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NYatKNIGHT
November 6th, 2002, 02:43 PM
We lost our last pizza thread, but I thought this enlightening article in today's NY Times Dining section might be a good way to launch a new one.

They didn't mention my neighborhood favorite Arturo's on Houston and Thompson - yummy coal oven pizza, but not by the slice.....



NEW YORK TIMES
November 6, 2002
Pizza 2002: The State of the Slice
By ED LEVINE

What's the best way to set New Yorkers to bickering? Ask where to find the best slice of pizza in the city. No subject starts a battle faster—not bagels or hot dogs or chopped liver, not even the primacy of the Rangers or the fastest route to J.F.K. Pizza, introduced to New York in 1905 by Gennaro Lombardi, who saw it as a way to use up the day-old bread in his Spring Street grocery store, has long been the affordable, satisfying food of choice for peripatetic New Yorkers of every age, sex, race and class. Slices of pizza, that is. Mr. Lombardi's descendants serve only whole pies at their pizza shop, and now no groceries. The Pero family, which established Totonno's pizzeria in Coney Island in 1924, does the same. John Sasso of John's Pizza, which opened on Bleecker Street in 1929, famously put a sign in the window: "No Slices." Indeed, of all the seminal New York pizzerias, only Patsy’s, on First Avenue near 118th Street in East Harlem, sells pizza slices, as it did when it opened in 1933.

But the pizza slice is ubiquitous on New York streets. The metropolitan region has some 2,750 pizzerias, according to the Yellow Book telephone reference guide. Mario Batali is about to open Otto at 1 Fifth Avenue, where he will serve thin, crisp pizza inspired by the Sardinian flat bread called carta da musica, and he said he dreams of opening a slice place on Eighth Street with a window that opens onto the street. Frank DeCarlo is serving rectangular pieces of pizza at his newly opened Ápizz on the Lower East Side, where they are made in the wood-burning stove and sold by the foot or the inch. When did pizzerias first start serving slices, and not pies? Patsy’s may or may not have been the first. Giovanni Brecevich, the current owner, has a photograph that he says was taken in the 1950's, showing the pizzeria’s distinctive white shelved slice box on the sidewalk in front. Louie and Ernie Ottuso served slices at Louie & Ernie's pizzeria in East Harlem as early as 1947; they moved the business to the current site in the Throgs Neck section of the Bronx in 1959. Nunzio Trivoluzzo served slices at his pizzeria in South Beach, Staten Island, when he opened the place in 1943.

Many experts trace the slice's widespread popularity to the end of World War II, when non-Italian veterans returning from service in Italy began to crave the sliced pizza they had enjoyed there. (In New York before the war, pizza was considered strictly an ethnic food.) But John Brescio, an owner of Lombardi's, also credits the proliferation of mixers from the Hobart Corporation, which introduced its first commercial machine in 1927 and a larger heavy-duty version in 1955. "With the Hobart mixer," Mr. Brescio said, "it was a lot easier to make a lot of pizza."

Another factor that probably spurred the postwar pizza boom was the move away from coal and wood ovens and toward gas-fired pizza ovens made by the likes of Bari, Blodgett and Bakers Pride. Those ovens were much easier to install, and cheaper, and they burned cleaner fuel more efficiently — all important in a high-volume business like selling slices.

Of course, if the origins of New York's pizza slices is a bit murky, the fact that New Yorkers love the things is not in doubt. Slices are cheap, almost always $2 or less. They are convenient, with a pizzeria seemingly on every block. And they are often filling, thanks to the thick blanket of cheese that covers most pizza-by-the-slice sold these days. (Many pizza lovers credit the Ray's Pizza shop at Avenue of the Americas and 11th Street with popularizing the half-pound slice, though Columbia University students often cite the gigantic slices at Koronet, at Broadway and 112th Street, as the original good-value portion, at nearly 15 inches long.)

But the desire for lots of oozing cheese has obscured many other important characteristics of a fine slice of pizza, some pizza cognoscenti say.

"All that cheese takes pizza from being a bread item to being a vessel for its toppings," said Ed Schoenfeld, a restaurant consultant with offices in Brooklyn. "It's like getting all corned beef and no rye bread."

That's not to mention the quality of the cheese itself. So-called pizza cheese has become the norm on slices. But just what is pizza cheese? It's a low-moisture mozzarella, very occasionally blended with provolone. You can say this about it: It melts well.

The best pizzerias in New York wouldn't dream of using an inferior mozzarella. Before pizza was a New York tradition it was a Neapolitan one, said Arthur Schwartz, a host on radio station WOR and the author of "Naples at Table" (HarperCollins). In Naples, he said, "they use either buffalo mozzarella that's made from the milk of water buffalo or cow's milk mozzarella on their pizzas."

John Tiso, who now owns Louie & Ernie's in the Bronx with his brother Cosmo, uses a full-cream mozzarella made in Wisconsin by the Grande Cheese Company. "I tried using something else once, and I hated it," he said. "The only mozzarella I'll use is full-cream Grande." The cheese comes in large blocks that Mr. Tiso grinds himself. Other top pizzerias like Nunzio's on Staten Island use full-cream mozzarella made by Polly-O, a cheese company based in New Jersey and owned by Kraft Foods.

But though buffalo mozzarella imported from Italy has been available in New York for some time, it is simply too expensive to be used regularly by any but one pizza-by-the-slice man: Domenico DeMarco, at DiFara Pizza in Midwood, Brooklyn. Mr. DeMarco said he uses three parts buffalo mozzarella to one part mozzarella Grande on his majestic pies.

"Of course it's more expensive," Mr. DeMarco said. "But for me it's important to get the flavor you can only get from buffalo milk mozzarella." He also dusts his pizza with freshly grated grana padana, a slightly salty hard cow's milk cheese from Italy.

Other top slice purveyors, like both Nunzio's and Joe & Pat's on Staten Island, top their finished pizzas with a touch of pecorino Romano. But Michele Scicolone, an author of "Pizza: Any Way You Slice It" (Broadway Books), calls that sacrilege. "Romano cheese has no place on Neapolitan pizza," she said.

Ms. Scicolone has a problem with the fresh cow's milk mozzarella sold by many fancy food stores all over the country. "Fresh mozzarella is softer and very gloppy when it melts," she said. "It can wet the whole pizza down."

Still, one recent trend in the slice business has been the "premium" slice made with fresh mozzarella. Giuseppe Vitale, who runs two Joe's pizzerias in Greenwich Village, serves such a slice. "People want fresh ingredients," he said with a shrug.

Directly beneath the thick padding of pizza cheese on most New York slices can be found a dollop of sauce, too often a canned and ready-made "pizza sauce." "Most of the time it's gummy and oversweetened and lacks the straightforward good taste of good tomatoes, olive oil, garlic, salt and pepper, well cooked," said Mr. Schoenfeld, the consultant. Imported canned Italian tomatoes, preferably San Marzanos, are the proper base for the sauce, he said.

Nunzio's and DiFara both use San Marzano tomatoes. Nunzio's adds fresh basil and a sprinkling of black pepper to the sauce.

"That's how my dad made it, and he learned from Nunzio, so that's how we make it," said Concetta Whiteaker, an owner.

Other pie men, like Joe Pasquale of Joe & Pat's, use California tomatoes grown from the seeds of San Marzanos. Mr. Vitale of Joe's has even had some success with canned cooked tomatoes from Spain.

"The fact is," he said, "every case of tomatoes I get has a slightly different flavor." Mr. DeMarco at DiFara blends fresh tomatoes and canned San Marzano tomatoes in his sauce.

Then there is the crust, that centrally important component of the New York slice, crisp though pliant enough to bend, with a few bubbles in the dough. As Ms. Scicolone put it, "Bubbles mean the dough has been hand-formed and cooked at a high temperature." Remember how John Travolta, as Tony Manero in "Saturday Night Fever," folded one slice around another in the opening sequence? The scene can be understood primarily as a paean to the perfect pizza-slice crust. (For anyone who might have forgotten, the movie was set in Bay Ridge, Brooklyn.)

The best pizzerias make their dough every day from high-gluten flour, water, yeast and a little salt. They also serve their pizzas plain, although toppings are another hotly contested subdivision of the pizza debate.

"I've only made one Hawaiian pizza in my life," Mr. Vitale said. "One of the regular customers was eight months pregnant and told me she had a craving for Hawaiian pizza. So I bought a can of pineapple and made one for her. But that's the last time."

The final variable in any credible pizza-slice discussion is heat, and particularly the kind of oven used to cook, or reheat, the slice. When pizza was introduced to New York in the early 1900's by Gennaro Lombardi, it was made in a coal-fired brick oven used to bake bread. Places like Lombardi's and John's and Totonno's still make their whole pies in ovens like that. Patsy's, in East Harlem, is currently the only place that makes slice pie in a coal-fired brick oven. Lawrence Ciminieri of Totonno's has tried to use his own coal-fired brick oven to make and reheat slices, but he said they "stuck to the floor of the oven because the cheese overflowed."

The most common slice ovens are gas-fired models made by Bari, in business in lower Manhattan since 1950 under an immense Italian flag. (Joe's and Nunzio's, however, use ovens from Bakers Pride of New Rochelle.) The stone bottoms of the Bari ovens, which retain and distribute heat evenly despite the constant opening and closing of the oven door, help ensure the crispness of the pizza.

Of course, pizza is no longer the exclusive province of Italians. Kosher pizzerias have cropped up in the Midwood section of Brooklyn and on the Upper West Side of Manhattan. Greeks have opened pizzerias in all five boroughs, making a Greek-style pizza with a highly seasoned sauce that finds echoes in the cornmeal-crusted pizzas served at the Two Boots minichain. Italians now share the Arthur Avenue neighborhood in the Bronx with Albanians, and while Tony & Tina's, a pizzeria there, serves decent if not great pizza, it has fabulous bureks — multilayer savory pies made with spinach, cheese and ground beef. And for the increasingly South Asian population in Jackson Heights, Queens, two Famous Pizza shops offer pizza with curry powder and jalapeño toppings. By the slice.

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/11/06/dining/06PIZZ.html?8hpib






(Edited by NYatKNIGHT at 2:25 pm on Nov. 6, 2002)

Jessica
November 6th, 2002, 02:47 PM
The New York Times
November 6, 2002
Locations: Where 'Gimme a Slice' Will Always Bring an Echo
By ED LEVINE


In the end, a great slice of pizza is defined by the quality of its ingredients and their ratio to one other. An exemplary slice should have discrete sections of cheese and sauce and a crust that is thin but not too thin. Most pizza these days has a barely visible layer of sauce — it's as though the sauce has gone into exile.

Here are six places that make Neapolitan-style slices worth going out of your way for. (Square Sicilian-style slices deserve their own discussion.) The list is based on this reporter's one-month search of all five boroughs of New York City, with stops at dozens of pizzerias.

DIFARA PIZZA In this nondescript and not altogether tidy storefront in Brooklyn, Domenico DeMarco has been baking transcendent slices for 41 years. He learned the basics of pizza-making at the Queen pizzeria on Court Street in Brooklyn Heights, but the pie he turns out is very much his own invention. A blend of buffalo mozzarella, freshly grated grana padana and whole milk mozzarella, and a combination of fresh and canned San Marzano tomatoes yield a supremely flavorful and tangy slice that would be perfect if the crust were only a trifle more crisp. 1424 Avenue J (East 15th Street), Midwood, Brooklyn; (718) 258-1367.

JOE & PAT'S Giuseppe Pappalardo, an owner, mastered his craft at three legendary Staten Island slice establishments: Nunzio's, Ciro's and Tokie's. His slices are distinguished by a superthin crispy crust. "They're easier to digest," he said, "so you can eat a lot of them." 1758 Victory Boulevard (Manor Road), Four Corners, Staten Island; (718) 981-0887.

JOE'S PIZZA Giuseppi Vitale, who owns Joe's with his father-in-law, Pino Pozzuoli, mastered the art of dough-making at the G&G Bakery in Brooklyn. He is a slice purist: no heroes or pasta are served in his restaurants. Mr. Vitale says his motto is "pride, knowledge and ingredients." It's worth it to have both a regular slice and a fresh mozzarella slice here, just to taste the difference. They both have superbly crisp crust. 233 Bleecker Street (Carmine Street), Greenwich Village, (212) 366-1182, and 7 Carmine Street (Avenue of the Americas) in the Village, (212) 255-3946.

LOUIE & ERNIE'S City officials know a good slice of pizza when they see one: the street in front of Louie & Ernie's has been renamed Ernie Ottuso Square, after one of the owners. A Louie & Ernie's slice is a diminutive triangle of pizza pleasure in which grated cheese and full-cream mozzarella sparingly cover a thin-enough crust. Also worth the calories and the trip are the fried calzone and the white pie, both made with creamy ricotta cheese. A word to the wise, however: don't arrive too late. The pizzeria ends its day when all the dough is used up. "We run out, we run out — that's it," said John Tiso, an owner. "We close." 1300 Crosby Avenue (Waterbury Avenue), Pelham Bay, Bronx; (718) 829-6230.

NUNZIO'S A slice from Nunzio's is a pristine exercise in elegant pizza minimalism. Everything about it is right: the ratio of sauce to cheese, the crisp yet pliant crust and the tangy sauce enlivened by fresh basil. Nunzio's even looks the way a pizzeria should: it is a white stucco shack with a tiny dining room brightened by black and white photos of the original Nunzio's in South Beach, Staten Island. 2155 Hylan Boulevard (Midland Avenue), Grant City, Staten Island; (718) 667-9647.

