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NYguy
April 9th, 2003, 08:53 AM
NY Post...

BOTH SIDES OF HUDSON VIE FOR NEW TV TOWER
By LOIS WEISS

April 9, 2003 -- While Bayonne, N.J., is ready to welcome a $200 million permanent TV antenna structure that would replace the World Trade Center's TV tower, area broadcasters still favor a New York location.

The city is negotiating to locate a temporary tower on Governor's Island until the first tall building at ground zero is ready for occupancy.

Currently, the only local broadcast tower for emergency services and media companies is the Empire State Building, where WPIX-TV just signed a 15-year lease to locate its broadcast facilities, as have most of the other major outlets.

"We made room for them," said Thomas Sullivan of Helmsley-Spear, who negotiated the deal for the building.

But Ed Grebow, president of the Metropolitan Television Alliance - a consortium of area television outlets - said he viewed the Empire State Building as a mere backup spot until a taller home can be constructed.

"The World Trade Center antenna was 1,750 feet. The Empire is 1,350 feet, and the Durst antenna will be about 1,100 feet and change," he said. "In this business, height matters, because otherwise you get terrible interference and lose range."

He says the MTVA really wants to relocate the broadcasters back to the World Trade Center site, and is now talking with the Lower Manhattan Development Corp.'s redevelopment architect, Daniel Liebskind, as well as developer Larry A. Silverstein about using the plan's tallest tower for that purpose.

Until that tower is actually constructed, however, the MTVA wants to use Governor's Island for what they have dubbed the "cheese grater" - a streamlined, low-cost temporary tower.

The Bloomberg administration nixed Governor's Island last year because, as Deputy Mayor Dan Doctoroff told us in June, it "didn't see the [dollar] value to having an observation tower there and it would involve a lot of digging for wiring."

[b]The MTVA is talking about an $8 million-a-year rent, but right now, sources say the Bloomberg administration is looking for nearly double that.

Meanwhile, Bayonne wants to host a $200 million permanent antenna, similar to the CN Tower in Toronto, which it hopes would anchor a local revitalization.

And the Liberty Science Center, also in New Jersey, is willing to host the antennas as well.

If Bayonne gets the nod from the MTVA, no additional city facility would be needed, Grebow said.

http://www.nypost.com/photos/web04090336.jpg

Bk Italian 123
April 10th, 2003, 12:55 AM
i really hope that that thing will be built in NewYork... if it is going 2 b built.

dbhstockton
April 10th, 2003, 01:06 AM
Chinese finger handcuffs

ZippyTheChimp
April 10th, 2003, 09:21 AM
Now I'll never get that image out of my head.

I would say let Bayonne have it, except there's a chance it may line up with my view of the Statue of Liberty, and look like a ridiculous hat.

billyblancoNYC
April 10th, 2003, 11:33 AM
Put up the temp, get the rent, let the WTC have the permanent (uh, huh, rhyming's cool, or something).

And put some damn casinos on that sh*t!!

NYatKNIGHT
April 10th, 2003, 11:58 AM
Put it on Coney Island and make a ride out of it.

TAFisher123
April 10th, 2003, 12:15 PM
Gee im glad they finally settled that

NYguy
April 28th, 2003, 09:22 AM
Here's a different view of the 2,000 ft tower in Bayonne ....

DAY
http://www.greghigginsarchitect.com/bayonne.html


NIGHT
http://www.greghigginsarchitect.com/bayonne_night_view.html


http://www.greghigginsarchitect.com/index.html

NYguy
April 28th, 2003, 09:25 AM
http://www.greghigginsarchitect.com/images/bayonne_night.jpg?

Fabb
April 28th, 2003, 10:08 AM
Why not ?
I mean, it's totally unrealistic, but that would make me happy.

Anyway, that new design NYguy posted is great.
It has something of the spider web that I love.

JMGarcia
April 28th, 2003, 11:39 AM
I don't think its an official design. That architect also has a proposal for the WTC.

NoyokA
April 28th, 2003, 03:55 PM
The above picture is from Governor's Island, not Bayonne.

NYguy
April 28th, 2003, 04:02 PM
Stern, the above pic is from Bayonne, you can even see the Jersey City skyline in the background. *Govs Island would give you more of a Downtown view, and you wouldn't see Midtown from that angle.

JMGarcia, its similar in pricipal to that last design we saw for the Bayonne tower. *I think it may have been one of the 12 designs. *Read below....


http://www.nypost.com/photos/web04090336.jpg..http://www.greghigginsarchitect.com/images/bayonne_night.jpg?


From the website...

In September 2002, after an expression of interest by MTVA tower planners, the rendering was produced to illustrate how the tower could appear on The Peninsula. As specified by the MTVA, the tower is crowned with 3 antenna masts. Broadcaster's call this antenna arrangement a "candelabra". The tower must accommodate an unprecedented number of antennas at an optimum height of from 1800 feet (for maximum coverage) to 2049 feet (maximum height above sea level permitted by FAA regulations): Hence the three masts on a circular platform.

