View Full Version : 165 Charles Street @ West Street - by Richard Meier

November 21st, 2002, 07:30 AM
From the NY Post: Senbahar has a quality track record- the Alex and the Grand Beekman are high-quality projects.



A new building may be coming between Calvin Klein and his skyline views.

That's because the two Richard Meier-designed towers at 173-176 Perry St. at West Street - where Klein, Nicole Kidman and Martha Stewart own apartments - may soon have a neighbor.

Sources told The Post developer Izak Senbahar of Alexico Management is paying $20 million to buy the six-story Pathfinder warehouse to the south of the two white condominiums.

On that West Village site, he plans to put up a 15-story luxury building that could total as much as 75,000 square-feet, and might hire Meier to design it.

And that means Klein, who owns the two top floors in the southern building, could find himself staring into other people's apartments instead of the Lower Manhattan skyline.

Neither Senbahar, the warehouse owner or Meier returned calls for comment.

Richard Born, who developed the Meier buildings at 173-176 Perry St., said he passed on buying the warehouse because future residences would have to sell for upwards of $1,500 a square foot.

"There are a lot of risk factors involved as these units will not be ready for two years, and who knows where the market will be," he said.

"I hope they use Richard Meier," he said. "Because I don't want them to mar the skyline we began to create."

Senbahar and his partners recently completed the 32-story Grand Beekman at First Avenue and 51st Street and are working on the 32-story Alex at 205 E. 45th St.

Rich Battista
November 22nd, 2002, 08:44 PM
wow, the area is becoming a hot spot for this new kind of architecture, lol.

January 10th, 2003, 12:53 PM
I hope whatever they build next to the two present towers, they're sensitive to the emerging skyline.... it would have been a lot better having another tall building a few doors down that right next to the two... *

March 2nd, 2003, 09:31 PM
From 24 November 2002 New York Times article "Along West Street, A Residential Makeover":

... One consequence of the extraordinary level that prices reached in the Perry Street condominium is that land prices for nearby property suitable for development have risen as well. Just south of the Perry Street site, bidding reportedly reached $250 a developable square foot for such a parcel — 12,000 square feet on West Street occupied by Pathfinder Press. "They were looking for $300 a foot," or $23.4 million, to build 78,000 gross square feet of building area, said Charles Blaichman, a co-developer of the Perry Street condominium. "That hasn't been paid anywhere. I think out-of-towners jacked up the price."

Unsuccessful bidders reported that a sales contract was signed for $20 million, or more than $250 for each square foot that can be built, with an unidentified buyer, but parties to the sale declined to discuss it.

The value of the Pathfinder Press property reflects in part the fact that demolition and new construction of a sizable building could begin fairly promptly, without zoning or other complications, developers say. This is rarely the case along West Street. Modest commercial and industrial establishments of yesterday operate on some blocks, and they will not disappear overnight.


March 2nd, 2003, 09:38 PM
Truly exquisite.

March 11th, 2003, 08:38 PM
I walked by the site today. A drilling rig was setting up next to the Pathfinder, so something is going up.

March 12th, 2003, 09:56 AM
NICE! *I can't wait until the entire west side highway is laced with new towers. *It's about time. *I think Hudson River Park has been a great catalyst. *It must be nice to be across from both the park and the water.

March 12th, 2003, 10:32 AM
You're right about the park as a catalyst. There's a residential building going up on a former parking lot at West and Laight, part of which is renovation of an adjoining warehouse. One block north a large truck maintenance garage has been vacated. The sugar building has already been restored as a condo.

Looks promising.

March 21st, 2003, 09:34 PM
Pathfinder Warehouse Site
West Street, West Village
15 stories
Richard Meier & Partners
Proposed 2004?

From the NYPost:


Meanwhile, Senbahar has officially hired architect Richard Meier to create a third tower at Charles and West Streets, just south of the elegant twin towers he designed earlier at Perry St.

"It will be very transparent," said Senbahar of the new building.

"Don't worry, Calvin Klein [the penthouse resident on Perry St.] will still have his views."

Apartments and apartment buildings are still a desirable investment even if the most recent Rent Guidelines Board survey found a 9.25 percent vacancy for flats renting for more than $1,750 and 10.05 percent for apartments renting for more than $2,000.

March 21st, 2003, 10:17 PM
Good News!

March 21st, 2003, 10:22 PM
This should be sweet.

March 24th, 2003, 06:41 AM
Tenant was moving out of Pathfinder this weekend.
Took this shot of Perry West

March 25th, 2003, 12:36 PM
"Don't worry, Calvin Klein [the penthouse resident on Perry St.] will still have his views."

This will be interesting, how will they manage that?

March 25th, 2003, 02:27 PM
I guess b/c the new building will be filled with walls of glass like the present Meier buildings?

I dunno, but it's good to see good looking building going up on the West Side H'way!

March 25th, 2003, 07:46 PM
I'm delighted, but given the identical context and use a little worried that the new one will look too similar. Meier tends to be repetitive.

March 26th, 2003, 11:39 AM
True, but another look alike like those is better than what's there now, IMHO.

March 26th, 2003, 02:57 PM
Meier is *original, blasphemy. Anyone who has ever been to the Getty realizes to full extent his capabilities, nothing ever repeated, all tied in. Judging from past Meier projects the last piece is somewhat conical.

March 29th, 2003, 03:41 PM
I'm not sure what you tried to say but what I meant is that Meier repeats himself from project to project.

Not trying to be fussy, but I like the contrast between the brick and the glass and metal. This contrast between old and new is one of the reasons why NY is so fascinating. I have no regret in this case. What I do regret is the attempt to make new buildings look old. They only look fake and impoverish the urban landscape.

October 5th, 2003, 08:31 PM
Demolition of the Pathfinder building has begun.

November 7th, 2003, 05:20 PM

By Lincoln Anderson
If it works once, why not try again?