PATSY'S Patsy's is the only pizzeria left in a century-old Italian neighborhood that once was a hotbed of pizza activity. The adjoining restaurant has tablecloths and a full Italian menu; the slice space has a gorgeous oven, a simple white box that holds the slices, a soda machine and one chair that is nearly always empty. The slices are small; they have just enough cheese and the great crust that can come only from a coal-fired brick oven. 2291 First Avenue (118th Street), East Harlem; (212) 534-9783. * *

Zoe
November 6th, 2002, 03:15 PM
As in the original pizza thread, I will once again second NYatKnight's endorsment of Arturo's. *That place rocks

(Edited by Zoe at 2:15 pm on Nov. 6, 2002)

Gulcrapek
November 6th, 2002, 03:55 PM
All of the good pizza is gone from near here... all of it is crappy now.. I want to go for a slice now from a place two blocks away but ever since ownership changed it's just like frozen flesh

NoyokA
November 7th, 2002, 09:32 AM
according to msn:

http://newyork.citysearch.com/best/results/7784

Top 10 Audience Nominees

1 John's Pizzeria *
2 Grimaldi's Pizzeria *
3 Lombardi's *
4 Three of Cups *
5 Patsy's Pizza *
6 Two Boots *
7 L & B Spumoni Gardens *
8 Joe's Pizza *
9 Famous Original Ray's Pizza *
10 Goodfellas Brick Oven Pizza *

Top Editorial Nominees

Lombardi's *
John's Pizzeria *
Patsy's Pizza *
Nick's Pizza

Des
November 17th, 2002, 05:15 PM
Oh you New Yorkers are so lucky! Here in London there is absolutely nowhere to get adecent pizza. Nowhere. Sure there are plenty of pizza joints but none of them compare to what I had when I was in New York. Nobody stands in the shop window and twirls the pizza in the air like they do in America. The tomato base sauce is virtually non-existant here and most pizzas are made by the same people who open those damn kebab shops everywhere. No Italians seem to make pizza here.

I remember as a kid in the sixties we couldn't get pizza at all here. We used to get shows on TV like the Dick van Dyke show and we would see people ordering pizza to be delivered and we would wonder what it was. Now they are evrywhere but they are mostly rubbish including the popular Pizza Hut ones which are nothing like the Pizza Huts of America and half the size.

How I wish some Italian New Yorker would come over here and open up a genuine pizza parlour.

Foodwise you have so much to choose from in the States, so much variety and so cheap compared to over here. Then of course the downside is you guys are so big ( I almost said fat but you are all so politically correct I might get sued if I mention that word ).

amigo32
November 17th, 2002, 07:33 PM
Believe me, the Pizza Huts over here aren't all that spectacular either.

Kris
November 17th, 2002, 08:29 PM
Again, NYC is exceptional in America because people there walk (and therefeore stay relatively slim). The weight problem is most acute in the suburbs, where everyone drives and there is less diversity of food (lots of chain stuff).

Des
November 18th, 2002, 02:34 PM
People are getting fatter over here now mainly because we are being taken over by American chains and eating and driving like Yanks. *We are now the most overwieght in Europe. This American disease is spreading all round the world. You should see the size of the rich kids in Suadi Arabia. They are looking more like Americans every day.

By the way, Christian, you, me and Amigo seem to be the only people posting on this site as well as a few others. I always thought Americans loved to talk and had loads to say about everything. From my limited experience of this forum they seem more shy and reticent than the English. I am a bit disapointed. Aggroamorria or whatever he is called seems a bit more animated. I thought all New Yorkers were like that.

Des
November 18th, 2002, 02:36 PM
It just occurred to me........maybe they are all attending their twelve step programmes when I log on!!

Only joking.

Jessica
November 18th, 2002, 02:41 PM
Who ever said this forum was all Americans?

By the way Des-You tend to stereotype people way too much-Americans, Yanks, New Yorkers...all those in just one of your posts. *This is a very narrowed minded opinion to have.

Des
November 18th, 2002, 02:47 PM
OK Jessica, I will just stick to New Yorkers. Waddya mean I'm narrow minded? I do not think so. Just read my posts for the coming six months!

Why do they call you a junior member? Should you be reading this stuff?

Jessica
November 18th, 2002, 02:52 PM
It is just naive to classify individuals into a "category." *Stereotyping is a simple way to state things, and avoids all the complication that diversity holds. *And it is usually insulting!

Des
November 18th, 2002, 03:16 PM
Give me a break, Jessica! I have barely arrived on this site. Give me time to settle in. If I went to a party at your house would you hit me over the head with a bottle the minute I walk in the door? I may just turn out to be the most fascinating guy you have ever met.

What's wrong with a bit of stereotyping anyway?

Hof
December 3rd, 2002, 02:04 PM
I'm a transplanted New Yorker,and I can honestly say that a slice is the first thing I seek when I visit the Big City.I begin craving it when I start THINKING of going to New York.
I live in Florida,where the art of pizza is lost(or maybe never was found)and a good Slice is made of unobtanium in these parts.It's usually soggy,gooey,overloaded with weak sauce and cheap,petroleum-based"cheese",and is not foldable or portable-and that's IF you can find a by- the- slice place.
My son,who's genetic makeup made him a Redneck,craves NY pizza,and forgets catfish and barbeque when he visits the City with me.His last visit,the plane landed at midnight,and at 1 AM,he and I went out into the Garment District for pizza-and found it,at a papaya stand,and it was good...
Some of my favorites are random drop-ins,and The Villiage and Brooklyn are the best grazing areas.
I actively seek out a slice-or two- from the store at the corner of Thompson and Spring,though I've forgotten their name(Patsy's???),and Joe's Pizza on Bleeker is excellent.
Ray's is also tops.I've had my cab stop and do a double park while I consume a slice of Ray's.
Along Fulton St in Brooklyn are numerous spots,many of them feeding a neighborhood,a"slice plain" at a time.
I visit the city to unearth the unexpected,and a quick slice,hot,crisped and peppered,served from a little window for a couple of bucks is always a pleasant respite from my explorations.
...And the smell of a freshly baking pie?Even fresh Krispy Kreme is a distant second.
I humbly propose that the best pizza in the known world is a slice of New York Pizza,plain.

NYatKNIGHT
December 4th, 2002, 10:24 AM
I agree whole-heartedly Hof. By the way, the pizza at the corner of Thompson and Spring is Ben's, complete with the pizza chef statue outside (winking and giving the thumbs up - you know the one) and a window on the sidewalk for immediate ordering.

A good slice of pizza is something you don't realize how much you miss until you can't get it anymore. Happened to me when I lived in Denver, and like Hof said every time I came back to the city first thing I'd do was go looking for a slice.

Eugenius
December 4th, 2002, 10:34 PM
I think the question of where the best pizza is found has been settled before this article was ever written. *It's obviously New York. *The question is "where in New York?" *My personal choice is Two Boots in the East Village.

Des
December 5th, 2002, 01:21 AM
I intend to start a campaign to bring real New York style pizza to London. First I am going to print out all these amazingly detailed and informed postigs and give them to the owner of the nearest pizza place to me. he is an Iranian I think. What would they know about pizza? This might give hime some food for thought.

Next I might try sending copies of these postings to all the food reviewers in the national newspapers.
*Something has to be done! It's so unfair that in a city the size of London there is no such thing as pizza.

Watch this space.

amigo32
December 5th, 2002, 01:37 AM
Good Luck! :)

AlvininAtlanta
April 30th, 2003, 12:31 AM
Here in Atlanta we have "New York" style pizza places but they're not all that great. *I don't know why but they seem to be more of the pizza hut type. *Just really greasy. *The best pizza places I have ever tried down here were Chicago style. *I love the double crust stuffed pizzas. *Only sometimes mind you, because they're so heavy you can only eat one or two slices but man are they good. *I want to try the "real" New York style again sometime. *I went to New York about 10 tears ago when I was a kid and had it and loved it but I don't remember what it tastes like. *After seeing some scenes in The Sopranos and Sex and The City where they get a juicy looking NY slice and bend it in half before biting off the hanging down corner my mouth waters. * I saw that I can order it by air but its way too expensive. *Like 13 bucks a pizza. *Anyways, thats my pizza thought. *Nice site BTW

NyC MaNiAc
April 30th, 2003, 09:25 AM
I found a pretty good pizza joint in the village. Can't remember the name....it was by some Tibetian shop...LoL, only in New York...

NyC MaNiAc

ZippyTheChimp
April 30th, 2003, 09:32 AM
Dalai Lama Famous Pizza

fvcrew22
April 30th, 2003, 12:32 PM
I'm from new york but moved down to Pensacola, Florida a few years ago (I hope to go back for college.) *I love almost any good pizzaria in the city, down here i'm lucky though because there are 2 guys from nyc that have good pizza places and 1 is only 5min from my house.. I love when i go back every year to visit family and have some great pizza, I can't eat enough of it.. *

TLOZ Link5
April 30th, 2003, 09:30 PM
I like Ray Bari the best when it comes to gen-yoo-wine Noo Yawk pizza.

Heh, always wanted to write that ;)

However, I'm quite willing to broaden my horizons. *I'll try and find some of these places you guys talk about.

P.S.: Will we ever find out which one in the chain is the "real" original Ray's? *It's puzzled me for many years.

And is it just me, or does the price of a slice go up in tandem with the transit fare? *My dad told me that when he moved to New York in '75, pizza was 35 cents, as was a token. *Then when the fare went up to 50 cents, so did the slice a few weeks later.

(Edited by TLOZ Link5 at 8:33 pm on April 30, 2003)

DominicanoNYC
April 30th, 2003, 10:40 PM
Haha. No! Famous Familia Pizza is the best.

Schadenfrau
May 1st, 2003, 12:28 PM
Hands down, the best pizza in New York is from Patsy's. But only the Harlem location: it's independently owned.

TLOZ Link5
May 1st, 2003, 07:33 PM
Quote: from DominicanoNYC on 9:40 pm on April 30, 2003
Haha. No! Famous Familia Pizza is the best.


You mean Famiglia? *Oh Gawd, I LOVE Famiglia! *But I still like Ray's better :)

DominicanoNYC
May 1st, 2003, 09:30 PM
Yeah I did.

Lightning Homer
May 3rd, 2003, 06:35 AM
Mmmmmh, PIZZA...
Thanks for all the tips, guys !

DominicanoNYC
May 3rd, 2003, 04:15 PM
You can now find Famous Famiglia pizza in Yankee Stadium. MMMMMMMMMMMMMM...

Gunslinger
May 9th, 2003, 06:48 AM
hi,
This is my first post - love NY and will return for the first time in 4 YEARS !!! in Sept.

Staying near Mad Sq Garden - any suggestions on where to get a great slice - expect to need that pizza almost as soon as I've checked in, if not before.

phxmania2001
May 9th, 2003, 09:09 AM
There's this one place across from the Woolworth Building (on Park Place I think) that makes awesome pizza. It's called Little Italy, and apparently even Bloomie goes there sometimes.

I'm gonna have to look for all these places on my college trip next week. :)

ZippyTheChimp
May 9th, 2003, 11:49 AM
Hmmmm...

A Walking Tour of New York City Pizza

I'm familiar with some, I'm sure all are good. A tour would have to consider historical aspects, so Lombardi's on Spring and Mulberry, NYC's first pizzeria.

For scenic views, Grimaldi's on Old Fulton St in Brooklyn. Beneath the Brooklyn Bridge, waterside views of lower Manhattan.

I don't know if it's still there - Totonno's on Neptune Ave in Coney Island.

garyclips
May 12th, 2003, 11:50 PM
I drove a taxi in the 1980's and been all over N.Y.C. The best pizza in N.Y. and possibly the country is Difara's pizza on the corner of east 15 st. and ave J in Brooklyn. The proof is in the location. This place is surrounded by ultra orthodox Jewish establishments and this place still thrives. The best square slice is L&B Spumoni Gardens at 86 street near Stillwell ave. in Bensonhurst, Brooklyn. After pizza indulge yourself in the best Spumoni around. I've been going to this place since 1976.

NYatKNIGHT
May 13th, 2003, 11:36 AM
Mmmmmmm, spumoni.......

HoustonStinks
June 12th, 2003, 03:33 PM
Anybody been to Rizzo's in Astoria, Queens? *They sell square slices, but they're thin crust. *I've been eating there (its on Steinway St.) for 20 years. *It's definitely worth the effort of going, just make sure you get the square slices... they've been selling those since 1954. *I may consider having those overnighted to Houston... there isn't anything that even resembles good pizza here. *I've gotta get out of here.

NYatKNIGHT
June 12th, 2003, 03:49 PM
Hmmm, square slices that aren't Sicilian - thanks HoustonStinks, I'll have to get over there and try it. Meanwhile hang in there, maybe a New Yorker like yourself will open up a real pizza place.

I had a couple fantastic slices the other day at Rivoli Pizza on the corner of Hudson St. and Christopher - across the street from PATH. Not sit down, it's grab and go. SO good.

ZippyTheChimp
June 12th, 2003, 03:54 PM
I was in agreement with Garyclips about Spumoni Gardens for Sicilian, but I'll have to try this place.

BrooklynRider
June 13th, 2003, 01:05 PM
Pino's La Forchetta PIzza - Seventh Avenue , Park Slope, Brooklyn. *A good traditional Brooklyn pizza.

Edward
March 22nd, 2004, 10:40 AM
http://www.nymetro.com/urban/guides/bestofny/food/04/pizza.htm
Pie Chart
New York's best pizzas, any way you slice it.


Best Restaurant Pie
Giorgione
307 Spring Street
212-352-2269
The pizza station is manned by a pro, and the proof is in the superb, sparingly topped Neapolitan specimens.

Best Bar Pie
Beacon
25 West 56th Street
212-332-0500
This thin-crust, wood-oven-fired ovoid beauty is slicked with a tangy quattro-formaggi mix and wild mushrooms, and rustically served on a wooden plank.

Best Pie In Transit
Figs
Central Terminal Building, La Guardia Airport
718-446-7600
The signature prosciutto, fig, and Gorgonzola pie is the silver lining in a La Guardia layover.

Best Worth-the-Trip Pie
Di Fara Pizza
1424 Avenue J, Midwood, Brooklyn
718-258-1367
You could fly to Palermo in the time it takes to get here on the Q, but you wouldn’t find such an artful artichoke slice or as succulent a Sicilian.

Best Myth-Shattering Pie
Nick's
1814 Second Avenue
212-987-5700
108-26 Ascan Avenue, Forest Hills
718-263-1126
Heavenly mozzarella, a subtly sweet sauce, and a charred, slightly puffy, flavorful crust. Nick’s pie triumphs without the benefit of a fancy oven: no wood, no Vesuvian-lava stone, not even a single brick.

Best Old-School Pie
Totonno's
1524 Neptune Avenue, Coney Island, Brooklyn
718-372-8606
The blistered crust, the sweet mozzarella ooze, the dabs of sauce all coalesce into a work of art; the occasional pizzaiolo outburst and no-frills, airline-wine-bottle selection only add to the charm.

