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Kris
December 6th, 2003, 02:16 AM
December 7, 2003

In Rockaways, a Tide Is Coming In

By DENNIS HEVESI

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The initial 32 two-family homes have been built at Arverne by the Sea on part of the long-dormant 308-acre Arverne Urban Renewal Area.

YOU can't buy a kewpie doll or a Tuckee Cup on the boardwalk in the Rockaways any more. The arcades are long gone.

But Michael and Donna Mark bought a two-family house behind a white picket fence three blocks from the ocean on Beach 60th Street for $246,000 two years ago. And in September, the house, in the Arverne section, was reappraised at $310,000 — a 26 percent increase in value.

"We thought the price was good because we saw a lot of potential in the area," said Mr. Mark, 38, an investigator for the New York State Insurance Department. "Now, it's exciting to see all the development around us. And the newest homes are going for $400,000."

Things are looking up along the 11-mile sand spit on the south shore of Queens that used to be known as "the poor man's Riviera" — particularly at its midriff, where vast swaths of land once crammed with summer bungalows have lain desolate for decades, orphans of urban nonrenewal.

Howard Schwach has watched the tides turn.

A native son, Mr. Schwach, 64, is managing editor of the peninsula's 110-year-old weekly newspaper, The Wave. He waxes nostalgic about his adolescent adventures along the boardwalk. "We joke that you're an old-time Rockaway resident if you remember the Tuckee Cup," Mr. Schwach said, explaining that it was chow mein in a cup made of pressed noodles that cost $1.25 back in the 50's. "So you would eat the stuff out of it with a wooden fork they gave you, and then when you were finished you would eat the cup."

Back then, Mr. Schwach continued: "The boardwalk was lined with stores and penny arcades, two movie theaters. Sometimes in the summer you slept on the beach; there was no air-conditioning. And it was great to be a teenage boy because thousands of teenage girls would flock to the Rockaways; summer romances were the thing."

Then, in the early 60's — some say particularly because of the coming of the jet age and fast flights to tropical climes — the Rockaway economy took a turn toward the terrible. The city, in what one local official termed one of its "urban renewal binges," tore down thousands of bungalows, leaving wide tracts vacant or dotting them with low-income housing projects.

"For 35 years we've been sitting here waiting for something to happen," Mr. Schwach said, "and now it is."

Using the two-family home as a sort of standard model (with one unit potentially providing rental income), builders have speckled the peninsula with hundreds of new houses over the last five years — three or four scattered among tattered though tenacious bungalows on this street or that; five square blocks lined with three-story town houses; acres blanketed by a hundred semiattached homes here, two dozen detached there, nearer to the surf.

To be sure, there are those concerned that the seaside way of summer life is facing extinction, and that there is insufficient infrastructure — roads, sewers and schools — to support all the new development on the peninsula. Lots of new houses have certainly been built.

And they've sold.

In 1999, the Briarwood Organization took a chance by building 40 two-family homes between Beach 59th and 61st Streets for a project called Waters Edge — a sliver from the long-dormant, rubble-strewn, 308-acre Arverne Urban Renewal Area that dominates the Rockaways' central corridor.

Despite buying the city-owned land through the Department of Housing Preservation and Development at only $1,000 for each promised housing unit, and agreeing to pass along the land-cost savings to new homeowners, said Briarwood's president, Vincent Riso, "It took us awhile to convince people to purchase."

"We were the first new construction in Arverne in 30 years," Mr. Riso said. "But once we started our sales program, we found a number of lovely families who bought and are now our best salespeople. Our sales staff tells buyers, `Don't feel shy, just go down the street and ring doorbells.' "

All of the original 40 homes, except the demonstration model, are now occupied; sold at an average price of $228,000. And in the second phase of the project, 65 more two-family houses are to be built starting in February.

"We found Arverne to have a slow kindling point," Mr. Riso said. "But now that we've been there awhile, we have no concern that we won't sell out these 65 new homes quickly" — at about $400,000, with no subsidy.

The First Spark
Cookie-Cutter Homes at $170,000 Each

If Waters Edge was the kindling point for real renewal in Arverne on the ocean side of the Rockaways, then the spark for the entire peninsula may have been lit a decade ago in Sommerville — a stub of land poking toward the tiny islands and sand hassocks, splayed with straw-gold stretches of marsh grass, that dot Jamaica Bay to the north. That, at least, is the contention of Vincent Castellano, the housing chairman for Community Board 14.

"There are three blocks around 63rd Street that, to me, started the building boom in the Rockaways about 10 years ago," Mr. Castellano said. A fledgling developer, Malcolm Smith, built 60 homes on that long-vacant land.

"Everybody thought he was crazy," Mr. Castellano said. "The price at the time was $170,000 for these cookie-cutter homes. But they sold."

And while there was criticism of the project's look-alike architecture back then, just as the Levittown box soon blossomed with add-ons and build-ups, much of Sommerville has been customized over the years. "That was the beginning, the first time a private developer put his money on the barrel," Mr. Castellano said. "And that gave confidence to other developers." In 2000, Mr. Smith, the developer, was elected to the State Senate.

For nearly a century, Rockaways' Playland — with its water slide, Olympic-sized swimming pool and amusement-studded midway — drew thousands of fun seekers to its site between Beach 97th and 98th Streets, from Rockaway Beach Boulevard to the boardwalk. In 1938, a 300-foot-long, 70-foot-high wooden roller coaster — later dubbed the Atom Smasher — first plunged riders toward that faint line between thrill and terror.

By the late 80's, the Atom Smasher, along with the rest of Playland, squeezed by dwindling attendance and skyrocketing insurance costs, had been reduced to rubble — little but its foundation to lie forlorn for nearly a decade.

Now, beside and to the south of the elevated A-line train stop that still bears a Playland station sign, 110 two-family homes have been built and sold by Rockaway Shore L.L.C. And 30 more are under construction.

"Our first homes were priced around $250,000," said Jonathan Miller, a partner in the company, pointing out that several parcels outside of the Playland site have been incorporated into the development. "Today, three years later, they sell for around $450,000," without any subsidy.

"It's still affordable," Mr. Miller continued, "because these are two-families. So when the buyer takes into consideration today's interest rates and the rental income, the house becomes affordable."

The company is also building 92 two- and three-bedroom apartments in three-story buildings off the southeast corner of Cross Bay Parkway and Rockaway Beach Boulevard. Rents there will range from $1,300 to $1,500 a month, with tenants required to have incomes between $44,600 and $157,000.

Other developers and city officials had high-rise designs for the Playland property and the vast Arverne site during the fallow years. "They made a lot of promises to the residents of the Rockaways," Mr. Miller said, "but none were fulfilled."

These days, to a greater degree, commitments are being kept.

Improvements are tangible at the six public housing projects with 4,000 apartments that dot the eastern stretch of the peninsula. For years, local residents and officials have complained that the Rockaways have borne an unfair share of the city's homeless and low-income burden.

"The housing projects have become less of a sore point," said Jonathan Gaska, the district manager of Community Board 14. "Over the last five years, the housing authority and the police, in partnership with the tenants, have really changed things for the better as far as crime. They are doing more security in the buildings and on the grounds."

At the Arverne and Edgemere Houses, particularly, Mr. Gaska said, "The housing authority has spent a significant amount of money renovating all the apartments, thousands of units."

And in the Edgemere Urban Renewal Area, on the bay side of the A-train line from Beach 32nd to 54th Streets, 400 two-family houses are being built, part of the Department of Housing Preservation and Development's commitment to promote homeownership in less affluent neighborhoods. "This is in cooperation with the New York City Housing Partnership program for families with incomes as low as $35,000, and up to $75,000," Mr. Gaska said. "They're done with the first phase, 60 houses, in the $300,000 range."

The Rockaways may even become a bit artsy, one artist hopes.

For two and a half years, Richard Kostelanetz, 63, a media artist and writer who currently lives in Manhattan's SoHo district, has been building what he calls, with mordant humor, his "terminal residence" at Kohlrider Square in the Rockaways, a two-block-long park on the bay side of the elevated line at 67th Street.

"I'm building a 4,000-square-foot home and studio; pretty eccentric looking," he said, "cinder block, a few windows high up, skylights, tall ceilings."

Mr. Kostelanetz is the author of "SoHo: The Rise and Fall of an Artists' Colony" (2003, Routledge), an account of the effects of gentrification in that downtown Manhattan neighborhood. He is currently writing "The Fall and Rise of the Rockaways" (no publisher signed yet).

"I'm a New Yorker, so I can't leave New York," he said. "I'm also a beach boy; I wanted to be near the ocean." A lesser, but added, pleasure is the last long leg of the A line "over Jamaica Bay, the most beautiful subway ride in the city."

In the short time that Mr. Kostelanetz has been working on his Rockaway home, he said: "All the empty lots — and there were many of them in my neighborhood — were snapped up. There's six two-family buildings on my block that have gone up in the last two years."

An Array of Projects
From Mansions to Town Houses

From the east to the west ends of the peninsula, lots of lots have been snapped up. In Far Rockaway, near the Nassau County border, four-story, Spanish revival-style mansions have risen where suburban ranches once stood. "They've started to call it West Lawrence," said Mr. Castellano, the housing chairman for the community board — a covetous reference to one of Nassau's affluent Five Towns, just across the city line.

Nearby, in Bayswater and Edgemere, the Leewood Real Estate Group and the Housing Partnership are building Ocean Pointe, a development of 100 town houses for families with incomes ranging from $52,000 to $79,000. The homes will sell for between $275,000 and $289,000. But 79 are eligible for approximately $55,000 in land-cost and cash subsidies through H.P.D. and the New York State Affordable Housing Corporation, a subsidiary of the state Housing Finance Agency.

In Neponsit, one of the westernmost communities on the peninsula — within a harrier hawk's take-off flight path from the dunes at Gateway National Recreation Area — opulent new homes with bay windows and balconies yawning toward the ocean have nestled among their long-established neighbors.

Few, if any, Rockaway residents have a better feel for the place than Mr. Castellano, who lives in a house he built to replace the bungalow in Breezy Point, at the western end, that his aunt bought for $4,000 in the mid-50's. It is only 10 feet from an unconverted bungalow, in a row of similarly spaced residences on a narrow path to the beach.

"If you have a fight with your wife, the next morning all the neighbors vote," he said.

"When you look at it lengthwise," Mr. Castellano said of the entire peninsula, "there's a different neighborhood every 10 blocks. And it's only a slight exaggeration to say that they each have their own name, their own political club, civic association, agenda, income category and ethnic mix. And they are all very jealous of their little fiefdoms."

"If you want to make enemies quickly," he said, "go into one neighborhood and refer to it by the name of the next neighborhood. You can't go to Neponsit and refer to it as Belle Harbor — and no, there's no `u' in harbor, not yet anyway."

The community board, Mr. Castellano said, has "seen situations where, if one neighborhood is getting some kind of municipal improvement, the adjoining neighborhood will object unless they get something, too."

Yet, if there is anything that, perhaps, most Rockaway residents might agree upon — though there are some involved in long legal struggles to insure that not all the bungalows fall — it is that something hopeful is happening in the 308-acre Arverne wasteland.

For nearly four decades, grand plans were offered for the 52-block stretch from Beach 32nd to 84th Streets, between Rockaway Beach Boulevard and the boardwalk. They fell through.

In the late 80's, Forest City Ratner proposed construction of a phalanx of mid- and high-rise condominium and rental apartment buildings on the site. But, with the collapse of the real estate market in the early 90's, that plan went by the boards.

Then, in the late 90's, a division of the Reichmann family real estate conglomerate in Canada planned to build — for more than $1 billion — an enclosed amusement area on the Arverne site, to be called Destination Technodome, with rides, movie theaters, an indoor ski slope and a hotel.

But as Mr. Gaska, Community Board 14's district manager, pointed out, the developer and the community "needed a commitment from the city and the state for infrastructure work, anywhere from $250 million to almost $1 billion for sewers, roadways, another exit off the Belt Parkway." That commitment never came.

Arverne by the Sea
Two-Family Homes in the Wasteland

Now, far more than a commitment has been made for Arverne by the Sea — a multifaceted development already rising on the western 117 acres of the urban renewal area. Most of the initial 32 two-family homes — models for what is to come — have been built on a three-acre site between Beach 73rd and 74th Streets. Those homes, in clusters of up to six in a row, will range in price from $395,000 to $495,000.

On Nov. 19, the City Council gave final approval to the land-use plan for the rest of Arverne by the Sea. "We'll be building an additional 650 two-family homes and another 1,000 units in midrise buildings, five to 11 stories," said Peter Florey, executive vice president of the Benjamin Development Company, which, in partnership with the Beechwood Organization, is the city-designated developer for the site.

Most of the midrise buildings will be located along a residential/retail corridor running from the Beach 68th Street train station to the boardwalk. "It will be known as Ocean Way, one of the new streets," Mr. Florey said. "The buildings will be a combination of market-rate rentals and condos."

Beechwood-Benjamin bought the land from the city for $8.6 million. "We are paying for all infrastructure costs," Mr. Florey said, "including all roads, storm and sanitary sewers. And we are building a 30,000-square-foot community center and an 800-seat elementary school on about three acres at Beach 67th Street." He estimated the infrastructure costs at $80 million.

The Department of Housing Preservation and Development projects that by 2009, there will be 2,300 housing units at Arverne by the Sea, and a total of 4,000 for the entire urban renewal site; an Arverne Central Park (planned as a nature park and dune preserve) and up to 500,000 square feet of commercial and retail space on the eastern portion of the site.

Seeming resolutely proud of it all, Mr. Gaska, of the community board, said: "There are those who doubted this day would ever come. They said nothing would ever get built. We've proved them wrong."

http://graphics7.nytimes.com/images/2003/12/07/realestate/cov.184.2.enlarge.jpg
Ocean Avenue, a part of Breezy Point where no cars are allowed.

Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company


www.arvernebythesea.com

Gulcrapek
December 6th, 2003, 12:18 PM
Good news. I hope they're not all vinyl though.

Kris
February 12th, 2005, 10:56 PM
February 13, 2005

On the Beach, a Brand New Life

By JEFF VANDAM

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Angel and Marisol Guivas, with their son, Gabriel, are thrilled to be among the newest residents of Arverne-by-the-Sea.

http://graphics10.nytimes.com/images/dropcap/m.gifARISOL GUIVAS met her husband-to-be one day in 1998 through an instant message. She lived in the Bronx, he in Brooklyn, and she asked his name. It was Angel, he said, and like his future wife, he had a keen interest in the heavenly figures that were his namesake. One of their first dates was to see the Internet love story "You've Got Mail." They seemed destined for each other.

Marisol and Angel were married in 2000. They lived in the $32,000 one-bedroom co-op that Angel had bought as a bachelor in Sheepshead Bay. He had grown up there, the only Puerto Rican kid in a neighborhood of Italians, and now he and Marisol were starting their family there. Their son, Gabriel, was born in June 2002, and as he grew out of his crib and into his big-boy bed, the co-op began to feel too small.

They looked north, to new construction under way in Harlem, and east, to homes in Long Island. Then an item in the newspaper caught Marisol's eye. It mentioned a lottery for brand new seaside homes in a complex to be named Arverne-by-the-Sea, in Queens. It was a 20-block stretch in the distant Rockaways, the string-bean-shaped peninsula that juts into the ocean south of Kennedy Airport and Jamaica Bay. It was only 10 minutes from Angel's job at the post office in Howard Beach, and would become a vast development of homes, with stores, restaurants, a Y.M.C.A., a marina and a school. They signed up.

Last February, they got a call that they were in line for the very last house in the very first phase of Arverne-by-the-Sea, 32 homes labeled the Sands at Harbour Pointe. They went to the sales office and poked around the neighborhood, if it could have been called that. There were no food stores, save for a bodega. The subway station was a treacherous 15-minute trek away on the sidewalk-less Rockaway Freeway. Still, when two buyers in front of them bailed out, Marisol and Angel scraped together a 10 percent down payment on the $395,000 price. Their new address was on Arverne Mews, a street that did not yet exist.

The land where the Guivases were about to put down new roots had been nothing but sand, weeds and trash for 40 years. It was as though a real estate curse had befallen it. More wild dogs than people on the streets. More trash than shells on the beach. The end of New York, literally and figuratively. It had been fallow, empty, abandoned, its beachside bungalows razed in the 1960's to make way for decades of schemes that never materialized. It was part of the 308-acre Arverne Urban Renewal Area, left over long after the idea of flattening a dense patch of residential land was rejected as an urban planning concept. The biggest vacant lot in the city.

But Arverne-by-the-Sea was to change all that. The free sand buckets and shovels from the sales office depicted people on the beach waving in front of a brilliant sunset. The ambitious master plan was to build 117 acres of residential subdivisions with names like Ocean Breeze, the Tides and the Dunes. The grand total of market-rate homes to be built by 2007 was 2,300. Marisol and Angel were taking a grand gamble on a place where no previous project had come to fruition in nearly half a century.

Land of 1,000 Schemes

To stroll on the shores of Arverne these days is to experience loneliness. Among the bare parcels that were once filled with houses and people, there is very nearly nothing. The only buildings are a closed bait-and-tackle outlet and a health clinic. A small "Comfort Station" sits on the boardwalk just off Beach 73rd Street; a weathered sign above the boarded-up restrooms says they are "temporarily closed."

The emptiness invites routine illegal dumping, and in 2001, two joggers, including a 74-year-old man, were attacked on the boardwalk by wild dogs. The skyline is composed of the elevated tracks of the A train and the towers of nearby housing projects. Manhattan, occasionally visible in the distance from Beach Channel Drive, seems impossibly far away, sunken into the sea.

