginning of this season, they set a record for lowest attendance for one game.

eddhead
July 19th, 2011, 06:27 PM
^

However, the A's drew over 2 million to crappy County Stadium in the early 2000s, when they had a good team.

I agree with everything you wrote. One note however, Their highest American League attendance ranking throughout the early 2000's was 6/14. Kind of middlin' at best, despite having a contending team. Even the powerhouse teams of the early 70's consistently finished in the bottom half of the AL in attendance. In fact the 74 team, winners of the 3rd of 3 consecutive WS's finished 11/12

ZippyTheChimp
September 30th, 2011, 03:22 PM
Jeter's time on the DL was just about mideason.

Before and after July 4th:

GAMES......PA......AB......RUNS....HITS...2B.....3 B.....HR.....RBI.....BB.....SO.....SB.....CS.....B A.....OBP.....SLG.....OPS
62...........293.....262......39.........68......9 .......1......2.......20......23......31......7... ....2......260....324.....324.....649
69...........314.....284......45.........94.....15 ......3......4.......41......23......50......9.... ...4......331....384.....447......831

eddhead
September 30th, 2011, 04:07 PM
That .831 ops would have lead AL SS's had it been over the full year. According to ESPN, it was .811 after the all-star break which was 4th among regular shortstops in the majors. I can't find a split that shows where he places after 7/4, but if the .831 had applied after the all-star game, it would have placed him 3rd amoung active shortstops over the same period which ain't too shabby.

I also think he had a very good year in the field.

eddhead
September 30th, 2011, 04:26 PM
^^Interestingly, the .811 or .831 post all-star game OPS beats Jose Reyes (.784).

And while we are discussing OPS (or at least I am) didn't fat Elvis have a great year? (sorry this is Off-topic). Considering his 2010, he has to be come back player of the year.

ZippyTheChimp
September 30th, 2011, 04:39 PM
Some people thought he never left.

Oh wait, that's the other Elvis.

hbcat
September 30th, 2011, 09:34 PM
Would have been great if he had hit .300 for the year. He was there the day before.

Now you have to think he's got a great chance to finish up making the top ten in all time hits. Maybe even the top six or seven.

eddhead
October 2nd, 2011, 01:08 PM
^
RE: Jeter hitting .300 - If he were Jose Reyes he would have ;)

ZippyTheChimp
June 2nd, 2012, 12:08 PM
Exactly 20 years ago, the Houston Astros held the #1 pick in the MLB draft. The Yankees had the #6 pick in 1992; in 1991 they had the #1 pick (after one of their worst seasons ever) and selected LHP Brien Taylor. That was a sad story; Taylor never reached the majors after a fight related injury to his shoulder dimmed his career.

That year, the term Poppel Money - referring to the pitching phenom in the 1990 draft, Todd Van Poppel - came into use. He signed out of high school with a very large bonus, unheard of at the time. The Atlanta Braves had the #1 pick, and passed on Poppel, selecting Chipper Jones instead. Poppel had a disappointing MLB career. Brien Taylor also got a huge signing bonus in 1991.

In 1992, Jeter was one of two top prospects that wanted large signing bonuses, Jeter to forego playing at the University of Michigan. The Astros were unable to sign their first round pick the year before, so they passed on Jeter. The selections were:

1. Houston Astros.....................Phil Nevin (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/n/nevinph01.shtml)
2. Cleveland Indians.................Paul Shuey (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/shueypa01.shtml)
3. Montreal Expos.....................B.J. Wallace (http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=wallac001bil)
4. Baltimore Orioles..................Jeffrey Hammonds (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hammoje01.shtml)
5. Cincinnati Reds.....................Chad Mottola (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/mottoch01.shtml)
6. NY Yankees..........................Derek Jeter (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/j/jeterde01.shtml)

The Yankees were also reluctant to pick Jeter, thinking he might opt to take a scholarship at Michigan. In a conversation with their Midwest scout, Dick Groch (http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=16743511), who monitored Jeter in high school, they asked, "Is this kid going to Michigan?" To which he replied, "No, the only place he's going is Cooperstown."

In the intervening years, the Houston Astros have no held the overall first draft pick, but here they are again, with #1.

It would be interesting to jump ahead several years, and see how this one turns out.

ZippyTheChimp
July 26th, 2012, 08:21 AM
Completely made-up statistic, but what the hell.

The most hits in a season vs age is 225, by Paul Molitor in 1996. But most of those was as a DH.

Coincidentally, the the record for most hits in a season by a position player vs age is by a SS at 38 years old.

In 1912, Honus Wagner, playing SS for the Pittsburgh Pirates, collected 181 hits.

With 127 hits so far this season, Jeter is on a pace to get 209 hits. But subtracting 21 hits as a DH, the projected total is 175.

Interesting to see how this turns out, and if the broadcast media picks up on it.

eddhead
July 26th, 2012, 10:18 AM
Not to sound dumb, I am not sure what you mean by most hits vs. age. Can you expand on that? Thanks.

ZippyTheChimp
July 26th, 2012, 11:11 AM
I should have added that Paul Moilitor was 39 years old in 1996. His 225 hits that year is not the single-season record, but it's the most hits for any player aged 39 or older.

The same for Honus Wagner. His 181 hits in 1912 is the most for any position player aged 38 or older.

eddhead
July 26th, 2012, 02:50 PM
Ahh. Thanks.

hbcat
July 27th, 2012, 06:29 AM
Hits vs decrepitude: 209 hits is excellent for a guy who was washed up not long ago.

ZippyTheChimp
August 22nd, 2012, 03:03 PM
Revisiting my useless statistic:

The number at issue is total hits for a position player age 38 or older. Recordholder is Honus Wagner with 181 hits.

Last checked a month ago, Jeter was on pace to finish the season with 175 hits at SS (minus hits collected as a DH).

After 123 games, Jeter has 168 hits, 29 as a DH. This projects to a season total of 221 hits, 183 as a SS. The 221 would surpass his own career best of 219 hits in 1999.

On another note: Although I think it's a distant long shot for Jeter to catch Pete Rose in total hits, a psychological barrier was reached with Jeter's HR yesterday. He now has 3256 hits, exactly 1000 less than Pete Rose. It's still a big number, but 970 feels a lot less than 1030. He was 2000 hits away in July 2007. Not really that long ago.

hbcat
August 24th, 2012, 07:12 PM
^ I wrote my note below before I saw this.

Even if Jeter keeps up his August pace in hitting, he won't catch Trout for a batting title, but he should lead MLB in hits and may break his own single-season record of 219 hits, when he hit .349 in 1999.

Right now he has 169 hits over the Yankees 124 games to the season thus far, which is about 1.36 hits per game. With 38 games left he is on pace for another 52 hits, which would give him 221 hits for 2012.

It never works out as projected, of course. He may slump or strain a muscle and have to sit out, or he may stay ultra-hot and even catch Trout. Regardless, he's having one of his best seasons of a fantastic career.

He's 38. Who knows how long he can keep this up.

hbcat
August 24th, 2012, 07:16 PM
He just doubled in his first AB while I was writing that. :)

What's more fun than baseball?

ZippyTheChimp
August 24th, 2012, 11:00 PM
Even if Jeter keeps up his August pace in hitting, he won't catch Trout for a batting title,It's not really a question of Jeter catching Trout, but the other way around.

Jeter has about 110 more ABs than Trout, so his BA won't move as much. But with 414 ABs so far, Trout can "catch" Jeter, if he goes into a slump. Well, not really a slump.

Trout's BA so far in August is exactly .300, and he lost 12 points in his season BA to .341. Figuring about 150 ABs for the remaining games, if Trout bats .300 for the rest of the season, he would end up at .330.

Jeter would have to bat about .350 the rest of the season and collect 224 hits to reach .331.

Their seasons are somewhat mirrored. Jeter had a June swoon, while Trout was hot for the month. Jeter is .385 for August, while Trout is experiencing the dog days. The difference is that Jeter was under .300 for his bad month, while Trout has batted over .300 every month. So if Trout has that sub .300 month, there's a chance.

But let's not forget Miguel Cabrera, who's right there at #2.

hbcat
August 25th, 2012, 12:50 AM
Yes, Cabrera is in the thick of it, for sure. He'll probably win an MVP this year whether or not he passes Trout and stays ahead of Jeter.

Trout was in a mini slump at the start of August, apparently, but is hitting .349 in his last ten games. He's also been pretty steady since he came up: .341 pre-All Star and .342 since, so there does seem to be any reason to believe he'll go flat from here through September.

I'd love to see Jeter win a batting title, but I don't think it is a good bet. I'd love to see him get 220+ hits this season, regardless of awards and accolades. He's doing fine in those categories.

ZippyTheChimp
September 6th, 2012, 03:24 PM
Trout was in a mini slump at the start of August, apparently, but is hitting .349 in his last ten games. He's also been pretty steady since he came up: .341 pre-All Star and .342 since, so there does seem to be any reason to believe he'll go flat from here through September.I don't think that 10 games is enough of a sample to base a prediction. Trout has batted .250 his last 10 games. He could finish the year batting .250, but I doubt it. However, his numbers through August and now into Sept have shown a consistent drop off. Over the last 33 games from August 1, Trout has batted .275. Nothing bad, but it'll drive down a high BA built on fewer ABs.

For a few reasons, I thought there was a good chance that, while very difficult for Cabrea or Jeter to catch Trout, he might come down to them.

He only played in 40 games last year; this is his first full season in MLB, and rookies often hit a wall late in the season. His BA was very high with over 100 less ABs than the other two players. And he is in the middle of a playoff run; unlike the others, new territory for him.