Three weeks ago, demolition began on the four-story, red-brick Pathfinder building at Charles and West Sts., just south of the new Richard Meier-designed, twin luxury residential towers flanking Perry St. The new building is also being designed by Meier and will likely be the same height and similar design as the existing buildings.

The development group is led by Stuart Marton and Izak Senbahar. Applications for a 16-story, 180-ft.-tall building with 31 apartments and 100,000 total sq. ft. were submitted to the Department of Buildings in May but were disapproved, though such applications are frequently disapproved on technicalities and resubmitted, said Sid Dinsay, a D.O.B. spokesperson.

The fast-disappearing Charles St. building was once home to Pathfinder, a socialist publishing company, and at another point, to a succession of gay bars. Glenn Bristow, a former Community Board 2 member, recalled a mural of revolutionary leaders on the building’s south side, which, she said, was blocked from view by a yellow wall put up a few years ago because a neighbor didn’t want to see it.

Lisetta Koe, a spokesperson for Richard Meier & Partners, said the project is still being designed and that it’s “really, really early” in the process, but it’s likely the building will be similar to the two already standing.

“Knowing the way that Richard works, he likes to keep things in context. The top line will probably be the same” height as the existing buildings, she said.

Meier’s Perry St. condominium towers, developed by Richard Born, were completed in June, but the apartments’ interiors are being finished, in most cases by the residents themselves, meaning it could be another year before most move in. Only about two apartments in each tower are occupied. Condo owners include Martha Stewart — according to Koe, despite rumors, Stewart didn’t flip her apartment — Calvin Klein, Nicole Kidman and Bill Joy, co-founder of Sun Microsystems and Java software developer.

Koe noted that having a new “private park” on the Hudson River is a big plus for the tenants.

“I don’t know if the tenants will use it, but it’s nice for them to be able to look at a nice landscaped park,” she said.

Plans for a restaurant by Jean-Georges Vongerichten in one of the towers are on hold, because “he’s been pretty busy,” Koe noted.

The new residential development is as-of-right, meaning no variance was necessary. A variance was needed further south at Morton St., where a 14-story, square-block, luxury project is rising in a manufacturing-zoned area. The community had fought this project and filed an Article 78 lawsuit against the city’s Board of Standards and Appeals for granting the variance, but the lawsuit was denied.

The Charles St. project is in an area unprotected by landmarking, west of the existing Greenwich Village Historic District and south of the newly designated Gansevoort Market Historic District.

In between the new Meier site and his two existing towers is Charles Lane, a historic, cobblestone street, though the cobblestones are rapidly becoming the street’s only historic element.

“It’s not landmarked,” Albert Bennett, of the Greenwich Village Community Task Force, said of the new site. “That means Charles Lane [will have] 16 stories on the south and 16 stories on the north.”

The Greenwich Village Community Task Force has pushed for the landmarking of the area along the waterfront, which it calls the “Maritime Mile.” But so far the city’s Landmarks Preservation Commission has not bitten.

Sherida Paulsen, the immediate past Landmarks chairperson, had been interested in certain areas outside the Village Historic District, including the area around Weehawken St. and part of the Printing District in Hudson Sq.

Hoping to block further development, residents and Councilmember Chris Quinn recently fought off an attempt by the city to rezone a section of the northern part of Hudson Sq., between Barrow and Leroy Sts. and Hudson and West Sts., to allow residential development.

When Paulsen was Landmarks chairperson, Aubrey Lees, then-chairperson of Community Board 2, convened a Board 2 task force on landmarking that met with Paulsen regularly, which helped bring about designation of the Gansevoort District and the extension of the Noho Historic District. C.B. 2 and preservationists are eager to establish a similar relationship with new Landmarks Chairperson Robert Tierney.

Jim Smith, C.B. chairperson, said he wrote Tierney shortly after Smith became chairperson in June, but hasn’t gotten a response. Similarly, Lees, who Smith has designated to continue the board’s landmarks task force, said she tried to call Tierney when she was still board chairperson, but he was always unavailable.

“Why he doesn’t want to continue the task force, which I felt was incredibly successful, I just don’t know,” Lees said. “There are many areas [in the city] that need to be designated, but the West Village should be high up on the list. If the Landmarks Preservation Commission isn’t interested, I think it’s really bad.”

Andrew Berman, executive director of the Greenwich Village Society for Historic Preservation, said the society, even while focusing attention on the Meat Market designation, has tried to advocate for other at-risk parts of the Village and will continue to do so. The society recently did a report on the importance of preserving neighborhoods on the edges of historic districts and how zoning can help, he noted.

Similarly, Katy Bordonaro, co-chairperson of the G.V. Community Task Force, said a wall of buildings on the waterfront would jeopardize the existing Greenwich Village Historic District.

“I think everybody in the Village is pretty solid with the idea of not walling off the Village,” she said. “We don’t want to create a wall along the river or along the edge of the existing historic district.”

Last Friday, Kaier Curtain, 65, was pointing out the new Meier tower to his cousin, Suzanne Bostick, 41, from Connecticut, as they were standing on the traffic median on West St. as cars whooshed by noisily. Things had changed a lot along the waterfront since Curtain, an authority on gay theater, lived in the Village in the 1960s. He recalled when the Village waterfront “was rough gay bars. It was like leather bars and motorcycles, very tough dykes.” And there was the cruising seen on the dilapidated piers.

But now he looked across to the park, which they had just toured, where a waterfall gurgled tranquilly at Christopher St. in the late afternoon’s golden sunlight.

“In the next five years, this’ll all be expensive apartments,” he predicted. “It’s amazing how fast this has gone up,” he said of the park.

November 8th, 2003, 08:57 PM
Demolition of the four-story, red-brick Pathfinder building at Charles and West Sts., just south of the new Richard Meier-designed, twin luxury residential towers flanking Perry St., is almost complete. The new building (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) is also being designed by Meier and will likely be the same height and similar design as the existing buildings. 7 November 2003.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/pathfinder_charles_west_7nov03.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

November 9th, 2003, 01:16 PM
Given the nearly identical specifications and Meier's "consistency", I expect few surprises.