Arverne was not always devastated. In the early 20th century, it was a well-to-do resort community containing one of the nation's largest hotels, the Arverne. Aristocrats gamboled in the sea spray.

"It was a vacation area with bungalows and houses and concessions along the boardwalk," said Jonathan Gaska, district manager for Community Board 14. "It really mirrored what the old Coney Island was."

By the 1940's, Arverne had become a bustling neighborhood. Yet the prosperity that bolstered other parts of the country in the 50's did not seep into that part of the Rockaways. Stores, theaters and restaurants fled, and Arverne declined to the point where the city razed its crumbling homes and labeled it an "urban renewal area" in 1964. But nothing was ever renewed.

This is not to say people haven't tried. In the years before Angel and Marisol Guivas set foot in Arverne, developers and community leaders brought forth a cavalcade of ideas, some more preposterous than others. Few of them took into account the wishes of the surrounding community.

In the late 1980's, the developer Bruce Ratner proposed 10,000 units of residential housing in Arverne. Opponents knocked the number of units to 7,500. But then the New York real estate market imploded and Mr. Ratner's company pulled out.

A few years later, the Reichmanns, a Canadian family that built the Canary Wharf development in London, submitted a proposal to build upon the sands of Arverne a futuristic pleasure palace, Destination Technodome. It was to be staggering in scale and include an indoor ski slope. There would also be theaters, an Olympic-size pool, skating rinks, a hotel and new jobs projected in the thousands. But the costs the family asked the city and state to assume, as much as $1 billion, proved too much, and the project collapsed.

Highly frustrated, the community asked a team of consultants to sketch out a plan that would actually work. A proposal was submitted to the Giuliani administration in 2000 that included the community's desires: attractive housing, a school, a recreation center and a large amount of retail, specifically a major supermarket, chain stores and restaurants.

Along with several other builders, two Long Island developers, the Beechwood Organization and the Benjamin Companies, assembled a bid for the project. Shortly after a devastating plane crash in the Belle Harbor section of the Rockaways in November 2001 that killed 265 people, the Giuliani administration designated Benjamin-Beechwood as the winning team.

"Within a week or two of that plane crash, we got the call," said Les Lerner, a principal of the Beechwood Organization. "Perhaps they needed to show something positive happening in the Rockaways."

A Grand Gamble

It was perhaps a cruel twist that Angel and Marisol Guivas had redone their kitchen in Sheepshead Bay before getting the call about the house in Arverne. They had put in new cabinets and appliances and bought a big new refrigerator, but in just a few weeks, they would have to shuffle their belongings across the Gil Hodges Memorial Bridge and onto the Rockaway peninsula.

It was a pleasant evening in November 2004, and furniture, clothing, empty juice boxes, catalogs and Gabriel's toys were scattered about in a pre-move jumble. An enormous sense of expectation permeated the household. "I'm psyched! You know what I'm saying?" said Angel, 35, his strong voice booming and his cropped black hair not moving an inch. Enthusiastic as ever, he clapped his hands together, loud. "I want to get to work, guys!"

Marisol, a petite, dark-haired 33-year-old with warmth and energy to spare, laughed. "It's very 'beach house,' " she said about their new home, her face glowing. She was pregnant with another baby, due in March. If the Guivases had not won their lottery spot in Phase 1A of Arverne, they probably would have had to begin raising the baby in a place that was not even big enough for the three of them.

To give Gabriel his own space in their Sheepshead Bay home, they had put his bed in a narrow room just off the main entrance that resembled a walk-in closet. Angel painted the ceiling sky blue and added white cloud puffs. But they knew their 2-year-old needed more space to run around.

Angel and Marisol, who can't seem to stop talking effusively about their new home, have never had serious doubts about choosing Arverne. But their final confirmation came from an entrepreneur with slightly more experience. They attended a real estate expo at the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center last fall, and one of the events was a question-and-answer session with Donald Trump.

"What happened was a girl told him, 'I'm about to go under contract with Arverne-by-the-Sea,' " Marisol said. "And Trump was like, 'Arverne? Can I have your contract?' "

"We high-fived," Angel said. "It was great! We were so happy. Another person said, 'I have $20,000 in equity, what can I do with that money?' And Trump said, 'Arverne.' That's exactly how we took Arverne, as an opportunity."

Less than a year after Angel and Marisol bought the house on Arverne Mews for $395,000, similar units in the newer phases of the development are selling at prices starting at close to $500,000. In the next section to be completed, 80 percent of the 121 houses have already been sold. In the section after that, the waiting list is 500 families long. People like the Guivases, who bought one of the first houses in the first development, sowed the seed.

"Pioneers is a good word," said Mr. Lerner of the Beechwood Organization. "At the time they committed to buy these houses, all that was going on in Arverne was these 32 houses. Now they really see that the dream they gambled on has come to fruition."

Yet in the surrounding community, there is still very little in terms of amenities. The only store for more than 10 blocks is a bodega on Rockaway Beach Boulevard, which shares space in a tiny strip mall with the Dragon Garden Chinese takeout and an empty storefront that was formerly home to "Forbidden Tattoos."

Transportation is another issue. The nearest subway station is the Beach 67th Street stop on the A train, and getting there requires traipsing through wide puddles along the Rockaway Freeway, an unlighted street with fast-moving traffic. The ride into Manhattan, which takes commuters across Queens and Brooklyn, usually exceeds an hour.

"It's really an hour and ten or an hour and twenty," said Mr. Gaska of Community Board 14. But when more people move to Arverne, he said, the community will lobby the Metropolitan Transportation Authority for express trains to Manhattan. "They don't have to build new tracks; they don't have to do anything," he said.

As for groceries, Mr. Lerner said he and his partners were on the cusp of announcing a deal with a "major brand-name supermarket" to install a store in Arverne-by-the-Sea. But for the time being, residents like the Guivases shuttle over to Brooklyn or out to Long Island for their basic needs.

Bright House, Big Future

Upon his first entry to the house on Arverne Mews, the Guivases' son announced that it was "Gabriel's house."

"Ooooh, beautiful," he told his parents. They were not aware he knew what that word meant, but they accepted his assessment. He now rides his Li'l Rascal tricycle around in the empty living room, his Lion King sneakers lighting up the carpet.

The new house is two stories of gleaming white and gray siding with a white picket fence. There is a backyard with enough room to barbecue and listen to the waves. There is a one-bedroom rental unit on the second floor that already has a tenant.

In the living room of their part of the house, Angel is painting the walls in shades of green like "Celery Ice" that get progressively darker as they approach the back window, which lets in glowing bright ocean light. There is no direct view of the water, but the beach is right around the corner.

"It's like a Florida in New York," Marisol said from the kitchen, where another new fridge waited to be installed.

"No, no," Angel corrected her, "it's California in New York. That's the way I see it. You see guys in wetsuits out there," he said, pointing to the ocean, which attracts its own legion of surfers.

Until all the furniture arrives, Angel, Marisol and Gabriel are staying in the first-floor bedroom, where they have installed an enormous inflatable mattress. The garage is full of boxes and shopping bags from Ikea, and the kitchen counter is scattered with papers and brochures advertising the model for their unit, "The Brittania."

Neighbors have already stopped by. Back in Sheepshead Bay, Angel said, "half the people, they don't really want to talk to you." But in Arverne-by-the-Sea, he said, "People are like, 'Heyyyy! How you doin'?' "

"We all got here almost in the same week," Marisol added of her neighbors. "We're building relationships together."

To Angel and Marisol, there is no end to what Arverne-by-the-Sea will bring. They have talked about investing in other properties in the area, or maybe even opening a franchise like Starbucks. ("Iced coffee at the beach!" Marisol said.) Outside, Angel pointed at the wide expanse of dirt that will become his new community, the expanse where so many others have seen defeat.

"You see that lot right there?" he asked. "That's prime real estate. That's untouched. That's empty. This is what I see that a lot of people don't see. You just have to have the courage to jump in. It's unbelievable. It's gonna be great!"

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Copyright 2005 (http://www.nytimes.com/ref/membercenter/help/copyright.html) The New York Times Company (http://www.nytco.com/)

alex ballard
February 13th, 2005, 07:02 PM
Is most of this lower-income housing? It would be excellent if the Rockaways we're to become a middle-class haven for people. Heck, it could even rival Long Island!

Derek2k3
May 8th, 2005, 11:29 PM
The Reef Condominium II
New 7 story condomium at Arverne.

http://www.pbase.com/archit_kderek2k3/image/43138789/large.jpg

Also check out new pictures of the Arverne development.
http://www.arvernebythesea.com/

TLOZ Link5
May 9th, 2005, 06:01 PM
Is anyone else reminded of Seaside, in Florida? This whole development is very New Urbanism.

NewYorkYankee
May 9th, 2005, 06:58 PM
Why are theey building all this for lower income? It should be mixed.

ZippyTheChimp
May 9th, 2005, 07:37 PM
Didn't you read the articles?

If you consider all of Rockaway, it is very mixed income. Move west toward Neponsit, and the homes become very expensive.

alex ballard
May 9th, 2005, 08:20 PM
Anyone else find it ironic that the closer you get to Brooklyn, the nicer the neighborhoods become, and the closer to Long Island, the crappier? In most urban cities in the US, it's the exact opposite...

ZippyTheChimp
May 9th, 2005, 08:41 PM
Bayside.

Malba.

NewYorkYankee
May 9th, 2005, 09:56 PM
Didn't you read the articles?

If you consider all of Rockaway, it is very mixed income. Move west toward Neponsit, and the homes become very expensive.

Your right, I apologize. Next time I will read the articles in full (Instead of skimming) before posting.

NewYorkYankee
May 9th, 2005, 09:59 PM
Do residents of outter borough neighborhood with generally 1 or 2 subway lines have cars? In Manhattan not owning a car is easy with the multitude of subway acess. But, In say the Rockaways there is just one. This isnt just about the Rockaways, neigborhoods like Canarsie, Flushing, Bay Ridge etc.

alex ballard
May 9th, 2005, 10:08 PM
Bayside.

Malba.

I was referring to the Rockaways.

ZippyTheChimp
May 9th, 2005, 10:51 PM
Rockaway is a penninsula connected to the mainland at the eastern end. Western Rockaway (and Breezy Point) were completely isolated from Brooklyn before the Marine Parkway Bridge was built. The A train serves the eastern part of Rockaway. The western end had an army base and a naval air station that became Riis Park. The land on the western side is also "newer." Until the jetty was built to stop sand migration, Rockaway added real estate every year. 100 years ago, the point was where the bridge is today.

So no, it's not ironic. Development moved westward.

sfenn1117
May 10th, 2005, 04:32 PM
Do residents of outter borough neighborhood with generally 1 or 2 subway lines have cars? In Manhattan not owning a car is easy with the multitude of subway acess. But, In say the Rockaways there is just one. This isnt just about the Rockaways, neigborhoods like Canarsie, Flushing, Bay Ridge etc.

I live in Bay Ridge, there is no car in my household (though we do have a garage), one subway line serves fine. Every subway line goes into Manhattan, subways aren't meant for cross-borough travel. Going from Queens to Brooklyn on the subway must be aggravating. I use the bus more than anything, the express bus to Manhattan, buses to Staten Island, Coney Island, Brighton/Manhattan Beach, Kings Plaza, etc. We're well served by mass transit.

I would estimate 1/2 of the population here has cars. Most of the houses have garages, but there are many apartment buildings that do not have parking spaces. In far-out areas like SI, Throgs Neck/Little Neck/Rosedale where this is no subway and limited bus service, I think mose residents have cars.

ZippyTheChimp
May 12th, 2005, 09:59 PM
Arverne-by-the-Sea

1. Shore Front Parkway and Beach 73rd St
2. Mews
3. More development on Rockaway Beach Blvd
4. 1/2 mile tract to the east ready for development
5. One wrinkle - JFK glide path, but planes are still up high.
6. It's by the sea.
7. Apt buildings to the west.

czsz
May 12th, 2005, 10:20 PM
The design is tacky and uninspired, like a golf course community in North Carolina or Florida. Still, it's a decent, humanist alternative to the grim tower-blocks otherwise marring a decent beachfront.

sfenn1117
May 13th, 2005, 04:54 PM
I agree with the "golf course community" but it's better than a vast empty lot that stood vacant for 40+ years, and it's better than those grim high-rises. So I'll take it, it's good for the neighborhood, I don't think they look bad. Just not urban, thats all.

billyblancoNYC
May 14th, 2005, 12:17 AM
Anyone else find it ironic that the closer you get to Brooklyn, the nicer the neighborhoods become, and the closer to Long Island, the crappier? In most urban cities in the US, it's the exact opposite...

????

Depends what you mean by nice. The areas in NE Queens are quite nice, though more suburban. There are some VERY nice areas and the whole section is quite pricey these days.

You must mean SE Queens, perhaps?

antinimby
June 22nd, 2006, 08:25 PM
THIS SAND IS MY SAND


THOUSANDS OF NEW BEACH PADS MAKE A SPLASH IN ROCKAWAY PARK


http://www.nypost.com/photos/re06222006055.jpg
LET IT TIDE: Ocean Grande still has two-bedrooms for sale.


By JASON SHEFTELL

June 22, 2006 (http://www.nypost.com/realestate/this_sand_is_my_sand_realestate_jason_sheftell.htm ) -- SURFERS hanging ten, a banging skateboard park with half pipes, tankers lining the horizon, 6 miles of boardwalk, bikinis and wild-eyed sun-bleached characters. Welcome to Rockaway Park, Queens. This water world is just an hour from Midtown on the A train. And if you want to live here, well, it seems like almost everything's for sale.

Wherever you look in Rockaway Park, you'll see "For Sale" signs. There are quaint beach bungalows for $150,000 and three-bedroom Victorians with wraparound porches for half a million dollars. There are also thousands of new condos attracting buyers looking for affordable property (and great tax breaks) on the beach.

With a slew of luxury beachfront condo projects ready for move-in within three months - including the latest phase of a 2,300-unit development on 117 acres - Rockaway Park is definitely riding the real-estate wave.

"The past three years were undoubtedly the best years I've experienced in this business," says area real-estate broker D. Brian Heffernan.

And, residents say, the beaches are clearly the area's best perk.

"I watch the sun come up over the ocean every morning," says Elizabeth Gardner, a Department of Transportation worker who owns a four-bedroom, two-family duplex with her boyfriend, Connie Cronin, on Beach 97th Street and Shorefront Parkway. "It's so quiet at night, you can hear the water - and the beaches are so big it's like you have them to yourself."

Rich in history, Rockaway Park, with water on all four sides, is located between the Atlantic Ocean and Jamaica Bay. A popular beach resort in the late 1800s, the area hit severe lows in the 1960s to 1980s. It was considered a dangerous slum with dingy public housing and even worse public services.

Although nearby mental-health facilities remain, and petty crimes like vandalism are still common police-blotter mentions, things are turning around. Violent crime is down 76 percent in the last 15 years. The beaches are cleaned every morning by city maintenance crews. There's a designated surfing section, the boardwalk, children's playgrounds, basketball courts and the National Gateway Recreation Area, a pristine national park known for bird-watching.

Another selling point of Rockaway Park is the low taxes. Thanks to 421a tax abatements given by the city to new-construction projects, residents often pay just $100 a year in taxes for eight to 15 years.

Michael Kerris, whose Frameworks Group built Belle Shores - a 78-unit, three-story luxury condo with beach views on 101st Street and Shorefront Parkway - sold 20 percent of his new development's 78 units in just two weeks. The two- and three-bedroom condos run from $439,000 to $989,900 for 972 square feet to 1,700 square feet.

Frameworks also has gobbled up more property on Shorefront Parkway along the beach at 94th Street, and plans to build a seven-story "Manhattan-style" condo development named the Landmark.

Three-bedroom penthouses will hit the million-dollar mark.

"These will be the most luxurious homes yet in the Rockaways," Kerris says.

The developers and residents at the new Ocean Grande condominiums at the top of Rockaway Park's main shopping drag on Beach 116th Street and the boardwalk might disagree with that "most luxurious" claim. The eight-story, 92-unit Ocean Grande development comes with an oceanfront club room, business center, gym and roof deck with views up and down the coastline.

"It was very emotional when we walked in here and saw our unit almost finished," says television and film producer Josh Kane, who, with his wife, Jane, bought into Ocean Grande when it was just a construction site. The couple purchased a sixth-floor two-bedroom with a terrace and ocean views.

"I don't want to sound corny, but I can't wait to fall asleep with the windows open and those ocean breezes coming in," Kane says.
Ocean Grande is 80 percent sold. Two-bedrooms with ocean views are available for $535,000.

The biggest development in the area is Arverne by the Sea, a 2,300-unit urban-renewal development being built in phases on what was previously an abandoned 321 acres of beachfront located next to a public housing project. Sales of the three-bedroom, two-family duplexes (owners can rent out one of the units), between $400,000 and $600,000 have not been hurt by the lack of stores and services in the immediate area. All 121 units of Palmer's Landing and the Sands are sold out. Units at the Breakers, a waterfront phase of 131 units, are now being sold.

"A major part of the plan is to bring in new schools, a recreational center," says Arverne by the Sea project executive Gerry Romski. "And we're close to signing a major retailer and beginning to build a major shopping center."

Derek Lindell, his wife, two teenage daughters and 22-year-old son downsized from their Sea Cliff, L.I., home with a pool to live near the beach at Arverne by the Sea.

"The price for a two-family home, the taxes, the fact I don't have to do the lawn all were big factors," Lindell says.