An elevated 2-story transmitter building is incorporated at the tower's base, within the ring of anchor cables. Bayonne officials propose that the tower be located within a public park. "The park, and possibly a portion of the transmitter building, could incorporate a host of public amenities, including the 9/11/01 memorial the City is planning." The super-tall tower could also serve as a 21st Century lighthouse to assist ship navigation into New York Harbor.

Fabb
April 28th, 2003, 05:34 PM
Hence the three masts on a circular platform.

The second rendering has three masts plus an antenna. That's beautiful. It could be like a huge insect above its nest.

NYguy
April 30th, 2003, 06:07 PM
I received an interesting email from the architect (Greg Higgins) who said:

-he and Geiger Engineers *are competing with KPF (no secret)

-the MTVA asked and received permission to use the daytime Bayonne rendering in USA Today

-he produced no renderings for a governors island site, but the WTC site rendering was a result of meetings early on with the MTVA (not just pie in the sky)

JMGarcia
April 30th, 2003, 06:20 PM
Well, I'm glad to hear that its serious. It's better looking than the current KPF proposal.

His WTC proposal on the other hand is pretty bad. Not so much the tower but the 4 surrounding buildings.

Kris
April 30th, 2003, 06:21 PM
Both are horrible.

Fabb
April 30th, 2003, 06:29 PM
Christian, I thought you liked KPF's design.

(there was a bigger, taller antenna on top if I remember correctly...)

JMGarcia
April 30th, 2003, 06:35 PM
Chris, everything is relative. ;)

Personally, I'll be shocked if the MTVA spend the money needed to building something like this rather than take advantage of the WTC tower. It seems much more likely Bloomberg will agree to a temporary tower in the mean time.

NYguy
April 30th, 2003, 07:42 PM
This is what I don't understand:

If the WTC tower is ready for occupancy in about 5 years, and the temporary tower takes 2 years to build, that would give 3 years in between. *Is the cost to build the temporary tower, and rents paid to the city more or less than the projected revenue loss if there wasn't a tower for those 3 years?

(Edited by NYguy at 6:43 pm on April 30, 2003)

Fabb
May 1st, 2003, 10:59 AM
Not to mention the antenna of the Conde Nast building that could become useless if the temporary tower is built.

JMGarcia
May 1st, 2003, 12:24 PM
I believe Conde Naste is being constructed under the idea that it would function as a back up location and would be used more for radio than TV.

NYguy
May 3rd, 2003, 09:10 AM
Daily News...

Tall order likely for WTC antenna
By GREG GITTRICH and MAGGIE HABERMAN

Officials are close to a deal with a broadcast group to put a new TV tower at Ground Zero, sources said yesterday.

The deal would require a temporary location for the antenna - possibly Governors Island - until construction at the World Trade Center site advances.

The sources said the city and state are hammering out a tower deal to keep the broadcast group, the Metropolitan Television Alliance, in the city. As of now, the alliance, which includes WNBC, WNET and WABC, is planning a 2,000-foot antenna in Bayonne, N.J.

The new tower is to replace the one that stood atop the Trade Center's north tower. If it's put at Ground Zero, it will be a part of the 1,776-foot spire proposed in architect Daniel Libeskind's site plan.

The spire is considered unpractical by many developers and has the best chance of getting built if it's a TV antenna. But because the adjacent building won't go up for several years, an interim site must be selected for the tower.

Officials involved in the negotiations declined to comment about the plan or said they knew nothing about it.

Fabb
May 3rd, 2003, 09:36 AM
The spire is considered unpractical by many developers and has the best chance of getting built if it's a TV antenna.

Wouldn't it alter Libeskind's design ?
I was surprised by the visual impact on 1 Liberty Plaza in Philadelphia when *the spire was turned into an antenna last March.

I even think the frail Freedom Tower wouldn't resist.

OKoranjes
May 3rd, 2003, 02:34 PM
Despite cost issues, at least if the Conde Naste antenni were rendered useless they could be taken down and return the crown of the building to some normalicy.

(Edited by OKoranjes at 1:34 pm on May 3, 2003)

Fabb
May 3rd, 2003, 03:13 PM
Would you like it to revert to its former appearance ?
I've always found the crown a little short.

NYguy
May 3rd, 2003, 04:08 PM
Quote: from Fabb on 8:36 am on May 3, 2003
The spire is considered unpractical by many developers and has the best chance of getting built if it's a TV antenna.
Wouldn't it alter Libeskind's design ?
I was surprised by the visual impact on 1 Liberty Plaza in Philadelphia when *the spire was turned into an antenna last March. *I even think the frail Freedom Tower wouldn't resist. *

The media refers to the "garden" tower itself as a spire. *I think the only thing it would alter is possibly the height. *The broadcasters on top would make the building more practical.

Fabb
May 3rd, 2003, 05:41 PM
No. I'm pretty sure a broadcasting antenna would be much heavier than a simple spire.
Not necessarily the height but the aspect would be different. I'm not saying worse, but different.