Since July 31

Jeter: batted .349, BA moved from .312 to .319
Cabrera: batted .353, BA moved from .322 to .330
Trout: batted .275, BA moved from .353 to .330

So Trout has caught Cabrera. If they both get hot, Trout has the advantage. The opposite if they both slump. At this point, I think 4 decimal places are necessary.

Cabrera: .3301
Trout: .3298

What makes this more interesting is that Cabrera leads the league in RBIs by two, and is fourth in HR, three behind the leader. RBI is a two man race between Cabrera and Hamilton, while six players have a shot at the HR crown.

hbcat
September 8th, 2012, 07:56 AM
You called it right on Trout. Cabrera has an outside shot at a triple crown. Unless Jeter goes wild for the rest of the month, he won't win a batting title. I don't think we can count on Cabrera to stop hitting; he's not prone to streaks.

Jeter will have 200 hits in about ten days, if luck holds. Not bad at all no matter how you break it down.

ZippyTheChimp
September 8th, 2012, 01:16 PM
If Jeter finishes with a very good month (above .350, 35 more hits), he could raise his BA to about .325. So Cabrera and Trout would have to drop.

If Cabrera hit .290 the rest of the way, his BA would drop under .325. For Trout, .300 would get him under .325.

Any one of these is reasonably possible, but I think all three falling into place is unlikely. I really can't see Cabrera hitting .290 down the stretch.

hbcat
September 8th, 2012, 02:50 PM
Unlike that little dweeb in Boston, Cabrera will have deserved any individual awards he earns this season. All Jeter really "needs" is another ring. An mvp or batting title would be icing on that cake. It hasn't really looked like any of this will come to pass for some weeks now, however.

eddhead
September 8th, 2012, 05:32 PM
Little dweeb? LOL

ZippyTheChimp
September 8th, 2012, 05:52 PM
I can't dislike him; he looks a bit like Bret Gardner.

eddhead
September 9th, 2012, 12:08 PM
He's a slightly better player than Gardner (he says sarcastically)

hbcat
September 9th, 2012, 08:07 PM
He's a very good, sometimes great, player, but not MVP level.

This is fun:

Trout .328
Cabrera .326
Jeter .324

WWYS (what would Yogi say)?

ZippyTheChimp
September 9th, 2012, 10:29 PM
"The guy at the end is leading from behind."

hbcat
September 10th, 2012, 12:11 AM
:)

ZippyTheChimp
September 10th, 2012, 08:06 AM
Cabrera may have damaged his MVP credentials this past weekend.

The Det-LA series was a fight for a playoff spot. Cabrera was 1-9 (.111). Trout was 3-11 (.272), but two of the hits were HR. And LA swept the series.

Detroit now finds itself last in the wildcard standings, with a big series in Chicago. The Tigers are lucky that the White Sox are 3-7 in their last ten, and have a better shot at the division than the wild card.

The Angels host the A's for four big games.

hbcat
October 18th, 2012, 07:56 AM
October 17, 2012
Doctor Says Jeter’s Recovery Could Take 4 or 5 Months

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/18/sports/baseball/doctor-says-derek-jeters-recovery-could-take-4-or-5-months.html?_r=0&pagewanted=print
By PAT BORZI


DETROIT — Derek Jeter will have surgery on his fractured left ankle on Saturday, but his recovery will take longer than the Yankees initially expected — four to five months instead of three. He could miss part of spring training and perhaps the World Baseball Classic in March. General Manager Brian Cashman and Manager Joe Girardi, however, expect him to be ready for opening day.


Dr. Robert B. Anderson, the foot and ankle specialist who examined Jeter earlier this week, will perform the operation in Charlotte, N.C.


“There’s no new information,” Cashman said. “I believe that Dr. Anderson just put a more conservative time frame on it, as explained to me. Nothing worse than what our team doctor saw. My understanding is, it’s possible he will be ready earlier than that time frame, but it is best to at least put out there four or five months as a safer bet.”


Anderson, a team doctor for the Carolina Panthers and a past president of the American Orthopaedic Foot and Ankle Society, has treated athletes like Ahmad Bradshaw, Hakeem Nicks, Jeremy Shockey and Chipper Jones.


“Bob has a great reputation, and a lot of agents use him,” said Dr. Matthew M. Roberts, a foot and ankle specialist at the Hospital for Special Surgery in New York City. Roberts said Anderson’s recovery estimate mirrors what he sees in his own patients.


Jeter, who had been playing with a bone bruise in his left foot since early September, fractured the ankle while fielding a grounder hit by the Detroit Tigers’ Jhonny Peralta in Game 1 of the American League Championship Series. Roberts watched on television as Jeter stepped awkwardly and collapsed in pain. Roberts said Jeter most likely broke the fibula, the bone on the outside of the ankle. Such breaks, he said, typically heal in six weeks after surgery.


“The reason to do the surgery is to make sure he doesn’t have a problem with instability, the bone not healing in the right position, or the bone not healing at all,” Roberts said.


Once the bone heals, Roberts said, patients need at least six weeks of physical therapy, perhaps more. Roberts sees no reason Jeter should not be ready for the start of the regular season.


“He’s a motivated, hard-working guy,” Roberts said. “Just waiting for the break to heal before stomping on it again is going to be the tedious part of his recovery.”

hbcat
September 9th, 2013, 11:54 AM
I hate to say it -- no one wants to say it -- but it looks like Derek Jeter is done, or thereabouts, and not just for this year. Even if he comes back next year, it seems doubtful that his body can take the strain of every day play. Perhaps he can switch to DH, with back up infield duty, but his legs will can no longer stand the wear and tear of every day play in the field.

I cannot recall ever having seen a baseball star drop off so suddenly. Last year was one of his best-ever seasons; this year has been a nightmare. His talent is intact, but his legs are shot.

This is incredibly sad!

Tell me I am wrong.

eddhead
September 9th, 2013, 12:54 PM
Maybe so, but I ave a hard time buying it. As prideful as he is, I cannot imagine Jeter wanting to go out this way, much as Rivera did not want to go out in 2014 after being injured in all of 2012.

I see him trying at least one more comeback - at SS - for the challange if nothing else. He just strikes me as the kind of player who would is compelled to compete and go out on top. Again, I could be wrong, but that instinctivley, that is how I feel.

hbcat
September 9th, 2013, 11:52 PM
Mo is in top physical condition. Yes, he torn his ACL early last season, but that was a freak accident. Jeter cannot stay on his feet for more than a few games.

I want to believe I am wrong, but I think this is "it". As I say, I want to be wrong, but the chronic legs issues aren't letting up, and it has been a full year already.

ZippyTheChimp
September 10th, 2013, 08:18 AM
Jeter's problems this year are directly related to the twice fractured ankle; whether this is career ending is speculation at this point. The CT scan was negative.

But it doesn't seem to have anything to do with "chronic leg injuries," or that his "legs are shot."

When it is said that Mo is a good athlete and in good physical condition, it's in comparison to baseball's bullpen population, some of whom are just arms. I doubt that he's at the level of an MLB middle infielder.

Jeter did not have a normal baseball season. There was no spring training, and he re-fractured the ankle in-season. Rehabs and simulated games aren't like real games, where the impulse isn't to hold back. A similar thing happened to Tex. He came back in-season, re-injured the wrist, and now is out for the year. It's unknown whether this will be career-ending, but it doesn't mean that his arms are shot.

GordonGecko
September 10th, 2013, 10:10 AM
Jeter's problems this year are directly related to the twice fractured ankle; whether this is career ending is speculation at this point. The CT scan was negative.

But it doesn't seem to have anything to do with "chronic leg injuries," or that his "legs are shot."

When it is said that Mo is a good athlete and in good physical condition, it's in comparison to baseball's bullpen population, some of whom are just arms. I doubt that he's at the level of an MLB middle infielder.

Jeter did not have a normal baseball season. There was no spring training, and he re-fractured the ankle in-season. Rehabs and simulated games aren't like real games, where the impulse isn't to hold back. A similar thing happened to Tex. He came back in-season, re-injured the wrist, and now is out for the year. It's unknown whether this will be career-ending, but it doesn't mean that his arms are shot.

That's all well and good but if Rivera had all these leg problems his arm would be of no use to him. It does actually seem like Jeter is suffering from chronic leg injuries but that's probably a subset of the bigger picture that his body is done for professional sports. There is only a very small portion of the athlete population that can maintain a high level beyond their late 30's (Pete Rose, Gordie Howe, Mariano Rivera, etc...). It really does seem like this is it for Jeter and his body is not able to continue at the level that he has been accustomed to. He's going to have dial it down a bit (if that's possible) or he's just going to keep going on the DL and it's not going to end well

eddhead
September 10th, 2013, 10:19 AM
It seems specutaltive to suggest that Jeter's injuries are chronic. Prior to last year's world series, he had no real history of chronic leg ailments. It is not unreasonable to suggest that broken ankle never really healed this year, and the recurring injuries are the result of a lack of conditioning.

Who knows, you could be right, but I think he'll be back.

ZippyTheChimp
September 10th, 2013, 10:25 AM
That's all well and good but if Rivera had all these leg problemsWhat leg problems are you referring to? As far as I know, it's the injured ankle.


It does actually seem like Jeter is suffering from chronic leg injuriesLike for instance?


It really does seem like this is it for Jeter and his body is not able to continue at the level that he has been accustomed to. He's going to have dial it down a bit (if that's possible) or he's just going to keep going on the DL and it's not going to end wellNormal decline is not the issue here. It's whether or not what is going on right now is a result of that normal decline or the current injury.

hbcat
September 12th, 2013, 11:05 AM
Sorry for the delayed response -- work stuff...