TonyO
March 22nd, 2004, 11:38 AM
Lombardi's is a must. Just prepare to wait. Grimaldi's in Brooklyn too. Similar pizzas, great crusts, subtle but flavorful sauce and excellent toppings. Lombardi's homemade pepperoni is amazing.

Does anyone know the pizza place in Midtown that is in an old church with a high ceiling? I recall seeing it on some FoodTV show and never caught the name.

A bud of mine recommends:

La Vineria
19 W. 55th
212 - 247 - 3400

The Good News: GREAT brick oven pizza, good wine selection, tremendous service, and if you're not in the mood for pizza, the rest of the menu is pretty good too

The Bad News: its very small so its always crowded - there is usually a wait unless you go really early - I don't believe they take reservations

JLM
March 23rd, 2004, 03:09 PM
I intend to start a campaign to bring real New York style pizza to London. First I am going to print out all these amazingly detailed and informed postigs and give them to the owner of the nearest pizza place to me. he is an Iranian I think. What would they know about pizza? This might give hime some food for thought.

Interesting. I live in Vancouver, BRITISH Columbia and the Iranians here think that they are Italian too. Why is that?

Schadenfrau
March 23rd, 2004, 05:21 PM
Maybe they don't think they're Italian, but rather that they're simply small business owners providing a desirable product?

JLM
March 23rd, 2004, 06:01 PM
Maybe they don't think they're Italian, but rather that they're simply small business owners providing a desirable product?

You are probably right. I didn't mean to sound racist or anything. It's just something that I have noticed. It by no means ends with pizza, to be honest. It would be nice to have authentic Iranian restaurants and products too.

Yanez
May 20th, 2004, 12:56 AM
Hi guys,
that's my first post on this interesting forum I've just found.
I'm italian and what I miss mostly is a real good italian pizza. I temporarely likve in DC, where I manage to find a couple of restaurants with an acceptable pizza, but I'm often in NYC, definitely one of my favorite cities.... ok, the favorite ! I agree with Tonyo about "La Vineria", small place, but with an excellent quality.
About PIZZA, which is the important topic, I've been in a place called "Pizza Fresca" (22nd street) and I was very well impressed !
I suggest to choose always the real pizza, which is the Margherita (named by a neapolitan cook after the italian Queen Margherita, end of nineteen century): tomatoes, buffalo mozzarella and basil (the colors of the italian flag). And of course: Brick Oven !!!
Check it out and Buon Appetito !
Ciao
Yanez

Pilaro
May 21st, 2004, 01:55 AM
I'm laughing because I was in NY last week and I just happened to eat at Arturo's and it was some of the best pizza I have ever eaten. My only objection is that some of the paintings are rather haunting. I spent my entire dinner staring at one particularly disturbing picture of an emaciated woman. I recommend eating there, just keep your eyes off the walls. Check out the bathroom too, there is a bathtub just incase you feel a little dirty or spill on yourself.

NYatKNIGHT
May 21st, 2004, 12:50 PM
Yeah, that bathtub is a laugh. Besides the creepy pictures, Arturo's has one of the best atmospheres of all the great pizza places in the city, especially when someone is on the piano.

Kris
August 13th, 2004, 07:23 AM
Are there any pizza places in Manhattan better than John's? I ate a lot of pizza there and it was the best.

L D
August 17th, 2004, 02:54 AM
Grimaldi's, Lombardi's and Denino's

TonyO
November 10th, 2004, 12:18 PM
I happened upon a touristy place that has great pizza just south of Central Park. Angelo's Pizza - 117 West 57th St.

kmistic
November 22nd, 2004, 03:37 PM
I heard a place in L.A. actually buys bottled NYC tap water. They claim to be the only place out side of new york to have a "real New York style" pizza. I forget the name of the place. I think it was on the travel channel or something.

NoyokA
November 22nd, 2004, 03:49 PM
I heard a place in L.A. actually buys bottled NYC tap water. They claim to be the only place out side of new york to have a "real New York style" pizza. I forget the name of the place. I think it was on the travel channel or something.

I've passed by that place. Supposendly what makes NYC Pizza so great is the water that makes the dough. Not suprising, its on Rodeo Drive.

TonyO
November 22nd, 2004, 04:26 PM
I heard a place in L.A. actually buys bottled NYC tap water. They claim to be the only place out side of new york to have a "real New York style" pizza. I forget the name of the place. I think it was on the travel channel or something.

I saw a similar story, but they don't ship water - they mix minerals to simulate NY tap. Shipping would be cost prohibitive.

kmistic
November 22nd, 2004, 06:27 PM
Thats probably what i seen. I stand corrected. :D

mr. big
November 23rd, 2004, 05:48 PM
The city is full of pizza parlors. If it's open late and full of people its bound to be good.

TonyO
November 29th, 2004, 05:41 PM
NYTimes
November 28, 2004
THE CITY LIFE

Brooklyn Pizza to Go

By FRANCIS X. CLINES

inding Patsy Grimaldi's name on a pizzeria out in Phoenix, amid all that sun and desert, is weird. Anyone who knows Patsy can only picture his coal-fired pizza oven glowing in the long shadows of the Brooklyn Bridge's eastern arch, with the patient lines of hungry customers outside and a firm no-delivery policy inside (except in the old days when Frank Sinatra ordered out from the Waldorf-Astoria or sent a plane from Los Angeles for two score of Patsy's pies). "I'm retired now," explains Patsy. "But franchised, kind of."

It's not like he's Brooklyn's answer to Colonel Sanders. So far there are just a precious few other Grimaldis out there and Patsy says he insists on personally training this new generation to make pies the way his late uncle, Patsy Lancieri, taught him 60 years ago in Harlem - with the special dough recipe and only fresh ingredients from Italy, of course, but always in an oven built the old way from brick and fired the old way by coal, not by gas as most modern pizzeria ovens are.

"Fifty years ago, 100 years ago, that's all they had in the city was coal ovens," Patsy says, proud to be handing on his retro-coal technique to Phoenix. By his account, the coal-brick approach produces far more heat (800 degrees plus) than gas, and thereby fierce-to-subtle hot spots of artistry to make the pie bubble, crisp and lightly char. "Far better flavor," Patsy assures, particularly for those who had their first taste of pizza after World War II, when soldiers came home with tales of discovering it in Italy. Pizza has since become a ubiquitous industry in America with flavors running from rare ambrosia to mall-rat flannel. It inevitably created a connoisseur craving for the real deal, the sort of pie that perennially has Grimaldi's rated among New York's best. "Everybody's advertising 'brick-oven,' but not with the coal," Patsy cautions. "These guys know nothing about pizza."

Like thoroughbred racing bloodlines, pizza can be traced in this country to a pioneer master, Gennaro Lombardi, who opened the first shop offering the exotic, postpeasant bakery product a century ago in Manhattan's Little Italy. He brought the recipe from Naples, where pizza was cooked in wood-fired ovens, and adapted it here to coal ovens, one of which still powers up worthy pies at an authentic version of Lombardi's on Spring Street.

Patsy Grimaldi honors this history down through Uncle Patsy as he finally hands their arts on to the future. First he put an outpost in Hoboken with a coal-brick oven built and run now by a contractor friend who preferred constructing pizzas. And now it's on to Phoenix, and only because the owner there needed the secrets of the Brooklyn pie maker who knows from coal-brick ovens. "So," says Patsy, "you could say I'm now a - what is it called? - a consultant. A pizza consultant."

nick1126
December 14th, 2004, 10:38 PM
I saw a show on the History channel about New York City pizza parlors. Most that were showing the pizza being made show the sauce added after the other toppings. Is this a new trend?

No other NY recipes I found on Google, or anywhere else for that matter, follow these directions.

Gulcrapek
December 14th, 2004, 11:15 PM
Sauce on top of cheese and maybe a few other things is called sotto sopra. I don't know how many places have it.

TonyO
December 15th, 2004, 12:02 AM
I saw a show on the History channel about New York City pizza parlors. Most that were showing the pizza being made show the sauce added after the other toppings. Is this a new trend?

No other NY recipes I found on Google, or anywhere else for that matter, follow these directions.

Nah, not that I've seen. The trend is neopolitan thin-crust with real mozz.

I saw a show (maybe the same) and they talked about John's Pizzeria in Times Square, a secondary location after their well-known Village eatery. Its the "largest pizza restaurant in the world" supposedly. It is in a refurbished church.

jacknife
December 19th, 2004, 09:39 PM
i like lombardi's and john's on bleecker the best, but up on amsterdam at around 121st near columbia is che bella which is real good too.

Hof
January 6th, 2005, 12:01 PM
Man,this post has got some legs!
It started back in Nov '03,and constantly stays near the top,and with 16,000 hits it must be THE authority on NY Pizza,anywhere.
I've got nothing new to add,except that I ducked into a pizza parlor on Court St.,near Atlantic Ave(in Brooklyn) to get out of the rain and discovered a GREAT slice.
I can't remember the name of the place,but it's worth finding.It's just across from the Federal Bldg construction.
It was so good,I had 3 slices.Try the Sausage toppings.
Also,I saw a TV show that explained the "Ray's/Original Rays" controversy.Can't remember where I saw that either.I guess this post is just useless filler.

TonyO
January 6th, 2005, 09:06 PM
Eat up New Yorkers, Norway has us beat:

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article942789.ece

TonyO
March 1st, 2005, 08:33 PM
The Best pizza


By Josh Ozersky

March 1, 2005, 12:49 PM EST

Deep in a distant section of Brooklyn, amid Hasidic Jews and Russian immigrants, I once ate the perfect pizza. It had a crisp but pliable crust, fresh whole milk fiore di latte mozzarella, mozzarella di buffala, regular Grande pizza mozzarella, padano and grated Parmigiano Reggiano cheese, all in proportion.

My search for the perfect pizza ended that day at Di Fara Pizza in Midwood. But for Ed Levine, the quest continues.

He is not alone.

Rather, a whole cult of online evangelists, unpaid but obsessively dedicated, continues to search the highways and strip malls for the perfect pie. "Pizza is a special food," Levine said recently at Di Fara, while helping me eat the perfect pie. "It matters to people."

The pizza-pie guy

Levine is the author of a new book, "Pizza: A Slice of Heaven" (Rizzoli, $24.95), which contains within its pages some of the deepest secrets and most piercing observations ever made on its subject.

Domenico DeMarco, the city's most venerated pizza figure, is the man I worship at DiFara, and Levine and I talked about pizza as he carefully grated low-moisture mozzarella on the slicing side of an old-fashioned box grater. Levine ate and talked.

"If there's one thing I want people to get out of this book," Levine said, "it's how rich and fascinating the culture of pizza is. It transcends class lines, race, gender, age." Levine, a big man, spread his hands wide and added: "New Yorkers are especially passionate about pizza."

But why?

Other foods have their dedicated advocates, their Talmudic controversies, their heroes. The disputes over barbecue alone could confound a scholar. But pizza seems to evoke energies that lie untapped when it comes to burgers or brisket.

A slew of dedicated New Yorkers scours the city daily in search of their grail pie. Although they may never find it, they share their findings with the world. Unlike Levine's book, a compendium of pizza musings by celebrated New York food writers, these pizza bloggers have no special qualifications other than energy and an abiding love of pizza.

For Adam Kuban, who maintains the popular Web site SliceNY.com, the site took root when he met another self-professed "pizza geek," Marc Bailes, at Martha Stewart Living, where they both work.

"I didn't start to be a pizza arbiter," Kuban said, but he says his site draws 7,000 visitors a day and is one of the first stops on any pizza quest in New York.

"We just wanted to create a site that would act as a record of our own pizza adventures throughout the city and beyond," Kuban said, giving some history. Each pizza record includes digital photos by Kuban of the pizza, and, in many cases, closeups of its underside, the better to show the char spots and bubble pattern.

Sharing the pie

This passion for pizza, Levine maintains, is a function of New York "slice culture."

"Pizza is cheap, and a slice is the first restaurant food you can buy on your own." Sam Sifton, one of the authors in Levine's book, describes this as the "pizza cognition theory": You eat a slice when you're young and seek one just like it for the rest of your life. As a result, New Yorkers will fight to the death about their favorite slice vs. somebody else's.

Geof Grayson, a pizza chef and one of Long Island's foremost pizza authorities, agrees. "New Yorkers don't talk about pizza. They talk about somebody's pizza. And they don't always agree," he said.

For Grayson, pizza-hunting on Long Island is a difficult exercise most of the time. "Most people don't care," he said. "But I look to see pizzas rotated through the oven to equalize hot spots, and I see if the pizza guy scrapes the oven with a spatula to clean out the black bits in the bottom of the oven. These are the kinds of things I look for. I'm usually disappointed."

On the other hand, many New Yorkers didn't have the good luck to grow up around great slice places; they came here as adults, which made the impression even stronger. Audrey Aponte writes and maintains a site dedicated to her pizza "field trips" on pizza.tienmao.com. "When I moved here from Vassar five years ago, I couldn't believe how great the pizza was. I had to find out more about it, so I started organizing the field trips. Not everybody wants to do that on weekends, but to me it was a natural," she said. "I needed to try the original [Patsy's East Harlem on First Avenue in Manhattan] for myself -- then I wanted to learn about all the coal-oven places."

Probably the biggest and most comprehensively detailed pizza quest is the ongoing "NYC Pizza Survey" at egullet. com, organized by the New York site director, Sam Kinsey. A bel canto opera singer with much experience eating pizza in Italy, Kinsey is obsessed with the Neapolitan-style pizza, in which thin pies are cooked in a hot wood- or coal-fired oven in three minutes or less. "What we're really interested in is, what is the crust like?" he said.

An ad hoc pizza club gathers for every trip, which is written about in excruciating detail and documented with even more digital photos than Kuban's reviews.

Crusty talk

Kinsey loves to talk crust, but he truly waxes poetic when describing the pizza of Patsy's in East Harlem: "The variable, fast emergence of air pocketing as it cooks creates a microscopic inner layer of indescribable pliability," he said to me rapturously one night over pizza at DeMarco's in Manhattan.