Adds his wife, Janet: "It's a new community where everyone is excited and friendly."

AREA: Rockaway Park, Queens

NEW BUILDINGS: Developments include Belle Shores, Ocean Grande and Arverne by the Sea

Copyright 2006 NYP Holdings, Inc.

submachine
June 25th, 2006, 01:34 PM
By JASON SHEFTELL

Although nearby mental-health facilities remain, and petty crimes like vandalism are still common police-blotter mentions, things are turning around. Violent crime is down 76 percent in the last 15 years.


lol, thats a joke.

Violent crime is down all over the city, and Far Rockaway has one of the highest crime rates of all, its a vile area with broken down public housing projects. And no, there are no good schools. These developments are selling at the slowest pace of any in all of NYC for these reasons. Flip the projects into coops and MAYBE 5 years later down the road you will have the START of a nice area.

BrooklynRider
June 26th, 2006, 11:21 AM
I think you are wrong - completely wrong. The developments look quite nice and the developers seem to have a good masterplan. The phasing is working nicely and the development of these tracts assures further redevelopment of existing areas. This is being rebuilt into a proper urban beachfront community. Pricing is very competitive and I think this is going to appeal to folks who enjoy heading to Long Island or the Jersey Shore on weekends, but who do so because they are beach lovers not wannabe hipsters.

ASchwarz
June 26th, 2006, 06:47 PM
lol, thats a joke.

Violent crime is down all over the city, and Far Rockaway has one of the highest crime rates of all, its a vile area with broken down public housing projects. And no, there are no good schools. These developments are selling at the slowest pace of any in all of NYC for these reasons. Flip the projects into coops and MAYBE 5 years later down the road you will have the START of a nice area.

Rockaway Park and Arverne are compeltely different neighborhoods than Far Rockaway. I think you are confusing neighborhoods.

As for Far Rockaway, I wonder if most bashers have even been to the nabe. Half the neighborhood isn't very nice but the other half is beautiful and very expensive. The fancy half is a leafy Orthodox Jewish neighborhood.

BrooklynRider
June 27th, 2006, 10:58 AM
I may be wrong, but I semse that some of the attitudes toward the Rockaways being posted are akin to those strange perceptions we get from midwest folks who still think it is 1977 in Manhattan.

Rockaway is changing and it is prime beachfront realty with relatively good transportation. The area had a decline, but the decline was complete - down to the ground. So we are talking about the development of vast tracts of land from Rockaway Park to Far Rockaway. There is no downside to this development. It has a wonderful design, ideally suited for beachfrontr living. It has an urban density. It is bright and green and seems to be good construction. I been through the area fairly regularly and it is transformative. Now, they need to address the crumbling subway el.

Kris
July 8th, 2006, 04:27 AM
July 9, 2006
Posting
Luxe Invades Rockaway Park
By JEFF VANDAM

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/09/realestate/09post2.jpg
Oceanfront views and granite countertops can be yours, appropriately priced.

ON the site of what was once a beachfront hotel called Curly's and then, for decades, a vacant lot in the neighborhood of Rockaway Park, there is now the Ocean Grande, an eight-story luxury condominium building set to open to residents in a few weeks.

The building, at the corner of Beach 117th Street and the Rockaway Boardwalk, is an eye-opener, in both pricing and appearance. It has $1 million units, and it dwarfs Rockaway's typical real estate — the relatively small two- and three-family houses that first sprouted here, cheek by jowl, in the early 1900's, so working-class immigrant families could take advantage of the oceanfront.

"Ten years ago, we were very desperate to get development," said Jonathan Gaska, district manager of the Rockaways' Community Board 14. The neighborhood still has a few S.R.O. hotels, according to Mr. Gaska. But the ambience clearly doesn't matter to developers all that much when there is waterfront living space to be created.

"No one was interested here," he said. "Now everyone is."

One of those interested parties is Steven Krieger, a principal at the Engel Burman Group, which is developing Ocean Grande with the Cedar Summit Property Group. "The reason we ended up doing this development is that we found a property on the Atlantic Ocean," Mr. Krieger said. "The ocean is magnificent."

Inside the Ocean Grande's apartments, which range from studios to three-bedroom penthouses, the developers have installed appliances and amenities that might seem at home in a new condo tower in Manhattan or Dumbo, Brooklyn: Bosch washers and dryers, General Electric Profile stainless steel appliances and granite countertops. Many apartments have balcony views of Manhattan, Jamaica Bay, the ocean or in some cases all three.

After a year of sales, more than 80 percent of the units have been sold; the first buyers will move in next month.

"The way they are selling here is that oceanfront new construction at these prices is very hard to find," said Grant Held, director of sales at the building. Prices for remaining units range from $420,000, for a two-bedroom facing Jamaica Bay and Manhattan, to $1.035 million, for a two-bedroom penthouse.

On the main floor, there is a large fitness center with a flat-panel television on each exercise bike and treadmill; across the hall, a bistro and a library with plush couches and a fireplace offer beach and ocean views. A business center is outfitted with computers and printers, and residents will have locker rooms and a private entrance to the boardwalk, which abuts the building's property. Indoor parking spots are available for purchase for $30,000.

Thus far, Mr. Held said, people buying units in the building have ranged from twentysomethings to seventysomethings, coming from both New York City and Long Island.

The area nearby, including Rockaway Park's commercial strip on Beach 116th Street, is still developing, with a subway shuttle to the A train and a long ride to Manhattan a few blocks from the building. Yet sales continue to be brisk, he said, with new buyers entranced most of all by the thought of the ocean directly in their backyards.

Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company

lofter1
August 11th, 2006, 08:56 PM
A Man’s Beach Bungalow Is His Castle,
Under Siege by Developers

http://graphics10.nytimes.com/images/2006/08/11/nyregion/600_Bungalow1.jpg
Chester Higgins Jr./The New York Times
Richard George of the Beachside Bungalow Preservation Association of Far Rockaway
at his home on Beach 24th Street.



“If money was my motivation, I’d want the project built because it would increase my property value . . . I’m not antidevelopment; only when it discriminates against everyone else living around it.”
NY TIMES (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/11/nyregion/11bungalow.html?_r=1&oref=slogin)
Queens Journal
By COREY KILGANNON
August 11, 2006

Richard George lives in a charming little beach bungalow just off the ocean on the eastern end of the Rockaway Peninsula in Queens.

Like the homes of his neighbors, his small, three-bedroom shack is cooled by the salty breeze and surrounded by wildflowers and the sandy walkways leading to other lovely old wooden homes that form a beach colony, parts of which look more like Fire Island than New York City.

Mr. George’s home on Beach 24th Street has cotton bedspreads, quaint tablecloths and kitschy artwork. But don’t be fooled by the surroundings: it’s really a war bunker from which he defends his ever-shrinking seaside neighborhood.

At the table in his galley-size kitchen, he assembles legal briefs used to sue developers and city agencies to ward off efforts to demolish the bungalows for newer, bigger housing.

Back when the Rockaways was still a popular ocean resort for New Yorkers, these bungalows were abundant, with many built in the 1920’s. Groucho Marx is said to have invested in 24 of them. Now the largest remaining patch of the historic shacks are the roughly 120 that line three city blocks leading to the dunes in Far Rockaway.

With each passing year, more of the bungalows along Beach 24th, 25th and 26th Streets between Seagirt Boulevard and the boardwalk are demolished by developers building new housing. So far, Mr. George has not been able to get the city to declare the bungalows, many of which are abandoned, landmarks.

So he fights local development by filing lawsuits claiming that the projects violate federal coastal regulations by illegally diminishing public access to the waterfront.

He is in court against a 130-unit condominium project being built between Beach 25th and Beach 26th Streets. Mr. George is arguing in State Supreme Court in Queens that the bigger project blocks an easement to the beach written into the bungalows’ deeds and titles.

State conservation officials ordered work stopped at that project, citing a lack of proper permits. Now the site, which has been idle for several months, looks as if the crew just went on a coffee break, with tools and brick piles strewn about and the iron framework gathering rust.

“These developers knew when they bought the property that their project was in violation,” said Mr. George, who bought his bungalow in 1982. He now owns a handful of other bungalows, which he rents out, and heads the Beachside Bungalow Preservation Association of Far Rockaway.

Gary Rosen, a lawyer for the project, Metroplex on the Atlantic, said the legal easements to the ocean expired in 1930. He said that he was certain he would defeat Mr. George in court but that the delays alone might ruin the project.

“My client has a $14 million loan out on this, and it is costing him $3,000 each day the project is delayed,” Mr. Rosen said. “This could bankrupt the project. He’s already cost my client more money than those bungalows are worth.”

Even when ultimately unsuccessful, Mr. George’s lawsuits have often managed to frustrate and delay developers until costly delays and legal fees have forced them to abandon their projects.

The most powerful weapon in his arsenal is an obscure regulation known as the Coastal Zone Management Act of 1972, enacted by Congress to help local governments preserve access to waterways. Mr. George claims that the city and state mainly ignore the regulations despite receiving federal funds to enforce them.

“The right to have waterway access maintained is protected by the U.S. Constitution and goes back to ancient Rome,” he said recently, sitting in his bungalow and surrounded by piles of documents that he says support his case. “It costs taxpayers millions of dollars a year to enforce this program, which benefits all city residents, and no one enforces it. They’re handing the waterfront over to developers and it’s breaking federal law, basically because nobody knows or seems to care about this law.”

He is suing the city in federal court, claiming it violated federal access laws in approving the huge Arverne by the Sea project, which will create thousands of units over 117 acres. Mr. George says the project will eliminate 46 streets that lead to the ocean.

The suit is one of at least seven Mr. George currently has against the city, said Gabriel Taussig, a city lawyer. Although judges may issue temporary stop-work orders against developers, Mr. Taussig said that in the end, the judges consistently reject Mr. George’s claims.

Federal and state officials say the federal coastal act offers a general guideline for projects, which are evaluated case by case. City Planning Department officials say waterfront development projects are stringently reviewed to ensure that access is preserved.

Mr. George sat in his kitchen showing old wills and deeds from landowners in the 1800’s stipulating that an easement to the ocean must be maintained. He thumbed through a heavily annotated, underlined, highlighted and Post-it adorned copy of the federal act, with his own bookmarks and footnotes. He flipped to Section 306, Part 1455, which encourages “public participation in the permitting process,” in order to “ensure compliance by government.”

Mr. Rosen accused Mr. George of protecting the bungalows simply to preserve his income as a landlord.

“He buys these bungalows for dirt cheap, and he’s lining his pockets by running the biggest scam,” he said. “Here you have developers bringing millions of dollars into the neighborhood, and he’s killing their projects and making them want to walk away.”

He said he was suing Mr. George for “malicious prosecution of my client.”
“I’ll take all the bungalows if I win,” he said. “Most of them are garbage anyway. They’re shacks.”

Mr. George dismissed Mr. Rosen’s claims.

“If money was my motivation, I’d want the project built because it would increase my property value,” he said. “I’m not antidevelopment; only when it discriminates against everyone else living around it.”

Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company

lofter1
August 11th, 2006, 10:43 PM
Beachside Bungalow Preservation Association of Far Rockaway, Inc. (http://www.preserve.org/bungalow/)

http://www.preserve.org/bungalow/logo.gif

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.preserve.org/bungalow/exterior4.jpg
Stucco Bungalow with plants
Beach 24th Street

http://www.preserve.org/bungalow/exterior1.jpg
Brick facade bungalow built 1921 -
Beach 25th Street

http://www.preserve.org/bungalow/exterior2.jpg
Renovated bungalow with porch lathing
Beach 25th Street

BrooklynRider
August 14th, 2006, 11:53 AM
It really should be deemed an Historic District.

Kris
November 10th, 2006, 12:44 AM
November 10, 2006
Queens: Development in the Rockaways
By DIANE CARDWELL

Moving to revitalize a long-neglected swath of the Rockaways, Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg broke ground yesterday on a 30,000-square-foot Y.M.C.A. center at Arverne by the Sea, part of a sprawling mixed-use community under construction in Arverne. The development project, in a 308-acre urban renewal area designated in 1964, is slated for completion over the next decade and is expected to bring thousands of middle-income residents, a Super Stop & Shop, a new elementary school and other amenities to the area. Mr. Bloomberg also designated the Bluestone Organization, L & M Equity and Triangle Equities as the development team for the Arverne East part of the project.

Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company

submachine
December 24th, 2006, 10:14 PM
I think you are wrong - completely wrong..

Six months since my last post here, and all evidence (before and) since then proves I am right - completely right.

Dead-slow sales in Arverne + crime rate (esp. murders) skyrocketing in NYPD Precincts 100 and 101.

And unless all the housing projects are flipped into co-ops, nothing will ever change.

ZippyTheChimp
December 24th, 2006, 11:07 PM
Rockaway Park and Arverne are compeltely different neighborhoods than Far Rockaway. I think you are confusing neighborhoods.


Six months since my last post here, and all evidence (before and) since then proves I am right - completely right.

Dead-slow sales in Arverne + crime rate (esp. murders) skyrocketing in NYPD Precincts 100 and 101.

And unless all the housing projects are flipped into co-ops, nothing will ever change.

You are again confusing the neighborhoods.

Arverne is in the 100 precinct, not the 101.

Crime statistics 100 Precinct (http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/pdf/chfdept/cs100pct.pdf)

2005 murders - 2
2006 murders - 1

BrooklynRider
December 27th, 2006, 01:13 PM
Six months since my last post here, and all evidence (before and) since then proves I am right - completely right.

Dead-slow sales in Arverne + crime rate (esp. murders) skyrocketing in NYPD Precincts 100 and 101.

And unless all the housing projects are flipped into co-ops, nothing will ever change.

When EXACTLY were you last there to make this assessment? I was through the entire Rockaway Peninsula twice this past weekend and the place is a boomtown. Arverne-By-The-Sea is a phenomenal success and all the people you claim aren't living there had the places decked out in Christmas lights and garland. The newer phases have no residents, but it looked more a matter of construction punchlist and ready for closings. Nautilus has a new tower development going up and the entire island thru-traffic route has been majorly altered due to the immensity of construction.

South of the el is developing as a strong (and very attractive) middle and upper-middle class zone. North of the el has an equal amount of new development and construction - some rather nice - others are horrid cheap crap. But, your assessment of the situation defies the truth that anyone can see simply by driving through.

They have already broken gound on the next phase, which is phase three or four (I'm pretty sure it is four). A site is cleared for the development of the Rockaways first major shopping/retail destination in well over 25 years with anchor tenants already signed.

caonima
December 27th, 2006, 03:57 PM
the biggest problem of rockaway is public transportation unless there is a non-stop express train to manhattan. but this will never exist

BrooklynRider
December 28th, 2006, 10:01 AM
That would definitely help, but the Rockaways has traditionally attracted many civil servants (NYPD, NYFD) who generally drive to work. All Rockaway residents can always head to Far Rockaway for the LIRR, which is at least a more comfortable ride.

submachine
January 2nd, 2007, 09:45 AM
When EXACTLY were you last there to make this assessment? I was through the entire Rockaway Peninsula twice this past weekend and the place is a boomtown. Arverne-By-The-Sea is a phenomenal success and all the people you claim aren't living there had the places decked out in Christmas lights and garland.

If you stand in the center of Arverne surrounded by the new condos, it may look "pretty". I was on a penthouse roof looking onto the ocean, it was spectacular.

But drive less than a minute away and you are in the projects, the WORST projects of Queens, maybe of the entire city.

Where are the kids in Arverne going to school? Nowhere. Where are they going to play? Nowhere. Where are the moms going to shop? Nowhere. It's a jewel surrounded by a dump in the middle of nowhere, and it is not changing. I know cops in the 101 precinct, and I know the entire area is a nightmare of drugs, crime, and grime.


September 14, 2006 – A crew tied to the Crips street gang made $1 million a year from trafficking narcotics in a cluster of public housing developments in Far Rockaway, Queens. After an eight-month undercover investigation by the NYPD, 96 people were charged and 81 were arrested. The investigation revealed that the dealers sometimes did transactions on school playgrounds and distributed drugs concealed in the battery compartments of remote-controlled toy cars and trucks; in one instance, a child was used to deliver drugs to an undercover officer.[40] (http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/attachments/74669.htm?CFID=1695618&CFTOKEN=33496110#_ftn40)




February 3, 2006 – Police arrested 43 members of a violent Far Rockaway drug gang who instilled fear in over 2,000 residents who lived in the Redfern Houses and Dix McBride Apartments. This gang controlled the narcotics distribution in the area, and is also suspected of being responsible for an epidemic of shootings surrounding the local drug trade.[46] (http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/attachments/74669.htm?CFID=1695618&CFTOKEN=33496110#_ftn46)

BrooklynRider
January 2nd, 2007, 09:55 AM
Actually, the neext phase of the project includes a new Stop and Shop market along with other supportive retail just south of the el and diagonoal (northeast) from Phase I.

That would be where everyone goes shopping. They can also drive to the huge supermarket on Braod Channel Drive.

I understand your view of the poorer, public housing areas, but had you done a full 360 degree view, you would have seen Belle Harbor a mile to the west, which is an extremely wealthy Queens neighborhood.

Also, almost every home in Arverbe by the Sea is a two family unit, meaning the landlord has additional income. It was a very interesting sales approach (considering what could've been made selling individual condo units) and seems to ensure that the area doesn't slide backward into the mire of the 60's & 70's.

ZippyTheChimp
January 2nd, 2007, 09:14 PM
Where are the kids in Arverne going to school? Nowhere. Where are they going to play? Nowhere. Where are the moms going to shop? Nowhere. It's a jewel surrounded by a dump in the middle of nowhere, and it is not changing.