March 10th, 2004, 09:55 PM
March 11, 2004


The Art of Selling Luxury Condos as Art


HERE COMES ANOTHER ONE A new Richard Meier tower, at right in this rendering, is rising on the far West Side.

IZAK SENBAHAR, a developer of luxury condominiums in Manhattan, was commenting this week that neighbors should not complain about a glass tower overlooking the Hudson River that he is planning. It is being designed by Richard Meier for a site just south of the two Perry Street buildings the architect also created.

"Simply by the fact that a new building by Richard Meier is being sold there, values will go up," Mr. Senbahar said. "Do you want to have a printer next to you or another high-class pure Richard Meier building next door?"

Before he could continue, he was interrupted by Louise Sunshine, one of New York City's most aggressive promoters of high-end real estate. "No, don't say 'high class,' " she said. "Say 'work of art.' "

In the latest marketing ploy for high-priced condos, Ms. Sunshine is trying to give real estate the cachet of fine paintings or sculpture. She plans to market the 31 apartments in the new Meier building, which broke ground in December, as "limited edition" residences. To underscore the point, Mr. Meier has commissioned clear acrylic models of the apartments — which he will sign and number to give buyers as a closing gift.

It's an all-out effort to associate the prosaic arena of real estate with the flashier art world. Ms. Sunshine is doing everything but selling Andy Warhol-style images of Mr. Meier on the Internet: a gallery opening, a brochure designed by Massimo Vignelli and, for preferred customers, tours of a warehouse where Mr. Meier keeps models and sculpture.

Mr. Meier called the marketing approach "flattering" and indicated he thought it appropriate. "There are not that many apartments like it," he said, in a conference room at his offices on 10th Avenue.

Tomorrow, Mr. Senbahar and Ms. Sunshine will inaugurate their campaign with a party for those attending the Armory Show, one of the world's largest art fairs, which opens tomorrow in Manhattan. The crowd, which is promised to include only 20 real estate brokers out of the 350 people invited, can sip cocktails in the Charles Street Gallery — essentially a glorified real estate sales office, which contractors were scrambling to finish just days ago. On display will be renderings of the new Meier building and seven of the acrylic models.

In addition, Mr. Meier, who has previously designed only 18 single-family houses, has agreed to display models of some of those rarities at the new "gallery," along with selections from his sculpture collection.

The marketing pitch is part of Ms. Sunshine's broader attempt to link real estate and art in the minds of wealthy buyers. As part of a campaign to which she has given the slogan "Great Homes and Great Art Live Together," she has enlisted gallery owners willing to lend artworks to display in unsold apartments or in advertisements.

In the case of Mr. Meier, Ms. Sunshine said she is showcasing the new building amid examples of his past work to attract "Richard Meier devotees." She said she believed such buyers would pay a premium to live in an apartment designed by the architect of the Getty Center in Los Angeles and the Museum of Contemporary Art in Barcelona.

Mr. Senbahar, who with a partner, Simon Elias, is spending $100 million on the tower, plans to ask at least $2,500 a square foot, more than double the $1,268 average per-square-foot price for luxury real estate in Manhattan in the fourth quarter of last year, according to Miller Samuel Inc., a New York-based appraisal firm.

With its glass facade, the new building, which is scheduled to be finished in March next year, will share an aesthetic with the two Meier towers on Perry Street. But where apartments in them were sold as raw space for buyers to customize, the new building has interiors and fixtures designed or selected by Mr. Meier.

The bathrooms, for example, will have sinks and countertops of Surell, a synthetic material that can easily be molded, unlike the traditional marble or limestone chosen by architects in luxury buildings. "It is like lacquer, but smoother," Mr. Meier said, stroking the surface of a black lacquer conference table he designed. "It is not quite as cold as stone."

He has also designed common amenities for the building, including a 50-foot pool, a fitness room, a wine cellar and a screening room with the same chairs he designed for the Getty Center.

Mr. Meier is not, however, customizing each apartment. And because the building bears more than a slight resemblance to its two neighbors to the north, some local critics question how unique the new units are. "It seems a little ironic that these are being sold as limited edition Meier originals when it is now the third of the same tower, more or less," said Andrew Berman, the executive director of the Greenwich Village Society for Historic Preservation, which believes that the Meier towers do not fit in with older buildings in the neighborhood.

For some in the art world, the marketing pitch seems disingenuous. "This is really stretching it quite a ways," said Richard Gray, an owner of the Richard Gray Gallery in Chicago and New York and the former president of the Art Dealers Association of America. "It's advertising license. I don't think it has the attributes that allow it to be seriously considered as a rare work of art."

But others saw it as a clever way to package Mr. Meier's work as a brand that some luxury home buyers will covet. "It's not just about buying the building but the entire aesthetic and atmosphere," said Toshiko Mori, the chairwoman of the Harvard Design School.

Other developers have selected star architects to design their condominiums. At Beacon Court, a tower being built on top of the new Bloomberg headquarters, the developer, Vornado Realty, has retained Cesar Pelli; RFR Davis, which has developed condos at 425 Fifth Avenue and the Impala on East 76th Street, hired Michael Graves.

With prices in Manhattan skyrocketing, buyers expect more glamour in their homes. "Little by little, the bar keeps being raised," said Adrienne Albert, president of Marketing Directors, which helps developers sell high-priced real estate. "In order for people to understand if that's the right building for them to live in, they expect it to be more and more interesting and exciting."

For Ms. Sunshine, who learned her trade as an apprentice to Donald Trump, the pitch for the new Meier building fits with her idea that real estate and art make natural partners. In a coming ad for a penthouse at the Time Warner Center, for example, she will use digital images of a Willem de Kooning painting, a Matisse sculpture and a 19th-century African sculpture, all borrowed from C&M Arts, a Manhattan gallery.