As long as there is great pizza in New York, there will be a place for the Cult of the Perfect Pizza to practice its ritual. Levine, though, went all across America in search of the perfect pizza. Is it possible, I asked the cultists, that they are missing a bet? That the perfect pizza might be somewhere out beyond our area?

Grayson thought about it for a minute and replied: "New York pizza is the best, I don't care what anybody says."

Josh Ozersky is a regular contributor to Newsday.
Copyright © 2005, Newsday, Inc.

NoyokA
March 2nd, 2005, 01:50 PM
Thanks tonyo.

Check out the weblink associated with the article:

http://www.sliceny.com

ant2781
March 6th, 2005, 01:55 PM
thats one thing i cant wait to try when i get to nyc in april. a chinese meal from china town....pizza from where ever you guys say is the best place...to have an italian meal down in little italy....

Ant

billyblancoNYC
March 7th, 2005, 01:58 PM
thats one thing i cant wait to try when i get to nyc in april. a chinese meal from china town....pizza from where ever you guys say is the best place...to have an italian meal down in little italy....

Ant

Well, I would look elsewhere for Italian than Little Italy. It's too touristy and pricey, for my tastes. There's great Italian all over, especially in the East Village (and cheap). The REAL little Italy in NYC is either Bensonhurst, Brooklyn or Arthur Ave. in the Bronx. Chinese in Chinatown is pretty damn cool, though.

ASchwarz
March 7th, 2005, 02:19 PM
Well, I would look elsewhere for Italian than Little Italy. It's too touristy and pricey, for my tastes. There's great Italian all over, especially in the East Village (and cheap). The REAL little Italy in NYC is either Bensonhurst, Brooklyn or Arthur Ave. in the Bronx. Chinese in Chinatown is pretty damn cool, though.

An excellent and little known Little Italy is Morris Park Avenue in the East Bronx. The neighborhood is on the 5 Train. This is the most authentic Italian neighborhood in the city.

Zouzzi
March 22nd, 2005, 01:24 AM
I have tasted the Pizza in NYC and was very disappointed..

I think Pizza in Australia is definately better..

Did you know 2 Australian blokes won the title of Best Gourmet Pizza in the world.. yes we won..

I guess it really depends where you get ur pizza from.. Unfortunately I must not have gone to a good pizza place..

I'm returning to NY in August anyone have any suggestions that will make me eat my words .. hehehe or eat better pizza
mwah mwah

Zouzzi

alejo_muskus
March 22nd, 2005, 05:46 PM
When I traveled to New York in January I stayed near Times Square and ate at a pizza place called "Famiglia" (or "La Famiglia", not completely sure of the name) because it was close to the hotel....

I personally liked it, I wouldn't say the best I ever had but it was good... any opinions? Is it a place regularly thought of when pizza is the question?

ASchwarz
March 22nd, 2005, 05:47 PM
When I traveled to New York in January I stayed near Times Square and ate at a pizza place called "Famiglia" (or "La Famiglia", not completely sure of the name) because it was close to the hotel....

I personally liked it, I wouldn't say the best I ever had but it was good... any opinions? Is it a place regularly thought of when pizza is the question?

Famous Famiglia is a pretty bad chain. I don't like it at all.

Schadenfrau
March 22nd, 2005, 06:11 PM
Where did you eat, Zouzzi?

You really can't expect to eat at any old chain on the street and find it representative of New York pizza. This thread offers many recommendations about where to find the good stuff.

NYatKNIGHT
March 22nd, 2005, 06:58 PM
Did you know 2 Australian blokes won the title of Best Gourmet Pizza in the world.. yes we won..

I guess it really depends where you get ur pizza from.
When I lived in Denver, a Pizza Hut was voted best pizza place in the city - what a joke. Two things can be concluded from this: 1)Denver pizza must really suck if that's the best they have, and/or 2) the judges must not know good pizza if they think any chain restaurant is the best (fellow self-proclaimed pizza connoisseurs will agree, no?). I think it was a combo of the two because after painful searching I finally did find some good pizza out there. Luckily New Yorkers had moved out and opened up shop on Colfax St. It was the only place I found that used real mozarella.

Point is, whoever won some Best Gourmet Pizza contest isn't really proof of anything either. Maybe it was good, or maybe it's what you're used to.

Also, "Gourmet Pizza" sounds like some enhanced meal, sort of like comparing that Chicago deep dish pizza to ours. Though it may be delicious, it's simply not the same thing and ought not be compared directly.

Or maybe I'm just totally wrong and all this time the best pizza in the world is Down Under. Who knew?

ZippyTheChimp
March 22nd, 2005, 07:05 PM
We don't need no stinkin' contest!

alejo_muskus
April 2nd, 2005, 06:57 PM
I went to a restaurant after visiting the Museum of Natural History but I can't remember the name... It is located on the corner of Columbus Ave. and 81 West, just behind the space center...

The pizza was quite good and the service was one of the best ones we had in our visit to New York...also the waitress was really cute, christina, made us feel real good...

algormortis
May 23rd, 2005, 06:11 PM
I've got nothing new to add,except that I ducked into a pizza parlor on Court St.,near Atlantic Ave(in Brooklyn) to get out of the rain and discovered a GREAT slice.
I can't remember the name of the place,but it's worth finding.It's just across from the Federal Bldg construction.
It was so good,I had 3 slices.Try the Sausage toppings.

It's called "My Little Pizzeria"--Court between State and Atlantic.

My nomination for the best. Their pizza always tastes so incredibly...fresh. And it's right near my house. I might go get a slice now. Bye.

Daddys_Little_NewYorkGirl
June 12th, 2005, 12:16 AM
John's is definetly a very strong contender- however it is almost always complete chaos to try and eat there- it is a pretty small place and there are always a million kids who are very enthusiastic about receiving their pie.

stepbystepShoppingDotCom
June 16th, 2005, 12:11 PM
Last weekend we were in the city and went to
JOE'S PIZZA...we highly recommend...

RandySavage
June 16th, 2005, 02:24 PM
Benny Tudino's in Hoboken has the best slice in Greater Metropolitan area.

Scraperfannyc
June 16th, 2005, 03:17 PM
I hate Benny Tudino's pizza. Crust flops down like a wet piece of paper and the cheese slides off, sauce is pretty tasteless compared to pizza I eat, and the cheese and quality of ingredients is at best average. Price and size is good though.

asg
June 16th, 2005, 06:12 PM
Man,this post has got some legs!
It started back in Nov '03,and constantly stays near the top,and with 16,000 hits it must be THE authority on NY Pizza,anywhere.
It really does have some staying power - it actually started back in 2002!

I like Lombardi's margherita pizza best, but downtown, for delivery, I have been really happy with the brick oven pizza from the Amish Market on Battery Place. Their prices are reasonable ($10.95, I think) and they use fresh Mozzarella, San Marzano tomatoes and top it with Romano and fresh basil. Their competition in Battery Park City (won't mention the name) has absolutely the worst pizza I've ever tried and yet they charge nearly double for it! I'll never order from that place again.

(Also, the sausage Calzone from the Amish Market is fantastic as well - Grandma sauce!)

Ninjahedge
June 17th, 2005, 10:03 AM
I hate Benny Tudino's pizza. Crust flops down like a wet piece of paper and the cheese slides off, sauce is pretty tasteless compared to pizza I eat, and the cheese and quality of ingredients is at best average. Price and size is good though.

Scrap, it is not bad if you get a fresh slice, but since they are large pies, if it is gotten later it is soggy...

There is a better one out on 1st street I believe, Grimaldis? i remember the green outside.. :P Really good thin crust Margharita pizza, but more expensive than your standard pie.

For a good overstuffed pie, ironically, Margaritas (sp) on 8th and Washington is not bad at all.

Joe's pizza at W4th is great, but do not get any toppings (they pretty much throw some stuff on a pre-cooked slice and stick it in the oven. It is not quite the same as a fully made/baked pie...)

Johns on Bleeker is very good for pies too, but it is crowded some days, and you have to order by the pie, not by the slice, so go when you need to....

TonyO
June 20th, 2005, 10:04 AM
Joe's pizza at W4th is great, but do not get any toppings (they pretty much throw some stuff on a pre-cooked slice and stick it in the oven. It is not quite the same as a fully made/baked pie...)


Thanks for bringing that up, this has to be the most disgusting thing a pizza place can do. Uncooked pepperoni, mushrooms on an old slice should be banned. So many places do it too.

TonyO
June 21st, 2005, 01:05 PM
NY Times
June 21, 2005

Digging Deep for a Slice of the Pie

By CLYDE HABERMAN
NOT to alarm New York City subway and bus riders, but a pizza shop around the corner from our Times Square office is charging $2.20 for a plain slice. At a Famous Famiglia parlor a few blocks north, the price is up to $2.25.

This horrifying discovery left us no choice but to place an urgent phone call to Eric M. Bram. He confirmed our worst fears for the subways.

"Are you going to get another fare increase?" he said. "I guess it's inevitable."

On this score, there is every reason to heed Mr. Bram, a Bronx-born patent lawyer who moved to Westchester some time ago.

In 1980, he articulated what we have since come to call the Pizza Connection. He noted that, from the early 1960's, the price of a pizza slice - we're talking here about a no-frills wedge of mozzarella and tomato sauce, unmarred by toppings - matched the cost of a subway ride "with uncanny precision."

At the time, a slice typically cost 60 cents. Thus did Mr. Bram conclude that the prevailing 50-cent subway and bus fare was doomed. He was right, of course.

He had history on his side.

In 1960, the fare was 15 cents. That was what a slice of pizza cost, too. By the early 70's, the fare had risen to 35 cents. So had pizza.

Three years ago, with the fare at $1.50, we invoked the Bram rule, noting that pizza was typically selling for $1.75 in many neighborhoods and for as much $2 in Midtown. It seemed unlikely that the Metropolitan Transportation Authority could hold out for long. And it couldn't. A year later, the fare zoomed to $2, after nearly eight years without change - a defiance of the Pizza Connection that obviously could not be sustained.

So now that a slice goes for as much as $2.25, what are the long-term prospects for the $2 fare? Probably no better, we figure, than the odds that Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie will still be together by this time next year.

Granted, pizza doesn't cost $2.25 everywhere in New York. A slice for $2, even for $1.75, is common in many neighborhoods. Still, the higher price has gained a foothold here.

Granted, too, that the situation is more complex than three years ago. With the subway token gone and the MetroCard in command, the subwaymeisters can tinker more readily with what in this city qualifies as natural law. The transportation authority did exactly that this year when it left the $2 base fare intact but managed nonetheless to dip deeper into riders' pockets by raising the prices of monthly and weekly cards.

That action dealt a body blow to the Pizza Connection. "Who knows if the fundamentals of economics will hold?" Mr. Bram asked.

AS it is, the fare is beset by other pressures, some almost as serious as the price of a slice.

Future budget deficits loom for the transportation authority. They could rise to $1.1 billion in 2010, the state comptroller said. Peter S. Kalikow, the authority's chairman, has said it was a mistake to go eight years without a change in the fare, only to then sock riders with a 33 percent increase. Smaller but more frequent increases make more sense, he said.

His agency will also have to borrow billions to renovate subway stations and pay for other improvements. Borrowing inevitably means higher interest payments, adding to the pressure on the fare.

Beyond that, the authority has assumed certain costs that some New Yorkers believe should be borne by others.

An example is a commitment to spend $80 million to rebuild the Cortlandt Street station on the No. 1 line, wiped out when the World Trade Center collapsed in 2001. Why, some wonder, is the authority - and by extension, the riding public - paying for this instead of the federal government, out of funds intended for post-Sept. 11 recovery?

"If the station was there and it was destroyed, that's exactly what 9/11 money was intended to cover," said Gene Russianoff, the staff lawyer for the Straphangers Campaign.

All in all, even without higher pizza prices, times are tough for subway and bus riders. It hardly helps that city and state subsidies for mass transit have shrunk over the years.

Maybe the problem, though, is not the size of the aid but rather where it goes. What if the city and state were to reinterpret the Bram rule and, instead of subsidizing subways, offer pizza parlors millions to keep their prices stable?

The way things are going, that may well be our best shot at stopping the fare from going up, and soon.

Hof
July 14th, 2005, 01:14 PM
Pizza Connection,Smeetza Connection--A pie still costs LESS than a Metrocard.A pie with meat.

ZippyTheChimp
July 31st, 2005, 06:41 AM
July 31, 2005
The Pizza's Still Old World, Only Now the Old World's Tibet

By JOSEPH BERGER (http://query.nytimes.com/search/query?ppds=bylL&v1=JOSEPH BERGER&fdq=19960101&td=sysdate&sort=newest&ac=JOSEPH BERGER&inline=nyt-per)

What do you say to the sushi chef who has just served you the most sublime yellowtail?

Often these days, it is "Gracias." New tides of immigration have so transformed New York City that classic ethnic foods and drinks are increasingly being prepared by people whose ethnicity does not necessarily match the menu's.

Exhibit A: the egg cream. For New Yorkers of a certain age, this was the nectar of a Jewish neighborhood, and Gem Spa was the drink's sacred temple, certified as such by magazines and travel writers. Gem Spa is still there, still turning out egg creams at its narrow patch of a soda fountain in the East Village. But the person who owns the store and taught the staff to make this curious concoction of seltzer, milk and chocolate syrup is Ray Patel, a 62-year-old immigrant from Gujarat state in India.

He learned the recipe, including the secret stirring motions that create a frothy head resembling beaten egg whites, from the previous owner (Italian), who learned it from the old owner (Jewish).

"People try to learn new things in a land of opportunity," is Mr. Patel's elegant explanation for how an Indian came to make a drink that is considered exotic west of the Hudson River, let alone in Gujarat.

The changing of the food guard has been so gradual that New Yorkers often don't notice that the falafel at their favorite stand has been whipped up by someone from Latin America.

But some of the changes have been striking.

The pastry chef at Brasserie La Côte Basque on West 55th Street is Ecuadorean. The pizza maker at Totonno's on Second Avenue and 80th Street is Tibetan. And one of the sushi chefs at Hatsuhana on East 48th Street, among the pioneers in initiating the city into the delights of raw fish, is Mexican.