Chronic means recurrent and long-lasting over the past 12-plus months. Jeter was nursing an injury and limping on his leg at the end of last season. When he went down in the middle of a game in October, I imagine every knowledgeable fan assumed it was his ankle. Since then he has had another fracture, a quad strain and a calf strain, and now another re-injury of the ankle. While it does seem like they are likely all related, these are separate injuries.

Zippy, I want to believe you are correct but I watch the games too and it looks like a bad pattern settling in, and something that would not have happened to him when Jeter was 25, 28, or 32. He is healing slowly and getting re-injured more easily.

hbcat
September 12th, 2013, 11:12 AM
It seems specutaltive to suggest that Jeter's injuries are chronic. Prior to last year's world series, he had no real history of chronic leg ailments.

Just from memory, I think he was on the DL in 2002 with a shoulder dislocation -- a freak accident in a game in Toronto in which a catcher covering third landed on Jeter with all his weight and gear. So, a pure accident in that case and not age.

The other DL stint I recall was a leg injury though -- a calf strain a couple of years ago just as he was nearing 3,000. Sure, it could happen to any athlete, but had not happened to Jeter. He was 37 then and 39 now. Was his body starting to break down & recover more slowly by then? Are we seeing something more serious now?

eddhead
September 12th, 2013, 01:42 PM
Again, you might be right, but I don't see it. I will say this however - you don't see many 39 year-old shortstops - even health shortstops, playing everyday. Given that Arod's days are likely numbered, I can see him moving to third next year (still taxing but less so than ss) while the Yankees break-in a replacement. I would sugges Nunez, who I always thought was a major talent, but he certainly did not do much to distinquish himself this year.

ZippyTheChimp
September 12th, 2013, 03:21 PM
Chronic means recurrent and long-lasting over the past 12-plus months. Jeter was nursing an injury and limping on his leg at the end of last season.Jeter fractured his ankle toward the end of last season. Fractures are caused by stress over time, a sudden injury, or a combination.

My wife is very athletic; when she was 32, she fractured her ankle. It took a year for her to get back to where she was; a year of hell for me almost as bad as pregnancy #1, when I got all those colorful nicknames.

It's worse for a professional athlete. Depending on the severity, and if pins are used, the leg must be immobile for the bone to heal. Leg muscles atrophy, and must be reconditioned along with gradually putting weight on the ankle.

Athlete's want to start playing as soon as possible, and they think when the pain is gone and the bone is "healed," they are ready to go. That's not always the case.

Even without injury, baseball is a carefully measured conditioning process because it's non-aerobic. You stand around, and suddenly have to move explosively. Muscles get pulled.

Jeter had no spring training. Rehabs with simulated games aren't the same as real games. There was an incident during the time between Jeter's first return and his going on the DL the 2nd time. He was instructed to "take it easy" running out of the batter's box. I don't remember who they were playing, but Jeter was on first. There was a base hit that normally would have gotten him to third. Jeter coasted around the bases and getting near third realized the play was going to be close, so he picked it up and slid awkwardly into third. It was noticed in the booth, and there was a discussion about how unrealistic it is to ask an athlete to hold back.

It's not fair in hindsight to blame the Yankees, especially since Jeter shares the blame, but bringing him back the way they did wasn't very smart. They finally did the smart thing and shut him down for the season. Now you can get a fair assessment next spring on how things are minus the injury.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for Nunez, I think he has great speed and a good bat. He hits the ball hard, ropes.

But I don't see him as anything more than adequate as a SS. It's easier to see when a batter is uncomfortable, but I see that in Nunez at SS. His footwork is bad, and no soft hands. Not relaxed.

He's the Anti-Cano.

eddhead
September 12th, 2013, 04:02 PM
My wife is very athletic; when she was 32, she fractured her ankle. It took a year for her to get back to where she was; a year of hell for me almost as bad as pregnancy #1, when I got all those colorful nicknames.
I don't know that I would attribute the colorfull nicknames to the pregnancy. ;-)




As for Nunez, I think he has great speed and a good bat. He hits the ball hard, ropes.

But I don't see him as anything more than adequate as a SS. It's easier to see when a batter is uncomfortable, but I see that in Nunez at SS. His footwork is bad, and no soft hands. Not relaxed.

Based on what we have seen to date, it is hard to argue with that. Though last year, I felt there was hope for him at SS believing is development was retarded by the fact he was a very young player who grew up in an underveloped country with limited English langauge skills being asked to play in New York City, assuming a utility role where he would have to get comfortable playing multiple positions. But he should be past that now.

I can't help but wonder if he will follow the Mantle, Mercer and Tresh mold, and end up in the outfield someday.

hbcat
September 12th, 2013, 07:27 PM
I agree giving Jeter a full fall and winter, with a totally fresh start in spring, is the best route at this point.

Nunez is playing much better in the field, but he is the anti-Cano for sure. He gets some great clutch hits though.

ZippyTheChimp
September 13th, 2013, 09:48 AM
I don't know what's going to happen to Nunez next year, but for the rest of this run, you saw the model last night - Nunez spelling ARod at third.

Brendan Ryan is the SS for the rest of the season. An excellent fielder, but can't hit. The move was made possible by Soriano and Granderson. The lineup is now deep enough that they can carry Ryan at the bottom of the order.

eddhead
September 13th, 2013, 10:27 PM
Soriano has been a God send.

mariab
November 14th, 2013, 08:14 PM
I like this. It will be sad to see him go, but I like where he's going.

Yankees great Derek Jeter plans a career in book publishing after playing days end

Jeter has decided what the next phase of his life will entail after baseball - Jeter Publishing, a partnership with venerable publishing house Simon & Schuster.


By Christian Red (http://wirednewyork.com/authors?author=Christian Red) / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS
Thursday, November 14, 2013, 3:58 PM

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1517499.1384462445!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_635/jeterweb15s-1-web.jpg

Howard Simmons/New York Daily News

Derek Jeter, 39, calls his publishing partnership with Simon & Schuster 'an exciting way for me to discover and develop new books.'




Now batting for Simon & Schuster publishing house, No. 2, Derek Jeter (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Derek+Jeter).
No, that is not a misprint. Yankee icon and captain Derek Jeter has decided what the next phase of his life will entail after baseball -- Jeter Publishing, a partnership with the venerable publishing house.
"This publishing partnership with Simon & Schuster is an exciting way for me to discover and develop new books, sharing insights of my own, or from people I believe have interesting stories, philosophies or practices to share," said Jeter in a statement that was part of a Simon & Schuster press release issued Thursday.

The 39-year-old Yankees shortstop, who missed all but 17 games this past season due to various injuries, agreed to a one-year deal earlier this month and will return for his 20th season in 2014. The team’s managing general partner, Hal Steinbrenner, said at the GM meetings this week that the front office believes Jeter can return to form next year, when he is expected to be the starting shortstop.


But because Jeter struggled to return from a broken left ankle injury suffered in Game 1 of the 2012 ALCS, how much does he have left in the tank? The publishing announcement is certain to fuel speculation that 2014 might be his last year playing in the majors. His other Core Four members -- Jorge Posada, Andy Pettitte and Mariano Rivera -- have all retired. Jeter became the Yankee full-time shortstop in 1996, when he won the first of his five World Series rings.

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1517498.1384462443!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_635/jeterweb15s-2-web.jpgMark Bonifacio/New York Daily News

Derek Jeter is the last of the fabled Yankees' Core Four but is starting to think about post-baseball plans.


The Jeter Publishing venture will publish adult non-fiction titles, middle grade fiction, ready-to-read children’s books and children’s picture books, according to the press release. The adult titles will be published in conjunction with the Gallery Books imprint.

“Derek Jeter will identify and help create sports-related non-fiction and fiction that appeals to audiences ranging from children who look up to him as a role-model to sports-savvy adults who have been witness to his remarkable career,” read the S&S press release. “Jeter Publishing will also publish books featuring interesting personalities and themes in sports, pop-culture, and other arts.”

According to a New York Times report, Jeter said he plans to be very much involved in the venture, not just having his name attached to the book spine.
“If I put my name on something, I’m going to be involved,” Jeter told the Times. “I’m not just going to put my name on it and not pay attention.” Jeter told the Times that the new venture “sort of sets the blueprint for post career.
“This is a great way to start.”


Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/jeter-plans-career-book-publishing-yankee-days-article-1.1517500#ixzz2kfjzu69M

mariab
February 12th, 2014, 04:09 PM
End of an era. :(

http://i1.nyt.com/images/2014/02/13/sports/13jeter_375/13jeter_375-largeHorizontal375.jpg (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/13/sports/baseball/derek-jeter-to-retire-from-yankees-after-2014-season.html?hp)Suzy Allman for The New York TimesJeter Says He’ll Retire at End of 2014 Season (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/13/sports/baseball/derek-jeter-to-retire-from-yankees-after-2014-season.html?hp)By THE NEW YORK TIMES 2:46 PM ETDerek Jeter, entering his 20th season with the Yankees, announced Wednesday on his official Facebook fan page that 2014 would be his final year of professional baseball.

ZippyTheChimp
February 12th, 2014, 07:29 PM
Many inside people, those who know Jeter well, have always expected that he would leave on his own terms, not hang around and be pushed out.

I wonder if this had anything to do with the decision:
Alex Rodriguez, who played many hundreds of games alongside Jeter on the left side of the infield, will not be part of any formal farewell. He is suspended for the entire 2014 season. The next time he plays, Jeter will be retired. Maybe the value of a 2015 season wouldn't offset playing the final one in the ARod Circus.

hbcat
February 12th, 2014, 09:02 PM
When the story mariab posted, about Jeter's intention to work as an editor, came out in November, I wondered if he would retire year. Jeter's clearly been thinking about it, but I didn't want to.

eddhead
February 14th, 2014, 11:08 AM
I realize we are going to be seeing this kind of stuff a lot over the next two years, but where do you suppose Jeter ranks amongst the greatest SS's in baseball history? Easily top 10, maybe even top 5.