Robert Mnuchin, the owner of C&M, said it was like "creating a mini-exhibition." Ms. Sunshine said she hoped to install art in other apartments she is trying to sell, including perhaps Mr. Meier's.

For now, she said, he is the only architect getting the full star treatment. Although she represents Mr. Pelli's Beacon Court, for example, there are no plans to sell limited-edition Pelli apartments or to open an ersatz art gallery in his honor.

Mr. Senbahar, the developer of the new Meier building, said most buildings do not qualify as art. "You can't give it a couple of bricks and two windows and call it art," he said.

A selling point is that Mr. Meier has designed the kitchens, at back, right, and the pool, far right.

The architect, Richard Meier.

Copyright 2004 The New York Times Company

March 11th, 2004, 06:36 PM
A Meier knockoff of his own innovation, this development throws off the balance and the purpose of making them twins in the first place. There is no interplay between the three, it is like any other condo midrise development in any beach resort town anywhere’s else.

March 13th, 2004, 07:47 PM
A Meier knockoff of his own innovation, this development throws off the balance and the purpose of making them twins in the first place. There is no interplay between the three, it is like any other condo midrise development in any beach resort town anywhere’s else.

Exactly! Well put, my friend.

June 17th, 2004, 09:54 PM
Richard Meier Designing Another Luxury Tower on New York's Hudson River

April 27, 2004

Images Courtesy Richard Meier & Partners

Fresh off the completion of his luxury condominiums on Perry Street along the Hudson River, Richard Meier is planning a similar luxury hi-rise on New York’s western waterfront.

The new 16-floor, 31 unit condo tower, at 165 Charles Street, will very closely resemble the architects’ designs at 173-176 Perry, just down the block. Both will be tall, minimalist luxury buildings made primarily of glazed glass and steel. Unlike those in the other project, Meier will also be designing the 11 to 22 foot tall interiors for these buildings. This means elements like leather seats similar to those Meier designed for the Getty Center in Los Angeles. The tower’s ground floor will also feature over 1500 square-feet of commercial space.

"Charles Street gives us the opportunity to further develop and evolve the design of my first two towers," says Meier. "It’s like music. One note is nice, but as you add notes you can create something different." Completion is scheduled for Spring, 2005.

Sam Lubell



June 6, 2004

After Next-Door Angst, Sales Begin at New Meier Tower


THE celebrity occupation of the green-glass condos designed by Richard Meier at West and Perry Streets has proceeded with a pleasing and well-documented Sturm und Drang.

Now that a third, nearly identical but larger building is rising just to the south, designed by Mr. Meier and paid for by a rival developer, you might say that in the world of star-powered architecture, if it's worth overdoing, it's worth doing over.

The new tower at 165 Charles Street will be slightly taller and wider than its two neighbors, and the apartments will cost about 25 percent more, ranging from $1.15 million for a 682-square-foot studio to $18.5 million for the duplex penthouse, all 4,551 square feet of it.

The difference is that the new tower will have interiors designed by Mr. Meier, down to their polished wenge wood floors, while the Perry Street condos were delivered to buyers like Calvin Klein, Nicole Kidman and Martha Stewart as raw space.

In the five weeks since state approval of the new project's offering plan, the Sunshine Group, exclusive marketing agent for the 16-story tower, has sold 9 of the 31 apartments.

That includes the studio and several two- and three-bedroom units.

The developers, Izak Senbahar, 45, and Simon Elias, 47, refused to name the buyers.

When the new tenants move in next May, they will have access to amenities not available to their next-door neighbors, such as a pool and wine storage units whose 5.65 square feet can be had for $30,000.

For some time, the low, steady rumble of celebrity umbrage-taking has emanated from the Perry Street towers, where the famous are famously unhappy and the prospect of the view-gobbling parvenu soon to be looming to the south is just another irritant added to a laundry list of plumbing glitches and neighborly rows.

Mr. Senbahar told how, last Christmas on the beach in St. Bart's, he ran into the restaurateur Phil Suarez, who owns the Perry Street apartment below Ms. Kidman. "He said, `You're blocking my view,' " Mr. Senbahar recalled. Mr. Senbahar shrugged. "It's New York. If you want somebody not to block your views, you've got to buy the whole town."



June 17th, 2004, 10:17 PM
The apartments in 165 Charles Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) range from $1.15 million for a 682-square-foot studio to $18.5 million for the duplex penthouse, all 4,551 square feet of it. 12 June 2004.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles_street_12june04.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

June 28th, 2004, 09:26 PM
165 Charles Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) is rising next to Perry West (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/perry_west/) towers. 26 June 2004.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles_26june04.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

August 8th, 2004, 06:44 PM
Viewed from Pier 45 Aug. 8, 2004


August 9th, 2004, 09:20 PM
I like the towers. Diffrent.

August 18th, 2004, 10:59 PM
Who'd want to live there with a view of all the bums sitting in the park outside. :P

September 12th, 2004, 01:20 AM
165 Charles Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) is rising next to Perry West (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/perry_west/) towers. 11 September 2004.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles_11sept04.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

September 12th, 2004, 11:59 AM
I read an article in today's NYT real estate section about how there are studio apartments in this building for more than $1 million. Let's hear it for capitalism..

September 12th, 2004, 01:30 PM
Let's hear it for capitalism..
Hip-hip, hurray! hip-hip, hurray! :P

November 29th, 2004, 09:50 PM
Two hits. One miss.


TLOZ Link5
November 30th, 2004, 01:15 AM
Sorry, Meier. You got greedy.

November 30th, 2004, 12:02 PM
Well, give it a chance. At least it's glass. I actually like that it's not a clone of the other 2. Three that are basically the same would have been too much. It might turn out fine upon completion.

November 30th, 2004, 12:07 PM
The design of the third was too derivative of the originals. It should have been a third completely in the same design and style or something completely different. The third altered design destroys the beauty of the first two and vice versa.