The main reason for this phenomenon - one observed across a nation being reshaped by newcomers - is that the old immigrant pipeline is drying up. The Italians, Irish, Jews and French who once made their fortunes standing over steaming pots of spaghetti or slicing endless slivers of paper-thin Nova Scotia smoked salmon sent their children to graduate schools to become lawyers and doctors. Keita Sato, the president of Hatsuhana, who grew up on Long Island and was trained in the delicate art of sushi by his father, said that his Japanese-American friends preferred to become stockbrokers.

"The younger generation, it's not their No. 1 priority to be a sushi chef," said Mr. Sato.

But somebody has to layer the moussaka and coddle the crepes and, increasingly, those willing to put in the long sweaty hours are newcomers from Latin America and Asia. A study by Dr. Andrew A. Beveridge, a professor of sociology at Queens College, showed that the number of New York food service workers from South and Central America and the West Indies jumped to 54,105 in 2000 from 31,214 in 1990, and the number of Asian workers increased to 34,393 from 25,358, according to his analysis of census figures. By contrast, the proportion of native-born workers in food service dropped to 36.2 percent in 2000 from 55.3 percent in 1980. "When the supply of your fellow ethnics isn't available to staff the place, you turn to the newest group on the block," said Joel Denker, author of "The World on a Plate: A Tour Through the History of America's Ethnic Cuisine" (Westview Press, 2003).

Right now, according to Ed Levine, a food writer in New York, "The work force in the food world is comprised primarily of Latinos." That explains why one of the best-selling books at Kitchen Arts & Letters at Lexington Avenue and 93d Street is "Kitchen Spanish" by Michael A. Friend and T. J. Loughran.

While the new immigrant workers may start out behind the scenes as busboys and dishwashers, many rise to positions as chefs or counter people who master not just the art of preparing other cultures' foods but also the whole accompanying cultural repertoire. Kenny Sze, an immigrant from Hong Kong who started out in the 1970's as a teenager at Zabar's and trained to fillet herrings under the legendary Sam Cohen, owns Sable's Smoked Fish on Second Avenue and 78th Street. It claims it carries "the world's best smoked salmon, sturgeon and caviar." His shop provided 35 pounds of caviar for the recent wedding of Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg's daughter Emma.

He has learned not only how to pick out a slab of nova before dawn at the right smokehouse, but also how to speak the smattering of Yiddish needed to kibitz with customers like former Mayor Edward I. Koch, for whom the patter is as important as the platter. In an interview, Mr. Koch exulted in the way Mr. Sze sometimes wraps lobster salad in a slice of sturgeon, and admitted that although "it may not be Jewish, it's haute cuisine." Over all, he said, he appreciates the diversity in the city's ethnic kitchens.

"It adds an exoticism to it and increases my appetite," he said.

Some ethnicities appropriate the food of other cultures that history had forced them to become familiar with. Albanians run many Italian restaurants, and Bangladeshis operate many of the Indian restaurants in the strip along East 6th Street. Some immigrants seize on an unfilled niche - as the Greeks did decades ago when they recast the American diner or the Cambodians who run numerous doughnut shops in Southern California.

Armando Martinez came to the United States in 1994 from the Mexican city of Puebla. One of his first jobs was as an all-purpose kitchen worker at a Japanese restaurant near Columbia University. He enjoyed the precision of boning fish and rolling rice so much that he moved up two years later to Hatsuhana, where the fish is flown in from Japan and where the care taken with sushi is on a far more demanding level. (It tries to observe the Japanese tradition that sushi preparation requires four years of priestlike training.)

Mr. Martinez, who lives in Astoria, Queens, with his wife and 19-month-old twins, worked his way up a year and a half ago to the sushi counter, where he and the other eight chefs pare off wedges of salmon and yellowtail and press them on beds of warm rice. A slender, genial man who was wearing a Yankees cap during a break, Mr. Martinez spoke of his love for the craft. "I like to see a satisfied customer," he said. "To do that, it takes a lot of work."

Mr. Sato is happy to have Mr. Martinez, since he says it is not easy to find skilled Japanese chefs. "In the kitchen when we are right beside each other preparing the fish and rice, he puts me to shame," he said. "He's better than most Japanese chefs."

Totonno's, which was established in 1924 in Coney Island and claims to be the "oldest continuously operating pizzeria in the U.S. run by the same family," has four locations but it despaired of filling them with Italian pizziolas, or pizza makers, and was not about to take just anybody.

"You have to have a feel for the dough," said Louise Ciminieri, granddaughter of the founder.

Phuntsok Tashi came along just in time. Mr. Tashi, who is of Tibetan ancestry, immigrated five years ago from Dalhousie, India, in the western Himalayas, which has a large Tibetan community. A sister worked in a restaurant on Second Avenue and told him Totonno's, a few doors down, needed a busboy. Soon Brooklyn-bred Risa Pleger, a part-owner, asked him if he wanted to learn the art of molding and baking a pizza. He mastered the trick of flattening the dough and spreading patches of mozzarella, tomato sauce and Romano over it.

"You have to press it very nicely and evenly and then press it from the back," he said as he moved the pizza with a paddle inside a brick oven heated to 1,100 degrees to prevent charring.

Rosa Vergara, 42, immigrated from Cuenca, Ecuador, 12 years ago and landed a job making jewelry for a garment district business. When the business failed five years ago, a Peruvian friend who worked at La Côte told her that the kitchen needed help. Jean-Jacques Rachou, the owner of the longtime institution of haute cuisine that has had two name changes and a makeover in recent years, said Mrs. Vergara worked under his pastry chefs and one day told him, " 'Give me the chance and I can show you I can do it.' "

"And she does it," he said.

The decorative skills she had learned in the jewelry trade came in handy. As she spoke with a visitor, she squeezed chocolate and vanilla sauce from plastic bottles into neat zigzags to adorn a plate holding a raspberry mousse she made earlier in the day, then dappled the mousse with blueberries.

Mr. Rachou also taught the art of fashioning French delicacies to her 25-year-old sister, Mayra. He had to.

"French cooks don't come to America anymore," he said. "They make more money in France."




Copyright 2005 (http://www.nytimes.com/ref/membercenter/help/copyright.html) The New York Times Company (http://www.nytco.com/)

nym9
August 7th, 2005, 03:17 AM
Singa's, on Kissena blvd in Queens

Patricia's, on Morris Park ave in the Bronx

Jasonik
October 24th, 2005, 06:18 PM
http://www.newyorkpizzashow.com/

Attendees who sign up for the Lombardi's Slice of History Tour will travel from the Jacob Javits Center via tour bus to the oldest pizzeria in America. The bonus this year is you will be visiting on the 100th anniversary of the opening of Lombardi's. It's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for anyone who owns a pizzeria or is in the pizza business. While there, you will get to sample pizzas and appetizers cooked in Lombardi's famous coal-fired oven. You will also tour the pizzeria and hear owner John Brescio talk about the history of Lombardi's, the Spring Street area and New York pizza. You will also get the opportunity to ask John one-on-one questions about what makes Lombardi's and New York pizza so special. The cost for this tour is $25 and includes food, drink and transportation to and from Lombardi's. Registration is required and is limited to 50 people, so call now to reserve your seat. This tour takes place on November 1st and is the only restaurant tour by Lombardi's being offered to any pizza show in the U.S. "PMQ stands for the independents of this country," John Brescio says. "They are the only ones we will open our doors to for something of this nature and we welcome all the pizzeria owners to drop by an visit Lombardi's on our 100th anniversary."

Supercool Dude
October 27th, 2005, 11:38 PM
Best Pizza I can buy is at Loretta's Pizza on Layton Avenue and Dean Avenue in the Bronx NY.

http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.835632,-73.817900&spn=0.003339,0.006870&hl=en

asg
October 28th, 2005, 05:04 PM
After reading this comment on http://www.mikeindustries.com/blog/tenthings I've gotta try Trader Joe's Frozen Pizza (http://www.traderjoes.com/) --

"Ok, let me get this straight. Someone in Italy handtosses a pizza with fresh ingredients, someone else packages it up, someone else ships it across the Atlantic to the east coast, someone else drives it across the country to Seattle, someone else delivers it to my local Trader Joe's store, someone else sells it to me at the register for three dollars, and somehow, someone is making money off of this??? What? This is quite possibly the best pizza I've ever had outside of Italy and yes, it's three dollars at your local Trader Joe's. Make sure you buy the large flat one which says "Made in Italy" and you won't be disappointed."

NYatKNIGHT
October 28th, 2005, 06:40 PM
I'd also be curious to try it. No doubt it may well be the best pizza they can get in Seattle, but even if it is incredibly delicious, which it may well be, there's no way I'm eating a frozen pizza while I live in Manhattan.

LeCom
October 28th, 2005, 07:28 PM
Pizza on the third level of Pier 17.

Supercool Dude
October 28th, 2005, 08:23 PM
Yuk! Frozen Pizza! (Shudders!) Preservatives? Ick!:eek:

Schadenfrau
October 30th, 2005, 04:25 AM
Pizza in the Northwest is notoriously disgusting, not to mention frequently laced with cornmeal.

I'm very curious to see these Italian spots the reviewer has visited.

Hof
January 2nd, 2006, 12:00 PM
Yuk.
I totally concour with the disgust for frozen pizza.There are times when circumstances have conspired to force dead,ex-cryogenicly frozen slices of a reheated pseudo-"pie" down my throat,and I will always regret those times.I usually let most of it go to waste as I fight back the gag reflex and reach for the Maalox.

And there is NO WAY that I'll touch microwaved pizza.Never have,never could.I will spend what is left of life avoiding it.When I see it in the supermarket freezers,I avert my gaze lest I be turned into an unworthy pillar of salt.
MICROWAVE PIZZA !!!

I like my pies fresh from an oven,served by an Italian,the hand-tossed shell darkly browned and thinly crusty,the pepperoini twisted and crispy;NO extra cheese,please.I want the sweet,steamed odor of sauce and yeast rising to activate an ocean of expectant saliva,and the Mozzerella so stringy hot that even cold beer can't chase the fire away.
Then I want the ability to buy all that glory by the Slice!

THAT kind of pizza is only available in New York.

Maybe a new thread needs to begin--"The Worst Pizza In New York"...

macreator
January 2nd, 2006, 02:13 PM
Mafei's Pizza on the southeast corner of 22nd street and 6th Avenue has the best sicilian slice in Manhattan. Ask for a "grandma" slice -- they are fantastic.

Outside of Manhattan, the best place to get sicilian is at L&B's Spumoni Gardens in Brooklyn. Great fun in the summer to sit outside on the picnic tables they have out front.

ECTO-1
January 2nd, 2006, 06:22 PM
I'd like to chime in with this place on 75th and 18th in Brooklyn. Best pizza I ever had, next to this place that closed up down the avenue on 83rd.

STT757
June 25th, 2006, 12:04 PM
There's no decent Pizza in Manhattan, it's all that fake Tourist crap.

The two best places to get Pizza in the NYC Area are Staten Island and New Jersey.

CastleHillzfinest718
June 25th, 2006, 01:54 PM
The best pizza I think is definitely in the Bronx, in Morris Park, and in Brooklyn, in Brooklyn Heights (Grimaldi's, and the Brooklyn Ice Cream Factory have the best ice cream).

BPC
June 25th, 2006, 09:05 PM
Grimaldi's (formerly Patsy's) in Brooklyn Heights is the best I've had, by far. But aside from a few great places, frankly, Dominoes makes a better pie than your average NYC pizzeria, with its soggy crust

milleniumcab
June 25th, 2006, 10:42 PM
I agree with Grimaldi's being the best but Domino's, please... Every neighborhood in NYC must have a pizzeria with pizza superior to Domino's.. I hope.

Convex
June 26th, 2006, 09:02 AM
there's a great pizza place just opened up in Williamsburg. one stop in on the L line in brooklyn. its steps away from the subway entrance. thin crust, italian style. the three cheese is my personal favorite...

it's called Fornino's.

Ninjahedge
June 26th, 2006, 10:24 AM
Johns Brick Oven on Bleeker and Joes Pizzaria on Bleeker near W4.

Very good stuff, for different reasons.

And Manhattan is getting bad, you have to find one of the older shops to egt a decent pie in. Most of the new ones are concentrating more on a Sbarro-like look than actual god TASTING pizza.

I really do not care if they have Artachoke Papaya Garlic Squid pie. Some combos may be interesting, but make about as much sense as Hamburger Sushi.

pianoman11686
June 26th, 2006, 10:47 AM
Gimme a break. You guys are too spoiled. Try living out in a place like North Carolina all year long, then come back to New York and have a slice in any Manhattan pizzeria. The difference is far greater than it reasonably should be. And I'm not just talking about switching from Domino's (although there is some of that). Even the places that call themselves "New York-style pizzerias" just don't cut it. What's next? Einstein Bros. (are they even still in business?) makes better bagels than the average Manhattan bagelry? Maybe some places are selling out to tourists, but the great majority of independent pizzerias still serve a good old-fashioned slice - be it in Manhattan, Brooklyn, or Queens (sorry, haven't been to one in the Bronx or S.I. yet).

TonyO
June 26th, 2006, 11:00 AM
^ True. We are a spoiled bunch here in the city but you have to expect that for the first place in the US to toss a pizza dough.

One annoying thing of some everyday-pizzerias here is the old slices they serve. Nothing more annoying than getting a heated up, dried out slice. Ask for pepperoni and they throw it uncooked on top and heat it up (which should be against the law).

pianoman11686
June 26th, 2006, 11:12 AM
I'll agree with you on the old slice issue, though I almost always get a fresh slice, even if it means waiting a few minutes for a new pie to come out. Can't say I get pepperoni often. I mostly stick to plain and white. Anyone else here like white slices?

Ninjahedge
June 26th, 2006, 11:46 AM
Heh.

I agree with you on that Tony....

I HATE it when I go inthere, see them use some canned mushrooms on a plain slice and throw it back in the oven to get toasty. (Sorry Joe's!) The best at most places are the fresh slices coming out. That is also why I do not care for so many "specialty" pies. You have 20 pies on display, chances are NONE of them are fresh.

Piano, as for being spoiled, after Grad School in Cali, I know a few things.

1. "California Pizza" is one of the funniest names for a pizza place I have EVER seen. Sort of akin to "Arizona Lobster".