A new school and parks are planned for the development. Ground was broken last month on a 30,000 sq ft YMCA.

270.000 sq ft of commercial development at Beach 73rd and Rockaway Beach Blvd. Along with Arverne East, there will be 500,000 sq ft of commercial space.

This is a huge project.

http://www.arvernebythesea.com/project.htm

http://www.arvernebythesea.com/rendered-site-plan-2006.jpg

submachine
January 3rd, 2007, 08:23 AM
A new school and parks are planned for the development.

Great, maybe when todays kids grow up, THEIR kids will be able to enjoy everything "planned for development" today. But if you have kids, and you don't hate them, you won't be moving to Arverne anytime soon.

All those grey rectangles surrounding the "huge project" ? Ugly, six-story, public-assistance buildings. "Dwarfed by massive new buildings—80 percent of all Queens nursing homes reside in Far Rockaway, sprawling housing projects continue to grow, despite public easements." - http://www.nationaltrust.org/magazine/archives/arch_story/121704.htm

ZippyTheChimp
January 3rd, 2007, 09:16 AM
But if you have kids, and you don't hate them, you won't be moving to Arverne anytime soon.Or maybe you're tired of throwing rent money down a sinkhole, and see an opportunity to build some equity and better provide for your kids.


All those grey rectangles surrounding the "huge project" ? Ugly, six-story, public-assistance buildings. "Dwarfed by massive new buildings

Please.
http://graphics7.nytimes.com/images/2003/12/07/realestate/cov.184.1.enlarge.jpg


—80 percent of all Queens nursing homes reside in Far Rockaway-So what?


http://www.nationaltrust.org/magazine/archives/arch_story/121704.htm
What does this article about preserving Rockaway bungalows have to do with the Arverne-Edgemere UDA?

BrooklynRider
January 3rd, 2007, 09:34 AM
All those grey rectangles surrounding the "huge project" ? Ugly, six-story, public-assistance buildings. "Dwarfed by massive new buildings—80 percent of all Queens nursing homes reside in Far Rockaway, sprawling housing projects continue to grow, despite public easements." - http://www.nationaltrust.org/magazine/archives/arch_story/121704.htm


The red area of Arverne by the Sea is the shopping center currently under construction. The gray buildings to the left of the Sands are oceanfront coops. The gray buildings to the right and single & multi family homes. Two things are apparent in your posts: (1) the posts are indicative of a perspective that hasn't been out to the Rockaways in at least a decade (2) there is little basis in truth or acceptance of truth.

This development has struck a nerve. It is selling. It has great aesthetic qualities. It is an all encompassing plan that is unaffected by real estate market fluctuations at this point. Buyers seem to be permanent residents viewing this as an a long-term investment.

Manhattan has projects throughout the borough and look at real estate prices. Look at the public housing between 9th & 10th Ave along 18th, 17th, & 16th Streets. They are not affecting development of luxury condos or the highline at all. They are simply being integrated into a larger neighborhood.

submachine
January 3rd, 2007, 10:01 AM
Manhattan has projects throughout the borough and look at real estate prices.

Take away everything great about Manhattan that makes those real estate prices, keep the projects, and you have Far Rock.


This development has struck a nerve. It is selling.

Yes and no. Yes it has struck a nerve of those who own bungalows, they hate it. And no, it is not selling. It is probably the slowest selling development in NYC in the past decade. "The Breakers" have been "Now Selling" for years. In comparison, new developements in other boroughs (City Island is just one example) are sold out before they are even complete.

submachine
January 3rd, 2007, 10:05 AM
Or maybe you're tired of throwing rent money down a sinkhole, and see an opportunity to build some equity and better provide for your kids.

Maybe if they're home-schooled. And home-playground, home-sports, home-everything.

September 14, 2006 – A crew tied to the Crips street gang made $1 million a year from trafficking narcotics in a cluster of public housing developments in Far Rockaway, Queens. After an eight-month undercover investigation by the NYPD, 96 people were charged and 81 were arrested. The investigation revealed that the dealers sometimes did transactions on school playgrounds and distributed drugs concealed in the battery compartments of remote-controlled toy cars and trucks; in one instance, a child was used to deliver drugs to an undercover officer.[40] (http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/attachments/74669.htm?CFID=1695618&CFTOKEN=33496110#_ftn40)

February 3, 2006 – Police arrested 43 members of a violent Far Rockaway drug gang who instilled fear in over 2,000 residents who lived in the Redfern Houses and Dix McBride Apartments. This gang controlled the narcotics distribution in the area, and is also suspected of being responsible for an epidemic of shootings surrounding the local drug trade.[46] (http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/attachments/74669.htm?CFID=1695618&CFTOKEN=33496110#_ftn46)

ZippyTheChimp
January 3rd, 2007, 11:29 AM
Yes and no. Yes it has struck a nerve of those who own bungalows, they hate it. And no, it is not selling.
Since your earlier statement about skyrocketing crime is not supported by any statistics, I'll ask you to provide some data on sales expectations and results at Arverne. Your yes and no is not good enough.

I still don't understand the relationship to the bungalows. Your tone seems to suggest that you resent the development for some reason. The bungalows? In that case, anything that is developed on the site would "threaten" them. Or do you want 300 acres to just sit fallow for another 50 years?


Maybe if they're home-schooled. And home-playground, home-sports, home-everything.I already told you that a school is planned, and a YMCA is under construction.

http://www.arvernebythesea.com/ymca-big.jpg

Have you read through any of the information on the website? No offense, but you seem to have no knowledge of the area, such as mistaking the coops for public housing.

ZippyTheChimp
January 3rd, 2007, 11:52 AM
Arverne East: From Beach 44th to Beach 32nd. 97 acres, with 35 acres set aside for a nature preserve.

RFP was issued in August, 2005:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/hpd/downloads/pdf/rfp-arverne-east-text.pdf

Graphics on pages 28-34:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/hpd/downloads/pdf/rfp-arverne-east-exhibits-a-i.pdf


In Nov, 2006, developers were selected for Arverne East:

The Mayor also announced the designation of the Bluestone Organization, L&M Equity Participants and Triangle Equities as the joint-venture development team for Arverne East, a 97-acre site adjacent to Arverne by the Sea that will consist of 47-acres of housing and commercial space, a 35-acre nature preserve and a 15-acre dune preserve. Nearly 1,600 units of middle-income housing will be built at the Arverne East site. Forty-three percent of the units will be reserved for households with incomes no greater than $92,170 for a family of four. The Arverne East development will consist of condominiums, two-family homes and three-family homes totaling nearly 1,600 middle-income units, and it is receiving financing from the Goldman Sachs Urban Investment Group. The development will also include over 500,000 square feet of commercial space with retail and entertainment opportunities, and will create over 5,000 construction jobs, more than 1,000 permanent jobs and youth employment programs.

http://www.nyc.gov/portal/site/nycgov/menuitem.c0935b9a57bb4ef3daf2f1c701c789a0/index.jsp?pageID=mayor_press_release&catID=1194&doc_name=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nyc.gov%2Fhtml%2Fom%2Fht ml%2F2006b%2Fpr390-06.html&cc=unused1978&rc=1194&ndi=1

BrooklynRider
January 3rd, 2007, 12:05 PM
"The Bungalows" that have all the resentment and are up in arms are at the far eastern end of the Rockaways (Far Rockaway) and represent two small streets. They are no where near this development. They are over by Seagirt Blvd.

ramvid01
January 3rd, 2007, 07:14 PM
That YMCA is really nice looking. Much better than the one in LIC. :(

submachine
January 4th, 2007, 07:52 AM
your earlier statement about skyrocketing crime is not supported by any statistics

You live in NYC and you trust statistics, crime statistics? Come on. You keep ignoring these, this is less than 4 months ago, and 11 months ago. This is the playgrounds, the schools, the area. Here are your numbers.

September 14, 2006 – A crew tied to the Crips street gang made $1 million a year from trafficking narcotics in a cluster of public housing developments in Far Rockaway, Queens. After an eight-month undercover investigation by the NYPD, 96 people were charged and 81 were arrested. The investigation revealed that the dealers sometimes did transactions on school playgrounds and distributed drugs concealed in the battery compartments of remote-controlled toy cars and trucks; in one instance, a child was used to deliver drugs to an undercover officer.[40] (http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/attachments/74669.htm?CFID=1695618&CFTOKEN=33496110#_ftn40)

February 3, 2006 – Police arrested 43 members of a violent Far Rockaway drug gang who instilled fear in over 2,000 residents who lived in the Redfern Houses and Dix McBride Apartments. This gang controlled the narcotics distribution in the area, and is also suspected of being responsible for an epidemic of shootings surrounding the local drug trade.[46] (http://webdocs.nyccouncil.info/attachments/74669.htm?CFID=1695618&CFTOKEN=33496110#_ftn46)


Your tone seems to suggest that you resent the development for some reason.

The only thing I resent is the false information that was presented here, that the area or the development is in any way successful. It is an abject failure; any house or condo, let alone a brand new one, being on the market for 6 months to over a year. Your tone seems to suggest you want to only focus on what is planned instead of what is there now. Too bad kids can't get an education in a YMCA :rolleyes: Or get culture from nursing homes.

krulltime
January 4th, 2007, 09:19 AM
^ Yet again Lokkitto (from Skyscraperpage) attacks Wirednewyork. Please take your crime fantasy world out of this website. Just because a few incidents happened in the Rockways doesn't mean that the area in no man land. This developement will happend and crime probably will go down. :rolleyes:

And stop being so ignorant. The other forumers told you already that a new school and a YMCA is planned in the area.

ZippyTheChimp
January 4th, 2007, 02:21 PM
His mistakes are so numerous, he can't be taken seriously.

He cites the same 2 instances twice, and it's Far Rockaway, not Arverne.

He mistrusts statistics, but has evidence that crime rate (esp murders) are skyrokreting in Precincts 100 and 101.. Arverne is in the 100 Precinct, and there was one murder in 2006, down from two in 2005.

He thinks all the housing projects should be flipped into co-ops, but doesn't seem to know what or where they are. The beachfront buildings are already co-ops; the housing project is the Carlton just north of the red shopping area - one low-rise building.

He worries about where the kids are going to go to school, not only ignoring that a new school is planned, but that there already is one (the grey block just above "The Nautilus" tag on the siteplan.

He notes that 80% of Queens nursing homes are in Rockaway, but doesn't explain what that has to do with anything. Wheelchair Crips terrorizing the neighborhood?

He notes that the development is not selling, that The Breakers has been "Now Selling" for years. What a misleading joke. There is nothing to sell east of B73rd st. The sign is a stupid real estate ad sitting in a 100 acre field. They have just staring land prep. There are no streets or utilities. All the completed homes are sold-out.

And to top it off, he states:

The only thing I resent is the false information that was presented here, that the area or the development is in any way successful. It is an abject failure;Arverne is such a failure that developers just repeated the "mistake" made two years ago by signing on to Arverne East, even further out on Rockaway.



Lokkitto, eh. I'll have to get over there and check out his schtick.

----------------------------------------------

I have several photos that show the reality of the development area. Just need to resize and upload them.

BrooklynRider
January 4th, 2007, 03:04 PM
As I'm sure your photos will show, it is a development that is far more aesthetically pleasing than anyone could've imagined for he Rockaways. It is literally building a new (and rather beautiful) neighborhood from the ground up.

Only thing that will suck is increased traffic. The Rockaways are a easy bypass for heavy Belt Parkway traffic. The traffic patterns have already been altered, in part by construction staging, to disuade thru traffic.

submachine
January 5th, 2007, 08:42 AM
Arverne is in the 100 Precinct, and there was one murder in 2006, down from two in 2005.

The 100 is a "satellite" precinct. Do you understand what that is? Do you know when, why, or how it was formed? Do you understand the political nature of statistics and how satellite precincts may be used to skew them (just like you are unknowingly doing)? Do you understand the geographic shape of Far Rockaway and Arverne?

If you understood any of that, you would see how laughable it is that crime of the area, to you, is better reflected by "one murder in the 100" instead of over 100 drug gang arrests in two days in the 101.


a new school is planned

Your tone seems to suggest you want to only focus on what is planned instead of what is there now. Too bad kids can't get an education in a YMCA :rolleyes:


80% of Queens nursing homes are in Rockaway

What a cultural jewel. :rolleyes:


All the completed homes are sold-out.

Where are your numbers? How many homes were completed and sold-out? And how many years did it take?


Lokkitto, eh. I'll have to get over there and check out his schtick.

Funny that you believe this accusation so readily, but in light of how easily you swallow the Arverne hype-machine without evidence, its not surprising. :)

ZippyTheChimp
January 5th, 2007, 09:04 AM
No reason to respond to SSP troll without a clue.


As I'm sure your photos will show, it is a development that is far more aesthetically pleasing than anyone could've imagined for he Rockaways.

The two completed segments, sold out.
http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/9708/arverne001crx7.th.jpg (http://img79.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne001crx7.jpg) http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/8499/arverne002cps3.th.jpg (http://img79.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne002cps3.jpg) http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/3213/arverne003cjd8.th.jpg (http://img92.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne003cjd8.jpg) http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/731/arverne004cdn4.th.jpg (http://img92.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne004cdn4.jpg) http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/3392/arverne005clz3.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne005clz3.jpg)

There's some kitsch here, like the forced street names (Aquaric Dr), but there are what's advertised as "luxury condos" further west along the beach that don't look as good.

Public school on B78th
http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/7710/arverne006cgz2.th.jpg (http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne006cgz2.jpg)

And opportunity for development across the street.
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/3995/arverne007cxh6.th.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne007cxh6.jpg)


Site of the YMCA
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/9053/arverne008cbu8.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne008cbu8.jpg) http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/3841/arverne009cpy0.th.jpg (http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne009cpy0.jpg) http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1677/arverne011cfq1.th.jpg (http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne011cfq1.jpg)

ZippyTheChimp
January 5th, 2007, 09:14 AM
Area north of Rockaway Freeway and B73rd.
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/4743/arverne010cmr6.th.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne010cmr6.jpg) http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/8918/arverne012cbw2.th.jpg (http://img406.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne012cbw2.jpg)

A jumbled mix of single family homes and commercial sites. Not pretty.
Dept of Sanitation garage on the right.
http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/1979/arverne013ces0.th.jpg (http://img406.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne013ces0.jpg)

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/4139/arverne014cmz5.th.jpg (http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne014cmz5.jpg)

On the other side of the sanitation garage
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/7048/arverne015cne9.th.jpg (http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne015cne9.jpg) http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/7827/arverne016cri8.th.jpg (http://img157.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne016cri8.jpg) http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/6203/arverne017cay2.th.jpg (http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne017cay2.jpg) http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/639/arverne018cqa5.th.jpg (http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne018cqa5.jpg)

The neighborhood housing project, Carlton, from Rockaway Freeway.
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/9436/arverne019cut5.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne019cut5.jpg)

ZippyTheChimp
January 5th, 2007, 09:32 AM
Under the El. Retail site is on the left.
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/7962/arverne020ccf4.th.jpg (http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne020ccf4.jpg)

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/9906/arverne022cns2.th.jpg (http://img244.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne022cns2.jpg)

View north at B67th
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/3981/arverne021com9.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne021com9.jpg)

Retail site from Rockaway Brach Blvd. Subway station at B66th will connect with the complex.
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/7448/arverne023cuh6.th.jpg (http://img214.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne023cuh6.jpg) http://img77.imageshack.us/img77/2706/arverne024crp1.th.jpg (http://img77.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne024crp1.jpg)

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/8148/arverne025ckz3.th.jpg (http://img216.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne025ckz3.jpg)

Subway station at B60th
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/6946/arverne026csh9.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne026csh9.jpg)

Typical street off the east boder of the site. B61st
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/8355/arverne027cke9.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne027cke9.jpg)

From the boardwalk on B61st. New home construction off-site.
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/5993/arverne028clb3.th.jpg (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne028clb3.jpg)

The entire site from the boardwalk.
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/28/arverne029cnk1.th.jpg (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne029cnk1.jpg)

I would have preferred if Rockaway Beach Blvd had more retail development along its length and less concentration in one area, but I understand the economic realities.

And hardly noticed in the discussion, the best beach in NYC is next door.

ramvid01
January 5th, 2007, 10:14 AM
Is this part of Queens called Edgemeer, or near it?

submachine
January 6th, 2007, 01:32 PM
Under the El. Retail site is on the left.
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/7962/arverne020ccf4.th.jpg (http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne020ccf4.jpg)

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/9906/arverne022cns2.th.jpg (http://img244.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne022cns2.jpg)


Thats where Mario Young was murdered a few months ago. I noticed in all that awesome photography, there are no night photos...not surprised.

"Cops yesterday busted a suspect in the fatal shooting of 16 year-old youth in Far Rockaway. Shakil Chandler, 19, was charged with murdering Mario Young after an argument on Sept. 26." http://www.nypost.com/seven/10032006/news/nypdblotter/nypdblotter.htm?page=0

BrooklynRider
January 6th, 2007, 06:11 PM
You'll notice that lots of neighborhoods aren't displayed on WNY photographed at night. It has to do with whether or not there is something that presents an outstanding night-lit photo. The Rockaways are under development and purely residential. Try taking a photo of the ocean at night and post it here. Post a picture of your home at night and post it here. There's not much of interest in a night view of a largely suburban neighborhood.