NYguy
May 12th, 2003, 09:18 AM
(NY Times)


Broadcasters Put Antennas in Midtown
By CHARLES V. BAGLI

Like a flock of birds migrating north, the major television stations in the metropolitan area have returned to the Empire State Building for the first time in more than 20 years.

Last Thursday, WNBC-TV became the last of 11 stations to sign a 15-year lease for transmission and antenna space atop what became the city's tallest skyscraper 20 months ago with the destruction of the World Trade Center.

All but one broadcaster had left the 102-story, 1,454-foot-tall Empire State Building decades ago for a higher rooftop on the trade center's north tower. After the Sept. 11 terrorist attack, some viewers were left with blank or fuzzy screens, and broadcasters were scrambling for a new home.

In an industry in which height matters, however, the broadcasters are still casting about for an even taller perch in a search that pits New York against New Jersey.

The Metropolitan Television Alliance, which represents the 11 broadcasters, is negotiating to build a $200 million, 2,000-foot-tall free-standing tower on a pier in Bayonne, N.J. At the same time, it has asked the Bloomberg administration for permission to erect a temporary $60 million tower on Governors Island, while a permanent tower and antenna are built at the trade center site.

"Whether we end up in Bayonne or at the World Trade Center site, the Empire State Building will be the backup," said Edward Grebow, the president of the television alliance. "They've worked hard to improve conditions there."

In a $6 million upgrade, the building's owners are installing steel beams to reinforce the giant mast and 204-foot antenna atop the building, according to Thomas P. Sullivan, the director of leasing for the building, which is managed by Helmsley-Spear. They are bringing more electrical capacity to the top of the tower to accommodate the broadcasters, and converting the office space on the 77th, 78th and 79th floors into transmission stations.

Mr. Sullivan said that 11 television stations, including WABC, WCBS, WNBC and WPIX, as well as 22 FM radio stations, now broadcast from the Empire State Building.

But while station executives say they want an even taller antenna that would enable all viewers to receive a clearer picture, some experts suggest the difference between the Empire State Building and the proposed antenna towers is not that great.

"There's not a lot lost between the World Trade Center and the Empire State Building," said Neil Smith, a broadcast engineering consultant who works for the partnership group that owns the Empire State Building, and has worked for many television and radio stations. "And there would not be a lot gained by going to a 2,000-foot tower in Bayonne."

"There would be some improvement within the service area," Mr. Smith said. "But the more significant issue is location rather than height. The Empire State Building is more centrally located with respect to other tall buildings that tend to block signals and do bad things."

Mr. Grebow, though, insisted that a couple of hundred feet mattered greatly. The taller the antenna, he said, the less likely that viewers who get their signals via an antenna, rather than by cable or satellite, will have shadows, ghosts or reflections on their screens.

"The shadowing from the Empire State Building is terrible," Mr. Grebow said, adding that there are still 700,000 homes without clear television reception as a result of the collapse of the trade center antennas.

An estimated 20 percent of the 7.3 million households in the New York metropolitan broadcast area do not have cable or satellite service, he said, and many of those that do plug their second television into an antenna.

"We still don't have good reception on any station," said Alan Compagnon, who lives in Brooklyn Heights and uses what he called super rabbit ears. "Most of the stations were clear before 9/11."

But reception has never been perfect for everyone.

In the late 1960's, the broadcasters then at the Empire State Building brought a lawsuit in an effort to halt construction of the trade center, claiming that the 110-story towers would reflect television signals and distort reception.

The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey settled the suit by agreeing to pay for some of the cost of moving the antennas to the north tower from the Empire State Building and installing new transmission equipment.

Even so, WCBS-TV reported receiving more than 600 complaints about poor reception in the weeks after the station switched on its trade center antenna in 1980, and the station advised viewers to adjust their own antennas.

Mr. Grebow said the signal coverage from the 2,000-foot antenna proposed for Bayonne, about 3.5 miles southwest of Manhattan, would be "`roughly equivalent" to that from the old World Trade Center antennas, which rose to 1,750 feet. The proposed trade center tower a 1,776-foot tower to be known as Freedom Tower, would be even better, Mr. Grebow said, because it is in Manhattan and would be taller than the Empire State Building.

Mr. Grebow contends that the Empire State Building antenna rises to only 1,350 feet, while the building's owners and John Tauranac, the author of two books about the skyscraper, puts the antenna's reach at 1,454 feet.

Mr. Grebow also said that 4 Times Square, another skyscraper in the mix, where the developer Douglas Durst is building a 385-foot broadcast antenna that is to rise to 1,141 feet, was not a suitable backup because it would not be tall enough.

Mr. Durst is signing a deal with Univision, the largest Spanish-language network in the country, which is currently broadcasting from the Empire State Building.

The television alliance is negotiating with the city of Bayonne over building the costly permanent, free-standing 2,000-foot tower at the former Military Ocean Terminal, where it would pay about $5 million a year in rent and taxes. The project still needs federal and state approval.