2. People put strange things on Pizza.

3. California has lousy bagels.

4. Unless you are IN Manhattan, 95% of asian food on the east coast sucks yarballs. (If you have any yarballs that is).

So wahtever. The sad part that I see are places like Sbarros, Pizza Hut, Dominoes and other places taking over in a lot of areas as NYers get "diluted" to the suburbs. Upside is that there are a lot of nice restaurants in the suburbs now. They are just harder to find than in NYC (less concentrated).

STT757
June 26th, 2006, 12:02 PM
I was in San Diego about 3 years ago, they had "Staten Island Pizza". I got a kick out of that.

CastleHillzfinest718
June 26th, 2006, 01:55 PM
Also Paty's in East Harlem has the best, I think, probably as good as Grimaldi's. The crust is super thin that you actually are forced to fold the slice in half. The tomatoes in the gravy taste like they were freshly grown in a small patch of grass in the back, and the mozzarella cheese is fresh and excellant.

NYatKNIGHT
June 26th, 2006, 03:40 PM
Anyone else here like white slices?Love the white.

Bright Lights, Big City
June 26th, 2006, 04:31 PM
Though I haven't tried most of the spots y'all New Yorkers are raving about, I do make it a point to go down to John's Pizza in the Village whenever I'm in town. Everything about their pizza is fantastic, from the crust to the cheese to the tomato sauce. I usually just get plain cheese and sauce, but last time I was there (a few weeks ago) I got one with sausage, pepperoni and mushroom, and was quite impressed.
I've also had pizza from a few of the ubiquitous slice spots around town, but I was never impressed with any of them.

Oh, and BTW, I still don't think New York rules in the American pizza realm - Chicago has got you beat in my opinion. That thick crust stuff from Lou Molnati's with whole sausages cut lengthwise - nothing can top it. Period.

New York thin crust is good stuff, but Chicago has the best pizza I've ever eaten, bar none.

peace

BL, BC

pianoman11686
June 26th, 2006, 04:33 PM
Oh no you di'n't...

CastleHillzfinest718
June 26th, 2006, 04:43 PM
Though I haven't tried most of the spots y'all New Yorkers are raving about, I do make it a point to go down to John's Pizza in the Village whenever I'm in town. Everything about their pizza is fantastic, from the crust to the cheese to the tomato sauce. I usually just get plain cheese and sauce, but last time I was there (a few weeks ago) I got one with sausage, pepperoni and mushroom, and was quite impressed.
I've also had pizza from a few of the ubiquitous slice spots around town, but I was never impressed with any of them.

Oh, and BTW, I still don't think New York rules in the American pizza realm - Chicago has got you beat in my opinion. That thick crust stuff from Lou Molnati's with whole sausages cut lengthwise - nothing can top it. Period.

New York thin crust is good stuff, but Chicago has the best pizza I've ever eaten, bar none.

peace

BL, BC

I'm sorry New York has the best pizza hands down, in my opinion. You don't even have to go to the city now to get good pizza, as there are many good pizzarias based out of the city opening in up and coming suburban areas, like Yonkers, New Rochelle, White Plains, Tarrytown, and Rye.

Bright Lights, Big City
June 26th, 2006, 04:48 PM
I'm sorry New York has the best pizza hands down, in my opinion. You don't even have to go to the city now to get good pizza, as there are many good pizzarias based out of the city opening in up and coming suburban areas, like Yonkers, New Rochelle, White Plains, Tarrytown, and Rye.


Have you even eaten good Chicago pizza before, or are you just assuming that New York's pizza is the best? I've had both, and I would be lying if I told you New York's was better.

But I guess it depends on the kind of pizza you like. Chicago does do a good thin crust, but it's different than New York's (more like that really thin, really crispy, flaky crust). But Chicago deep dish from Lou Molnati's is the best pizza I've ever eaten. And the toppings are all of the highest quality, fresh, and yummy. The damn pizza is so thick you have no choice but to eat it with a knife and fork.

peace

BL BC

ZippyTheChimp
June 26th, 2006, 04:56 PM
It may be good, but it's not pizza.

milleniumcab
June 26th, 2006, 11:16 PM
^ True. We are a spoiled bunch here in the city but you have to expect that for the first place in the US to toss a pizza dough.

One annoying thing of some everyday-pizzerias here is the old slices they serve. Nothing more annoying than getting a heated up, dried out slice. Ask for pepperoni and they throw it uncooked on top and heat it up (which should be against the law).

Pizza is always best when reheated, just like a good lasagna...But once refrigrated, it is a gonner..

lofter1
June 27th, 2006, 12:02 AM
For a change of pace Two Boots makes a mean pie ...

milleniumcab
June 27th, 2006, 12:29 AM
For a change of pace Two Boots makes a mean pie ...

Do they still have multiple locations?

Ninjahedge
June 27th, 2006, 09:47 AM
Pizza is always best when reheated, just like a good lasagna...But once refrigrated, it is a gonner..


Um, I have to disagree with that.

A fresh thin crust is almost impossible to reheat right and a Sicillian absorbs all the moisture into the crust, it does not taste right either...

I know what you are saying about the lasagna...Although it needs some fresh sauce after heating.....

TonyO
June 27th, 2006, 09:59 AM
For a change of pace Two Boots makes a mean pie ...
Two boots is good, they have a spicy tomato sauce there.

TonyO
June 27th, 2006, 10:05 AM
Pizza is always best when reheated, just like a good lasagna...But once refrigrated, it is a gonner..

I have to disagree with that also, pizza's shelf life (like any bread product) is short once its done cooking. Especially since the sauce slowly soaks into the crust and makes a moist and doughy slab.

ZippyTheChimp
June 27th, 2006, 11:09 AM
A note on Sicilian style pizza, not to be confused with sfincione.

There was a place in Brooklyn under the El at 86th St and 23rd Ave called the Reliable Bakery. It's been closed for decades. They would put out a tray of Sicilian at various times during the day. If you timed your visit, it was worth the trip. Sicilian to die for - not the doughy dense stuff you find today, but light, with a slightly singed bottom.

I've never found its equal.

I've heard that L&B Spumoni Gardens, further down 86th St near the Sea Beach subway line, makes good Sicilian. But I only have experience with their spumoni.

lofter1
June 27th, 2006, 11:35 AM
"The Newman" pizza rocks ...

Two Boots has multiple Manhattan locations -- a few downtown plus GCT & Rock Center:

http://www.twoboots.com/frames/TwoBootsMain.html

lofter1
June 27th, 2006, 11:41 AM
In Rome the serve an amazing pizza called "pizza rustica" with a thicker crust -- but not doughy. Baked on a rectangular tin and cut in squares / rectangles. Simple and delicious. Never found anything comparable in the USA.

BPC
June 27th, 2006, 01:26 PM
"The Newman" pizza rocks ...

Two Boots has multiple Manhattan locations -- a few downtown plus GCT & Rock Center:

http://www.twoboots.com/frames/TwoBootsMain.html

The original (or at least what I believe to the original) Two boots in Park Slope made some of the best pizza I've had, but somehow the magic does not translate to the GCT location across the street from my office.

Schadenfrau
June 27th, 2006, 01:33 PM
The original Two Boots was on Avenue A. The branch in Brooklyn opened a few years later.

Ninjahedge
June 27th, 2006, 02:36 PM
TB in GC is OK. The varieties are creative, but overall it is not the best place.

The Pepperoni Square today was not bad, but the crust was a little tough and dough-y. Tasty sauce.

hungryfrank
July 5th, 2006, 08:26 PM
if anyone is intrested you can email me a copy of your favorite pizzeria in new york city and i will post it in and wil;l add it to the map
http://pizzainny,com

Ninjahedge
July 6th, 2006, 09:38 AM
if anyone is intrested you can email me a copy of your favorite pizzeria in new york city and i will post it in and wil;l add it to the map
http://pizzainny,com

Correct the typos and we may visit! ;)

Ninjahedge
July 6th, 2006, 12:23 PM
Me gets tired of waiting.

http://pizzainny.com/

replace "," with "."

eddhead
August 17th, 2006, 06:02 PM
DeNino's in staten Island, (sp?), Road House in Staten Island, Lombardi's in Noho, Angelo's Midtown, Nick's Forest Hills

pianoman11686
October 17th, 2006, 12:46 AM
Traffic-Stopper: Pizza for Less Than a Buck

http://graphics10.nytimes.com/images/2006/10/16/nyregion/600_INK.jpg

By JOE BRESCIA
Published: October 17, 2006

IT was almost 1 a.m. on a recent Monday at the corner of 41st Street and Ninth Avenue in Manhattan where during the weekday rush a conga line of cars, buses and trucks usually snakes around the block inching its way to the Lincoln Tunnel.

At this hour there was also a line of cars, but it had nothing to do with a tunnel backup. It was about the pizza, specifically a small place at that intersection called 99¢ Fresh Pizza. Twenty-four hours a day, the huge white writing on the green awning above the closet-sized spot serves as a beacon for light spenders.

“I’ve never seen pizza so cheap and so good anywhere,” said Shkele Athar, 31, leaning against the bumper of his taxi outside the store, two slices on his plate and a queue of cars idling behind him.

Garbage trucks, police vans, limousines and minivans curled around the block while their occupants went to grab their 99-cent slices. A bus driver coming out of the Port Authority bus terminal was a pizza Pied Piper, leading four people to the store.

Munchers gave a saucy thumbs up to the slices: Firm. Crisp enough. No sloppy cheese.

Behind the counter, three men worked in white soda-jerk caps, dancing a pizza polka in the small space, hustling to keep up. They worked the dough, slipped pies in and out of the oven, balanced paper plates and boxes.

They spoke little English, offering few words but many smiles. And some free stand-up, too. One worker who was asked where he was from said, “Astoria.”

He flashed a grin, then added, “Bangladesh.”

A whirring fan to the left of the oven offered a strange kind of mood music, offsetting the street noise.

99¢ Fresh Pizza, across from a homeless center, provides one answer to the perpetual question asked by sidewalk philanthropists: “What will this needy person really buy with this money?”

A man walking nearby with one crutch asked, “Can I please have a dollar?”

The customers in line paused.

“I want to buy pizza,” the man added.

Three hands reached out, holding bills and change.

So, how can the pizza be such a deal?

Oli Miah, the night manager, smiled but would not talk about the bottom line. “All I can say is, we stress volume to make our money,” Mr. Miah said.

And he was a little concerned about what a newspaper article might bring. “Uh-oh,” he said. “We might have lines all the way around the block if too many people find out.”

Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company

Fabrizio
October 17th, 2006, 10:13 AM
I sometimes like a good greasy, sloppy slice of pizza while in the US but I´ve never had GOOD pizza there. I don´t think it even exists.

A slice of good pizza, made as it should, would probably cost more than anyone would be willing to pay.

You need unclorinated water for the dough, "00" flour which doesn´t even exist in the US ( it´s a slightly harder less absorbant white flour). You need sea salt. The dough has to rise naturally. You need fresh mozzarella. Mozzarella can´t sit around for more than 2 days. And it has to sit in water. It must be sliced, not grated. The dough has to be thrown (spun) to make the pizza. That streches and pulls the dough, rather than squashing it with a rolling pin. Good extra-vergine olive oil. And the tomato. You want tomato canned from San Marzano.

http://www.barifoods.com/information/infopage_files/San%20Marzano.htm*

And there are only 2 real pizzas: the "margherita" and the "marinara". A few other combinations can pass but the catch-all toppings I see in the US make those pizzas as authentic as chocolate bagles.

*be sure to scroll down: hot Italian field worker with cigarette.

eddhead
October 17th, 2006, 03:56 PM
I sometimes like a good greasy, sloppy slice of pizza while in the US but I´ve never had GOOD pizza there. I don´t think it even exists.

A slice of good pizza, made as it should, would probably cost more than anyone would be willing to pay.

You need unclorinated water for the dough, "00" flour which doesn´t even exist in the US ( it´s a slightly harder less absorbant white flour). You need sea salt. The dough has to rise naturally. You need fresh mozzarella. Mozzarella can´t sit around for more than 2 days. And it has to sit in water. It must be sliced, not grated. The dough has to be thrown (spun) to make the pizza. That streches and pulls the dough, rather than squashing it with a rolling pin. Good extra-vergine olive oil. And the tomato. You want tomato canned from San Marzano.

http://www.barifoods.com/information/infopage_files/San%20Marzano.htm*

And there are only 2 real pizzas: the "margherita" and the "marinara". A few other combinations can pass but the catch-all toppings I see in the US make those pizzas as authentic as chocolate bagles.

*be sure to scroll down: hot Italian field worker with cigarette.

I certainly agree that there is a big difference between the pizza you get in the US vs. what you would get in Rome or Florence, but I would not necessarily suggest the Pizza in the US is not good... it is just different. There is also more variety. The pizza i grew up knowing and loving was pruchased at a "pizza parlor"... it was non-brick/coal oven pizza with semi-thin crust, made with packaged mozzerella and.... quite good actually. Not gourmet, nothing fancy, very greasy, and quite tasty. Among the best I have tasted are Denino's in SI, and Lentos in Brooklyn. Over time we have seen the evolution of other varieties.. thin crust, brick oven, with fresh (yes sliced) mozzerella and optional toppings. Try Lombardi's on Spring Street, I think it is the best Pizza in NYC, and you do not have to get the toppings if you do not want them, the margherita version is outstanding. The big differnce between what you get here vs in Italy is in fact the crust or the dough.. that is true.. but I think it is a pretty fair representation and quite good. Or, you could try Chicago style deep dish pizza, a different but tasty animal altogther, but that is probably best saved for another day.

Ninjahedge
October 17th, 2006, 05:12 PM
I have also had better in certain areas. You go down the shore and the sea salt gets into teh dough somehow (you taste it in almost everything, but moreso in the dough).

Now this is not the chlorinated taste you get in the ice for the over-syruped sodas there, but it is distinctive none the less.

I guess it all depends on what you are in the mood for. Everyone says "oh that is not REAL pizza" but we all have our own definitions of that.

I think the only thing we can all agree on is that there are no real chains that have gotten it right. Pizza Hut was founded by two guys that had 10 minutes of training each. Dominoes is crap, Uno's is over buttered for what you get, and there are at least a dozen other chains that do nothing for the name of "True" pizza.