November 30th, 2004, 02:59 PM
I agree. I think he should've played more with abstract forms and created a greater whole, if Meier would've made the third a curving building it would've looked hot!

TLOZ Link5
November 30th, 2004, 03:30 PM
It's also the same height. Brings to mind just a domino row of matching luxury apartment buildings, one after the other, marching down the Hudson riverfront. Playtime, anyone?

December 12th, 2004, 06:59 PM
Not so bad; sure dresses up the neighborhood.

And the skyline.

Ain't a thing in existence that you can't improve in your mind. Question is: can you improve it on paper?

Meier is one of the best; he never does an ugly building. How many others can you say that about?

P.S. I really like it in red.

January 4th, 2005, 11:27 PM
165 Charles Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) is rising next to Perry West (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/perry_west/) towers. 25 December 2004.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles_pier45.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

January 5th, 2005, 12:28 AM
Wow, the three of them look very nice like that.

January 5th, 2005, 10:06 AM
I'm not loving it.

January 5th, 2005, 12:03 PM
Porque non?

February 1st, 2005, 02:48 PM
Sometime in early January.

February 1st, 2005, 03:36 PM
I like the texture on this one, real silky.

February 11th, 2005, 10:05 AM

Sales at Meier-Designed Tower Could Signal Pricier Downtown Market

BY JULIE SATOW - Staff Reporter of the Sun
February 10, 2005

The last of three Richard Meier-designed glass towers rising on the edge of the West Side Highway is nearly half sold, with two bidders in hot contention over the penthouse. Forty-five percent of the 31 apartments at 165 Charles St. are in contract, and a local real estate developer is vying with Hollywood heavyweight David Geffen, who owns DreamWorks SKG with Jeffrey Katzenberg and Steven Spielberg, for the $20 million penthouse, according to sources close to the deal.

The units, which went on sale in April, cost between $5.3 million and $8.5 million for the 22 three-bedroom units in the building. One 2,553-squarefoot three-bedroom on a high floor went into contract recently for $2,895 a square foot, said a senior managing director at the Sunshine Group, James Lansill. The building has two apartments with only two bedrooms, both of which have sold, and two apartments with one bedroom, which have also been sold. There is one remaining studio in the back of the building.

As for the 4,551-square-foot four bedroom penthouse, if it sells for the asking price of $4,394 a square foot, it would be the most expensive apartment to sell downtown, the president of appraisal firm Miller Samuel, Jonathan Miller, said. A deal for the penthouse is expected as early as this month, Mr. Lansill said.

The 16-floor building, which is wrapped in a glass, aluminum, and granite skin, will be ready for occupancy this summer.

The price points for the building, which are on par with real estate prices for luxury buildings uptown, is helping to drive a trend in name-brand architecture downtown, experts say.

"If the building's sales succeed, it will prove that this type of product can be absorbed into the market, and it will spur more development by well-known architects downtown," Mr. Miller said. "It builds a track record that other developers will follow."

A Douglas Elliman broker who specializes in luxury real estate, Leonard Steinberg, agreed.

"The buildings are the most visible of all the designer buildings and are a clear leader," he said.

Other buildings by well-known architects include the Santiago Calatrava glass-cube building at the South Street Seaport, the Gwathmey Siegel building at Astor Place, and the Winka Dubbeldam-designed luxury residences on Greenwich Street.

Nicole Kidman, Martha Stewart, and Calvin Klein are just a few of the boldfaced names who have bought units at Mr. Meier's other glass towers on nearby Perry Street. Those buildings were delivered raw and have reportedly been plagued by infrastructure problems. The Charles Street building has also attracted Hollywood luminaries, including Natalie Portman, who bought one of the building's two one bedrooms, and the owner of a travel agency, Michael Holtz, who bought two apartments in the building.

The developers, Izac Senbahar and Simon Elias, hope the building will not have infrastructure difficulties like the others. "There were logistics problems with [the Perry Street] apartments because they were delivered raw," Mr. Senbahar. "We have professionals doing everything so we will not face these issues."

Mr. Meier was given carte blanche to decide even the smallest details for the interiors, including 9-foot-tall, $6,500 bathroom doors and leather theater seats in the communal screening room.

"This was Richard's vision, and we wanted to let him paint the entire canvas," Mr. Senbahar said.

The Charles Street building, which has a 50-foot infinity-edge pool and a private wine cellar, has terraces on 23 of its units. Every apartment comes with wide-plank Wenge wood floors, double-glazed windows, and central air conditioning and heat. There are Bosch washers and dryers, Gaggenau ovens and dishwashers, and Sub-Zero refrigerators. The bathrooms are designed with white Corian, Dornbracht fittings, gray jet-mist granite slab stone flooring, frameless glass showers, an extra deep soaking tub, and Duravit bidets.

As part of the process of allowing Mr. Meier free rein to design the entire building, the developers skipped a traditional aspect of development known as value engineering. This is when a project architect is hired after the design architect - in this case Mr. Meier - with the purpose of finding a more affordable way to adapt the styles to the apartments. Without value engineering, most of the fittings must be custom-made to Mr. Meier's specifications at a much higher cost.

"We didn't do any value engineering, so it is very unique, and would be very difficult to pull off in a bigger building," Mr. Senbahar said. The banks balked at the costs and financed about 60%, instead of the more common 80% or 90%, of the $100 million project, with the remainder coming out of the developers' own pockets, Mr. Senbahar said.

March 8th, 2005, 01:27 PM
the 50 foot infinity edge pool sounds awesome as well as the wine cellar and screening room. Glass Towers are becoming ever so popular, since Gwathmey Siegels creation of Astor Place used the idea of "waves" and Meiers which is strictly a "Glass Box", I wonder what other designs can possibly be created through this new reinvented concept of architecture

March 20th, 2005, 02:42 PM
The Real Deal (http://www.therealdeal.net/issues/March_2005/1109912833.php), March 2005

165 Charles Street costs rise

By Steve Cutler

While architect Richard Meier�s marquee two tower project on the West Village waterfront attracted almost as much notice for construction delays and water leaks as architectural panache, his latest project, at 165 Charles St., may eventually epitomize cost overruns in pursuit of perfection.