From my perspective, your point has been made. You despise the Rockaways. You think development is foolish. You think development will fail. You think the area is crime ridden. Thank you for your contributions.

Now, flip your calendar from 1977 to 2007.

Repeating the same thing over and over tends to diminish any appearance of objective, intelligent thinking and one's credibility.

With such disdain for the Rockaways, one would wonder why you have such an obsession with this thread. WNY Forum members are interested in development, architecture and the growth of the city. We're not here finacially speculating with our own money.

The baseless commentary and general negative and underlying nasty tone of the postings under your username certainly indicates an agenda. I think that by posting and reposting here at WiredNewYork you are pursuing that agenda in the wrong place.

ZippyTheChimp
January 6th, 2007, 07:18 PM
Well, that's about enough.


Thats where Mario Young was murdered a few months ago.Since you know the victim's name, which wasn't mentioned in the article, you must be familiar with the story. The murder occurred at 12-13 Beach Channel Drive. That's at Mott Ave, closer to Nassau, and three miles from where that photo was taken.

Knowing this, you are deliberately posting false information. In my opinion, you are not interested in an intelligent discussion, but only to start an argument.

I'm not going to let that happen.

You'll get an infraction for any posts you make on this thread that I determine are intentionally misleading.

antinimby
January 7th, 2007, 12:49 AM
In Faded Beach Community Seeking Rebirth, Projects and Luxury Homes Meet

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/01/07/nyregion/600_rock.jpg
Gang fights have plagued the Hammel public housing project, which abuts the upscale Arverne by the Sea
development in the Rockaways.


By COREY KILGANNON
Published: January 7, 2007 (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/07/nyregion/07rockaways.html)

In a gritty section of the Rockaways, there is a cluster of new homes that stand out for their catchy colors and modern style. They are laid out in neat clusters with cheery nautical names like Ocean Breeze, The Sands and The Breakers, and there are newly mapped streets with names like Spinnaker Drive.

This is the early phase of the mammoth Arverne by the Sea development, a heralded project to make over a mostly blighted stretch of the Rockaway peninsula into 2,300 homes and condominiums.

There are snazzy showroom apartments with stunning ocean views, and a warm-and-fuzzy short film featuring families frolicking on the beach. The promotional material makes no mention of the surrounding low-income area of meager houses, shabby bungalows and public housing projects, but rather urges potential buyers to “imagine the serenity of living in an oceanfront community.”

That serenity has been interrupted in recent weeks by gunshots from the nearby projects, a spate of violence that has left three young men from the projects dead.

Some community leaders and elected officials say the violence is sparked by an escalating conflict turf war between gangs at several of the housing projects.

“This is a gang war between housing projects,” said Councilman James Sanders Jr., who has met with the police and community leaders.

The unrest has also worried officials at the Benjamin-Beechwood company, which is building the Arverne development. The 117-acre development stretches into low-income, primarily black neighborhoods that include the Ocean Bay Houses, a public housing complex formerly known as the Edgemere Houses, and the Hammel Houses, which abut the western edge of the development.

Though the Rockaways were once a popular beach resort, the expanse of trash-strewn lots that overlook pristine beaches has remained undeveloped for decades. It is premium oceanfront real estate accessible to Manhattan, but it is also a low-income area with few amenities and high crime rates. These are challenges the developer counts on overcoming in building two-family oceanfront homes costing up to $1 million.

A company official, Gerry Romski, said that police officials from the 100th Precinct assured him that extra police units had been brought in to help patrol the projects and that “the situation was under control.”

“These seem to be isolated incidents limited to the housing projects, the Hammels and Edgemere Houses,” Mr. Romski said. “We have not been impacted in any way. We’ve increased the security guards around our buildings, and there have been no incidents.”

The shootings, which received meager attention in the news media, have not affected the brisk sales of the units, he said. Roughly 500 of the planned 2,300 units are completed, he said, and most of those are occupied.

Eric Rasmussen, 26, a city firefighter, recently moved into the Coral House, an apartment building that is part of the Arverne development. It overlooks Building 10 of the Hammel project, the site of one of the shootings. “You definitely hear gunshots over there pretty regularly,” Mr. Rasmussen said.
“But I don’t consider it dangerous.”

Mr. Sanders calls the violence and the ensuing response by developers — initial panic, then relief that it did not affect their development — a microcosm of “exactly what is wrong here in the Rockaways.”

Mr. Sanders contends that development officials are “trying to build a self-contained city” while ignoring the surrounding community and its ills: unemployment, gangs, guns, drugs and troubled schools.

“We’re going to be stuck with a tale of two cities,” Mr. Sanders said.
“They’re creating the conditions for a perfect storm of racial discontent and possibly more violence.

“This situation cannot be dealt with by simply increasing security and police and arresting and imprisoning more young people.”

Community leaders have long complained that the Rockaways have been a dumping ground for the city’s poor. The residents of the housing projects, an overwhelming majority of them black, have few nearby job opportunities, social and youth and parolee services. They complain of being isolated on the peninsula.

Mr. Sanders said the recent violence stemmed from turf battles between gang members at the Ocean Bay Houses, the Hammel Houses and the Redfern Houses, which are farther east, in Far Rockaway.

On Nov. 27, Christopher Glenn, 16, of the Ocean Bay Houses, was shot and killed. On Dec. 15, another teenager, Cedric Smalls, 18, was fatally shot in front of Building 10 of the Hammel Houses. Four days later, Laton Spurgeon, 25, an Ocean Bay resident, was killed.

Last week, Jamel Bryant, 17, who the police say is a Bloods street gang member with a street name of Psycho, was arrested at the Ocean Bay Houses after firing eight bullets at police officers, the department said.

Mr. Smalls was one of 11 children of Cynthia Young and had moved with six of his siblings from the Hammel Houses into the apartment of his grandmother, Algia Young, 71, a block away. His grandmother said Cedric kept hanging out with his friends in the project, but he denied being in a gang.

“I used to check his backpack and go through his pockets every night to see if he was up to anything,” she said. “He was a good kid.”

She looked out her window toward the Arverne development and said, “How they going to build that thing when they can’t even take care of the community now?”

But Mr. Romski said the development had good relations with its neighbors and would benefit the rest of the Rockaways by bringing jobs, shopping and recreational facilities.

He said the development would bridge communities by serving as a link between poorer black areas of Far Rockaway and wealthier white sections such as Breezy Point, Neponsit and Belle Harbor. Arverne by the Sea is attracting many retailers, he said, and a new Y.M.C.A. center on the property will be open to outside residents.

“This project is going to pull up the rest of the community,” he said.

Copyright 2007 The New York Times Company

submachine
January 8th, 2007, 07:13 AM
From my perspective, your point has been made.

Let's see how good your reading comprehension is.


You despise the Rockaways.

False.



You think development is foolish.

False.



You think the area is crime ridden.

True. If it wasn't the most dangerous area in Queens (and perhaps the entire city), I (and I suspect many, many others) would already own a condo there.

The only "agenda" I have is correcting your mis-statements and false assumptions. I was born in this city (I doubt you and the Chimp were), and I've lived through the progress that has been made. I am not blinded by this progress like you seem to be, and I don't make blanket statements about the entire city (based on "overall stats") the way you seem to make.

Far Rock is a crime-ridden dump, an isolated cultural wasteland surrounded by 6-story housing projects and 6-story nursing homes in every direction. Except of course, for the waterfront. All the proof you need is to look at the price and the sell-rate of brand-new condos on "the best beach in the city". They should be sold out at over a million each. They are barely selling, for less than half that. Money knows, even if you (or your agenda) don't.

submachine
January 8th, 2007, 07:22 AM
In Faded Beach Community Seeking Rebirth, Projects and Luxury Homes Meet

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/01/07/nyregion/600_rock.jpg
Gang fights have plagued the Hammel public housing project, which abuts the upscale Arverne by the Sea
development in the Rockaways.


By COREY KILGANNON
Published: January 7, 2007 (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/07/nyregion/07rockaways.html)


That serenity has been interrupted in recent weeks by gunshots from the nearby projects, a spate of violence that has left three young men from the projects dead.

Some community leaders and elected officials say the violence is sparked by an escalating conflict turf war between gangs at several of the housing projects.

“This is a gang war between housing projects,” said Councilman James Sanders Jr., who has met with the police and community leaders.

The unrest has also worried officials at the Benjamin-Beechwood company, which is building the Arverne development. The 117-acre development stretches into low-income, primarily black neighborhoods that include the Ocean Bay Houses, a public housing complex formerly known as the Edgemere Houses, and the Hammel Houses, which abut the western edge of the development.

Getting worse, not getting better.


“You definitely hear gunshots over there pretty regularly,” Mr. Rasmussen said.
“But I don’t consider it dangerous.”

lol


Mr. Sanders calls the violence and the ensuing response by developers — initial panic, then relief that it did not affect their development — a microcosm of “exactly what is wrong here in the Rockaways.” Mr. Sanders contends that development officials are “trying to build a self-contained city” while ignoring the surrounding community and its ills: unemployment, gangs, guns, drugs and troubled schools.

Exactly. And its exactly what ZippyChimp is doing, I post an article about how a young man was murdered, and instead of focusing on that, he only mentions the address of the photo may be wrong "Thats not within Arvene-By-The-Sea boundaries, you disagree with me so im gonna censor you!". Who has the agenda?


“We’re going to be stuck with a tale of two cities,” Mr. Sanders said.
“They’re creating the conditions for a perfect storm of racial discontent and possibly more violence.

“This situation cannot be dealt with by simply increasing security and police and arresting and imprisoning more young people.”

Community leaders have long complained that the Rockaways have been a dumping ground for the city’s poor. The residents of the housing projects, an overwhelming majority of them black, have few nearby job opportunities, social and youth and parolee services. They complain of being isolated on the peninsula.

Mr. Sanders said the recent violence stemmed from turf battles between gang members at the Ocean Bay Houses, the Hammel Houses and the Redfern Houses, which are farther east, in Far Rockaway.

On Nov. 27, Christopher Glenn, 16, of the Ocean Bay Houses, was shot and killed. On Dec. 15, another teenager, Cedric Smalls, 18, was fatally shot in front of Building 10 of the Hammel Houses. Four days later, Laton Spurgeon, 25, an Ocean Bay resident, was killed.

Last week, Jamel Bryant, 17, who the police say is a Bloods street gang member with a street name of Psycho, was arrested at the Ocean Bay Houses after firing eight bullets at police officers, the department said.

AN you rule, see you in the FL thread, this one is done thanks to that article. Like I said, I know the situation because I know cops there. Let BrooklynRider and Chimp get their info from press releases.

ZippyTheChimp
January 8th, 2007, 07:39 AM
Exactly. And its exactly what ZippyChimp is doing, I post an article about how a young man was murdered, and instead of focusing on that, he only mentions the address of the photo may be wrong "Thats not within Arvene-By-The-Sea boundaries, you disagree with me so im gonna censor you!". Who has the agenda?That's two, submachine.

ASchwarz
January 8th, 2007, 06:17 PM
Submachine, you are completely ignorant of the Rockaways. The article deals with Arverne, which is as close to Far Rock as Midtown is to Wall Street.

Also, drug-realted violence in NYCHA housing typically has no bearing on nearby real estate. There is public housing in proximity to most of the richest Manhattan neighborhoods, yet Manhattan real estate is among the most valuable on earth. Some of the priciest Manhattan blocks are almost immediately adjacent to public housing.

scatman
January 22nd, 2007, 04:45 AM
I checked out Arverne By The Sea last summer. Houses are georgeous!!!!! And yes, I had to walk through Rock Freeway (coming off the subway) to get threre.

The PJ's aren't the issue. It's the 1.5 hour commute to Lower Manhattan that's a drag. Hence, the look elsewhere for housing. Peace.

submachine
January 24th, 2007, 12:52 AM
Unlike some of the others in this thread, I live in Queens, I was born in Queens, I know Queens and I know people in Queens. And the people I know who moved to Arverne have either already re-sold and moved out, or put their place on the market and are just waiting to get out. Its not getting better, its getting worse, the crime is so bad that it not only makes the news, its the front page:

NYPD wades into gang war

BY ROCCO PARASCANDOLA
NEWSDAY STAFF WRITER

January 23, 2007It started over stolen sweatshirts.

Now there's an all-out gang war in the Rockaways, police sources say, and the New York Police Department is prepared to set up street "chokepoints" to separate the combatants from two rival housing projects if more violence erupts.

The plan is part of a multipronged approach to the eight-month-long conflict between drug-dealing gang members based at the Hammel Houses and the Ocean Bay Apartments -- better known as the Edgemere Houses, the longtime former name, police sources said.

The police strategy was formulated in late December after Jamel Bryant, 17, who police know as a Bloods member with the street name "Psycho," fired at two cops who had tried to arrest him in connection with an earlier gang shooting, sources said. He was arrested a week later.

That shooting occurred in addition to 12 others in 2006 involving gang members who deal crack and marijuana out of several apartments in and around the two city Housing Authority properties, the sources said. Two of the shootings resulted in deaths.

Tensions appear to be highest at Hammel, where the group "GIB," an acronym for "Get It In Bricks," is at war with another faction whose grip on the drug trade at Hammel and nearby has waned in recent years, according to sources.

The other faction doesn't go by a name, but police sources said its membership includes several members of one family and their associates, about 15 people in all.

One man in the family, Laton Spurgeon, 26, was hit by a car and then fatally shot Dec. 19 near Fernside Place in Far Rockaway. No one has been arrested in the killing, but police believe it was a hit by GIB in retaliation for the Dec. 15 shooting death of Cedric Smalls, 18, a GIB guy.

GIB is named for a rap song the gang recorded and has about 20 members, several of whom appear in a YouTube video, "HardRockTimes ... Hammels," recorded outside the Hammel Houses.

Two miles east, a Bloods crew based at the Ocean Bay Apartments deals drugs and is tight with Spurgeon's faction, sources said.

The violence began May 18 when a 25-year-old man was shot and wounded by a GIB member who saw him handing out stolen GIB sweatshirts, sources said. Since then, it has been one retaliatory shooting after another -- one in June, one in July, three in August, two in September and four in December.

One victim, wounded on Aug. 31, was an innocent bystander. Antonio Pennix, 22, was on Rockaway Beach Boulevard, near the Hammel Houses, when he was shot. Joseph Favor, 22, who police said is a GIB member, was arrested the next day. His case is pending.

The violence comes as Arverne By the Sea, a massive residential development project along the waterfront near the Hammel Houses, begins to take shape. The upscale homes stand in stark contrast to the Rockaways housing projects, filled mostly with poor and working-class families.

Residents say gun play has been a constant in their neighborhood.

One recent day outside the Hammel Houses, a demolition worker who calls himself "Fox" and says he knows all the players involved in the gang war, lamented that neither side is willing to end the bloodshed.

"It's like any typical neighborhood, low-income housing, not too many jobs for the people," said Fox, 26. "We tend to rub each other the wrong way sometimes. We're killing each other, yeah. Everything is about being a man. You say something to me that I don't like, I got to be a man. Stupid stuff."

Last Wednesday night, shots rang out on Beach 54th Street, not far from the Ocean Bay Apartments. The gunfire, which police believe was not connected to gang violence, didn't faze a number of passersby. They simply went about their business, walking around the yellow tape that police set up where shell casings had been recovered.

"It's been like this for years. It's always been like this in the projects," said Herb Shelby, 39, a roofer who lives nearby. "I basically go to work and then I come home."

Bryant, meanwhile, has been charged with attempted murder for shooting at the officers. On the night he allegedly fired at police, he was being sought for questioning in the death of Smalls, sources said.

Should another shooting occur, the beefed-up police response would involve setting up two "chokepoints," one along Rockaway Beach Boulevard and the other along Beach Channel Drive.

Sources said the idea is to have officers watch for suspicious activity or for gang members heading to the other project .

The officers have been given pictures of some gang members and told which cars they drive.

Other officers, meanwhile, will immediately go to both projects, regardless of which one is the scene of a shooting, to prevent retaliatory violence, sources said.

"These guys seem determined to keep shooting each other," said a police source involved in the investigation of some of the shootings. "It's like each one wants to be the last one standing." http://www.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/am-gang0123,0,3683877.story?coll=ny-top-headlines
http://www.newsday.com/news/local/newyork/ny-nygang235063646jan23,0,4491047.story

ablarc
January 24th, 2007, 09:40 PM
"We tend to rub each other the wrong way sometimes. We're killing each other, yeah.
Sounds like Iraq.

antinimby
January 24th, 2007, 10:30 PM
All this redevelopment talk makes me want to go there later this year to see for myself.

Although now listening to all this talk of violence makes me a little chicken.

ZippyTheChimp
January 24th, 2007, 10:38 PM
Two middle-aged white guys walked through this neighborhood with a $1000 camera.

Wait until the warm weather and hit the beach.

antinimby
January 25th, 2007, 01:16 AM
^ Thanks for the reassurance.

I'd bet the sand and water here is probably cleaner than Coney Island.

ZippyTheChimp
January 25th, 2007, 07:19 AM
The water is cleaner, but the currents are sometimes dangerous.

The sand is about the same, if you don't count the natural material that's more abundant than at Coney. Lots of horseshoe crabs flipped over by seagulls.

Don't go on a Monday. People are pigs.