Potential top SS's in no particular order

Wagner
Banks
Applink
Vaughan
Boudreau
Smith
Ripkin
Vizquel (sort of a dark horse)
Aparacio
A-Rod
Rizzuto
Reese
Cronin


To me Wagner is clearly at the top of the class. Most of the other SS's on the list were wither great defensive players, or great offensive players, very few stood out in both categories.

I think this is where Jeter distinguishes himself. Despite the criticism, Jeter is a more than solid defensive player especially when moving to his left or over his head into shallow left. He is also one of the greatest "money players" I have ever seen. You could make the argument that he falls right under Wagner and perhaps A-Rod (depending on your view of him) as the 2nd or 3rd best all-around shortstop of all time. In fact, I WOULD make that argument.

One of the wild card's here is Arky Vaughn, one of the most underrated players of all time. Certainly a top 5 SS in my view.

ZippyTheChimp
February 14th, 2014, 12:50 PM
I'm going to wait to see what sort of final year Jeter has.

I'll give a lot of weight to those who have played long careers almost exclusively at a demanding position. Haven't looked at all the list, but I know that Ozzie Smith and Luis Aparicio played SS at or beyond 40 years old. At 39, Aparicio played 132 games, and outperformed many of his career numbers. Smith played SS until he retired at 41, but played less than 100 games in each of his last three years. Both were great SS, but neither had close to the offensive output of Jeter. Ripkin started moving off SS at age 36.

hbcat
February 15th, 2014, 01:48 AM
The weight of his entire career to 2012, including all the postseason glory, already beats out those guys, imo. I hope he has a great year -- I almost expect him to do something extra-ordinary, like winning a batting title -- but regardless, he's still beats the guys you mention.

Wagner might still be ahead, but I don't know. We never saw him play and all we have are his numbers and his legend, which are impressive. He only played in two WS (1903, 1909), and the Pirates only one the second of those. The eras were so different though, with Wagner born in 1874 and Jeter in 1974, so finding bases for comparison is tough, except that each is a standout within his era.

hbcat
February 15th, 2014, 01:50 AM
How was Ernie Banks as a defensive SS? He beats all these guys with this power. Is it his fault he played for the Cubs?

hbcat
February 15th, 2014, 01:52 AM
Never mind. I just checked. He didn't play SS after 1961 (age 30). He doesn't really qualify in this discussion.

ZippyTheChimp
February 15th, 2014, 07:42 AM
Wagner might still be ahead, but I don't know. We never saw him play and all we have are his numbers and his legend, which are impressive. He only played in two WS (1903, 1909), and the Pirates only one the second of those. The eras were so different though, with Wagner born in 1874 and Jeter in 1974, so finding bases for comparison is tough, except that each is a standout within his era.You can only compare players a century apart to their peers, not to each other.

Forget actual numbers. Wagner won the batting title 8 times, RBI 5 times, doubles 7 times, stolen bases 5 times. When he retired in 1917, he lead the NL in hits, singles, doubles, triples, and runs.

He was the Babe Ruth of infielders. I don't think anyone touches him.

hbcat
February 15th, 2014, 08:08 AM
Point taken.

eddhead
February 18th, 2014, 12:15 PM
How was Ernie Banks as a defensive SS? He beats all these guys with this power. Is it his fault he played for the Cubs?

Although widely regarded as an offensive player who just happened to play SS Banks actually had some impressive defensive seasons as a SS winning one GG back in the time when only one was awarded for each MLB position, and before they became popularity contests. His defensive WAR stats for 1958 and 59 were among the best in history for SS's at the time.

Bank's 1961 mnove to 1B was not because of age or poor play, it was because of a debilitating knee injury. Of course you never know, but had he not been injured me may have been rated with just under Wagner. His power numbers for a SS were virtually unheard of at the time - he may have been the A-Rod of his time.

EDIT:My mistake about the MLB wide GG selections. The AL and NL began having seperate awards in 1957.

As for Banks, He led the NL in DWar in 1959, was second in 1955, 3rd in 1960 and 5th in 1958. He also led NL SS's in assists in 1959 and 1960, and in range factor in 1960 and won a GG that year. All in all, not to shabby.

TREPYE
February 22nd, 2014, 01:36 PM
Considering how private and introverted Jeter has been his whole career I was very surprized he made his retirement so public. Considering the overabundace of attention Rivera got last year (and rightfully so, he is a legend) I wouldn't think this is something Jeter would want to endure. Mike Francesa actually tied that loose end of logic (as he usually does so aptly) by deducing that he is doing to cash in on the "Last Season" memorbilia as one last ballon payment prior to retirement; a severance payment of sorts. Now it makes perfect sense why such a private person would go about it so publicly.

IrishInNYC
February 24th, 2014, 12:11 PM
If you took all the sense in the world and got rid of it, that's how much sense Francesa makes. (and perhaps your post was tongue in cheek). I'm sure the decision was as much a Yankees one as it was Jeter's. Everything he has done in the last 20 years has been for the good of the organization and the retirement announcement continues that trend.

It eliminates the "will he, won't he" speculation and lets the team focus on playing (better). The same was true of Mo.

Jeter has more money than he can spend. He's not worried about signing a few bats and balls.

eddhead
February 25th, 2014, 04:06 PM
Everything Jeter has done over the past 20 years has been for the good of the organization? I am not sure I agree with that.

I like Jeter as much as anyone here. He is a great teammate and a terrific team player. But he is also a very shrewd negotiator and very aware and protective of his image, and he was never shy about leveraging either for his own benefit. If you don't beleive that is true, take a look at his last contract negotiation.

Don't get me wrong, it is true that Jeter earned every penny he was paid. But it is also true, that he was paid for every dollar he was worth.

No one ever pulled the wool over Derek Jeter's eyes.

GordonGecko
February 25th, 2014, 04:13 PM
I haven't looked at Jeter the same way since he was a no-show at Bob Sheppard's funeral. Jeter has paid lip service to how great he was his whole career and yet when the time came not a single player cane to show respects. Jeter is just a jock looking to maximize his earnings like the rest of them, nothing more

ZippyTheChimp
February 25th, 2014, 04:24 PM
Jeter has paid lip service to how great he was his whole career...What exactly does this mean?

GordonGecko
February 25th, 2014, 05:18 PM
What exactly does this mean?
Exactly what it says.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lip+service

Before he died, Jeter commented on how great Sheppard was regularly and he spoke of him often and how much respect he had for him. Then the guy dies and Jeter is nowhere to be found.

ZippyTheChimp
February 25th, 2014, 05:44 PM
This is what you posted soon after Jeter's 3000th hit.

Plus his image has really gone down the tubes lately, first after he snubbed his supposed idol's funeral (Bob Sheppard), then squeezed the Yankees to grossly overpay for his new contract, and now after (1) he snubbed the All-Star game and (2) didn't give the kid anything who gave him the 3000th hit home run ball for free and is getting hit with a $14,000 tax bill. Jeter doesn't have the same shine he used to.
Bob Sheppard was Jeter's idol? Sheppard was not in the dugout or clubhouse; he didn't travel with the team. Did players really know him? Maybe Jeter and the other players should have gone to the funeral, but I can't see this as an attitude changer for someone not personally connected to either of them.

Snubbed the All Star game? A non-story.

Squeezed the Yankees on his contract? History proves you wrong.

The kid got plenty of stuff, and the Yankees and sponsors took care of his tax bill and some of his other bills.

My response at the time was:
Those that think his image has "gone down the tubes" probably never liked him.

You're entitled to that opinion, but don't try to make it seem otherwise.

Have you ever posted anything positive about Jeter?

GordonGecko
February 25th, 2014, 05:53 PM
I haven't posted much about specific players here. My favorite by far was Mariano, my remaining favorites are Ichiro & Gardner. I respect Derek Jeter's skills and performance, but in terms of having an extra aura of "classiness" or being more of a good guy than any other typical player, to me that went out the door with the Sheppard thing. Sheppard wasn't a player but you sure wouldn't have known that the way Jeter used to talk about him and had his voice recording announce him at all his plate appearances. I'm past the contract stuff, I don't hold any of that against the guy but it was frustrating at the time. The Sheppard thing was totally classless

ZippyTheChimp
February 25th, 2014, 06:23 PM
As I remember, no Yankees attended Sheppard's funeral, except Brian Cashman and some front office people. No Gardner either. But I guess Gardner wasn't as "important" as Jeter. As if that should be a measuring stick.

Jeter attended Cory Lidle's funeral in California. Only other Yankees there were Torre, Reggie Jackson, Giambi, Jared Wright, and Cashman. What does that mean? Nothing really. These are private matters that we don't have much of a window into.


I haven't posted much about specific players here.Debatable I think, but anything at all on Jeter? I mean, it's not like there was nothing much to post about.

GordonGecko
February 25th, 2014, 06:41 PM
As I remember, no Yankees attended Sheppard's funeral, except Brian Cashman and some front office people. No Gardner either. But I guess Gardner wasn't as "important" as Jeter.
I guess we agree on something, Gardner wasn't the team Captain nor purporting Sheppard to be an idol of his.

ZippyTheChimp
February 25th, 2014, 11:15 PM
Sorry, but the "important" was sarcasm. We don't agree at all.

When did Jeter call Sheppard his idol?

This is the sort of Hollywood fussing that gets celebrities in trouble, even when they have the best of intentions. Last week I came across a Daily News gossip article that was written last summer.