Where Meier designed the glass towers at 173-176 Perry Street, but left them as raw space on the inside, the new Charles Street project is the architect�s outside and in, right down to the bathroom faucets and screening room chairs.

Developers Simon Elias and Izak Senbahar, who are unaffiliated with the Perry Street buildings, decided to meld their fate to the architect�s vision from the start. Giving the architect carte blanche has meant continual cost increases.

"We went to Richard Meier and he really wanted to do a third building and he wanted to do the finished interiors," Elias said. "We gave him a free hand � everything he wanted. We knew we would end up with a unique product."

It hasn�t been cheap. "We started out with an 85 percent construction loan," Elias added, "and ended up at 60 percent as we continued down the design phase. All the extra money we put in was our own equity."

Living in a building that owes more to art than commerce leaves little room for modest budgets. Prices have reached as high as $4,394 a square foot � or $20 million - for the 4,551-square-foot penthouse with an 1,800 square-foot terrace. The unit has drawn interest from prospective buyers such as Hollywood mogul David Geffen. If it gets the asking price, it would be Downtown�s most expensive apartment.

Wrapped in glass and aluminum, the sleek, minimalist 16-story building is similar but not identical to the Perry Street towers. "The fa�ade is different�it�s like a cousin, not a brother, of what�s there," Meier said. "The height is the same and the idea of the open, transparent building is similar."

Extraordinary interior finishes abound. Apartment walls never touch the ground but instead float just above it, for purely aesthetic reasons. Sheetrock was laid on the inner walls by the same team that did the Museum of Modern Art. Meier�s handwritten signature even graces the inside of kitchen cabinets.

"They are pure Richard Meier," said James Lansill, senior managing director of The Sunshine Group, which is marketing the project. "Every detail on the inside is proscribed by Meier."

Windows in the building have three layers of glass to keep out the noise from the West Side Highway below. A protective layer shields out harmful ultraviolet light rays. To keep the glass clean, the building had a crane-like apparatus mounted on the roof to reach down � it�s an in-house, or rather on-house, robotic window washer.

The finishes transcend craftsmanship, says Elias. "If you look at the Getty Museum [designed by Meier], everything lines up in an amazing way. You see here too, in the apartments, the wood planks on the floors line up with the bare wood on the terraces. I don�t know if anybody notices that, but it�s the kind of thing that�s typical of him."

Interior doors are made of translucent glass. Bathrooms feature a frosted window between the shower and the master bedroom. Shower bases are made of one piece of stone, custom-ground for drainage, instead of tiles.

The common areas are similarly impressive. A below-ground atrium space houses a 50-foot pool next to a 15-foot waterfall. Other amenities include a private wine cellar and a 35-seat screening room specially-designed by acoustic engineers.

Approximately 45 percent of the building�s 31 apartments are sold. The 22 three-bedroom units cost between $5.3 million and $8.5 million. Its three studios, lacking the front views that the larger apartments have, are the building�s bargains, going for about $1.25 million, well below the average overall $2,500-per-square-foot pricing.

Developers hope that with finished space, they will avoid the problems experienced in the other Meier towers. In that project, buyers had to put in their own basics, including bathroom plumbing, and the building reportedly experienced leaks and other problems. Calvin Klein, who bought a unit in the building, threatened to sue over the complications that arose.

The Charles Street project will also be unique in that Meier made an agreement with the developers stipulating that he would never replicate certain aspects of the design in any other projects.

Two of the units are reserved for the developers. "Both Izak and I are going to keep apartments here," said Elias. "We won�t do this again and we didn�t want to drive by 10 years from now and say, �I should have kept one.�"


April 30th, 2005, 03:00 PM
Great website guys. As a current Meier employee, it's easy to have one's perspective skewed by one's surroundings. It's good to see a forum with different points of view.

The location of the project next to the Perry Street development was an odd situation. I can't think of another instance where we built adjacent buildings with different clients. I think the consensus in the office would be that both projects would be better if they were not next to each other, unfortunately, architects are rarely able to choose their client or the site.

May 2nd, 2005, 12:50 AM
165 Charles Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) is rising next to Perry West (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/perry_west/) towers. 1 May 2005.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

May 2nd, 2005, 04:25 PM
Thanks for the pic.

165 is a great looking building but building it right next to Perry West seriously detracts from both projects. It's a crying shame it wasn't built on another site.

May 2nd, 2005, 04:33 PM
I agree. It ruins the "gate way" effect the 2 buildings had. The building is beautiful, high quality and right for the waterfront but the whole thing looks a little less special now.

August 7th, 2005, 11:09 PM
165 Charles Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) next to Perry West towers in August 2005.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles_hudson.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

August 8th, 2005, 12:17 AM
The building is beautiful, high quality and right for the waterfront but the whole thing looks a little less special now.
An ad in today's NY Times states that units at 165 Charles start at $5,000,000.00 ++ !!!!!!

And won't they be upset if someone builds something that blocks their views ...

August 8th, 2005, 07:22 PM
Its so stupid having that one tower different, anyone know why richard didnt design it to fit the other towers?

August 8th, 2005, 10:21 PM
I think, literally, because he wanted something different.

August 8th, 2005, 11:26 PM
I think its more similar than different. I'm hoping his Brooklyn development will be radically different.

August 9th, 2005, 10:31 AM
When looking at the 3 buildings from nearby you can see the the newer tower has a different glass than the original two. It is a much clearer glass, without the blue-greenish tinge of the glass in the first towers. Meier also seems to have refined the exterior structural elements to offer more expansive and uninterrupted views -- though the glass enclosures on the balconies of the new tower are somewhat awkward in how they relate to the rest of the building.