The western part of the island near the Marine Parkway Bridge is upscale, one of the most suburban places in the city.

iiliiiiill
February 16th, 2007, 12:58 PM
Far Rock is a crime-ridden dump, an isolated cultural wasteland surrounded by 6-story housing projects and 6-story nursing homes in every direction. Except of course, for the waterfront. All the proof you need is to look at the price and the sell-rate of brand-new condos on "the best beach in the city". They should be sold out at over a million each. They are barely selling, for less than half that. Money knows, even if you (or your agenda) don't.

first of all i read all 5 pages of this thread....you dont know what you're talking about....all you're doing is quoting from newspaper articles...i live in far rockaway, so let me clear things up for everybody....

arverne by the sea is going to be in 2 phases...1st phase is beach 63rd to beach 81st...which encompasses the neighborhoods of arverne and rockaway beach. hammels houses abuts the western edge of phase 1 on beach 81st street, which is the 100 precinct, and its not a "satellite" precinct.

phase 2 is beach 59th to beach 36th, which includes the neighborhoods of arverne and edgemere...this development is going to be between the el and the boardwalk.

the rockaway peninsula consists of the following neighborhoods (in east to west order): far rockaway, edgemere, arverne, rockaway beach, rockaway park, belle harbor, neponsit, breezy point.

the rockaway peninsula has 6 public housing developments: redfern, beach 41, edgemere, arverne (now ocean bay), carleton manor and hammels. they are spread out over the east end peninsula with the exception of arverne and edgemere which are directly across the street from each other (beach 51 to beach 58 streets) and this is where the majority of crime in the rockaways occured at one point. overall the crime in the projects had dropped significantly in the past 10 years. i frequent hammels myself and have never been in a dangerous situation. im not saying its a good neighborhood but the bad things that happen there are more personal, not random attacks of violence.

far rockaway does not have a lot of nursing homes. however it has a lot of state housing set aside for the elderly, which is mostly contained to several high rises on seagirt boulevard.

the reason why condo prices are so low in the rockaway peninsula is not because of crime, but rather the public transportation issue. if you look on foxtons.com there are 1 bedroom condo units in sheepshead bay that actually sell for less that a condo unit across the street from hammels.

far rockaway does have its crime, and it is one of the worst neighborhoods in queens, but thats understandable when you look at queens as a whole. queens is primarily 1 and 2 family residential. the only reason why far rockaway is bad because it has 50% of the public housing in queens, but its only 5% of queens' land area. so that makes the situation worse, but if you put far rockaway in the bronx or brooklyn, it would be an average crime rate neighborhood. furthermore, public housing does not deter neighborhood growth, as several people on here have already addressed. example, brownstones in cobble hill brooklyn right across the street from gowanus houses have increased in value as the neighborhood experienced its rennaisance in the late 1990s. if you want further proof, look at neighborhoods like harlem, where you can find 1800 p/mo rent across the street from public housing (e 108 & 2nd ave).

the rockaway peninsula is rapidly growing and its on the rise, and as a resident for 25 years, i welcome the change. submachine, do not speak on topics you know little of.

Willg24
April 29th, 2007, 04:07 PM
Arverne by the sea is looking very nice...impressive

ZippyTheChimp
May 25th, 2007, 07:50 AM
I was in the Rockaways, and stopped by to check progress at Arverne.

Construction has moved across B73rd, and Rockaway Beach Blvd through the site has been closed.

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/5438/arverne039cru6.th.jpg (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne039cru6.jpg) http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/6657/arverne040cei9.th.jpg (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne040cei9.jpg)

Activity throughout the site.

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/1595/arverne041cjc5.th.jpg (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne041cjc5.jpg) http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/8823/arverne042caa9.th.jpg (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne042caa9.jpg) http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/6435/arverne043cfm2.th.jpg (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne043cfm2.jpg)


http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/6296/arverne044cwe6.th.jpg (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne044cwe6.jpg)

ZippyTheChimp
June 15th, 2007, 12:38 PM
Gotham Gazette - http://www.gothamgazette.com/article//20070611/200/2203

Change Reaches the City’s Edge

by D. Wolffe
11 Jun 2007

http://gothamgazette.com/graphics/rockaways/1.jpg
The Rockaway Peninsula: Isolation within
the city limits

For close to a quarter of a century Richard George has sat at the kitchen table of his bungalow in the Rockaways and filed reams of lawsuits to attempt to preserve the Queens beachfront community known as “the poor man’s Riviera.”

For years, George’s efforts were geared largely toward the preservation of the bungalow colonies — the 119 remaining wooden cottages built on landfill in the Atlantic Ocean at the turn of the century and used by New Yorkers seeking a quick and affordable getaway for decades afterward. Lately though, the stakes have been raised. As the city offers incentives to developers to build housing on some of the last remaining plots of vacant land in the city, George fears great – and what he sees as catastrophic – change in the community.

About a half dozen developments have just gone up or are planned for the area. One, The Wavecrest II, a seven-story apartment complex, sits directly adjacent to George’s bungalow on Beach 24th Street. George claims such buildings are swallowing the views of the Atlantic and even making it harder for residents simply to go to the beach. The developers have blocked or built over streets, so getting to the sand or boardwalk can require a long, roundabout walk.

http://gothamgazette.com/graphics/rockaways/2.jpg
On the Atlantic: Escaping
the urban hotbox

In response to these pressures, in late 2003, George, along with John Baxter, the somewhat eccentric owner of the Baxter Hotel in Far Rockaway, filed suit, charging that the city’s actions in the area violated its own Waterfront Revitalization Program. They lost the case but plan to appeal.

“Developers rule the roost….No matter what they do, they win. The city allows developers to build almost anything they want,” Baxter said. “We know we are never going to win, but we are going to keep filing these lawsuits until somebody listens to us.”

A CHANGING COMMUNITY

For his part, George is particularly peeved about one of the largest developments, Arverne by the Sea, located on 117 sandy beachfront acres. A contract for the land was awarded late last year to Benjamin Beechwood LLC in hopes it would include 2,000 apartments and help Mayor Michael Bloomberg meet his goal of providing 165,000 new affordable homes in the city.

“Today we see the future of Rockaway,” said Queens Borough President Helen Marshall, at the ribbon cutting ceremony for the development two years ago. “After a generation of hopes and promises these homes are proof that the renaissance of the Rockaways has finally begun. It will continue to flourish with thousands of new homes, recreational and retail facilities and a great natural resource—the beloved beaches of Rockaway. Arvene by the Sea provides attractive quality housing with the Atlantic Ocean for a front porch.”

http://gothamgazette.com/graphics/rockaways/3.jpg
The Baxter Hotel: Seaside
rooms for the working class

But as is so often the case in this rapidly changing city, existing residents see something quite different. “They want to demolish these structures [the bungalows], which are constructed to fit in with the landscape --they are low rise, the materials have lasted almost a century, they are protected from hurricanes—and replace them with these monstrous structures,” George said.

“What’s happening in Rockaway is the same thing that is happening all over to beachfront communities in the city,” said Baxter. He fears the developed will go on to create create private gated communities. “That’s what they are doing,” he said

A resident of the Rockaways for 45 years, Baxter is among the old timers who believe the developments will spoil the character of the Rockaways. But while almost everyone agrees that change is coming, if not already here, some think it is precisely what the area needs.

PEOPLE ON THE EDGE

An isolated peninsula straddling the borders of Queens and Nassau County, the Rockways include communities like Broad Channel, Jamaica Bay, Belle Harbor and Far Rockaway. It was originally developed as a summer vacation resort for luxury and middle class residents to escape from the hotbox of the city. But in the 1960s, the city constructed a number of low-income housing projects in the area. These projects, which include the Edgemere houses and the Beach 41st Houses, were plagued by turf wars and drugs as residents struggled with poor access to good schools, hospitals or social services.

http://gothamgazette.com/graphics/rockaways/4.jpg
Rockaway's bungalow: Only 119 remain

Now, with record high housing prices throughout the city, a number of New Yorkers are willing to consider the distant community a viable place to live. “I find it kind of funny that they are starting to ship rich people out here because there is nowhere left for them in the rest of the city anymore,” said Lenore Martins, a resident of the Beach 41st Street houses in Far Rockaway.

MIDDLE CLASS MECCA?

Rich may be overstating it. Though Arverne by the Sea includes luxury housing, its 2,300 one and two family homes and mid-rise condominiums largely will offer middle-class housing, giving those lucky enough to win a lottery a chance at ownership. When completed the mixed-use development will include 270,000 square feet of commercial space, retail stores, a supermarket, a YMCA and parkland.

http://gothamgazette.com/graphics/rockaways/5.jpg
Arverne by the Sea:
2,000 new homes

“This new oceanfront community complete with affordable housing, commercial and recreational spaces, will bring jobs and homes for the entire Rockaway peninsula. We will help thousands of teachers, police officers, firefighters, nurses and other moderate and middle-income New Yorkers to realize the American dream of owning their own home,” Mayor Michael Bloomberg said at the groundbreaking of the Arverne YMCA late last year.

Many Rockaway residents believe the YMCA and the other amenities that will accompany projects like Arvene, including possible ferry service, would bring sorely needed economic development and resources to the community 20 miles from Manhattan.

“I would be happy if the ferry service came to the Rockaways,” said Martins. “Of course, you do know they are not bringing the ferry service out here for us, but because of that new little development they are bringing in. … But if that’s what it takes, that’s what it takes.” She added the development could be a “good thing if it helps get us some services all the way out here.”

But other residents resent the luxury housing.

“My problem is basically that they are building all these high-dollar developments when they have never paid one bit of mind to us. They didn’t care that the young people here don’t have any chance at a good education, or about all the drugs run through here or the people dying on the streets,” said Peter, a resident of Beach 41st who preferred not to be further identified.

http://gothamgazette.com/graphics/rockaways/final.jpg
The Boardwalk: Strolling on the "poor man's Riviera"

There have been rumors of tension between residents of the low income housing projects and those of Arverne by the Sea. “I think there was a scare over some gunfire a while back,” Martin said. “Unfortunately that kind of thing happens out here sometimes. It’s been different out here for a while. The people that moved into the developments either have to be willing to stomach it or have to have a sense of humor about it—look at it as the great Wild West or something.”

MidtownGuy
January 27th, 2008, 09:05 PM
This town needs to make use of more water transportation.

antinimby
May 5th, 2008, 07:50 PM
^ Clairvoyant...


Water Taxis get bigger launch starting May 12

The new service between Queens and Manhattan, is part of a two-year project that also envisions broader service on the East River.

http://cnimg.sv.publicus.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Site=CN&Date=20080505&Category=FREE&ArtNo=475344953&Ref=AR&Profile=1066&maxw=319&border=0


May 05. 2008 (http://www.crainsnewyork.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080505/FREE/475344953) 2:38PM By: Matthew Sollars

More people will have the opportunity to take to the seas to get to work under an expansion of ferry service in New York City, the mayor announced Monday.

Beginning next Monday, NY Water Taxi will transport passengers between Riis Landing in the Roxbury section of the Rockaways in Queens, and Pier 11 at South Street in Lower Manhattan. The hour-long, one-way trip will include a stop to pick up more passengers at the Brooklyn Army Terminal, at 58th Street in Sunset Park.

A $1.1 million subsidy approved by the City Council will cap the one-way fare at $6—$1 dollar more than the cost for express bus service from the Rockaways. NY Water Taxi is also exploring weekend ferry service to Rockaway Beach. Details are still being worked out, but the weekend service could begin as early as Memorial Day.

By July, private ferry service will also be restored from Pier 11 and 34th Street to Long Island City in Queens and Williamsburg in Brooklyn. The city’s Department of Transportation will spend $1.25 million on service from these locations and to expand the ferry dock at 34th Street.

“Ferries are fast, affordable, and environmentally-friendly,” said Mayor Michael Bloomberg in a statement.

“As our waterfront becomes even more dynamic – with new housing and open space in communities like Greenpoint, Williamsburg, and Hunters Point – ferries are going to become an even bigger part of our city’s transportation network.”

The ferry initiative was first announced by Mr. Bloomberg last May and was a central element of the PlaNYC 2030 plan. The ferry service is part of a two-year pilot project that also envisions broader ferry service along the East River.

In the next two years, roughly $5.5 million in federal and city funds will pay for new docks on Roosevelt Island and Greenpoint and Williamsburg, Brooklyn.

The city will also spend $500,000 to develop a five-borough water taxi service plan. The funding will help explore ferry locations in the Bronx, on the South Shore of Staten Island, and additional locations in Manhattan, Brooklyn and Queens. http://www.crainsnewyork.com/images/diamond.gif

© 2008 Crain Communications, Inc.

ZippyTheChimp
May 5th, 2008, 09:51 PM
The ferry slip is just to the west of the Marine Parkway Bridge.

ZippyTheChimp
May 19th, 2008, 03:53 PM
Arverne by the Sea moving right along.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/1757/arverne045ctn7.th.jpg (http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne045ctn7.jpg)


Traffic circle at B 73rd St and Shore Front Pkwy

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/1786/arverne046cnu3.th.jpg (http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne046cnu3.jpg) http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/3981/arverne047cyu8.th.jpg (http://img528.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne047cyu8.jpg)


http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/7753/arverne048cxf9.th.jpg (http://img176.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne048cxf9.jpg) http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/4596/arverne049cqh9.th.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne049cqh9.jpg)


From the Boardwalk

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/7383/arverne050cwc8.th.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne050cwc8.jpg) http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/5354/arverne051cez9.th.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne051cez9.jpg) http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/307/arverne052clg1.th.jpg (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne052clg1.jpg) http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/6462/arverne053ces3.th.jpg (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne053ces3.jpg)


YMCA site. Nothing much done by the city here since they made that pile of rocks last year.

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/7793/arverne054cqf1.th.jpg (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne054cqf1.jpg)


Stop & Shop across the street.

http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/5905/arverne055cnx0.th.jpg (http://img122.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne055cnx0.jpg)


http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/1682/arverne056coi2.th.jpg (http://img122.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne056coi2.jpg) http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/7926/arverne057cwg7.th.jpg (http://img122.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne057cwg7.jpg) http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/4374/arverne058cja0.th.jpg (http://img122.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne058cja0.jpg)


Rockaway Beach Blvd rebuilt.

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1194/arverne059cpv8.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne059cpv8.jpg) http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/849/arverne060cda7.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne060cda7.jpg)


To the south, a segment of the old boulevard.

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/5796/arverne061cmi3.th.jpg (http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne061cmi3.jpg)


Everything says Coming Soon, but the field offices will be here for some time.

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/1238/arverne062cdt3.th.jpg (http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne062cdt3.jpg)


Next segment, east from B 67th St

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/323/arverne063cgy7.th.jpg (http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne063cgy7.jpg)

A-train B 67th St station. One hour to Manhattan.

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/6746/arverne064cvx8.th.jpg (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne064cvx8.jpg)

submachine
May 26th, 2008, 09:15 PM
Arverne by the Sea moving right along.


Too bad it can't move to a better neighborhood. This one is getting worse.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/23/nyregion/23rockaway.htm
Murder, From Front to Back, in a Project in Queens

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/23/nyregion/23rock.span.jpg Robert Stolarik for The New York Times
A detective posted a sign Thursday offering a reward for information about the killing of a 15-year-old girl in the Redfern Houses in Far Rockaway last week.
Published: May 23, 2008
Mourning the murdered has become a familiar routine at the Redfern Houses in Far Rockaway, Queens. First there are the makeshift memorials, with flowers and candles and a smattering of personal items. Then, the dead often get more permanent epitaphs scrawled on the walls of the apartment house they called home, remembered by nicknames like “peanut” or “dimplez.”

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/23/nyregion/23rockMAP.Wide.jpg (http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:pop_me_up2%28%27http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2008/05/23/nyregion/23RockMap.ready.html%27,%20%27436_647%27,%20%27wid th=436,height=647,location=no,scrollbars=yes,toolb ars=no,resizable=yes%27%29) A History of Violence (http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:pop_me_up2%28%27http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2008/05/23/nyregion/23RockMap.ready.html%27,%20%27436_647%27,%20%27wid th=436,height=647,location=no,scrollbars=yes,toolb ars=no,resizable=yes%27%29)

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/23/nyregion/0523-ROCKAWAY-B.JPG (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2008/05/23/nyregion/0523-ROCKAWAY_index.html) Violence in Rockaway (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2008/05/23/nyregion/0523-ROCKAWAY_index.html)
(http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:pop_me_up2%28%27http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2008/05/23/nyregion/23rockaway_CA0.ready.html%27,%20%2723rockaway_CA0_ ready%27,%20%27width=670,height=600,scrollbars=yes ,toolbars=no,resizable=yes%27%29)
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/23/nyregion/23ROCKX.190.jpg (http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:pop_me_up2%28%27http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2008/05/23/nyregion/23rockaway_CA0.ready.html%27,%20%2723rockaway_CA0_ ready%27,%20%27width=670,height=600,scrollbars=yes ,toolbars=no,resizable=yes%27%29) Photographs by Robert Stolarik for The New York Times
Top, a makeshift memorial in the Redfern Houses was created for Brandon Bethea, 15, who was shot to death last week. Below, a basketball court is left unused because of concern that it has too few exits to allow an easy escape should gunfire erupt.