The stations are also talking to the Bloomberg administration about erecting a less expensive temporary tower on Governors Island, for which they have offered to pay $8 million a year in rent and to make an unspecified contribution toward the construction of Freedom Tower.

The Bloomberg administration has been reluctant to agree to a large antenna on Governors Island, because, officials say, they fear it could turn into a permanent installation. "We're prepared to consider it, provided we're absolutely convinced it's on a short-term basis," said Deputy Mayor Daniel L. Doctoroff.

The administration and Gov. George E. Pataki express support for permanent antennas on Freedom Tower, but there is debate over how soon the tower will be completed. So, the decision facing the broadcasting alliance now is New York or New Jersey, not both.

"We have to build a permanent tower in Bayonne, which won't accept a temporary tower," Mr. Grebow said. "We have been having conversations with the city and the state about the possibility of using Governors Island. But at the moment, it seems unlikely."

In the meantime, Bayonne is waiting.

"We're working out the fine points of an agreement with the broadcasters," said Nancy Kist, executive director of the Bayonne Local Redevelopment Authority. "Given that the broadcasters are based in New York City, I understand their rationale for wanting to be there. It's really a matter of timing."

NYatKNIGHT
May 12th, 2003, 02:34 PM
This explains what's been going on high up on the ESB. Yet, they still don't have this issue figured out. Obviously Bloomberg wants assurance that the Gov's Island site is temporary. And if the proposed "Freedom Tower" was taller there would be no need to entertain a Bayonne site.

ZippyTheChimp
May 12th, 2003, 04:47 PM
I can understand the concern about Governors' Island, but from our point of view, I hope the city nails this down. It's the best insurance against the Freedom Tower being whittled down. May even make it more substantial.

JMGarcia
May 12th, 2003, 05:16 PM
I would say that at this point the Freedom Tower would be the odds on favorite. Doctoroff is so unpredictable though who knows what kind of power games he'll play.

NYguy
May 12th, 2003, 07:10 PM
It would make too much sense to have the tower at the WTC, which is why nothing has been decided yet. *Everyone involved with the "freedom tower" would love to have the income from the broadcasters, so all the petty issues involved should be dropped.


Mr. Grebow said the signal coverage from the 2,000-foot antenna proposed for Bayonne, about 3.5 miles southwest of Manhattan, would be "`roughly equivalent" to that from the old World Trade Center antennas, which rose to 1,750 feet. The proposed trade center tower a 1,776-foot tower to be known as Freedom Tower, would be even better, Mr. Grebow said, because it is in Manhattan and would be taller than the Empire State Building....... At the same time, it has asked the Bloomberg administration for permission to erect a temporary $60 million tower on Governors Island, while a permanent tower and antenna are built at the trade center site.


I don't know why they are still insisting on the temporary tower. *The "freedom tower" will be ready in 5 years.

TomAuch
May 13th, 2003, 12:19 AM
The Freedom Tower's antenna, however, will probably take longer than five years to build. About six or seven I'd imagine. The importance of having the temporary tower is so it's not built in Bayonne, which could give the LMDC et al an excuse to reduce or scrap the Freedom Tower. All they have to do is cite the Quinnipiac poll and Grebow's decision to move to Jersey, and they'll get rid of it. We can't let City Hall blow this! We should write letters to Bloomberg and Grebow, and at the same time, write to Bayonne officials and ask them to consider a temporary tower.

NYguy
May 22nd, 2003, 09:21 AM
Quote: from TomAuch on 11:19 pm on May 12, 2003
The Freedom Tower's antenna, however, will probably take longer than five years to build. About six or seven I'd imagine. The importance of having the temporary tower is so it's not built in Bayonne, which could give the LMDC et al an excuse to reduce or scrap the Freedom Tower.

The "Freedom Tower" isn't being built specifically for the broadcasters. *The spire was part of Libeskind's plan to "restore the skyline".
.................................................. .............................

(Jersey Journal)


Trouble for TV tower from inside the FAA
Broadcasters: Hold application in abeyance

Thursday, May 22, 2003
By Ronald Leir

A branch of the Federal Aviation Administration has red-flagged an application by New York City broadcasters to place a 2,000-foot TV antenna at the Peninsula at Bayonne Harbor.

Pat Smith, a spokesman for the Metropolitan Television Alliance - a coalition of 11 broadcast stations - said that the Alliance was asking "that the application be held in abeyance" after learning that the FAA's Terminal Radar Approach Control unit, known as Tracon, "recommended that the application not be approved."

Tracon, based in Westbury, L.I., tracks aircraft coming in and out of the Greater New York area.

FAA spokesman Jim Peters said it wouldn't be appropriate to comment on the report "because we haven't completed our determination on the application, which is now on hold."

Peters refused to elaborate, but a source knowledgeable about FAA protocol said that Tracon wouldn't be the only branch of the agency to be consulted about the broadcasters' proposal.