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/confidential/jeter-finally-ring-hannah-davis-article-1.1427196

So Jeter and his girlfriend go out one morning for coffee. not only are there photographs, but a zoom-in on on her ring. If that's not enough, maybe some research:
But the diamond bling is definitely an engagement ring, according to one Diamond District jewelry expert, who told Confidenti@l the piece is “elegant.”

The point here is, this level of scrutiny goes on all the time. Jeter has played his entire career in the media spotlight of New York and the Yankees, has become very wealthy and famous, has dated many gorgeous women, some of whom are famous in their own right; and in all that time what we come up with is Jeter missing a funeral. Not whether this was right or wrong, but that it's an image changer.

I'm reminded of what Eddhead said about the new standard that seems to have taken hold of sports: Pete Rose - bad; Ryan Braun - good.

To those who have regarded Jeter's career in a positive way, missing the funeral might be regarded as - no big deal; an unfortunate cringe-worthy incident (I wish he had gone); or something that shows that no one is perfect.

To those who have not liked him or thought he was a phony (too good to be true) - this one incident seals the deal. Feet of clay.

eddhead
February 26th, 2014, 10:09 PM
I'm past the contract stuff, I don't hold any of that against the guy but it was frustrating at the time. The Sheppard thing was totally classless

To be clear, I have absolutely nothing against Jeter's contract negotiations. The Yankees would have had to have been insane to not take care of him. He is a great player, and a great teammate - and he was compensated accordingly.

My only point was that as great as he is, he is not St. Derek, nor should he be expected to be. He did a great job in managing his career. Nothing wrong with that. My point was in response to another posters suggestion that everything he did over the past 20 years was for the benefit of the Yankees. This was a mutually beneficial relationship.

TREPYE
March 2nd, 2014, 01:23 PM
If you took all the sense in the world and got rid of it, that's how much sense Francesa makes. (and perhaps your post was tongue in cheek). I'm sure the decision was as much a Yankees one as it was Jeter's. Everything he has done in the last 20 years has been for the good of the organization and the retirement announcement continues that trend.

It eliminates the "will he, won't he" speculation and lets the team focus on playing (better). The same was true of Mo.

Jeter has more money than he can spend. He's not worried about signing a few bats and balls.
One should carefully consider the backdrop of context when looking at a situation that seems extremely obvious as in its absence you are liable to come off as naive and perhaps even uninformed. Yes you are quite correct Jeter has made more $ than he knows what to do with.... if he wanted to just live out his life in a limbo of a perenially celebrated has-been superstar. But one of his declared greatest ambitions is to own a baseball team, a feat that still still eludes him financially in his current state. Albeit at face value the extra $ he brings in with memorbilia isnt enough to fill this ambition now it does increase his base capita to a potential where if he invests it wisely through the years he will attain enough to become a franchise owner at some point.

ZippyTheChimp
March 2nd, 2014, 07:19 PM
But one of his declared greatest ambitions is to own a baseball team, a feat that still still eludes him financially in his current state.Actually, Jeter never said it was one of his GREATEST ambitions; the subject of what Jeter would want to do came up several years ago, and it was reported that he did not want to be a manager or coach or TV analyst. One of the baseball related possibilities was a team ownership. I believe he said this to Gene Michael.

I'm not sure how you determined that "the feat still eludes him financially" when no one is certain of his net worth. One source estimates it at $125 million. Forbes estimates that Jeter earned $25 million in 2013 from his endorsements. In that area, his marketable worth will be maintained as a Yankee oldtimer, and further enhanced when elected to the HOF.

It's hard to say how much all this would lend itself to the purchase of a baseball team, but you can say that stacked up next to it, a season's worth of retirement gifts is Peanuts.

At any rate, I can't see Jeter after 20 years turning himself into a Pete Rose clone, cashing in on autographs and such. He has his Turn 2 Foundation to run, and he formed Jeter Publishing in partnership with Simon & Schuster.

I agree with Irish about Pope Francesa:
If you took all the sense in the world and got rid of it, that's how much sense Francesa makes. (and perhaps your post was tongue in cheek).Francesa is a must-watch (or listen), only because he attracts big time guests, especially during football. But forget about any insightful observations on player motivations, contract law, and the like. He is clueless. He was given a primer by the radio station attorney on the legal aspects of the ARod situation. That lesson lasted about two days, after which he fell back into his uninformed drivel.

Look how ARod played him for a fool.

eddhead
March 3rd, 2014, 12:01 PM
Francesa is now,and always has been a loud-mouthed blow hard.

GordonGecko
March 3rd, 2014, 01:54 PM
I never ever understood why he had any sort of ratings. He simply offers an extended monologue where he uses callers to berate them about how wrong their opinions are to prop up his own intransigent opinion. He takes himself WAY too seriously

TREPYE
March 3rd, 2014, 06:03 PM
Actually, Jeter never said it was one of his GREATEST ambitions; the subject of what Jeter would want to do came up several years ago, and it was reported that he did not want to be a manager or coach or TV analyst. One of the baseball related possibilities was a team ownership. I believe he said this to Gene Michael.

I'm not sure how you determined that "the feat still eludes him financially" when no one is certain of his net worth. One source estimates it at $125 million. Forbes estimates that Jeter earned $25 million in 2013 from his endorsements. In that area, his marketable worth will be maintained as a Yankee oldtimer, and further enhanced when elected to the HOF.

It's hard to say how much all this would lend itself to the purchase of a baseball team, but you can say that stacked up next to it, a season's worth of retirement gifts is Peanuts.

At any rate, I can't see Jeter after 20 years turning himself into a Pete Rose clone, cashing in on autographs and such. He has his Turn 2 Foundation to run, and he formed Jeter Publishing in partnership with Simon & Schuster.

I agree with Irish about Pope Francesa: Francesa is a must-watch (or listen), only because he attracts big time guests, especially during football. But forget about any insightful observations on player motivations, contract law, and the like. He is clueless. He was given a primer by the radio station attorney on the legal aspects of the ARod situation. That lesson lasted about two days, after which he fell back into his uninformed drivel.

Look how ARod played him for a fool.

Whether its "greatest" or not, who cares, the point is that its a declared ambition. Also the memorbilia I speak of is the one for 2014 with "Jeter's Last Season" stamped and authenticated all over it; the reason this is relevant and likely somewhat more valuable is because these will be more limited than anything he signs once he is retired. So you have made it very clear that you disagree with me thats cool; but I am only going to ask this question once and hopefully you can answer it directly without any caveats or tangents that remove from the objective of the question....

For a celebrity whom has always inclined towards the side of privacy, why would he announce his retirement now and do the dog & pony Mariano got (doing the press conferences that he disdains and the like) instead of saying that he will not decide until the end at the end of the season of during the offseason and end all expectation then (and associated distractions) and inquiries about the duration of his career unitl then? Why be so public when he by nature is so private?

Lemme simplyfy it: Why now and not after the season; what does he gain?

ZippyTheChimp
March 3rd, 2014, 07:10 PM
So you have made it very clear that you disagree with me thats cool; but I am only going to ask this question once and hopefully you can answer it directly without any caveats or tangents that remove from the objective of the question....Actually, I wasn't sure I was disagreeing with you or Francesa, since you posted this:

Mike Francesa actually tied that loose end of logic (as he usually does so aptly) by deducing that he is doing to cash in on the "Last Season" memorbilia as one last ballon payment prior to retirement; a severance payment of sorts. Now it makes perfect sense why such a private person would go about it so publicly.Most of us familiar with Francesa would have taken that to be sarcasm. If not sarcasm, then Francesa must have had some inside information which you did not provide.

But if it's ultimately your opinion, then my opinion is disagreement.


For a celebrity whom has always inclined towards the side of privacy, why would he announce his retirement nowGood question.

Jeter hasn't really been private; his non-baseball life has been there for everyone to see. What he has done is control it, or control the media spin. He has been a frustrating subject for reporters; he mentioned at his retirement announcement that he "hasn't always been very open with you guys (media)."

Jeter only wanted to talk about baseball. Not the social aspects of baseball, but only the job of baseball. After one of the biggest stories of the decade, the ARod suspension, all he had to say was that it was unfortunate, and the team would have to move on without him.


Why now and not after the season; what does he gain?Like his private life, Jeter gets to control his last season.

What would you have if he had said nothing? A 40 year old shortstop, coming back from a tough injury. A franchise icon with end of the season options for both him and the Yankees. It wouldn't matter if he has a great season or a poor one. The questions would be slightly different, but persistent.

Another possible reason: During the weeks leading up to one of the milestones (either Gehrig's hit total or 3000), it was discussed in the broadcast booth that Jeter's father advised him to enjoy these events.

Maybe Jeter liked the way Rivera went out.

Rivera had been talking about retirement since at least 2011. After his injury in 2012, many assumed he would not be back. But Mariano said after the injury, I'm not going out like this." So it may have been a surprise that when he came back in 2013, he announced his retirement before the season began.

What was to be gained?

TREPYE
March 5th, 2014, 06:32 PM
Like his private life, Jeter gets to control his last season.

What would you have if he had said nothing? A 40 year old shortstop, coming back from a tough injury. A franchise icon with end of the season options for both him and the Yankees. It wouldn't matter if he has a great season or a poor one. The questions would be slightly different, but persistent.

Another possible reason: During the weeks leading up to one of the milestones (either Gehrig's hit total or 3000), it was discussed in the broadcast booth that Jeter's father advised him to enjoy these events.

Maybe Jeter liked the way Rivera went out.

What was to be gained?