And then there is vengeance.
Invariably, those killed are young. Sometimes they are the intended targets, other times they are not.
But most are victims of a private war that has been playing out at this housing project for years. A war over money, turf and drugs — growing increasingly deadly as guns have become more prevalent.
“It is the front versus the back and the back against the front,” said Jeanette Williams, who has lived at Redfern since 1972, when she was a child.
She was being quite literal, describing an ongoing battle between youths that dominate specific buildings in the project, setting neighbor against neighbor, with many innocent bystanders locked in the middle.
Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/k/raymond_w_kelly/index.html?inline=nyt-per) visited with residents and community leaders in the area on Thursday afternoon, announcing plans to step up the police presence after an outburst of violence last week, when two people were killed and another five were injured in three separate shootings.
“Unfortunately,” he said, “sometimes it takes a tragedy to focus the efforts of the community on a persistent problem.”
To combat the violence, he said, there would be an influx of 50 officers to the area as well as the installation of a crane to be used as an observation post, allowing a 24-hour police presence.
He also urged residents to use an anonymous tip line to inform police about who owned guns, noting that there is a $1,000 reward if the information leads to an arrest.
The latest round of violence started with the killing of Brandon Bethea, 15, whose family had recently moved from the project hoping to escape the ever-present violence. She was visiting old friends when she was shot in front of 12-70 Redfern on Saturday night. The police believe she was not the intended target.
A few hours later, before dawn on Sunday, five people were shot only a few blocks away in what the police described as an argument that escalated to a gunfight.
Then on Monday afternoon, 16-year-old Tyrese Johnson was fatally shot in the head a few blocks from Redfern, his body strewn on the sidewalk in front of the Last Stop Deli.
Ms. Williams, who helps run the day care center in the complex and is responsible for 54 children ages 2 to 6, said that Redfern felt like a world apart from the heart of the city, where significant drops in crime are constantly touted.
“When the attention dies down, it will start again,” she said, describing how she is awakened by gunfire at least two or three times a week.
While there is a playground just outside the center, Ms. Williams said she often has to keep the children inside, after getting tipped off that there is going to be trouble.
The Redfern Houses, nine squat six- to seven-story brick buildings, were built in 1959 on 19 acres at the farthest edge of New York City, just beyond the runways at Kennedy International Airport.
The New York Police Department’s crime statistics for the 101st Precinct, where Redfern is located, show a drop of more than 50 percent in murders, assaults and other major crimes from 1998 to 2007. And while most other leading crime indicators are down this year compared with last, there has been a rise in murders and shootings.
There have been five murders this year already compared with one in all of 2007, said Paul J. Browne, the Police Department’s chief spokesman.
But beyond the official statistics, the residents of the Redfern Houses describe a climate of fear that has made parts of the complex virtual no-go zones.
“You can’t even sit in the park in the middle of the project,” Monique Daily said. “We are prisoners.”
Like many others, she said that she would often walk all the way around the outside of the project to go visit a friend in another building rather than walk through the middle.
The main fight, according to more than a dozen residents, is between a group that calls itself the Hassock Boys, taking a name from one of the streets that border the project and the house they dominate, and the 1270 Gangbangers, a name derived from the address of their house.
As police patrolled the project after midnight and before dawn Thursday, they posted signs offering a $12,000 reward for any information leading to the arrest of those responsible for Brandon Bethea’s murder.
But it was clear that the 1270 boys had a different idea of justice, spray painting one of the red New York Public Housing signs near the site where she was slain with their “tag” and taunting the Hassock Boys.
Joyce Turner, like many other older residents, blamed what she described as the complete lack of activities for young men and women for the problems. Organized sporting teams were eliminated long ago, and just two weeks ago the community center was shuttered. “What are these kids going to do?” she asked. “They just stand on the corner looking at each other and get angry.”
On Wednesday afternoon, some of the boys from building 12-50, who go by the name Guerrillas, illustrated Ms. Turner’s point.
As the police patrolled, they mocked them, pretending to shoot dice. They approached another young man who was by himself, seized his skateboard and clowned a bit. When they returned it, he thanked them.
It would be a typical scene among virtually any group of teens, with the bullying and posturing, where packs tend to pick on the weak, but the ever-present threat of guns added another dimension.
Asked what they did besides stand around, one young man half-joked that sometimes they like to go to the roof and have a little gun practice.
But what makes the violence more confounding is the simple fact that everyone knows everyone else. Most residents say the ones responsible for the violence are just children themselves, as young as 14. The residents said they are not inclined to go to the police, whom many said they mistrusted.
On Tuesday afternoon, the tense relationship between the police and the residents was evident when they arrested one young man just outside building 12-50. As they cuffed him, a woman from the building screamed, “Where are you taking my son?”
Shortly after the police took the young man away, Ms. Daily came into the entrance hall of her home at 12-70.
All around her were tributes scrawled on the pale brick walls to the Redfern fallen, with Brandon Bethea’s various nicknames — “twiins” and “dimplez” — appearing repeatedly.
Ms. Daily expressed the distinctly fatalistic approach that seemed to come with living in Redfern, saying that one of her daughters had even written up a list of guests she wanted to attend her funeral.

ZippyTheChimp
May 27th, 2008, 01:08 AM
^
Two years ago, you said Phase 1 wasn't selling west of B 73rd. Sold out.

Then you said that "The Breakers" wasn't selling - when they hadn't even broken ground. Now it's 90% sold.

Now they're starting east of B 67th on "The Dunes."

Do you have any more predictions?

BrooklynLove
May 27th, 2008, 07:13 AM
it's all good.

antinimby
May 27th, 2008, 06:29 PM
Building boom revives Rockaways peninsula


http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2008/05/25/alg_rockaways-bungalows.jpg
New bungalow homes line Beach 108th Street at Shore Front Parkway


BY JOHN LAUINGER
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
Sunday, May 25th 2008 (http://www.nydailynews.com/real_estate/2008/05/25/2008-05-25_building_boom_revives_rockaways_peninsul.html), 4:00 AM

For half a century, a paralyzing economic decline left the once-fashionable Rockaway peninsula virtually untouched by development.

But now, the overlooked oceanfront hideaway is shedding its ramshackle past as a development boom sweeps along the sandy spit of land at the city's southern shore.

"Several years ago, it was a Rockaway resident buying in Rockaway," said Michael Kerris, chief financial officer of the FrameWorks Group, which has built three high-rise oceanfront condos along Shorefront Parkway in the Seaside neighborhood.

"Now it's people coming from Manhattan, coming from Queens and Brooklyn, coming from Nassau County - and even from outside the state," he said. "We are attracting second-home buyers like the Rockaways has never experienced before."

The boom, which began this decade, is flooding the peninsula with more than 5,000 new housing units, primarily a mix of pricey oceanfront condos and housing aimed at middle-class families and first-time home buyers.

Prior to the current boom, the last major development on the island had been six housing projects built between 1951 and 1973.

Locals say that many small homes have been redeveloped into super-size, multifamily dwellings - a trend that would largely be stopped by the city's current proposal to down zone 278 blocks on the peninsula.

At the heart of the building boom is the Arverne Urban Renewal Area, a city-subsidized megadevelopment that will revitalize 300 acres that have sat vacant since the city began razing dilapidated bungalows there in the late 1960s.

The site, between Beach 34th and Beach 79th Sts., will be transformed into residential structures with an estimated 4,128 units - 1,136 of which will be restricted to families of four with annual incomes less than $92,170, according to the city Department of Housing Preservation and Development.

The urban renewal area will include three separate developments. Arverne by the Sea, which is roughly half sold, includes 600 two-family homes (1,200 units) and 1,000 condos. They range in price from $200,000 for a subsidized condo to $1.1 million for a waterfront, two-family home.

The second development, Water's Edge at Arverne, features 170 condos with an average price of $230,450. Construction should be completed by the end of the year.

The third development, Arverne East, calls for a mix of 1,650 condos and homes. Construction is expected to start sometime next year.


http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2008/05/25/graf_condos.gif


While some Realtors say the slumping economy has greatly slowed sales on the peninsula, Vincent Riso, a principal developer behind Water's Edge, said the city subsidies have significantly lowered asking prices.

"If people were to pay the full cost of development, they would pay another 40%," he said.

The so-called Rockaways renaissance has fueled a dramatic rise in population - 13,000 new residents between 2000 and 2006, according to census figures - and that has many longtime residents fuming over what they say is a lack of transportation upgrades to match the boom.

Although a $6 Rockaways-to-Manhattan ferry service debuted this month, the peninsula still has only one subway line, one of the nation's few intra-county toll bridges and aging streets that locals say can't handle the onslaught of summer traffic.

"Our community is being ruined," said Fran Stathis, head of the Rockaway Park Homeowners and Residents Association. "We're too congested. We don't have the infrastructure for so many people."

© Copyright 2008 NYDailyNews.com

JCMAN320
May 27th, 2008, 07:00 PM
No one on here is acknowledging the problem in the article about the crime in the Rockaways?

submachine
May 28th, 2008, 07:04 AM
No one on here is acknowledging the problem in the article about the crime in the Rockaways?

They would rather talk about how fast they are selling...if you consider three years "fast" :rolleyes:

ZippyTheChimp
May 28th, 2008, 08:47 AM
No one on here is acknowledging the problem in the article about the crime in the Rockaways?The Redfern Houses are at the Nassau County border, three miles from Arverne. It's like describing crime in Central Park by reporting conditions in Greenwich Village. The biggest problem at Arverne is desolation, a half-mile long vacant lot.

Safety in New York is relative to it's own history, and the level of violence in America. Though the numbers are low, an average of almost two people per day are murdered in the city. On that basis, you could state that the city has a crime problem.

There's higher crime in Far Rockaway, hardly any in Neponsit, and varying conditions in between. To say there's crime in the Rockaways is like saying there's crime in New York.

Submachine likes to remind us that he is from Queens, but that doesn't mean he knows all of it, or has spent much (if any) time in the Rockaways. Except for occasional trips to the beach, how many people would pay a toll or take a long subway ride just to visit?

It was spelled out here (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showpost.php?p=148812&postcount=71) over a year ago, a post with no response from submachine. What could he say?

submachine
May 30th, 2008, 01:55 PM
The Redfern Houses are at the Nassau County border, three miles from Arverne. It's like describing crime in Central Park by reporting conditions in Greenwich Village.

Yeah its just like that. Rockaway is a tiny isolated peninsula, and the crime-ridden Far Rock is the only way out. Which, if you think about, means that the good areas are surrounded by bad areas, and water. :)


Submachine likes to remind us that he is from Queens, but that doesn't mean he knows all of it, or has spent much (if any) time in the Rockaways. Except for occasional trips to the beach, how many people would pay a toll or take a long subway ride just to visit?


Like I already said, I know cops in the 101, the nighttime shift gets call all the time from the new developments. How many people like Zippy are aware of the crime in the area when they haven't spent a night there?

Do you know why they get those calls?

Because like I explained above, they are like a watering hole in the jungle, a juicy isolated target for criminals from the nearby projects to feed.

If they made it a gated community, it would a different story.

But they thought the way Zippy thinks, and they didn't, and now the whole thing is a disaster, just like YMCA, the school, and the shopping center they never built. Why dump more money into this mess, who cares about what you promised.

ZippyTheChimp
May 30th, 2008, 07:05 PM
The point of this sub-topic was whether Arverne would get built.
Your central rationale for why it would fail was because of crime in the area.

Well it hasn't failed, so what's your point now, that it isn't going up fast enough to suit you?

You apparently got nothing from my response to JCMAN.


he school, and the shopping center they never built.What do you mean never? Do you have any info that they've been cancelled? The site of the school is at the edge of the present phase; they haven't even put in streets yet. I remember last year, you weren't even aware that the project included a school.

You really don't know much about the development or Rockaway, but...


I know cops in the 101

Yeah, and I know the Queen of Denmark.

Arverne is in the 100 Precinct. The stationhouse is on Beach 92nd. 3/4 of a mile from Arverne. They would be responding to nightly calls from Arverne. 101 is way east on Mott Ave, three miles away. Know any cops in the 100?


they are like a watering hole in the jungle,Well yes, that explains it.

Come back in a year with you next set of parameters for success.

ASchwarz
May 30th, 2008, 07:52 PM
The school and the shopping center are part of the final phase.

Submachine do you work for a competing developer? Were you a losing bidder on the site?

JCMAN320
May 30th, 2008, 11:08 PM
Zippy I see and understand your point and I appreciate the response.

submachine
June 2nd, 2008, 07:39 PM
Arverne is in the 100 Precinct. The stationhouse is on Beach 92nd. 3/4 of a mile from Arverne. They would be responding to nightly calls from Arverne.

Wrong again. It's not a station, its a satellite. Every call goes to the 101 main precinct.

Every other precinct in the city gets help, in emergencies, from other precincts.

Not the ones near Arverne. They are so isolated that they are on their own.


Well it hasn't failed, so what's your point now, that it isn't going up fast enough to suit you?.

The reason development is crawling to a halt is because sales are crawling to a halt. That pretty much defines a failure.

It is literally the most isolated, lacking, dangerous area of all 5 boroughs of NYC. There is nothing there but poverty, crime and nursing homes. Of course in one direction there is some water, but most people would rather live in a nice area and drive on their occasional trips to the beach.

ZippyTheChimp
June 2nd, 2008, 08:13 PM
Wrong again. It's not a station, its a satellite. Every call goes to the 101 main precinct.You were wrong when you said this a year ago.


The reason development is crawling to a halt is because sales are crawling to a halt.Phase I sold out; phase II 90% sold; phase III sales beginning before construction.


Rockaway is a tiny isolated peninsula, and the crime-ridden Far Rock is the only way out. Which, if you think about, means that the good areas are surrounded by bad areas, and water...

Because like I explained above, they are like a watering hole in the jungle, a juicy isolated target for criminals from the nearby projects to feed.Of all your arguments, this is the silliest.

Aren't all the neighborhoods in Rockaway on the same peninsula? Wouldn't Belle Harbor residents have left decades ago?

Overall, your crime argument would only be relevant if the project wasn't selling. Then we could argue about the various causes. But it is selling, so even if one accepts your crime "statistics," it doesn't matter. People are buying the units.

Note: If you come back and state that the project is not selling, you'd better back it up with data. Or I'll regard it as trolling.

ASchwarz
June 3rd, 2008, 03:16 AM
How exactly is Far Rock the only way in and out? Funny, I thought there were multiple bridges, the A train, the ferry, etc.

Also, has Submachine even been to Far Rock? It's hardly dangerous.

It's the projects (only one of which is in Far Rock) that have high crime. Outside of the projects Far Rock is decent. There's even a quite nice rapidly expanding (mostly Orthodox Jewish) portion that covers the bulk of the northern and eastern reaches of Far Rock. Lots of teardowns, McMansions and newly constructed yeshivas and religious structures.

ZippyTheChimp
June 3rd, 2008, 07:45 AM
The Hammel Houses are west of Arverne, at B 83rd St. Crime in this area is nowhere near levels in the past.

Besides the land-clearing urban renewal of the 60s, the Boardwalk and beach were isolated by Robert Moses' Shore Front Parkway (http://www.nycroads.com/roads/shore-front-rockaways/), a highway planned highway from the Hamptons to the Marine Parkway Bridge. B 73rd St (http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne046cnu3.jpg) is as far east as it got. The 100 foot jog south in the Boardwalk at B 108th St marks the western end of the parkway.

The parkway also cut off Rockaways' Playland (http://www.farrockaway.com/carol/morpPlayland1.html) at B 98th St from the Boardwalk, hastening its demise.

submachine
June 5th, 2008, 09:51 AM
Phase I sold out; phase II 90% sold

Instead of repeating their website lingo, put up some real numbers.

Total units sold?

Time on market before being sold?

ZippyTheChimp
June 5th, 2008, 01:26 PM
^
My information is based on the website, actually going to the neighborhood many times since the project began, noting the level of occupation, and speaking to construction workers and one sales rep (people get curious when you're taking pictures.)

I am not interested in the selling price, nor the rate of sale; I have no interest in living or investing in the neighborhood. There are several types or units, some with rentals. At any rate, people have been buying pre-built.

I doubt that Goldman Sachs would continue to provide funding for construction in Phase III if I and II were a failure.

If you want me to dig out more detailed financial records, you're going to have to show me that you're more than a lazy troll that doesn't have a clue as to what he's talking about.

Provide an authoritative source that the project is in financial difficulty, or shut up.


BTW, this is your last warning.

williedigital
June 7th, 2008, 01:09 AM
I'm originally from NC, but am living in Manhattan for the Summer. I've traveled far and wide in this nation, but today was my first trip to the Rockaways. I knew very little about the area beyond the wikipedia page, but wanted to see what it was like out by the sea in nyc.

I took the bridge that goes over the Gateway rec area ($2.50 toll, grrrr). and drove down to the west end of the "island" first, driving through the little retail area, which seemed nice enough before stopping at the Riis beachhouse, which was stunningly beautiful but weirdly deserted. The parks ranger on duty seemed resigned to Rockaway as a place that was nice once, but isn't now, but will be better with the ferry service from manhattan. For someone who's never considered the idea of urban ferry service, why would someone pay $6 for an hourlong ferry ride rather than $2 for an hour long subway ride? What am I missing here? Just a better view and you don't have as much interaction with poor people?

In any case, I left Riis and headed toward what I knew to be the "bad" end of the island. Lots of kids (school just get out?) were hanging out at the beach, playing basketball, etc. Lots of non-white skincolor, but that seems to be the norm anywhere but Manhattan. The parks were all somewhat beautifully decrepit. I drove through the knew condo housing thing that the topic of so much discussion here. Having grown up in a rural coastal town which is seeing similar development, I find them sort of ugly and boring, but I recognize that everyone wants to live by the ocean, and you can't blame them for that.

I kept going east, hoping to run into some of these "bad" areas, mostly just because I was curious as to what a project building on the beach looked like, and I didn't really see anything so bad. Most of the time I was asking my partner, whether they thought it was the jects or just regular residential housing, so I guess nothing was so bad to set off any alarm bells.