Input from other branches, like Airway Facilities - which oversees maintaining navigational aides - and Flight Standards - which handles aircraft and pilot procedures - would also be consulted, the source said.

Bayonne officials expressed surprise when told of the development and Joseph Waks, legislative chief of staff to Assemblyman/Mayor Joseph V. Doria Jr., said that as far as the city knows, "The MTVA is still working with the FCC (Federal Communications Commission) and the NJ DEP (New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection) on the project."

Several months ago, the Bayonne Local Redevelopment Authority voted to give the MTVA the right to build the TV tower on the Peninsula, pending completion of a formal contract stipulating various conditions that the alliance would have to meet in the process, such as building a memorial to the victims of Sept. 11 and providing opportunities for local schoolchildren to learn about broadcasting technology.

Under that arrangement, Bayonne would stand to receive about $5 million a year in rental and other fees from the MTVA.

In December, BLRA Executive Director Nancy Kist predicted that having the tower in Bayonne "would serve to spur redevelopment at (the Peninsula) by providing construction and permanent jobs, tax ratables and lease revenues that could be used to further redevelop the Peninsula."

The MTVA opted to go with Bayonne over Jersey City, which was pitching to locate the tower near the Liberty Science Center, because Jersey City was insisting on placement of an observation deck atop the tower. MTVA President Edward Grebow said safety concerns ruled out having a deck. There also has talk about building a tower on Governor's Island in New York Harbor, but New York City officials have opposed that.

The broadcasters have been searching for a location for a new tower since the old one was destroyed when the Twin Towers were destroyed on Sept. 11, 2001. Since then, they have signed leases with the Empire State Building for an interim setup. There are plans for a new tower to be built, eventually, on the World Trade Center site in Lower Manhattan.

NYguy
May 26th, 2003, 08:15 AM
May 21, 2003

BAYONNE TV TOWER PROPOSAL IN QUESTION

BY RON MARSICO

New York City broadcasters have put a hold on plans for a 2,000-foot television tower in Bayonne, requesting that the Federal Aviation Administration at least temporarily suspend its review of the project's viability, officials said yesterday.

The Metropolitan Television Alliance, a coalition of 11 stations, made its decision after receiving a "negative" review of the plans from the section of the FAA responsible for takeoffs and landings from airports in the New York metropolitan area, said Pat Smith, a spokesman for the alliance. He did not elaborate.

"We're reconsidering," Smith said. "They (the broadcasters) could decide it's a deal-breaker. (But) they might be able to fix it."

The MTVA's decision also follows discussions with New York City officials about erecting a temporary tower on Governor's Island in New York Harbor until a permanent one can be placed on the proposed 1,776-foot Freedom Tower that will be built on the World Trade Center site.

Initially rebuffed in their attempt to locate a permanent tower on Governor's Island, the broadcasters turned to Bayonne, arguing that it would take too long to site a new antenna atop the future Manhattan tower.

A new tower is needed to improve TV reception in the metropolitan area, which has been spotty for some households without cable since the old tower at the World Trade Center was destroyed.

Since Sept. 11, 2001, the MTVA has been transmitting from a backup system atop the Empire State Building. Though that system is being upgraded, it is outdated.

"(The broadcasters) called us and told us to put our determination process on hold. They gave us no reason why," said Jim Peters, an FAA spokesman. "We're abiding by their request. We're not doing any more analysis."

Peters said he could not comment on Smith's statement that the broadcasters deferred because of the "negative" review of their plans by the FAA section that oversees landings and takeoffs.

While the broadcasters notified the FAA, they did not tell Bayonne officials of their decision.

"As far as we know, MTVA is still working with the FAA, FCC (Federal Communications Commission) and DEP (state Department of Environmental Protection) to try to get it done," said Joe Waks, a spokesman for Bayonne Mayor Joseph Doria Jr.

A tower in Bayonne would generate $5 million a year in rent for the city. Local officials had been willing to host the tower, which would have been the world's highest free-standing structure, on the former Military Ocean Terminal.

Bayonne had won an in-state competition with Jersey City, which had sought to build a tower adjacent to the Liberty Science Center. Broadcasters opted against a tower in Jersey City, in part because local officials had insisted it include an observation deck.

Fabb
May 26th, 2003, 08:38 AM
I can't believe it.
Why would the broadcasters oppose a structure that would include an observation deck ? Do they need secrecy ? Are they afraid of some kind of disruption ? Or do they believe an observation deck would be a target ?

NYguy
May 26th, 2003, 03:55 PM
Who knows what those people are thinking. *The WTC would include an observation deck and restaurants, not sure of the difference. *Maybe an excuse to kill the JC option? *As far as the FAA, I sense state politicians at work somewhere in the background.....

NYatKNIGHT
May 27th, 2003, 11:32 AM
That all sounds right. Also, I always got the feeling they didn't want an observation deck because they want to build the cheapest piece of crap they can get away with. The "security issues" were the excuse. Now we can only hope that it goes on the Freedom Tower so nothing so cheesy lines the shores of our spectacular harbor. And better yet, that might somehow beef up the tower.