When I though about it that was the only exception that I could come up with; he anounces it now he looks good either way.... if he has a crap season then he foresaw his inevitable decline, if he has a great season he is adulated as one who goes out on top. But he has alwaye been very steadfast in declaring how much he dislikes press conferences, etc... despite his pristine persona and character he was never one to call attention to himself. Setting up a season where he will be the deliberate center of attention, I believe, required an extra push. Team hierarchy might have persuaded him as well, as we know they dont like leaving any dollars on the table.

So the question then becomes, if there wasnt a considerable sum of $$ to be made in the memorbilia aspect, would he have more favorable to circumvent the excess media attention he does not care for and announce his retirement at the end of the season or during the next offseason. I thought Francesa was on to something.

hbcat
March 5th, 2014, 11:28 PM
I am not convinced that Jeter or the Yankees are up to anything manipulative. I think Jeter just wants to retire and since he's come to this decision, he wants to dampen a season-ful of questions about when and how and if he can play this year and beyond. However, I think this victory lap pattern is going to get tiresome sooner or later. Even Jeter can be over-hyped.

In recent years MLB has allowed games to stop, e.g. when Jeter got to 3,000, so there could an on-field mini celebration *in the middle of a live game*. It doesn't really matter that this wouldn't have been done past decades for other great stars at a milestone moment, and no one really objected, but the contrivance is going to start getting old if it hasn't already.

There is enough room for spontaneous outbursts of emotion in pro sports -- no need to conjure them. In this case though, I think I would have done the same if I were Jeter.

ZippyTheChimp
March 6th, 2014, 12:12 AM
So the question then becomes, if there wasnt a considerable sum of $$ to be made in the memorbilia aspect, would he have more favorable to circumvent the excess media attention he does not care for and announce his retirement at the end of the season or during the next offseason. I thought Francesa was on to something.The media attention would be present in either case for the reasons I already stated. There is no way he can avoid it.

Jeter has never been out of the media spotlight, hasn't shied away from it or not been accessible to the media. What he's done is try to control it with opaque responses. If he didn't announce his retirement, the questions during the season would be open-ended, not just for him, but also for the rest of the team and the front office. Every slump or hitting streak would bring out the questions. And knowing that he was going to retire but staying silent, he would have to become even more opaque to reporters, essentially carrying a little white lie all season. Not a huge deal, but still a distraction.

This way, no matter what the situation, the answer is something like, "I have one season to play right now, and it will be my last."

And don't underestimate the appeal of retirement parties.

hbcat
April 14th, 2014, 09:18 AM
Jeter sits out with "tightness" in his right quad, but we are told he could have played "in an emergency". What, pray, might that emergency be if Carlos Beltran has to supplement the riddled infield? This doesn't sound good.

ZippyTheChimp
April 14th, 2014, 06:04 PM
Putting an outfielder in the infield risks one game. Having a player with an injury - sitting in the dugout for most of the game - go in cold risks more.

My guess is that "in an emergency" is a way of to avoid saying, "He's not going in. If we lose the game, we lose the game." Managers hardly ever say stuff like that.

We'll know soon enough.

hbcat
April 14th, 2014, 08:19 PM
That sounds reasonable for sure, but on one replay I saw Beltran plant is foot on the line-side of the bag. Imagine the uproar if he got himself spiked while playing out of position. I guess for a few outs it was worth the risk, but still...

eddhead
April 15th, 2014, 09:47 AM
The bigger question to me is weather or not this is a foreshadowing of things to come - not just for Jeter but for this vet team. Ellsbury, Roberson, and now Jeter have already suffered what can be minimally categorized as "nagging injuries" - the type of hurts that effect older players.

In a previous post Zippy commented that last year's season has to be viewed through the prism of unexpected injuries which I responded to by indicating that given the age of the team, and the propensity for older teams to get hurt, they really were not unexpected at all. I know it is a but early to jump to conclusions - Is is April, the weather is cold, and injuries of this sort happen under these conditions. Still, this remains an older team, and possibly prone to injuries similar to the ones that inflicted the team last year.

Something to look out for.

ZippyTheChimp
April 15th, 2014, 12:41 PM
I disagree.

The big injuries happened to young players - Robertson, Cervelli, and Brendan Ryan are key injuries; and they're not old. The ball that deflected off Pierzynski and hit McCan on the hand wasn't a nagging injury. No xray report has come out yet, but if his finger is broken, the Yankees are screwed. Romine becomes the starting catcher for a month, and they have to find or bring up a backup.

You can't predict for it, and it can totally screw up any team. It's not just the Yankees.

What happens to the Red Sox if Pedroia is seriously injured. They already lack a lead off hitter.

The Tigers lost SS Jose Iglesias for the season.

The Dodgers - five pitchers on the DL, including Kershaw.

Mets - closer Parnell out for season.

Rays - Sp Hellickson on DL till late May, SP Moore out for season.

Jays - SS Reyes will be back from DL, but now 2B Izturis has a torn LCL and maybe gone for the season.

If Solarte got seriously injured Sunday night on that play at 1B, it would have been huge. Not because he's batting .350, but his infield play. He's 26 years old. Who would have thought in spring training that keeping him in the lineup would be key.

ZippyTheChimp
April 15th, 2014, 12:44 PM
Just found out xray on McCan's hand was negative. That's a relief.

eddhead
April 15th, 2014, 05:29 PM
I disagree

The big injuries happened to young players - Robertson, Cervelli, and Brendan Ryan are key injuries; and they're not old.




The bigger question to me is weather or not this is a foreshadowing of things to come - not just for Jeter but for this vet team.

Foreshadowing, meaning things to come, not things that are happening now. Soriano, Tex, CC, Beltrane, Jeter, Kuroda, Roberts, Ichiro, Thornton, even Ellsbury who while at 31 is not exactly aged, has suspect season sustainability. These are key players who are on the tail end of the careers. There is a strong chance that nagging injuries will impact the effectiveness of at least some of these players.

Sure, younger players get hurt too But the likelihood of older players getting hurt is far greater.

hbcat
April 15th, 2014, 07:16 PM
To return to Jeter, I am worried that this leg injury is part of the same pattern we've seen for two years. I called this a chronic problem a few pages ago, but Zippy thinks last year was all about one ankle break (actually two). However, his leg problems started earlier -- he was hobbling around for August & Sept 2012 before the bone actually gave way in the 2012 playoffs. Also, remember he had a calf injury in 2011 as he was nearly 3000. I hope these few days rest are enough, but if this is a harbinger of a DL stint then I think we cannot be too surprised.

Jeter really will be 40 in a couple of months. He's always said he would call it quits when playing was no longer fun, and managing injuries is miserable for him. He knows his body, knows how hard it has been to stay on the field, and has decided to call this his last season. As much as none of us wants to let go, this is the right year. Every at bat is special now -- always has been, but now we know there is no tomorrow.

ZippyTheChimp
April 15th, 2014, 07:23 PM
My point is that you can't worry about injuries in the future because any fan knows that whenever a player get hits by a pitch, or runs into a wall, or stumbles over a base, you hold your breath. Miguel Cabrera can get hit by a pitch tonight and break a bone in his wrist, and the Tigers turn into a completely different team. Nothing you can do about it.

As for the Yankees, the big injury worries coming in have generally turned out well.

The concern was with Jeter's ankle, and that appears to be fine. He looks OK at the plate and running down the line.

For Tex it was his wrist; if it didn't thoroughly heal, he wasn't going to be effective at the plate; but he looked really good hitting the ball before the hamstring.

Biggest of all was Pineda. Two years out with shoulder surgery, nobody knew what to expect.

Some of the players you've associated with nagging injuries doesn't make sense. CC has pitched over 200 innings every year he's been with the Yankees. Kuroda has also hardly been injured. His problem last year was that he ran out of gas - another reason Pineda is so important. Suzuki? He missed about 35 games in 10 years.


Foreshadowing, meaning things to come, not things that are happening nowYeah, I know what it means. Things to come - what you can't predict (what I said). Like almost losing both your catchers in one day.

eddhead
April 16th, 2014, 10:18 AM
The point is they are old. And older people are more likely to break down than younger people. It is possible Tex would have suffered the hammy 10 years- but the likelihood of his hurting it is greater now than it was than.

Even with CC and Kuroda there is at least a possibility that their the sub-standard portions of their season can be attributed to age.

You have to expect that an older team will experience more injuries than a younger team.

ZippyTheChimp
April 16th, 2014, 08:20 PM
I didn't want to get into this, but look up foreshadow.

Then reconsider my post 135.

eddhead
April 18th, 2014, 11:20 AM
Foreshadow Syns. - Foretell, predict, warn of. What I intended to convey in post 134 was given the age of the team, Jeter's injury can be construed as a predictor to possible future injuries or late season wear downs to their older players as well as others who have proven to be less than durable through out the recent portions of their careers - and there are lots of them

I don't believe the players you highlighted are relevant to that argument. Every team suffers the types of injuries you refer to at some point. My point is over the course of the season,the Yankees' injury rate is likely to be higher than the norm because of the team's advanced age, and I have not been dissuaded from that position,

Syntax aside, the bottom line is I stand by post 140 and my other supporting posts. Because they are an older team, their players are more likely to miss games because of injury or wear down late in the season. IMO, that was the root cause of all the lost time they suffered last year.

p.s. please don't make me look up "syntax"

ZippyTheChimp
April 18th, 2014, 06:59 PM
Eddhead, if you're going to make snarky remarks about what words mean, be sure you know what they mean.

What's the matter, didn't like the definition?

to represent, indicate, or typify beforehand : prefigure

Her early interest in airplanes foreshadowed her later career as a pilot.
The hero's predicament is foreshadowed in the first chapter.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreshadow



Foreshadow Syns. - Foretell, predict, warn of. What I intended to conveyI can only respond to what you post, not what you intended. What happened last weekend had nothing to do with age.