What I don't understand with all three of the towers is the desire for the expanse of windows on the buildings at the eastern edges away from West Street. This is where they look across to the other buildings. Seemingly this design element is to unify the look of the buildings from the exterior, but it must make for a very odd experience from inside the units.

IMO the refinement of the new tower actually makes the original two (terrific looking on their own) look somewhat busy. In a perfect world the new tower would be a few blocks removed from the other two.

August 9th, 2005, 10:35 AM
The terraces are there so Martha and Calvin can hang their wet bathing suits to dry on the railings after coming back from a swim at Coney Island.

August 9th, 2005, 02:54 PM
I would honestly think it odder to want to look at New Jersey than the other buildings.

August 9th, 2005, 08:10 PM
^ha! I think its the river they want to see! Can some one direct me to the thread about his brooklyn development if there is one please.

August 9th, 2005, 10:25 PM
The whole "Hudson river view" thing is seriously overhyped. I can't stand in Riverside Park and look down at the river without being distracted by the glowing Target sign and hideous condo towers in Edgewater on the other side. New Jersey should have either left its Hudson shoreline pristine or mandated it be completely built up, a la Jersey City...its current state is deplorable.

August 10th, 2005, 01:59 AM
The whole "Hudson river view" thing is seriously overhyped.
I think it's the view of endless sky to the west that makes these buildings so valuable and desirable.

August 10th, 2005, 07:30 AM
New Jersey should have either left its Hudson shoreline pristine or mandated it be completely built up, a la Jersey City...its current state is deplorable.
Bingo! Either would be better than what we have, which is neither fish nor fowl.

August 10th, 2005, 11:15 AM
The whole "Hudson river view" thing is seriously overhyped. I can't stand in Riverside Park and look down at the river without being distracted by the glowing Target sign and hideous condo towers in Edgewater on the other side. New Jersey should have either left its Hudson shoreline pristine or mandated it be completely built up, a la Jersey City...its current state is deplorable.

You'll only find that if you live in Inwood. An interesting little tid bit is that in building the Cloister's Rockefeller also protected the views across the river by buying the land on the Palisade's and restricting development there.

August 11th, 2005, 06:19 PM
I think the draw is that the jersey waterfront is better than a wall across the street from your window

August 18th, 2005, 09:39 PM
Pictures taken 8/1/05: (sorry for the delay)

http://images.snapfish.com/3447645523232%7Ffp3%3B%3Dot%3E234%3A%3D937%3D37%3B %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A3%3B%3C%3B646%3Aot1lsi

http://images.snapfish.com/3447645523232%7Ffp45%3Dot%3E234%3A%3D937%3D37%3B%3 DXROQDF%3E2323%3A3%3B%3C%3B646%3Bot1lsi

The view of the Jersey waterfront from that area:

http://images.snapfish.com/3447645523232%7Ffp7%3Enu%3D3259%3E846%3E28%3A%3EWS NRCG%3D3232%3B2%3C%3B%3C5555nu0mrj

http://images.snapfish.com/3447645523232%7Ffp45%3Dot%3E234%3A%3D937%3D37%3B%3 DXROQDF%3E2323%3A3%3B%3C%3B6465ot1lsi

http://images.snapfish.com/3447645523232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E234%3A%3D937%3D37%3B%3 DXROQDF%3E2323%3A3%3B%3C%3B6467ot1lsi

http://images.snapfish.com/3447645523232%7Ffp46%3Dot%3E234%3A%3D937%3D37%3B%3 DXROQDF%3E2323%3A3%3B%3C%3B85%3A%3Aot1lsi

August 18th, 2005, 09:47 PM
Meier's towers: Variations on a Theme or Symphonic Metamorphoses?

Are they all the same height due to regulations?

Btw, to my eye they look sensational.

August 18th, 2005, 09:58 PM
Well, you can't really call them variations on a theme, as the first two that were built are identical. The third one is somewhat of a variation, but not really. It's the same building, except with different glass and no interior finishes. I'm pretty sure the heights were restricted, but the fact that they all have the same height stems more from Meier's vision than from zoning regulations.

August 18th, 2005, 10:02 PM
^ Not really identical; one's wider than the other, and the balconies wrap around a bit more.

August 18th, 2005, 10:05 PM
Wow. You're right. And all this time I was sure they were twins.

August 19th, 2005, 11:54 AM
Man, those park shots are great. Boggles my mind how people would not want to see something similar go the length of the WSH.

hella good
August 19th, 2005, 02:54 PM
the bottoms of the lamp posts look like an art deco proposal for some sort of factory.

August 20th, 2005, 04:17 PM
The combination reminds me of an abstract crown (arguably the best part) of the Chanin Building or some other art-deco masterpiece but in modern materials, massing, and proportion.


April 19th, 2006, 04:11 PM
Richard Meier: Maximizing Minimalism (http://images.businessweek.com/ss/06/04/meier/index_01.htm?chan=innovation_architecture_model+ho use)
An insider's look at the residences of 165 Charles St., designed by the "starchitect" and decked out in 20th century modernist furnishings

August 8th, 2006, 05:17 PM
Took these Sunday 6/8/06


Compare it to 173 Perry Street




August 8th, 2006, 05:38 PM
These I found on Flickr.

jskrybe's photostream (http://www.flickr.com/photos/cityspecific/)




Hans Bouman's photostream (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hansbouman/)

adlin's photostream (http://www.flickr.com/photos/66576516@N00/)

August 8th, 2006, 06:53 PM
I think they really look beautiful. Not sure if they are worth $2,500 psf but still beautiful. Some of those photos are incredible

August 8th, 2006, 06:57 PM
Just WOW Derek2k3! Some of those shots are just amazing! The towers look beautiful together from afar! Look at that mean sky on that one photo! I love it!