Fabb
May 27th, 2003, 11:42 AM
and also provide the impetus to build fast.

NYguy
May 29th, 2003, 08:31 AM
(NY Times)

TV Stations to Put Antennas on New Ground Zero Tower
By DAVID W. DUNLAP

The 1,776-foot Freedom Tower planned at the World Trade Center site is meant to send a signal of resilience to the world. Now it will also be designed to send signals of another kind to households from the New Jersey Shore to the end of Long Island to Fairfield County, Conn.

Specifically, Channels 2, 4, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 31, 41, 47 and 68.

On Tuesday, the Metropolitan Television Alliance signed an agreement with Larry A. Silverstein, the leaseholder and developer at the trade center site, to install as many as 22 antennas atop Freedom Tower, to be completed in 2008.

Freedom Tower is being designed by Studio Daniel Libeskind. There would be roughly 70 occupied floors, reaching 900 feet, and the upper half of the structure would be more of an open latticework.

Some antennas could be mounted in the mast that Mr. Libeskind has already designed as the pinnacle of the tower, said Edward Grebow, president of the broadcasters' alliance. Others could be mounted within the latticework.

The new agreement would return New York broadcasters to the site they occupied before Sept. 11, 2001. It would also bring Mr. Silverstein a rent-paying tenant "That always helps," he said yesterday that needs space at altitudes where many office workers feel uncomfortable.

And, Mr. Grebow said, "It guarantees that Manhattan will dominate the skyline."

Until recently, the broadcasters had given serious consideration to constructing a 2,000-foot mast in Bayonne, N.J. Only two months ago, Mr. Grebow said the Bayonne mast would "dwarf the Libeskind tower at the trade center, which, believe us, is not what we want but where we are being forced to go."

In April, however, Mr. Grebow attended a luncheon at which Gov. George E. Pataki set out aggressive goals for redeveloping Lower Manhattan. "I came away thinking for the first time, `Yes, this is going to happen in a plausible time frame,' " he recalled.

Under this timetable, Mr. Pataki asked Mr. Silverstein to pledge that the cornerstone for Freedom Tower would be laid in August 2004. "I told him we'd do that," Mr. Silverstein said. The governor also asked that the steel be topped out on Sept. 11, 2006. "I said we'd endeavor to do that," Mr. Silverstein said.

There are many unknowns about the Freedom Tower project, including the exact design of the building and the cost. The broadcasters would "pay our way" in construction costs for the antennas, Mr. Grebow said, and would also pay rent to Mr. Silverstein, who was their landlord at the World Trade Center, where they paid about $9 million a year.

Since the attack, broadcasters have been using the Empire State Building as a stopgap to reach the 700,000 households in the metropolitan area that do not have cable. Their search for a new site has led them to consider Governors Island, Jersey City and Brooklyn.

The broadcasters' architects are Kohn Pedersen Fox Associates, which would advise them on the Freedom Tower installation, working with Mr. Libeskind and with Mr. Silverstein's architects, Skidmore, Owings & Merrill.

"One of our big challenges will be to make the antennas aesthetically pleasing," Mr. Grebow said. They range in height from several hundred feet to 30 or 40 feet, he said, and could be concealed within a shell of fiberglasslike material. Twenty-two antennas are needed to accommodate both analog and digital signals from each of the 11 stations, but some channels could be combined.

Members of the alliance are WCBS (Channel 2), WNBC (4), WNYW (5), WABC (7), WWOR (9), WPIX (11), WNET (13), WPXN (31), WXTV (41), WNJU (47) and WFUT (68).

"What better place for them to be than in New York," Mr. Silverstein said, "from whence they came and where they've always operated."

TAFisher123
May 29th, 2003, 09:31 AM
Freedom Tower is being designed by Studio Daniel Libeskind. There would be roughly 70 occupied floors, reaching 900 feet, and the upper half of the structure would be more of an open latticework.[/b]

900 feet? open lattice work? *hopefully they got these wrong

JMGarcia
May 29th, 2003, 09:41 AM
I figured the WTC site had the best chance of getting the broadcasters. I guess this also means we have the temporary tower to look forward to on Gov's Island? Funny how the article doesn't mention it.

As far as the office part of the tower goes the reporter has obviously gotten his information from Silverstein. Therefore the "open latticework" and "roughly 70 stories/900 feet" are just Silverstein spouting off for his preferred design by SOM. I wonder how they estimate at height when they don't even have an exact floor count. If its true though then a pox on Silverstein.


And, Mr. Grebow said, "It guarantees that Manhattan will dominate the skyline."