Now, being raised in NJ, we have our own varieties, and I have to say I liek them as well as the ones available in NYC. Unfortunately, I see some really crappy alternatives coming out. Not saying that hispanic workers canot make a decent pizza, but I would rather have a German Sausage, French Crepe, Mexican Burrito, Spanish Pollenta or Italian pizza made by someone who GREW UP on them. Or at least was trained to be more than a counter guy at a restaurant that was not his lifes asperation... ;)

The good thing? Pizza may be getting $$ and harder to find a decent slice, but other foods (Indian, Thai, Spanish, Mexican) are getting easier to find.

I just hope that some places stick around so I can get my pepperoni fix every now and again... :D

Fabrizio
October 17th, 2006, 05:44 PM
I go out here for Chinese. Tastes great, but it has little to do with actual Chinese cooking. And that´s really my point. "Real" pizza is quite different from what you might think.

BTW: there´s lots of terrible pizza here too... and you should try an "American style" hambuger here: a lot gets lost in the translation.

lofter1
October 17th, 2006, 07:31 PM
You need unclorinated water ...

Before they started loading with NYC water with chlorine 10+ years ago (all that new development near the Croton watershed was causing nasty little bugs to live in the water headed for NYC) we had great tasting water. Nowadays? Eccch.

When I was lucky enough to live in Rome a while back -- and oohing and aahing over the pizza + pasta there --- some friends and I were trying to figure out the secret so we could transport it to the USA ... we thought to analyze the water and then put together little packets of those minerals to add to your pasta water. Seemed like a good idea, but maybe it was the wine ...

It seems the real answer is to transport shiploads of Roman water over here.

Not so cost effective.

Cheaper to fly to Rome and eat the real thing ;)

Strattonport
October 17th, 2006, 08:12 PM
Two local places of mine get a mention, Cascarino's and Rosa's.

I went to Cascarino's before they went "big" (locations in College Point, Whitestone, Bayside and the official supplier of pizza for the Mets). Now, they're overpriced and the quality isn't worth it. Rosa's is your typical place, although it just changed management and I'm worried taste will slip.

MidtownGuy
October 18th, 2006, 11:54 AM
BTW: there´s lots of terrible pizza here too... and you should try an "American style" hambuger here: a lot gets lost in the translation

I'm chiming in because I recently returned from Italy. I had lots of pizza there. I have spent a lifetime listening to how great and different the pizza is in Italy. Well, I agree that there is lots of terrible pizza in Italy too. Just like New York, there are so many places to get pizza that there will be all levels of quality. Also, I suspect that, just as in New York, it takes either some local knowledge or good luck to happen upon the really good stuff. My luck brought me lots of pizza in Italy that was mediocre at best.

In Rome I had just touristy pizza that was crap. I didn't have time to go to some "authentic" Roman neighborhood (my limited time there had me racing from one historic site to another), but heck, I thought, surely a good pizza in Roma can't be that elusive.

That said, the best pizza I had in Italy is a toss-up between 2 places: a small back-street place in Venice (again, luck) where the slices were perfect, and at a tiny, cheap pizzeria in Palermo where a "pizzete" (mini pizza) I had while walking was so scrumptious, I had to turn back around and get another. In general, the food in Palermo was the best I had in Italy.

OmegaNYC
October 18th, 2006, 12:33 PM
I know what you mean, Midtown Guy. That story reminds me of this one time my family and I, went to visit some family members in NC. We stopped at this little Mom and Pop rest area, and they were serving pizza. I tell ya, that was one of the best slice of pizza I ever had in my life. I just had to get another. :)

TonyO
October 18th, 2006, 01:06 PM
Just tried Luzzo's in the east village/union square area. Great old-school, neopolitan style pies. They have a good deal on their "marinara" pizza which is olives, fresh mozz, tomato sauce and anchovies. Not my style but it costs less than the standard margherita.

pianoman11686
October 18th, 2006, 11:14 PM
Best pizza I had in Italy was in Napoli, without a doubt. A fantastic pizzeria-cafe on a busy street downtown, full at midnight, delicious personal pies.
Best pasta was a neighborhood joint in a quiet part of Rome. Worst food overall: Venice.

Can't even begin to think of where the best slice exists, stateside. I'll always be partial to Gino's - a small chain whose Bayside, Queens outlet I frequented as a kid. Bayside had a lot of great pizzerias - Sal & Vinny's, Pete's, Joe's...those were the days. Famiglia is fairly dependable when in Manhattan. That big slice place up by Columbia is fantastic, as is a similar big-slice place in Hoboken. Most traditional, New York-style pizzerias are fine for a quick slice on the go.

Chicago-style deep dish, on the other hand, is garbage.

Peteynyc1
October 21st, 2006, 04:03 PM
If you are heading up I-95 thru New Haven, I highly recommend stopping off on Wooster Street and visiting Frank Pepe's Pizzeria Napoletana, also known as simply "Pepe's".

Many consider it the best Pizza in America, and some, the world. Nothing but pies are available (and beer/soda). The line gets long but moves relatively quickly and its well worth the wait every time. If you are in the mood for dessert afterwards, there is a great old fashion Italian bakery next door called Libby's. Read more about Pepe's here:

http://pepespizzeria.com/

http://www.pizzatherapy.com/pepe's.htm

http://www.pizzatherapy.com/frank_pepe.jpg

http://www.pizzatherapy.com/Pepes_Bumper_Sticker.jpg (http://www.pizzatherapy.com/pepe's_quotes.htm)

ablarc
October 21st, 2006, 04:53 PM
That said, the best pizza I had in Italy is a toss-up between 2 places: a small back-street place in Venice (again, luck) where the slices were perfect...
Wasn't by any chance on a little square in the old Jewish ghetto, east and north of the station?

That was my best Italian pizza experience. Seating was outdoors, the waitress was from Grand Rapids, and she called me "hon".

MidtownGuy
October 21st, 2006, 06:36 PM
It was a different place, this one had only take-away.:)
The proprietor was equally cheerful though, and it was the first thing we ate after checking in, so we were happy travelers at that point. Always makes me laugh, the amount of energy tourists spend in search of "the place" to plop down and eat. I find myself walking around entirely too long, feet getting more tired, looking at the menus posted near the door and trying to choose the right place. The presence of locals at the tables is usually a good sign.

dmkilcran
October 24th, 2006, 11:05 AM
I am originally from Connecticut and my boyfriend is from New York. We both are currently living in Kentucky and we "need" a good NYC pizza (something they cannot make in KY). Does anyone know of a good NYC pizza that I can get delivered to KY? My boyfriend's birthday is coming up and would love to surprise him! :)

antinimby
November 9th, 2006, 08:08 PM
‘Brooklyn Style Pizza’ Meets the Real Deal


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/11/08/dining/08domi.1.600.jpg
WORTH THE TRIP Tommy and Jackie Sessa of Freehold, N.J., at Totonno’s in Brooklyn.


By KIM SEVERSON
Published: November 8, 2006 (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/08/dining/08domino.html)


IT took no small amount of courage to walk into one of the great Brooklyn pizzerias with a Domino’s Brooklyn Style Pizza in our hands.

“Get that thing out of here,” was the first thing Totonno’s owner, Louise Ciminieri, said when she saw the Domino’s box.

Once we explained that we were on a mission to determine exactly what constituted a Brooklyn Style pie, she softened. Sort of. “When they say Brooklyn Style Pizza they’re referring to us,” she said. “We were the first ones.”

“But Domino’s has a lot more money than I do so I guess they know what they’re doing,” said Mrs. Ciminieri, who is known as Cookie.

At Totonno’s in Coney Island, pizza has been made the same way since 1924.

Along with its Brooklyn pizza brethren Di Fara’s, Grimaldi’s and Franny’s, Totonno’s is considered among the best in the country by people who have dedicated their lives to the subject.

We purchased our Domino’s pie just a few blocks away from Totonno’s on Neptune Avenue. That it was handed to us over bulletproof glass turned out to be the most authentically Brooklyn part about it.

Domino’s, which began selling Brooklyn Style pies at its 5,100 United States stores last week, designed the pizza to mimic what most New Yorkers get when they go for a slice. The crust is stretched thinner than that of a standard Domino’s pizza, and the cornmeal cooked into the crust gives it certain crispness. The pieces of pepperoni and wads of sausage the company suggests as toppings are freakishly large.


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/11/07/dining/08domi.2.190.jpg
Domino's Brooklyn style pizza with
pepperoni, left, and the pizza served
at Totonno's, in Coney Island since 1924.


The slices are so big you can fold them, which, it seems, is the Brooklyn-y part.

Tony Muia, who runs A Slice of Brooklyn Pizza Tour, said the first problem with the Domino’s pie is that it’s cut into six slices instead of eight.

And he doesn’t like the cornmeal. “O.K., so you put cornmeal on the bottom of your pizza. So what?” he said. “You go back to Naples, there’s flour on the board.”

Still, any time Brooklyn gets a nod, that’s not a bad thing. “But anyone in the Midwest who thinks this is real Brooklyn is getting fooled,” he said.

That’s the basic message from Mrs. Ciminieri at Totonno’s, who was finally persuaded to taste a Domino’s slice in the name of research.

“In Utah, they’re going to love it because they use ketchup and American cheese on their pizzas,” she said. “It tastes like any other pizza you get at the corner slice joint. They used the same tomatoes, the same processed cheese, the same preservatives.”

Domino’s uses its standard sauce and a blend of mozzarella and provolone on the Brooklyn Style Pizza. At most slice stores in Brooklyn, you won’t find cornmeal on the crust, and the cheese is usually a blend of shredded part skim and whole milk mozzarella. The typical sauce is usually not as sweet as Domino’s, but it doesn’t compare with Totonno’s.

Totonno’s uses unadulterated tomato sauce and thin slices of fresh mozzarella hand-pulled with just a little salt in it, and a dusting of pecorino-Romano cheese.

The Domino’s pizza has an oddly sweet crust that somehow manages to blend the characteristics of cotton and rubber.

Totonno’s dough is made fresh the day it’s baked and is never refrigerated. The result is crust that blisters nicely in the coal-fired oven. It has an airy chew, and it cracks a little when you fold the slice.

That’s just the taste Anthony Saltarelli is looking for. He had driven to Totonno’s from Staten Island with his wife, Josephine, and their friends of 36 years, Jean and Al Bloise.

“All I want in a pizza is to be reminded of my childhood,” he said.

The group eyed the Domino’s box with suspicion. “I’ll tell you what, I won’t eat it,” said Mr. Saltarelli.

The notion of a Brooklyn-style pie stumped Stan Kagan, 22, who grew up in the neighborhood and has been eating Totonno’s pies his whole life.

He doesn’t doubt the pizza will be successful. “It’s about marketing, not taste,” he said.

Not that he has any idea what a Domino’s pizza tastes like. He’s never had one. “I’ve just ordered their Buffalo wings a few times,” he said.

Adam Kuban, the founding editor of www.sliceny.com, a Web site devoted to New York pizza, felt it was his duty to taste the new pizza. Mr. Kuban declared it good — for a Domino’s pie, that is. And he’s just as puzzled as the next Brooklynite over what constitutes a Brooklyn-style pizza.

“It seems to be the same style you get in Manhattan and Queens,” he said.

Pizza in the Bronx sometimes has a cornmeal crust, and in Staten Island the best places bake pizzas with a little more crunch in the crust. But Brooklyn probably has the best pizza of the five boroughs, he said.

“Manhattan has sort of dropped the ball,” he said.

Marketing experts for Domino’s, which is based in Ann Arbor, Mich., said they studied pizza in Brooklyn carefully before introducing the new pie.

“We found that Brooklyners like to eat their pizza differently,” said Dana Harville, a spokeswoman for Domino’s. “They like floppy, large slices, and they fold them into almost a sandwich.”

But that’s no different from the way thousands of people in any of the other boroughs eat a slice. So why call it Brooklyn Style as opposed to, say, Staten Island Style?

“Brooklyn has such a big personality,” she said. “It’s a little different than the Manhattan-style personality. We’re really having a lot of fun with the culture.”

As part of the marketing of that culture, Domino’s has started a couple of contests. One is a drawing for a vintage New York taxi, even though everyone knows it’s almost impossible to hail a cab in Brooklyn.

The rest of the marketing blitz rests on television ads and on a Web site, www.brooklynstylepizza.com, which features characters purchased at the Brooklyn Stereotype Store.

An older Italian woman yells out of a brownstone window. A man with the look of an extra from “The Sopranos” pumps iron on the roof. A Rosie O’Donnell lookalike berates a taxi driver for not folding his slice like a man.

And there’s an African-American guy. You can’t hear what he’s saying because the rap music pouring from his car speakers is too loud.

That kind of imagery just grinds at Marty Markowitz, the Brooklyn borough president.

“It’s a multinational right-wing company, mass marketing the Brooklyn attitude with obsolete ethnic stereotypes, not to mention flimsy crusts,” he said through a spokesman.

Mr. Markowitz has yet to taste the Domino’s pizza. But that didn’t stop him from offering an opinion: “To our sophisticated palates, Domino’s is about as Brooklyn as Sara Lee Cheesecake is Junior’s.”

The right-wing reference is to Domino’s founder, Thomas S. Monaghan, who sold the company in 1998. He has supported the anti-abortion organization Operation Rescue and earlier this year announced his intention to build a town called Ave Maria in Florida based on strict Roman Catholic principles.

Arthur Schwartz, the Italian food authority and author of “Arthur Schwartz’s New York City Food: An Opinionated History and More Than 100 Legendary Recipes” (Stewart, Tabori and Chang) said he might be to blame for this turn of events. He was a consultant to Domino’s last year, suggesting — among other things — that they use cornmeal in the crust.

He said the phrase Brooklyn Style Pizza never came up, and he doesn’t believe there is such a thing.

He didn’t know what Domino’s was planning.

“If I caused this,” he said, “I apologize.”


Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company

MidtownGuy
November 9th, 2006, 09:56 PM
I've heard extremely good things about Luzzo's at 211 First Ave.(betw. 12 and 13th).

Can't wait to try it.

pianoman11686
November 9th, 2006, 10:00 PM
Anyone ever been to Bleecker Street Pizza?

antinimby
November 9th, 2006, 10:09 PM
Those are Manhattan places right?

