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kakonsteraro
December 13th, 2009, 02:19 PM
I was a long time poster for Syracuse.com. Today we had a minor disagreement about censorship and then they deleted all my posts and cancelled my membership. Well, here I am talking about censorship again and trying to figure out the type of mindset that would support such a thing. Maybe someone here can help me better understand it.

lofter1
December 13th, 2009, 03:40 PM
Without knowing the context of what you describe it's hard to discuss.

infoshare
December 13th, 2009, 04:01 PM
Well, here I am talking about censorship again and trying to figure out the type of mindset that would support such a thing. Maybe someone here can help me better understand it.

If the subject is censorship, then the subject is in effect about posing a challenge (questioning) to an existing authority, that authority being those with the power to censor whatever you wish to say: if what you have to say on the subject is in any way a threat to that authority you will be censored.

I hope that somewhat convoluted statement will help you get the discussion started.

kakonsteraro
December 13th, 2009, 05:16 PM
I didnt threaten noone or name-call anyone. I just said that they claimed to be liberal and they really didnt know what a liberal is if they supported censorship. Actually I feel kind of irritated because that person is a patriot to the government and not a patriot to the country.I think that statement must be what upset them. You would think people would want to protect our rights instead of further restrict them.

infoshare
December 13th, 2009, 06:43 PM
I just said that they claimed to be liberal and they really didnt know what a liberal is if they supported censorship.

I think that statement must be what upset them. You would think people would want to protect our rights instead of further restrict them.



Are you aware that political ‘liberalism’ is often equated with fascism. This is a good book (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Fascism) on that point of view: you need only to read some of the various book reviews to gain a better understanding of what you have refered to (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showpost.php?p=308983&postcount=1) as the ‘mindset’. Here is paraphrase from one of the reviews of J. Goldberg's book - "Goldberg shows how liberals came to believe that authoritarian government is fine as long as representatives of 'the people' — themselves — are in charge".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Fascism

ZippyTheChimp
December 13th, 2009, 06:50 PM
I didnt threaten noone or name-call anyone. I just said that they claimed to be liberal and they really didnt know what a liberal is if they supported censorship.What was censored that led you to make that statement?

lofter1
December 13th, 2009, 07:55 PM
... liberals came to believe that authoritarian government is fine as long as representatives of 'the people' themselves are in charge"


You could take out the word "liberals" and substitute just about any faction or "mindset" and that sentence would hold true in many cases.

Humans don't like to be subjugated. And if there are two people involved and somebody has to be on the bottom then almost everyone would choose it to be someone else.

kakonsteraro
December 13th, 2009, 10:20 PM
i was debating with another member about patriotism.He inquired if I served in the military before.I said no...that I would not serve for this GOVERNMENT.If I served for any war it would be on the side of the Mohawk Tribe.He then proceeded to belittle me for being less than he because he was a vet.I responded by explaining that we could both be patriots even though we were on different sides.He is fighting for his government and I am fighting for my people.EVEN if I had to fight his government to protect my people.He and I could still fight in the field and still means we are both patriots.
The bottom line is we were in a political debate and the Moderators didnt like my side I guess. After the mods deleted several of my posts, I explained that they were Nazis and of course...you can fill in the blanks!!

go ahead...make my day!just remember...YOU asked!!

ZippyTheChimp
December 13th, 2009, 10:29 PM
go ahead...make my day!just remember...YOU asked!!Huh? Are you expecting an argument from me?

I only asked the question to get information. We can't talk about it if we don't know about it.

Maybe hostility was your problem at Syracuse.com. Think I'll pass on this thread.

kakonsteraro
December 13th, 2009, 10:32 PM
I said that cause I used clint eastwood as my avatar. I wasnt upset at you for asking.