I wonder how upset Jersey is about that statement. ;)

I also prefer KPF to be involved over SOM. I'm also happy that they're concerned over the aesthetics and like the idea of imbedding the antennas within the structural height of the tower. ;)

NYguy
May 29th, 2003, 12:05 PM
Quote: from TAFisher123 on 8:31 am on May 29, 2003


Freedom Tower is being designed by Studio Daniel Libeskind. There would be roughly 70 occupied floors, reaching 900 feet, and the upper half of the structure would be more of an open latticework.[/b]

900 feet? open lattice work? *hopefully they got these wrong



Well, we already knew that the upper portion of the tower would be mostly open, and the 70-story tower would be in the 900 to 1000 ft range. *The exact height isn't given of course.

NYatKNIGHT
May 29th, 2003, 12:42 PM
I guess the Freedom Tower will have quite a different look in the next renderings. Good, this was the best option for everyone (except Bayonne).

Fabb
May 29th, 2003, 01:18 PM
Others could be mounted within the latticework

I would like to see that latticework.
It doesn't make much sense since that part will be much lower than the spire.

JMGarcia
May 29th, 2003, 02:56 PM
An additional article from the Daily News can be found here.

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/breaking_news/story/87778p-79984c.html

The only additional thing it says is...


The new tower that will be built at the site, designed by architect Daniel Libeskind, is scheduled to be completed in 2008. Its exact design and cost are still unknown.

It seems Libeskind is still doing the designing. I'll be very interested to see what it turns out to be. Any huge variation from the current renderings will get ripped to shreds by the press. That will also be true if it doesn't include the promised observatory, restaurants, and cafes. So I expect it to be somewhat similar.

JMGarcia
May 30th, 2003, 01:12 AM
TV Antenna To Top Freedom Tower
Newsday
By Katia Hetter
Staff Writer

May 29, 2003


The spire 1,776 high at Ground Zero will be topped with television antenna -- and the architect who designed it will spend six months revising his World Trade Center plans.

Architect Daniel Libeskind will refine the details of his "Memory Foundations" plan under a $3.3 million contract approved Thursday by the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey board. He will work on the memorial and cultural district, design guidelines for the buildings, the streets and open spaces, transportation infrastructure, according to the Port Authority.

Meanwhile, Trade Center leaseholder Larry Silverstein found a tenant for its the Freedom Tower: the 1,776-foot office tower in Libeskind's design for the World Trade Center site.

Silverstein Properties announced an agreement Thursday with an alliance of New York area television stations will construct a broadcast mast for television station antennas atop the tower, with work beginning next summer.

The tower originally was to have several "gardens in the sky" at its peak.

Although landscape architect George Hargreaves, who worked on Libeskind's initial proposal, said he ould like to include two smaller gardens in the tower, it's not clear if that will happen. Libeskind has not named a landscape architect for the next phase of development.

The television stations, which previously broadcast from the top of the World Trade Center's North Tower, have been using the Empire State Building's system. They had considered other sites in New Jersey and New York City.

Silverstein said construction could begin next summer, with broadcasters starting operations on the tower by 2008, according to a press release.

The agency, which added $4 million to its $10.5 million trade center planning budget, is splitting Libeskind's contract's costs and administration with the Lower Manhattan Development Corp.

"Its time and materials and profit and it will probably be of six month duration," said Joseph Seymour, the Port Authority's executive director.

Port Authority negotiations with the city over the city giving the agency the land beneath the two Queens airports in exchange for the city taking the trade center site stopped for two weeks during budget negotiations, Seymour said. He expects a decision within 60 days.

The two agencies extended their cooperation agreement to continue their work together at the site, which is owned by the Port Authority.

The Port Authority is negotiating a separate contract with Libeskind for transportation services, and the LMDC has its own contract with the architect for work on the memorial competition and infrastructure.

The television stations, which previously broadcast from the top of the World Trade Center's North Tower, have been using the Empire State Building's system. They had considered other sites in New Jersey and New York City.

Silverstein said construction could begin next summer, with broadcasters starting operations on the tower by 2008, according to a press release.

The broadcasters will contribute to the mast's construction costs and would lease space on the mast for their antennas and office space for equipment and support space.

Fabb
May 30th, 2003, 04:23 AM
Office space ? That's impossible. They must be crazy.

ZippyTheChimp
May 30th, 2003, 08:41 AM
So let's see, where will the broadcasters lease office space? Probably near the antenna. And if we consider the broadcast technicians office workers, then we can consider that office space occupied.

NYguy
May 30th, 2003, 08:45 AM
quote from a NY Post article..

A group of broadcasters agreed to put at least 22 TV antennas atop the 1,776-foot spire planned for the World Trade Center site.

Though separate, the antennas will appear as a single unit on the skyline.

NYguy
May 30th, 2003, 09:00 AM
And from a Star Ledger article, the only mention of gov's island...


Until this week, broadcasters had said the timetable of redevelopment at Ground Zero would take too long to accommodate the antenna, which needs to be working as soon as possible.

But Pat Smith, a spokesman for the MTVA, reversed course yesterday and said it is now feasible to wait five years. He said the broadcasters are discussing with city officials the possibility of erecting a temporary tower on Governor's Island at the tip of Lower Manhattan.