My point is over the course of the season,the Yankees' injury rate is likely to be higher than the norm because of the team's advanced age, and I have not been dissuaded from that position,
The Yankees are younger in 2014 than 2013.
http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/rosters

I don't think the Yankee roster has been under 30 since 2000.

Look at the Yankees going into 2009. Similar situation, they missed the playoffs the year before.

Jorge Posada: turned 38 during the season. In 2008, had mid season shoulder surgery, and missed the rest of the season. his backups were 35 year old Molina, and Cervelli, with 6 games MLB experience.

Hideki Matsui: 35. In 2008 went on the DL with a chronic knee injury, surgery in the off-season. No longer viable as an outfielder.

Mariano Rivera: 39 years old. Think there weren't concerns about him?

We all know how that season turned out.

2014 starting pitching:
Kuroda - 39
CC - 33
Nova - 27
Pineda - 25
Tanaka - 25

Average: 29.8

2009 starting pitching:
Pettitte - 37
Burnett - 32
CC - 28
Joba - 23

Average: 30

The "5th starter" was Wang (29) and Hughes (23). Wang was sent to the minors early in 2009 with muscle weakness. He came up for a while, but was put on the DL. Hughes couldn't maintain velocity as a starter, and went to the BP, where he did well. Joba wasn't exactly a workhorse with 160 innings.

Overlooked in this argument is that the player with the most frequent "nagging injuries" over the last few years isn't on the 2014 roster - replaced by a 26 year old.

ARod had appeared in 99, 122, and 44 games in 2011 - 2013. And in many of those games, he was recovering from something.


Because they are an older team, their players are more likely to miss games because of injury or wear down late in the season. IMO, that was the root cause of all the lost time they suffered last year.Stop reading Yahoo and ESPN articles. The Yankees have been an older team for a long time. It's not anything out of the ordinary, except like 2009, they are coming off a year where they didin't make the playoffs, and the writers gotta write.


p.s. please don't make me look up "syntax"I don't have to make you do anything. You're perfectly capable of making your own mistakes.

eddhead
April 19th, 2014, 01:18 PM
Eddhead, if you're going to make snarky remarks about what words mean, be sure you know what they mean.
What's the matter, didn't like the definition?
to represent, indicate, or typify beforehand : prefigure

Thanks for taking the time to construct such a thoughtful strawman, but I am pretty sure I know what the word means. I think my explanation stands for itself. And I just LOVE the word - even more so now!!

Cherry picking players age groups aside, your examples are not predictors of how the Yankees 2014 injury rate will stack up against league averages. Jeter's injury just might be.

The fact is, this is an older team. Tex, Roberts, Soriano, Beltarne, Sabathia, Kuroda, and of course Jeter - all major players, all older and some with a recent history of debilitating injuries. Even Ellsbury falls into the latter category,

You can suggest otherwise, just don't express surprise (as you did earlier with respect to the 2013 team) when key players wear down toward the end of the year, or when this team's players spend considerably more time on the dl than last years.




Stop reading Yahoo and ESPN articles. The Yankees have been an older team for a long time. It's not anything out of the ordinary, except like 2009, they are coming off a year where they didin't make the playoffs, and the writers gotta write.

That is not how I formulate my opinions but nice 'snarking'!


I don't have to make you do anything. You're perfectly capable of making your own mistakes.

i am not the one who was surprised or thought it was extraordinary that this team suffered though injuries last year. But of course you are perfectly capable of NOT making your own mistakes.

ZippyTheChimp
April 19th, 2014, 08:33 PM
Thanks for taking the time to construct such a thoughtful strawman,What straw man? You brought it up.


Cherry picking players age groups aside,Oh I see, when I look at the 2009 Yankees as an example, It's cherry picking. By the way, I forgot to mention, Rivera also underwent surgery in the 2008-2009 offseason.


your examples are not predictors of how the Yankees 2014 injury rate will stack up against league averages.Now that's a laugh. I'm making predictions? I've been saying that you can't. You're the one making predictions.


Jeter's injury just might be.What injury is that? He's played in two games since, got three hits


The fact is, this is an older team.As was the 2009 team. As were most of the Yankee teams since 2000.


You can suggest otherwise,When did I suggest that the team isn't old.


i am not the one who was surprised or thought it was extraordinary that this team suffered though injuries last year.If I said I was surprised, was it because these injuries happened; or was it because they wound up leading the league in players on the DL, and still manged to win 85 games in a division that produced the WS winner?

There's a difference. Instead of referring to my "thoughts" out of context, why don't you just go dig up the post.

Some of those 2013 "old" players on the DL:

Cesar Cabra: 24. fractured elbow.

Francisco Cervelli: 27. broken hand

Joba Chamberlain: 27. Oblique

Ivan Nova: 26. back. bullpen. AAA

Eduardo Nunez: 26. ribs

Curtis Granderson: 32. Twice, fractured forearm, fractured wrist

Add to that, Michael Pineda 24, put on DL before season opener, out for year.

eddhead
April 19th, 2014, 09:50 PM
II am not going to go back and forth with you on this. Your argument does not hold up to a sanity test.
Here is the bottom line.

The average age of the players from last year's team was 31.8. They were the oldest team in the league, their players spent an inordinate amount of time injured or on the dl, and key players who may not have been hurt seemed to wear down at the end of the season

The average age of this year's opening day line-up was 36.8, none of their players were under 30, and several of these players have lost significant time to injury in recent years. They are an older team, maybe the oldest in baseball again. Given last year's experience, it is not unreasonable to fear that Jeter's injury could be a 'foreshadowing' of things to come, and portend a repeat of events that took place in 2013, meaning there is at least a reasonable chance that they will suffer from injury, significant lost time once, or wear out late in the season again this year.

I never suggested that younger players never get hurt, or that older players always get hurt. Nor did I suggest that every older player will get hurt whereas younger players never get injured - that is the strawman represented in your post. I recognize the potential for injury to occur or not occur for every player of every age. I am merely suggesting that older players have a greater propensity for injury, and that Jeter's recent injury MAY BE a foreshadowing of things yet to come. And I make that observation not on the basis of ESPN and Yahoo articles, but rather on the basis of the observation and reason that comes from being a rabid fan of almost 50 years and with fresh memories of last season, which included injuries to Tex, Jeter, A-Rod, Sabathia, Hafner, Granderson, Youklis, and Overbay as well as Kuroda, who while not hurt, was clearly worn out by the end of the year. That list represents 9/25 of the most important members of the opening day roster, the youngest of whom, Granderson, (who you seem to think was young) being older than the average age of the oldest team in baseball.

Is that really something you want to argue about?

ZippyTheChimp
July 16th, 2014, 10:22 AM
Nice All Star for Jeter.

hbcat
July 16th, 2014, 11:10 AM
Adam Wainwright is a dope.

eddhead
September 19th, 2014, 10:59 AM
I remember the play as I am sure most of us do. I also remember the reaction in the press which I felt than was unduly harsh.





The last thing Huckaby intended was to cast himself as an extra in another Jeter extravaganza, his impending retirement, after how his first cameo worked out.

“I figured by then, the hoopla was over, he must have looked at it on film,” Huckaby said, recalling both the play and the encounter in the clubhouse.

When he spoke to Jeter that day, Huckaby added, he did not apologize for what happened at third base but did wish him an expeditious recovery and waited for some acknowledgment — a nod of approval, a tap on the shoulder. Instead, Jeter, by his own account, said merely, “O.K.” Huckaby turned and walked out, feeling many prying Yankees eyes upon him.

“It was troubling to me, disappointing, the whole thing,”’ Huckaby said, stressing that he did not wish to compare himself to Jeter, only to emphasize how desperate he was to cling to his beloved baseball.




The young man from the Lansing Lugnuts’ front office offered an email address for Ken Huckaby. “You’re welcome to try, but I should tell you that someone did a story recently on the Derek Jeter (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/j/derek_jeter/index.html?inline=nyt-per) thing and Ken kind of regretted it,” said Ben Owen, the team’s digital media and marketing manager.

Late last month, SportsNet, a Canadian network, published the article on its website with the headline “Huckaby Had Lasting Impact on Jays, Jeter.” According to Owen, Huckaby, who is a hitting coach with Toronto’s Class A team, climbed aboard the bus that night and was immediately chagrined that several players, on their digital devices, were transfixed by his brush with fame — or infamy — 11 years ago on opening night in Toronto.

The last thing Huckaby intended was to cast himself as an extra in another Jeter extravaganza, his impending retirement, after how his first cameo worked out.

“I figured by then, the hoopla was over, he must have looked at it on film,” Huckaby said, recalling both the play and the encounter in the clubhouse.

When he spoke to Jeter that day, Huckaby added, he did not apologize for what happened at third base but did wish him an expeditious recovery and waited for some acknowledgment — a nod of approval, a tap on the shoulder. Instead, Jeter, by his own account, said merely, “O.K.” Huckaby turned and walked out, feeling many prying Yankees eyes upon him.

“It was troubling to me, disappointing, the whole thing,”’ Huckaby said, stressing that he did not wish to compare himself to Jeter, only to emphasize how desperate he was to cling to his beloved baseball.

“I’ll be the guy limping around as a manager at 60 on bad catcher’s knees,” he said.

He is on the way now, 43 and making a living in the low minors. While the Blue Jays were clinging to wild-card life along with Jeter and the Yankees on Thursday night at Yankee Stadium, Huckaby, as predicted, did not respond to an email request for an interview. The first question would have been: All these years later, does Jeter’s cold, separated shoulder make any more sense?