ZippyTheChimp
December 13th, 2009, 10:40 PM
Sorry, don't know how I missed that. :)

Ninjahedge
December 13th, 2009, 10:51 PM
Sorry, don't know how I missed that. :)


There was no winkey.

kako.... One thing you have to realize is that no-one hears your tone on here. If you come on challenging a decision and then say "make my day"...well, the FIRST reaction is obvious.


;) helps so much when you are being sarcastic. Different cues are also handy, but then again what do I know >shrug<.

lofter1
December 13th, 2009, 10:54 PM
After the mods deleted several of my posts, I explained that they were Nazis and ...

Rarely a productive move. But around here that ^ tends to generate 3 or 4 pages of retorts rather than an immediate ban.

kakonsteraro
December 13th, 2009, 11:02 PM
i am knew to posting so I guess the smiley faces will help.I am sarcastic and guess you cant hear my tone.I do like a good debate and seldom get upset...usually walk away for a day or so.
I understand about getting chewed out by everyone here too. I didnt even mean it literally...calling them Nazis was really sarcastic and they went off the deep end i guess. It really stinks though...I liked the site. I guess I can get used to this one if your all willing. Im not a city boy though, never been there. I just sold my cows and im out of work right now.ill probably drive you all nuts over the next week:rolleyes:

hbcat
December 13th, 2009, 11:50 PM
Im not a city boy though, never been there. I just sold my cows and im out of work right now.ill probably drive you all nuts over the next week:rolleyes:

Hi there, Kakosteraro.

Let me get right to the point: Are you aiming at a nice "debate" or are you trying to antagonize people here until you get busted and banned from this forum? I notice that you've piped up on hot-button issues -- e.g., the War in Afghanistan -- and you've even started (I think) your own thread condemning the transit union. No problem at all with engaging people here and challenging opinions, but I sense that you are trying to get a rise out of people by casting yourself as a country boy taking on the "city slickers". You've already alerted us to your recent banning from another forum, and now you warn us(as if we speak with one voice) that you are going to drive us nuts this week. I think you're getting off on the wrong foot.

There probably is a liberal/progressive bias here at WNY, but there are also many independent-minded people who don't mind a spirited debate on the issues of the day. Why not ease up on the confrontation, listen a bit more, and then focus on letting us hear about ideas & issues from your point of view, in a respectful way. Deliberately taking a sarcastic stance (with or without emoticons to signal tone) will almost certainly lead to unpleasantness, and may get you kicked off this site. That isn't your goal, is it? You do want to last more than a week, don't you?

hb

lofter1
December 14th, 2009, 12:38 AM
Hi there, Kakosteraro.

... and you've even started (I think) your own thread condemning the transit union.

Based on the name of the poster who started that ^ thread they're not the same peoples.

hbcat
December 14th, 2009, 01:34 AM
Kakosteraro --

I just read through your posts, and I see that lofter is correct: I was mixing you up with another new member, so my comment, addressed only to you above, is not wholly appropriate and I wouldn't have written it based on your posts alone. I won't delete it either, however, just to avoid any possible confusion.

I do apologize. I look forward to reading your messages.

Cheers,
hb

Merry
December 14th, 2009, 05:18 AM
I think you're getting off on the wrong foot.

IMO, so are you. You're also very new to this forum.

hbcat
December 14th, 2009, 07:08 AM
As I wrote, it was a case of mistaken identity. I also apologize for being presumptuous.

Alonzo-ny
December 14th, 2009, 07:19 AM
Kakosteraro,

You will find this forum is a great place for intelligent, tolerant debate. Forget about the last forum and start fresh here. I am sure we would all be very interested in what you have to say. It is not often to hear a Native American view on matters of the day and I would be very interested in what your opinions are. So my suggestion, forget the last forum and welcome to this one. It is a fresh start.

Alonzo

Merry
December 14th, 2009, 08:46 AM
^ Well said.