Haven't you heard? You've got to go to Brooklyn if you want the best. :D


“It seems to be the same style you get in Manhattan and Queens,” he said.
Pizza in the Bronx sometimes has a cornmeal crust, and in Staten Island the best places bake pizzas with a little more crunch in the crust. But Brooklyn probably has the best pizza of the five boroughs, he said.
“Manhattan has sort of dropped the ball,” he said.

yankeesrule13255
June 7th, 2007, 05:32 PM
What do you think is the best pizza shop in nyc?

Schadenfrau
June 7th, 2007, 05:34 PM
Patsy's in East Harlem.

MidtownGuy
June 7th, 2007, 05:51 PM
I tried Luzzo's. It was very good.
I also like Lombardi's.

yankeesrule13255
June 7th, 2007, 05:56 PM
Does any1 know if Patzeria onTimes Square is any good?

Schadenfrau
June 7th, 2007, 06:20 PM
Nothing in Times Square is any good. Don't waste your time eating there.

ZippyTheChimp
June 8th, 2007, 08:20 AM
June 7, 2007

A Beloved Brooklyn Pizzeria Is Closed, Again, by the Health Dept.

By DALTON WALKER

It was about lunchtime yesterday when Eugene Kaplun stood in front of a pizzeria in Brooklyn, not believing what he was seeing. He read the yellow sign. He read the brown sign. Neither was a menu.

The yellow sign, a notice of closing, had been posted by the city’s Department of Health and Mental Hygiene. The brown sign was a more personal note from the management about why it was closed.

The restaurant in question was Di Fara Pizza, a place in Midwood that is frequently mentioned in arguments about who serves New York’s best slices. Hours-long waits to get in are not uncommon. So finding its doors closed, as they have been since Monday, has been a source of dismay for many would-be diners.

Mr. Kaplun, 18, said he had left class at Brooklyn College and was on his way home to Coney Island when his friends called and asked to meet at their favorite pizzeria.

“I come twice a week, at least,” he said. “This is the best pizza. I don’t want to find a new place.”

The corner of East 15th Street and Avenue J where Di Fara sits was unusually quiet. The pizzeria’s owner, Domenico DeMarco, was not inside making each pie personally, as he has for more than 45 years. Instead, the doors were locked, and newspaper covered the windows.

This is not the first time that Di Fara Pizza was closed by the health department. Its doors were shut on March 15 after inspectors found numerous violations, including rodents. It failed two more inspections before being allowed to reopen on April 2.

On Monday, during another inspection, the pizzeria was cited for unsanitary conditions including flies, a mouse infestation and bare-hand contact with food, said Sara Markt, a health department spokeswoman. The operators also failed to meet some of the conditions they had agreed to in April, like proving that they had passed a food safety course.

Margaret DeMarco, Mr. DeMarco’s daughter, said that the family provided a certificate from a food safety course, but that the health department did not recognize it because it was a photocopy.

Ms. DeMarco, 30, said her family was scheduled to appear at a city tribunal on June 14 to produce the paperwork and to determine any fines and the next steps. Until then, she said, “we sit around and wait; nothing we can do about it.”

“We are just very anxious to open the place,” she added. “This is how we all make our living.”

In recent months, dozens of restaurants, from high-profile establishments like Brasserie La Côte Basque to humble neighborhood sandwich shops, have been closed by the health department. The closings came after a furor in February caused when television cameras captured rats swarming a KFC/Taco Bell restaurant in Greenwich Village the day after a health inspector gave it a passing grade.

With Di Fara’s fate unknown yesterday, people like Fred Darretta, 59, were left with their cravings unsatisfied. Mr. Darretta, who lives on Staten Island and works in Brooklyn, was eating a small chocolate roll instead of a slice from Di Fara. He said he visited the restaurant at least once a week and gladly waited in line.

“I usually take a slice home on Fridays,” Mr. Darretta said. “This is my lunch today.”

Curious onlookers tried to peek past the newspapers and signs on the windows. Some walked away confused or surprised; most walked away hungry. People in passing cars could be seen stretching their necks to read the signs in the window.

One man walked by, shaking his head. The man, Max Kelman, 23, had eaten at Di Fara on Sunday. He said he picked up a pie there most Fridays. “It hurts,” he said. “It’s the best pizza in my life, ever.”

Tony Muia, who operates a pizza tour called A Slice of Brooklyn, has been taking people to some of Brooklyn’s best-known pizzerias for years. He said his tours did not stop at Di Fara Pizza, not because of the quality but because of the long waits. He said he was optimistic that the pizzeria would reopen. But if it does not, he added, “we’ll be losing not only a Brooklyn landmark but a national treasure.”

Copyright 2007 The New York Times Company

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/7602/midwood248hq.th.jpg (http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=midwood248hq.jpg)

kliq6
June 8th, 2007, 09:46 AM
Totonno's of Coney Island and Manhattan. Grimaldi's is most overrated, its good but not that good

Schadenfrau
June 8th, 2007, 10:23 AM
I agree on two of three counts, but the Totonno's in Manhattan isn't as good as the one in Brooklyn.

kliq6
June 8th, 2007, 10:42 AM
agreed

milleniumcab
June 10th, 2007, 05:00 AM
Patsy's (East Harlem) is good. But I think it is a toss-up between Lombardi's (Little Italy) and Grimaldi's (Brooklyn)...Manhattan Totonno's...ehhh , so so...

And how about that pizzeria in Staten Island that won the "Best pizza in the world" award in Las Vegas.. I can't recall the name.. Did anyone eat there?...

lbjefferies
July 8th, 2007, 09:01 AM
Grimaldis - I agree with previous posters who say it is overrated. It is consistant and reliably good, but remains far from reliably great. I just don't get all the love this place receives.

Sal and Carmines - High quality slices but a little salty for my taste. My wife loves this place and loves the two old italian uomini behind the counter making the pies--and they love her.

Johns - The meatball pie is fan-friggin-tastic. A great atmosphere makes this a reliable crowd-pleaser. If you are a fan of white pizzas, don't bother here.

Di Fara's - Health inspectors may not love this place, but I do. I go almost as much for Signore DeMarco's ballet behind the counter as I do for the wonderfully crafted pies. The slices are a bit limp, and even a solid fold fails to make it sturdy enough to lift to one's mouth one-handed, but the taste is as good as it gets.

Lombardi's - My one complaint is that it is inconsistant. You can come here and receive a pizza that is merely good. But when you come on a good day, you'll get the best there is. Probably the ten best pizzas I have ever had were eaten here. The white pie is perfection.

itsallgoode9
July 10th, 2007, 04:39 PM
I went to the patsy's over around west village area and liked the pizza alot from there. Is the one in Harlem the best or do all the patsy's have the same quality pizza?

I know i'll probably get scoffed at, but there's a place on 27th and 6th called Waldy's that I like ALOT....the smell of the wood fired pizzas is amazing when you walk in....anybody eaten there?

still trying to make it around to lots of different places...made it to lombardi's and grimaldi's....they were pretty good as everybody says.

still trying to get my pizza palette developed, i lived in the midwest my whole life so I was used to dominos, pizza hut, papa johns, etc. so the stuff here is definitely a new style of pizza for me.

AmeriKenArtist
July 30th, 2007, 11:52 PM
I now have a bead on all the favorite pizza shops, in and out of Manhattan. My question is how much is that doggy in the window? If you're frequenting your favorite shop, let us know the going price for that slice! I'd appreciate it very much, thank you!

NewYorkDoc
July 31st, 2007, 01:02 AM
$2.50 for the place I usually go.

Schadenfrau
July 31st, 2007, 12:11 PM
The best pizza places don't serve slices.

Ninjahedge
July 31st, 2007, 12:27 PM
The best pizza places don't serve slices.

They do in NJ! ;)

C'mon Schade! Don't be a party pooper! I love Joe's pizza (carmine), and they serve it by the slice.

But places like, what's that one around teh corner on Bleeker (I think). Is that John's? That is great, but only serves it by the pie.

kliq6
July 31st, 2007, 01:21 PM
Grimaldi's is very overrated and there pies get cold very very quick

eddhead
July 31st, 2007, 02:28 PM
i agree on grimaldi

Da Ninos and Joe and Pats in SI are both excellent, and I will stick with Tuttonon's at Coney Island. Manhattan's best is Lombardi's on Spring street in my view, but Angelo's on 3rd in the 50's is also excellent.

None of these places offer slices though.

Don't discount the $1.00 place off 9th and 41st for slices. It is not as good as the others but it is not bad either and becaue the turnover is so fast the slices are always hot and fresh. $1.00 for a hot, fresh slice is hard to beat!!

Eugenious
July 31st, 2007, 03:42 PM
While there are infinite combinations of ingredients and ways to prepare a Pizza I have found that there are mostly 5 different kinds of Pizza in New York. I tend to like Pizza that's somewhere in-between the expensive Sicilian with fresh mozzarella and herbs (patsy's style) and cheaper Brooklyn large slice pizza. I really don't like when the pizza is either not fresh or has to be reheated for a long time, to me Pizza should be baked fresh as they do in the new Mitchel London Pizza place on 9th and 35th.

Ninjahedge
July 31st, 2007, 05:20 PM
I always look and ask what has come out recently.

I don't need a fancy slice if it has been sitting on the counter for 30 minutes....(or more!)

BrooklynRider
August 2nd, 2007, 10:32 PM
^ Same here. I ask what just came out or what's hot. If the answer is "I can heat up what ever you want," I move on.

sbarrorocks
September 15th, 2007, 12:26 AM
I go to NYU and I've been in new york for a year, and i have to say, sbarro pizzas are the best in the city. NO CONTEST. I dare anyone to question me on this point

zhimple
September 15th, 2007, 02:27 AM
pizza is one of my favorie:D and sbarro pizza is the best:p

cysthead30
September 17th, 2007, 01:21 AM
I go to NYU and I've been in new york for a year, and i have to say, sbarro pizzas are the best in the city. NO CONTEST. I dare anyone to question me on this point


OK...I'll bite......why is it the best pizza in NYC? I think its ok....but not even close to the top 50 in NYC....but I want to hear your reasoning....so please oblige me......:D

Ninjahedge
September 17th, 2007, 10:48 AM
I go to NYU and I've been in new york for a year, and i have to say, sbarro pizzas are the best in the city. NO CONTEST. I dare anyone to question me on this point

I question you.

I also question the veracity of an anonymous poster that comes on a NY/Architectural website, names himself "Sbarro rocks" and then says, well, 'Sbarro rocks' on their first and (to this point) only post.

I still go with Joes and Johns. Although there is a nice place for some small italian food up here called Pizza Rustica on 2nd ave+44th.

BPC
September 17th, 2007, 06:52 PM
I won't even eat a Sbarro's slice in an airport, they are so bad. I suspect the post was tongue-in-cheek.

MidtownGuy
September 17th, 2007, 10:48 PM
Yeah Sbarro's really sucks, I never go there.
Has anyone ever tried Bravo's Pizza on 42nd near the Library? It's pretty good when you want a fresh slice to take to Bryant Park.

eddhead wrote
Don't discount the $1.00 place off 9th and 41st for slices. It is not as good as the others but it is not bad either and becaue the turnover is so fast the slices are always hot and fresh. $1.00 for a hot, fresh slice is hard to beat!!

You nailed it! I really like that little place. The slices are always steamy hot, just out of the oven. 2 slices and a soda- $2.50 :eek: Tasty too.
You see some interesting characters while you stand there and wolf 'em down.

Some people are pizza purists, they think the only good pizza is the kind with the bufala mozzarella, thin crust, brick oven, piece of basil on top yada yada yada. YES, that style of pizza is delicious..but there are plenty of equally delicious variations.

amati63
October 16th, 2007, 10:02 PM
Hey guys, this is my first post. There is a new wonderful pizza joint in Chinatown in the corner of Worth St and Park Row named Baby O. Brick oven pizza with a delicious crust. Highly recommended!!!!!!!

MidtownGuy
October 24th, 2007, 11:23 AM
There is a piece on yahoo news today with people voting for the best pizza in the country. Evidently some place up in Harlem called Presidential Pizza is getting the most votes in the whole USA and I've never heard of the place.
Anyone been there?

justfabulouslyme
November 14th, 2007, 01:34 PM
The ever important question for tried-and-true NYers...

Where is the best pizza, in all 5 boroughs?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ebf6gD-UyU

Without a doubt, my vote goes for di Fara's ^^ on Ave. J in Brooklyn. Words cannot even describe the bliss I experience when I chomp down on one of Domenico's masterpieces. I DEFY you to go to di Fara's and then tell me Totonno's or the wimpy Spumoni Gardens or even, dare I say it, New Park Pizza in Howard Beach can compare.. I DEFY YOU! :D

Front_Porch
November 14th, 2007, 02:19 PM
I thought Di Fara's had been closed down for a little while . . open again?

Ninjahedge
November 14th, 2007, 03:29 PM
I think there is another thread covering this.

DO a search for "pizza" on the forum search engine and look around! :)

justfabulouslyme
November 14th, 2007, 03:37 PM
I thought Di Fara's had been closed down for a little while . . open again?

Pretty sure they're still closed. Sadly. :(

orangeblossom
February 23rd, 2008, 06:32 PM
apparantly, where i relocated, so did tons of other new york patriots. There is a shop here that serves up great new york pizza.

try them out, if you miss it. They told me they put out a website....nypizzashipping.

paul_houle
April 12th, 2010, 04:27 PM
... I've really got to make it there the next time I'm in town.

http://images.ny-pictures.com/photo2/m/35393_m.jpg (http://ny-pictures.com/nyc/photo/picture/35393/classic_pizza_marguerite_nyc)

Picture of Lombardi's (http://ny-pictures.com/nyc/photo/topic/6337/Lombardi27s) thanks to deadling (http://ny-pictures.com/nyc/photo/photographer/604555/deadling) and New York Pictures (http://ny-pictures.com/nyc/photo/)

lofter1
April 12th, 2010, 07:47 PM
Notice that the pie at Lombardi's is placed on a pedestal.

JanetJay
July 1st, 2010, 08:58 PM
I like any of the dehlis on Broadway a block south of Time Square. I ate at all of them and in fact ate pizza all over New York. Nothing better than here. The cheese melts in your mouth and that's what you want.