JMGarcia
May 30th, 2003, 09:50 AM
A group of broadcasters agreed to put at least 22 TV antennas atop the 1,776-foot spire planned for the World Trade Center site.

Though separate, the antennas will appear as a single unit on the skyline.

Good. I never liked the porcupine look. :)

Zzed
June 2nd, 2003, 06:40 AM
as the broadcaster's original proposal called for a 2000' antenna perhaps there's a chance that Freedom Tower will be heightened to match the requirements - now that would be really someTHING!

NoyokA
June 2nd, 2003, 03:47 PM
Its official, and the action of the news article that should've been posted here in the first place:

Bayonne loses out on giant TV tower
Broadcasters to wait for new Freedom Tower

Friday, May 30, 2003

By Ronald Leir
Journal staff writer

There'll be no giant television tower in Bayonne, and that means the city can kiss good-bye the $5 million a year in new revenues that officials hoped to get from the venture.

The Metropolitan Television Alliance (MTVA), the 11-member New York area broadcasters group looking to replace the tower lost in the attack on the World Trade Center, will be sticking to the same site when it comes to installing a new antenna.


The MTVA and Silverstein Properties, Inc., jointly announced yesterday that the alliance and Silverstein affiliates have concluded a memorandum of understanding to build a broadcast facility atop the Freedom Tower, a 1,776-foot office tower that Silverstein plans to build at the site where the World Trade Center stood.

Details of the agreement remain to be negotiated, except that the alliance's members would contribute to the cost of construction of the broadcast structural arm or "mast" -part of the upper portion of the building - and they would lease space on that mast for their antennas and space inside the building for equipment and support facilities.

The Freedom Tower would be the first office tower to be built on the World Trade Center property. Silverstein hopes to begin construction in summer 2004 and the alliance could expect to start using the antenna by 2008, according to the joint announcement.

"Considering that the TV antennas for many years had been located on the North Tower (of the WTC), it is fitting and appropriate that they come back to the World Trade Center at the pinnacle of the 1,776-foot Freedom Tower, higher than before, and redefine the skyline of New York," said Silverstein Properties President Larry A. Silverstein.

MTVA President Edward Grebow said: "We are pleased to be working with Larry Silverstein to guarantee broadcasters a new Lower Manhattan site for our critical broadcast tower. This tower is essential to restoring quality television service to the New York metropolitan area. We also expect that the tower will be used by New York area emergency services."

Bayonne and Jersey City had vied for the big tower when it was to be situated on the west side of the Hudson River, and in March the Bayonne Local Redevelopment Authority and MTVA had reached a tentative agreement to construct it at the southern tip of the Peninsula at Bayonne Harbor, the former Military Ocean Terminal.

At the time, Grebow said the alliance preferred to go with Bayonne because Jersey City had insisted on having an observation deck atop the tower and that, Grebow said, was something the security-conscious alliance wanted to avoid.

But several weeks ago, a branch of the Federal Aviation Administration - one of several regulatory agencies reviewing the proposal - red-flagged the proposed Bayonne tower, reportedly because of concerns about flight patterns in and out of area airports.

MTVA spokesman Pat Smith said yesterday that, "(Bayonne) Mayor Joseph Doria did an outstanding job in promoting the venture, he was a good partner, but the broadcasters had several things tugging at them - the objections by the FAA, the need to get up and running and the situation in Lower Manhattan and making a financial commitment to becoming the first tenant at the World Trade Center site."

Smith said the alliance's antennas atop the Empire State Building will remain there as a backup location, even after the Freedom Tower antennas are installed.

Doria had no comment yesterday, referring questions to the BLRA, whose executive director, Nancy Kist, released a prepared statement:

"We have worked closely with the MTVA to build the broadcast tower at the Peninsula at Bayonne Harbor. Unfortunately, the FAA has not acted on the MTVA's application to locate the tower in Bayonne in an expeditious manner, causing the consortium to look toward locating the antenna at the World Trade Center site, where it sat prior to the events of Sept. 11, 2001. We continue to believe that Bayonne would be an outstanding host for the tower, but we understand the MTVA's business decision."

NyC MaNiAc
June 2nd, 2003, 09:10 PM
There isn't a date or anything for the new Libeskind renderings are there? When do you think we should expect them?

JMGarcia
June 2nd, 2003, 11:04 PM
There was an article in Newsday a few days ago that reported Libeskind had just signed a 6 month contract to "refine the details" of his designs. So I'd guess that new renderings would be available in the fall.

Unfortunately, I think all the criticism he's been getting lately from some quarters will make it much less likely that anything "conceptual" or "in progress" will be released.

NYguy
June 3rd, 2003, 08:56 AM
Something had better be final before they put up the mural...

NyC MaNiAc
June 3rd, 2003, 09:17 AM
Yeah...I'm hearing too much about how they want to get the building up right away(which is great, I guess) But, I don't even know what the Tower's will look like!