Welcome to WNY, kakonsteraro :).

kakonsteraro
December 14th, 2009, 09:41 AM
anything i write here is all out of fun. I do have fun posting and debating. i guess i need to get better use to 'tone' or something because im finding a lot of my posts are taking as an 'attack' on someone.i got kicked off that site...and still dont really think it was my fault. i was asked a question and answered it as honestly as i could.
Are you suggesting i dont offer my opinion?Are you saying to keep my opinion to myself because it may 'antagonize' someone?
I DO have a different opinion than most but if I cant offer it, what is the sense?
I AM a good one for "stirring ' up emotion and debate...but what is a political forum if you cant put your opinion.?:cool:

hbcat
December 14th, 2009, 10:13 AM
Are you suggesting i dont offer my opinion?Are you saying to keep my opinion to myself because it may 'antagonize' someone?


Not at all. If you are referring to my message, I made a stupid mistake, and my post was never meant for you. Tell us what you think. I'm all ears.

Again, I am sorry for the confusion. I'd like to know what you have to say.

kakonsteraro
December 14th, 2009, 12:24 PM
i just read someone elses post that had their stuff removed from this site. I guess it was returned out of good faith. thats cool though.it all boils down to I NEVER INTEND on disrespecting anybody and i hope you all take my posts in good faith. I AM a God fearing man too. Politics though generally intend to offend some people and that is why you never start 'politicing ' in a bar,.i appreciate meeting you all and respect all your responses. ive checked this post probably 10 times since ive posted it.:D

lofter1
December 14th, 2009, 12:59 PM
I think you'll find that, unless posts lose the focus and start to get personal (that's when the deleting might start), debates / discussions here at WNY can get quite interesting.

Ninjahedge
December 14th, 2009, 01:11 PM
Always better to be FARING than Fearing anyway. ;)

kakonsteraro
December 14th, 2009, 10:34 PM
now do I remove this whole thread if I got the answers I was looking for or does it just stay here for ever.I dont know who to ask here so maybe someone will explain or direct me.id also like IM here,is it possable?

hbcat
December 14th, 2009, 10:52 PM
I was confused by this too recently. You can delete your own posts (sometimes), but I don't think you can delete this thread, and there is really no need to, I don't think. However, I did ask moderators to expunge a thread I started last month. I was told it should remain (especially since there was nothing most people found offensive) as others may later have the same questions, but the implication was they could delete the entire thread if it seemed the right way to go.

I don't know about IM (instant messaging?), but you can send personal messages (PMs) by following your User CP (Control Panel) button in the upper left, or by clicking on another members user name and then selecting "Send ___ a message". I am going to send you a personal message so you can see how it works.

Bob
December 14th, 2009, 10:52 PM
I don't always find myself in lock-step with the majority of regular contributors to WNY, but it's an enjoyable group, characters all around, and with the give and take I actually learn a few things along the way. If I felt WNY censored free expression, I would leave the site.

hbcat
December 14th, 2009, 10:54 PM
kakonsteraro --
You have the private messaging option blocked (I just tried). Keep it that way if you prefer, but just to let you know I am not ignoring you.
best,
hb

kakonsteraro
December 15th, 2009, 09:46 AM
i think ill like this feature.

MidtownGuy
December 17th, 2009, 08:27 PM
Welcome, Kakonsteraro, to this forum. And may I say you have every reason as a Mohawk to have the perspective that you described. I think you'll enjoy this forum if you stick around.

kakonsteraro
December 18th, 2009, 05:32 AM
so far I like it here.has anyone ever told you you look like richard gear?i was just reading the news...seems taliban managed to hijack a u.s. drone!isnt that something for the most advanced country in the world?they did it with a laptop from a cave! UNBELIEVABLE! what next?

lofter1
December 18th, 2009, 09:37 AM
Not actually hijacked the drones. Hacked (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/dec/17/skygrabber-software-drones-hacked) into their vids using $26 software.

MidtownGuy
December 18th, 2009, 10:40 AM
has anyone ever told you you look like richard gear?

LOL, that's funny because I get that a lot, since I was a teenager. Even my sister used to say that. :)