Brian Butterfield, a Boston Red Sox coach who held a similar role with the Blue Jays in 2003 and also worked with Jeter in the Yankees’ minor league system, said in a telephone interview from Pittsburgh that articulation of what Jeter was thinking after the injury was surely less significant than what he was feeling.

“I do recall a lot of discussion with Huck, who felt badly about what happened and would never have tried to hurt anyone in 100 years,” Butterfield said. “But sometimes when you’re competing — and Huck, like Jeter, knew only one way, 100 miles an hour — it’s an unexplained thing. Intent is not the issue.”

Jeter, in other words, was a star who always competed like a journeyman — every day, every play. In Butterfield’s opinion, such single-minded and, yes, stubborn purpose left little room for sentiment, given the context and timing of the injury.

As for Butterfield, he felt for Huckaby. But having been a Yankees organizational insider, he deified Jeter.

“Many have asked me about Jeter and I always use the same word — respect for the game,” Butterfield said. “So many guys say they want to emulate him, but they really have no idea of what that takes.”

Actually, Huckaby had a pretty good notion on opening night in 2003, and presumably is trying to teach young players with greater skills than he had to use Jeter as their role model: Play every day as if your day’s pay is at stake. That should be the reverberating message over the next 10 days as Jeter, saluted all season, receives his final, deserved rewards.

But he also might consider giving one thing back — or taking back — a rare misstep made across nearly two decades of brilliance. Call up the Lansing Lugnuts, get a contact for the old catcher who 11 years ago landed on him with his tools of ignorance. Tell Ken Huckaby that he gets it now, he respects the effort, and leave it at that.

hbcat
September 21st, 2014, 05:27 PM
I don't get it. Did anyone ever say Huckaby did anything wrong? Did Jeter? It was an accident.

eddhead
September 22nd, 2014, 04:30 PM
That is because I inadvertantly omitted several key paragraphs while editing the text onto wired. In fairness to me, NY Time doesn't make is easy to do this anymore ;)

Anyway, here is a portion of the omitted text:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In the third inning, Jeter, having drawn a walk off Roy Halladay, tried to take an extra base on an infield out. Third base had been left uncovered when the Blue Jays put a shift on for Jason Giambi. It was a classic Jeter hustle play. Huckaby tried one, too, taking off for third and arriving just in time to leap for a throw from the first baseman, Carlos Delgado, that was high and slightly behind him.

Huckaby’s knee and shin guard landed on Jeter’s left shoulder, which was separated, putting him out for 39 games. Huckaby was quickly criticized in the New York news media and by a couple of Jeter’s teammates for making a reckless play.

Back from the hospital the next day, Jeter said little to dispute this version and dismissed Huckaby’s claim to have left a concerned message on Jeter’s cellphone the previous night. “He doesn’t have my number,” Jeter said.

The tempest soon subsided, Jeter recovered, and he was hitting over .300 when the Yankees returned to Toronto in July. By then, Huckaby was back in the minors with the Jays’ International League club.

He was on the road in Columbus, of all places, then the home of the Yankees’ Class AAA Clippers, when he picked up his hotel room phone and shared the result of a conciliatory visit to the Yankees’ clubhouse before the final game of that season-opening series. As Huckaby recalled in the SportsNet article, Jeter “wasn’t very receptive. I’ll just leave it at that.”

But in that July 2003 phone conversation, Huckaby was more forthcoming, making it clear he was bewildered and bothered by Jeter’s refusal to recognize not only an absence of malice on his part, but also the mandatory nature of his defensive effort, especially for someone of such fragile major league status.

When he spoke to Jeter that day, Huckaby added, he did not apologize for what happened at third base but did wish him an expeditious recovery and waited for some acknowledgment — a nod of approval, a tap on the shoulder. Instead, Jeter, by his own account, said merely, “O.K.” Huckaby turned and walked out, feeling many prying Yankees eyes upon him.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/19/sports/baseball/the-other-side-of-a-derek-jeter-hustle-play.html?_r=0 (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/19/sports/baseball/the-other-side-of-a-derek-jeter-hustle-play.html?_r=0)
Continue reading the main story (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/#story-continues-4)
Continue reading the main story (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/#story-continues-4)
“I figured by then, the hoopla was over, he must have looked at it on film,” Huckaby said, recalling both the play and the encounter in the clubhouse.

hbcat
September 24th, 2014, 04:25 AM
I see. Still not a big deal even if it is all true. Star player gets hurt; teammates grumble about "recklessness"; news media amplifies this (because that is what they do). Sorry if Huckaby thought it was unfair -- maybe it was -- but I don't remember a hoopla and recall the play as a completely unintended accident.

The world has kept spinning, somehow...

mariab
September 25th, 2014, 04:10 PM
I hope the weather holds out. This is so sweet.

'Voice of God' to exit with Derek Jeter

Updated: September 23, 2014, 3:05 PM ET
Associated Press



NEW YORK -- When Derek Jeter (http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/_/id/3246/derek-jeter) plays his final game at Yankee Stadium, Bob Sheppard will exit along with the New York Yankees (http://espn.go.com/mlb/team/_/name/nyy/new-york-yankees) captain.

Nicknamed "The Voice of God" for his stylish, elegant introductions, Sheppard was the ballpark's public address announcer from April 1951 until Sept. 7, 2007. Before Sheppard took ill, Jeter asked Sheppard to record his introduction, which has been used when the Yankees captain walked to the plate for home games.

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/photo/2014/0226/ny_a_derek-jeter-fan_mb_203x114.jpg (http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/derek-jeter)

As Derek Jeter plays out his final season in Yankee pinstripes, ESPNNewYork.com will be there every step of the way.
The Jeet Index (http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/derek-jeter) http://assets.espn.go.com/icons/live.gif Cap Map » (http://espn.go.com/newyork/map/_/page/maps-jeter-newyork-2014)

"He's as important as any player that's been here. He's part of the experience," Jeter said after Monday night's win over the Baltimore Orioles (http://espn.go.com/mlb/team/_/name/bal/baltimore-orioles). "Part of the experience of Yankee Stadium is Bob Sheppard's voice."

Sheppard debuted for the Yankees on April 17, 1951, and worked his final game on Sept. 5, 2007. He missed the 2007 AL division series because of a bronchial infection, ending his streak of 121 consecutive postseason games at Yankee Stadium. He was replaced by Jim Hall, his longtime sub, and Paul Olden took over when the Yankees moved to the new ballpark in 2009.
Sheppard announced his retirement after the 2009 season and died in July 2010 at age 99.

Jeter, the Yankees' 40-year-old captain, is likely to play his final home game Thursday night, since New York probably will miss the playoffs.
He said he had gone to Sheppard with the idea of the recording.

"That's the only voice I'd heard growing up, and that's the only voice I wanted to hear when I was announced at home," Jeter said. "And fortunately he agreed to do it."
Recordings of Sheppard are used to welcome fans to Yankee Stadium at times, but Jeter's introduction will be its last in-game airing.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/11573959/bob-sheppard-voice-exit-derek-jeter-retirement-new-york-yankees

Copyright 2014 by The Associated Press

GordonGecko
September 26th, 2014, 10:23 AM
D-Rob: greatest blown save in Yankees history!

antinimby
September 26th, 2014, 10:35 AM
This guy's whole career is like a fairy tale.

mariab
September 26th, 2014, 10:55 AM
Hollywood couldn't have written a better story. The only thing that would have topped yesterday's ending is him hitting a home run that knocked out the stadium lights, 'The Natural' style.

He did look like he was going to lose it a little a couple of times but as usual he managed to keep it together. He also made the decision yesterday to play his last game as short stop last night, but to still play the last stand in a different capacity in Boston, which I liked.

It was such a happy atmosphere at the end of the game I kept forgetting they didn't make the playoffs.

As long-suffering Mets fan, I always admired the guy, and I'm glad they won that last home game.

mariab
September 28th, 2014, 08:06 PM
Watched a bit of the last game, saw all the highlights, and I think this was the most pleasant game NY ever played in Boston.


Now he wants to make babies:p


Starting a family Derek Jeter’s next goal

In the immediate future, however, Jeter is just going to relax.

BY Bill Price (http://wirednewyork.com/authors?author=Bill Price)
NEW YORK DAILY NEWS
Friday, September 26, 2014, 1:52 AM




http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1953571.1411710598!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_970/usa-baseball-mlb.jpgJASON SZENES/EPADerek Jeter’s family, including mother Dorothy (c.) with nephew Jalen and father Dr. Charles Jeter (r.) watch along with Jeter’s girlfriend Hannah Davis (l.) as Jeter celebrates his game-winning hit.
With the end of his career just a few days away, Derek Jeter said he is looking forward to some time off — but not for long.
Jeter, whose career will end Sunday at Fenway Park, told NBC’s Brian Williams he’s looking forward to having some free time, but is also ready to start a family, something he felt he couldn’t do while playing for the Yankees.

“I have the utmost respect for these guys that are able to do it — you know, missing their kids’ birthdays and not being able to see them play Tee ball or summer ball and missing a lot of time,” he told Williams. “So it’s another reason why I feel as though now’s the time. I mean, I want to have a family. Who knows when it’s gonna be? But I look forward to it.”

In the immediate future, however, Jeter is just going to relax. “I’ve been on a schedule for — you know, I've been doing this professionally for 23 years,” Jeter said. “And, you know, I’ve been playing baseball since I’ve been 4 or 5. So I really haven’t had much time off. I’m not complaining. But I’m looking forward to having some time off.”

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/starting-family-derek-jeter-goal-article-1.1953568

hbcat
October 11th, 2014, 11:20 PM
http://m.mlb.com/nyy/video/v36612345/?player_id=116539