August 8th, 2006, 07:58 PM
I think they'd look perfect together if the third building had the white frame-like detail on the front facade like the first two have.

August 8th, 2006, 08:10 PM
Or in the middle, it would help with the symmetry. Beautiful nonetheless!:)

August 8th, 2006, 09:56 PM
Thank you Derek, those cross-river views look amazing! In that second photo, I had to do a double-take. I semi-expected to see some sand and sunbathers in front of Meier's buildings. Absolutely gorgeous.

August 8th, 2006, 11:51 PM
One amazing thing about the Meier triplets is that it still seems as if half of them are going through interior construction.

How many units are actually lived in / occupied (as opposed to having been purchased)?

August 9th, 2006, 12:41 PM
I've heard reports that there are like 2-3 units actually occupied in the big one but who knows....they had some serious issues with leaks and things but now supposedly all set. There are A LOT of units for sale but at pretty steap prices.

That being said, this is as good as it gets for an apt building downtown....

August 30th, 2006, 01:15 AM
165 Charles St (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/) on 17 Aug 2006.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/images/real_estate/165charles/165charles_meier.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/165charles/)

August 30th, 2006, 01:40 AM
Great pic....man you nailed it....

September 4th, 2006, 07:01 PM
God, those buildings are beautiful.

September 4th, 2006, 07:45 PM
And thank goodness that Meier had the sense to incorporate the roof-top mechanicals into the design -- rather than just plopping them on top (like so many buildings / developers / architects do these days).

Walking down the Hudson River Park today I couldn't help but notice that Johnson's Urban Glass House has failed to do this -- it shows the roof-top cooling tower for all to see. One of the tricks of NYC zoning laws is that those in charge have seen fit to separate the mechanicals from the allowed building envelope -- somehow a 20' mechanical tower isn't included in th allowable height. Th very least they could do is establish some rules so that our skyline isn't topped by the image of TRANE et al.

That machinery has none of the romance -- or elegant simplicity -- of the ubiquitous NYC roof-top wooden water towers.

June 25th, 2007, 02:10 PM
These buildings are arrestingly beautiful, especially near sunset.


June 25th, 2007, 02:13 PM
^ How come he never got to do a real skyscraper in New York?

June 25th, 2007, 04:28 PM
^I would love to see his Philadelphia proposal in Long Island City or Brooklyn, especially on the waterfront:


July 31st, 2008, 06:04 PM
Just posting this gossip to bring back a thread that a lot of new posters will not have seen.
Some great photographs from Derek, Pianoman and Edward.

Natalie Portman Moving Out of Meier's Glass Tower

by Irina Aleksander (http://www.observer.com/2008/author/irina-aleksander) | July 31, 2008

http://www.observer.com/files/imagecache/article/files/portman%20apt.jpg Natalie Portman's apartment.

Natalie Portman would like to ditch her three-bedroom, three-bath apartment in Richard Meier's West Village glass tower at 165 Charles Street, the Post (http://www.nypost.com/seven/07312008/realestate/pony_up_122279.htm) reported this morning.

Ms. Portman, who bought the 2,500-square-foot place in 2005 for $5.7 million, has placed the apartment on the market for $6.55 million. The listing (http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=1281668) went to Andy Fink and Nancy Teague at the Corcoran Group.

Mr. Meier's West Side buildings, which appear entirely see-through from the outside, have nonetheless drawn privacy-seeking celebrities like Heather Graham, who just bought a place in the Meier-designed 173 Perry Street. Martha Stewart's daughter Alexis and Mr. Meier's own daughter Ana both reside at 165 Charles.

Lately, the demure Ms. Portman has been spending quite a bit of time in Los Angeles with her boyfriend, long-haired Venezuelan-American folk singer-songwriter Devendra Banhart. Perhaps the pair will be seeking out something a bit less shiny.

[Via Curbed (http://curbed.com/archives/2008/07/31/on_the_market_natalie_portman_ditching_meierville. php)]


© 2008 Observer Media Group,

July 31st, 2008, 07:25 PM
How can spend all of that money on a great apartment and furnish it like that?

It looks like the "tufted" display at a furniture showroom.

July 31st, 2008, 07:56 PM
LOL ^ It is just so wrong :eek:

But it's probably just laziness -- the George Smith (http://www.georgesmith.com/) showroom is only a few blocks south on Hudson Street :cool:

July 31st, 2008, 08:04 PM
LOL. OMG, that sofa... it's from the "George Smith Reno Nevada Whorehouse Collection"

July 31st, 2008, 08:04 PM
... Lately, the demure Ms. Portman has been spending quite a bit of time in Los Angeles with her boyfriend, long-haired Venezuelan-American folk singer-songwriter Devendra Banhart.

Looks like the fault lies with the "demure Ms. Portman." :rolleyes: Doesn't seem to match the style of the boyfriend (http://www.devendrabanhart.com/photospage.html) ...


July 31st, 2008, 08:05 PM
On the other hand ...

that sofa... it's from the "George Smith Reno Nevada Whorehouse Collection"

July 31st, 2008, 08:06 PM
Although that might more aplty read: "The Avenue A Whorehouse Collection" ;)

July 31st, 2008, 08:17 PM

We've gone from Jackie Curtis glamour to this?

I will continue to hang out in Italy.



July 31st, 2008, 08:46 PM

July 31st, 2008, 11:16 PM
^^^ Love it!

July 31st, 2008, 11:47 PM
That is one scary dude. Doesn't that poor little Natalie have parents to give her advice?

They used to take those guys to Bellevue and slap straightjackets on them. Now they date pretty actresses.

June 8th, 2010, 05:36 PM
173 and 176 Perry Street - Richard Meier by Scott Norsworthy (http://www.flickr.com/photos/22447079@N02/2760298325/)

173 and 176 Perry Street - Richard Meier by Scott Norsworthy (http://www.flickr.com/photos/22447079@N02/2760298325/)