That said, this evening I've been watching the multitude of far rockaway videos on youtube (many filmed in these projects), and they certainly make the case that yes, there is low income housing and activities associated with this housing in far rockaway.

At approximately what streets does the rock start to get rough? All the people "repping" in the youtube videos are showing streets signs in the 20's and teens and am just curious how high the crimeish areas run to.

submachine
June 7th, 2008, 10:56 AM
I have no interest in living or investing in the neighborhood.

Now thats something we agree on! :D I have no interest in living or investing in the neighborhood because its a dump, surrounded by the worst crime and desolation of any neighborhood in any borough of NYC.

If the developers were smarter, they would have made it gated. They weren't, so they didn't.

If the city were smarter, they would privatize and re-develop the horde of housing projects and nursing homes into condos.

Rockaway could have been a highly desirable place to live, but every step of the way there is failure.

ASchwarz
June 7th, 2008, 02:27 PM
because its a dump, surrounded by the worst crime and desolation of any neighborhood in any borough of NYC.

This is a lie and you know it. The Rockaways aren't close to the highest crime neighborhoods in New York. Nor do they have the highest proportion of vacancies or vacant land.



If the developers were smarter, they would have made it gated. They weren't, so they didn't.


The developers are among the largest and most successful residential builders in the Northeast, so I would trust their real estate acumen over yours.

Besides, if you knew anything about the site, you would know that it was city-owned land, and the idea was to integrate it with the larger neighborhood, so a gated community would be out of the question.



If the city were smarter, they would privatize and re-develop the horde of housing projects and nursing homes into condos.


You seem to have a fairly expansive ego for someone speaking without any first-hand knowledge of the Rockaways or the real estate market.

Housing projects are funded by the feds and nursing homes are funded by the state.

Most of the housing complexes in the Rockaways are not NYCHA or nursing homes, but middle-income Mitchell-Lama or Section 236/RAP developments, but you already know that, right???



Rockaway could have been a highly desirable place to live, but every step of the way there is failure


Maybe that's why it has more new housing going up than any other neighborhood in Queens? It's been #1 in new building permits for a couple of years running.

And would that be why a number of the Arverne units have sold for over $1 million? The buyers in Arverne almost all make six figures, and most make well into the six figures.

And what about all those teardowns and McMansions in Far Rockaway? The Orthodox Jewish community is booming, and pays big money to live close to the synagogues and schuls. Seems like a pretty desirable area, where the only "failure" is one of demand outstripping supply.

ASchwarz
June 7th, 2008, 02:43 PM
For someone who's never considered the idea of urban ferry service, why would someone pay $6 for an hourlong ferry ride rather than $2 for an hour long subway ride? What am I missing here? Just a better view and you don't have as much interaction with poor people?

Ferry service is faster than subway service. Also, many people live close to the proposed ferry stops, which are all far from the subway.



Lots of non-white skincolor, but that seems to be the norm anywhere but Manhattan.

Definitely false. The whitest areas of the city are outside of Manhattan. Manhattan is the place where the races mix the most, and the Boroughs tend to have some racial divisions by neighborhood, but that is receding.

Also, the stereotype of inner city = nonwhite and suburbs = white is a myth of the past. The fact is that the black population in the city is declining and the white population is rising, and the inverse is true in the suburbs. This phenomenon is not limited to New York. It's happening in Boston, DC, San Francisco, Seattle, Atlanta and a few others.


I kept going east, hoping to run into some of these "bad" areas, mostly just because I was curious as to what a project building on the beach looked like, and I didn't really see anything so bad. Most of the time I was asking my partner, whether they thought it was the jects or just regular residential housing, so I guess nothing was so bad to set off any alarm bells.

Projects always have distinctive NYCHA signage. Most of the housing complexes in the Rockaways are middle-income complexes.


That said, this evening I've been watching the multitude of far rockaway videos on youtube (many filmed in these projects), and they certainly make the case that yes, there is low income housing and activities associated with this housing in far rockaway.

Agreed, but youtube videos are obviously not a statistically sound manner of determining the "roughness" of a neighborhood. I doubt the neighborhood's old ladies or the Orthodox Jews are posting too many videos on Youtube.


At approximately what streets does the rock start to get rough? All the people "repping" in the youtube videos are showing streets signs in the 20's and teens and am just curious how high the crimeish areas run to.

The Eastern Rockaways have all the "tough" parts. There are really no tough neighborhoods, but rather tough isolated housing projects, such as the Redfern Houses. The problem is not neighborhood-specific but housing development-specific. The same "issues" are present in public housing throughout the city regardless of neighborhood, though it is true that NYCHA is much safer and better run than other big-city housing agencies in the U.S. (which is why they're trying to fix it rather than just giving up and destroying it like virtually every other U.S. city).

submachine
June 9th, 2008, 07:17 AM
The Rockaways aren't close to the highest crime neighborhoods in New York.

False. 101 Precinct has the worst crime in the city.


a gated community would be out of the question.

False. It is always an option and the developers failed.


Housing projects are funded by the feds

Housing projects have been and are now being privatized in NYC.


And would that be why a number of the Arverne units have sold for over $1 million?

That unknown "number" is multi-family rentals.


Ferry service is faster than subway service. Also, many people live close to the proposed ferry stops, which are all far from the subway.

False rationale, williedigital was right when he said "you don't have as much interaction with poor people"


Manhattan is the place where the races mix the most

False. Queens is the most diverse borough in the city (and nation).


The problem is not neighborhood-specific but housing development-specific. The same "issues" are present in public housing throughout the city regardless of neighborhood.

Once again, false. The reason why Arverne is priced so incredibly low, only to achieve one of the slowest selling developments in the city, is more than enough evidence to prove you wrong. And its that kind of thinking that led Arverne to think they can make a new community without making it gated. False again.

williedigital
June 9th, 2008, 09:14 AM
Ferry service is faster than subway service. Also, many people live close to the proposed ferry stops, which are all far from the subway.

Definitely false. The whitest areas of the city are outside of Manhattan. Manhattan is the place where the races mix the most, and the Boroughs tend to have some racial divisions by neighborhood, but that is receding.

Also, the stereotype of inner city = nonwhite and suburbs = white is a myth of the past. The fact is that the black population in the city is declining and the white population is rising, and the inverse is true in the suburbs. This phenomenon is not limited to New York. It's happening in Boston, DC, San Francisco, Seattle, Atlanta and a few others.

Right. NYC seems to follow the mold of most large cities, in that the inner-inner portions of the city are becoming predominately white because of the high prices, and the suburbs are become "ethnic enclaves". So far from what I can tell in NYC, manhattanites are crazy-rich, mostly white, and of a whole different mindset than found almost anywhere else in the world (perhaps only silicon valleyites are living in such a different world in the US). The parts of Brooklyn close to Manhattan seem filled with young (mostly white) hipsters--the kind of people who would have once lived in junky places in lower manhattan but can't afford it anymore. Queens is very ethnically diverse. That's about as far as I've been able to personally ascertain, but I find the development patterns interesting.


Projects always have distinctive NYCHA signage. Most of the housing complexes in the Rockaways are middle-income complexes.

Right, I've seen the NYCHA signs other places, but I guess I wasn't looking closely enough in Rockaway area. I guess my point was that there were no external signs that would lead one to assume they were in a particularly rough neighborhood, or that a certain building was rougher than any other. Granted this was noon on a Tuesday, but I didn't see anyone on any corners or any large groups of unemployed men congregated in courtyards, which are the kinds of signs one can normally spot throughout the country. The buildings all seemed reasonably well kept up. Of course, this might all be tempered by the fact that I was recently traveling in the Gulf coast, which is pretty unbelievably grimy in areas.

Agreed, but youtube videos are obviously not a statistically sound manner of determining the "roughness" of a neighborhood. I doubt the neighborhood's old ladies or the Orthodox Jews are posting too many videos on Youtube.

This is true, but the mere presence of that element is enough to dissuade some from considering the area. The one video I have in mind showed about 50 people in a courtyard, several wearing bullet proof vests/brandishing guns. At the end of the video, several of them emptied clips into the air. While I recognize that the vast majority of crime associated with these young men would be contained to the very immediate area of their buildings and directed at each other, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that it would not be a wise move to encounter these guys on your block in the middle of the night after either of you have had a drink or two. This is why I ask how far out onto the peninsula these projects extend. All the youtube videos show street signs for beach 21st and similar corners.


The Eastern Rockaways have all the "tough" parts. There are really no tough neighborhoods, but rather tough isolated housing projects, such as the Redfern Houses. The problem is not neighborhood-specific but housing development-specific. The same "issues" are present in public housing throughout the city regardless of neighborhood, though it is true that NYCHA is much safer and better run than other big-city housing agencies in the U.S. (which is why they're trying to fix it rather than just giving up and destroying it like virtually every other U.S. city).

I complement them for not giving up, but wonder if there has been any talk of tearing them down. I just can't believe that the city doesn't see how valuable that land could be and how much of a tax base they could develop it into. Hell, the property taxes alone could fund some amazing public housing, that might help solve some of the "issues". Lots of ways to fix a problem.

ASchwarz
June 10th, 2008, 12:43 AM
Now you are clearly just spamming for kicks.


False. 101 Precinct has the worst crime in the city. .

FALSE.

East NY's 75th has been the highest crime precient for many years. Rockaways aren't even close. Nothing in Queens comes close.


False. It is always an option and the developers failed. .

FALSE.

The site was HPD urban renewal land, which does not allow gated communities. The developers did not choose the site plan, they bid on an existing, approved site plan


Housing projects have been and are now being privatized in NYC. .

FALSE.

No NYCHA project has ever been privatized. Not one unit.



That unknown "number" is multi-family rentals.
.
FALSE.

The $1 million+ sales are all attached two-family townhouses.

There are presently no apartment rentals within the complex, unless you are including the one accessory unit in each two-family townhouse.



False rationale, williedigital was right when he said "you don't have as much interaction with poor people"
.

FALSE.

Williedigital never made such a claim.

I used to live in Bushwick, which was definitely poor at the time. As for Averne, there is nothing remotely poor about this complex. I sure as heck couldn't afford it.



False. Queens is the most diverse borough in the city (and nation).

NON-SEQUITUR.

I never referenced Queens' diversity. You, on the other hand, claimed it was all poor people.


Once again, false. The reason why Arverne is priced so incredibly low, only to achieve one of the slowest selling developments in the city, is more than enough evidence to prove you wrong. And its that kind of thinking that led Arverne to think they can make a new community without making it gated. False again.

FALSE.

If you think units priced over $1 million (and nothing under 500k) is "incredibly low", then you must be a very wealthy man.

Consdering the median price of a home in the U.S. is around 200K, the cheapest units at Arverne are far beyond the means of a typical American.

submachine
June 10th, 2008, 09:14 AM
East NY's 75th has been the highest crime precient for many years.

"Precient"? Enough of your shilling for Arverne, time to dismiss you once and for all:

http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/queens/2008/01/08/2008-01-08_101st_precinct_tops_list_for_worst_crime.html
101st precinct tops list for worst crime

BY BRENDAN BROSH
DAILY NEWS WRITER
Tuesday, January 8th 2008, 4:00 AM
At a time when serious crime is near an all-time low in New York City, one Queens precinct is at the top of a dubious list.
The 101st Precinct leads all city stationhouses in the percentage increase of serious crimes.
Felony assaults, burglaries and grand larceny are all dramatically up for the Far Rockaway precinct in the NYPD's preliminary Compstat report for 2007.
The precinct saw a 9.15% increase in serious crimes compared with 2006.
As the NYPD touts its own success and points to a 6.2% reduction in crime citywide, Far Rockaway community leaders are disturbed by the 101st Precinct's lackluster performance.
"The neighborhood is saturated with firearms," said Ed Williams of the Far Rockaway NAACP. "Young folks have nothing to do here."
The 101st Precinct's numbers run counter to citywide trends, with burglaries in the area up 30%, felony assaults up 19% and grand larceny up nearly 21%. Unemployment, poor public transportation and housing problems are contributing factors to the increase, locals said.
"Most of these crimes are against property - crimes of poverty," said Councilman James Sanders, who represents the area. "We have not been successful in creating jobs, in creating opportunities for local people.
"Crime has decreased everywhere in the city except in public housing and we have one-third of all public housing in Queens," Sanders added.
Capt. Brian McMahon was named commanding officer of the 101st Precinct in 2006, and crime has increased nearly 14% in the past two years, according to the Compstat figures.
Repeated attempts to contact McMahon through the 101st Precinct and the Police Department's press office were unsuccessful.

ZippyTheChimp
June 10th, 2008, 09:50 AM
False. 101 Precinct has the worst crime in the city.


East NY's 75th has been the highest crime precient for many years. Rockaways aren't even close. Nothing in Queens comes close.


http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/queens/2008/01/08/2008-01-08_101st_precinct_tops_list_for_worst_crime.html
101st precinct tops list for worst crime BY BRENDAN BROSH
DAILY NEWS WRITER
Tuesday, January 8th 2008, 4:00 AM
At a time when serious crime is near an all-time low in New York City, one Queens precinct is at the top of a dubious list.
The 101st Precinct leads all city stationhouses in the percentage increase of serious crimes.
Ironically, you highlighted the passage that you misinterpreted.

You said 101 had the HIGHEST crime rate. The article stated the 101 had the HIGHEST INCREASE.

The 75 and 101 aren't even close.

Crime stats 75 Precinct (http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloads/pdf/crime_statistics/cs075pct.pdf)

Crime stats 101 Precinct (http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloads/pdf/crime_statistics/cs101pct.pdf)

**The rest of you post was deleted for reasons I already warned you about. You can think it over for a week.

Loosh
June 11th, 2008, 08:25 PM
Not sure whats going on here but ASchwarz is wrong about new developments, there is a gated development in Brooklyn that used to be housing projects, right here- http://www.meadowwoodatgateway.com/

They are extremely low-priced for new NYC construction, as are the prices in Arverne- http://curbed.com/archives/2008/01/04/friday_reader_rant_about_those_100k_brooklyn_condo s.php

The reason for both is the same, those neighborhoods are extremely undesirable to live in. Not sure why this is even in debate. :confused:

As far as Rockaway, there is a part that is a highly desirable place to live because it is a private gated development called "Breezy Point". Likewise, the pricing reflects that, it is very high, for old homes.

ZippyTheChimp
June 12th, 2008, 11:59 PM
I took the bridge that goes over the Gateway rec area ($2.50 toll, grrrr). and drove down to the west end of the "island" first, driving through the little retail areaThe western end of the peninsula is young land. Toward the end of the 19th century, the terminus was about where the bridge is. Land was being added at the rate of 100 yards per year, and the jetty was built at Breezy Point in the 1930s for fear the channel would be closed.

Riis Park was a Naval Air Station in 1917. The first transatlantic flight originated there in 1919. To the west of the NAS was Fort Tilden, also built in 1917. The NAS was decommissioned in 1930, Fort Tilden in 1974. The two communities west of the bridge are Breezy Point and Roxbury, both part of the same cooperative. They are really summer communities, losing two-thirds their population the rest of the year.

Fort Tilden has been allowed to return to its natural state, including the beach.

http://www.pbase.com/zippythechimp/image/15173603.jpg



which seemed nice enough before stopping at the Riis beachhouse, which was stunningly beautiful but weirdly deserted. The parks ranger on duty seemed resigned to Rockaway as a place that was nice once, but isn't now, but will be better with the ferry service from manhattan.Notoriously underfunded by the NPS. It took decades to get the beachhouse restored. If you go there during the summer on a weekend, the beach will be crowded. The boardwalk ends at Neponsit, and resumes at B 125th St. Street parking during the summer extremely restricted, so if you want to go ny car, Riis is the only lot. The curved section of the beach is huge, over 500 feet deep.

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/5382/rockaway02gpq9.th.jpg (http://img183.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway02gpq9.jpg)


For someone who's never considered the idea of urban ferry service, why would someone pay $6 for an hourlong ferry ride rather than $2 for an hour long subway ride?For the western end of the peninsula, the subway is 2 miles away, and it heads in the wrong direction for another mile before crossing the bay.


--------------------

Quite a bit of misinformation being posted here by people who don't know what they're talking about.

A common perception is that the Rockaways are small. Although the peninsula is narrow, it's 10.5 miles long (Manhattan is 13 miles long).

The Arverne and Arverne East projects are large with respect to the impact on the two neighborhoods, and Rockaway Beach to the west...
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/8241/arverne01cls7.th.jpg (http://img98.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne01cls7.jpg)

but are a small part of the peninsula...
http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/5030/arverne02cfp1.th.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne02cfp1.jpg)


I've gathered some photos (some are a few years old) of Rockaway neighborhoods.

Just east of Riis Park is Neponsit, from B 149 to B 142. It was built as an affluent neighborhood in the early 20th century, and remains so.

http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/9033/rockaway32sa9.th.jpg (http://img388.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway32sa9.jpg) http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/7889/rockaway33mu5.th.jpg (http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway33mu5.jpg) http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/6715/rockaway34jo7.th.jpg (http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway34jo7.jpg) http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/8227/rockaway35ut6.th.jpg (http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway35ut6.jpg) http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/2418/rockaway31vy0.th.jpg (http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway31vy0.jpg) http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/9351/rockaway07er0.th.jpg (http://img502.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway07er0.jpg) http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/4581/rockaway08ok2.th.jpg (http://img502.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway08ok2.jpg)

That ranch lost its complimentary wind-sculpted pines, and a couple of McMansions were built nearly.

Next door, this looks like it's trying to be a Riverside Dr townhouse.
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/306/rockaway09ky5.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway09ky5.jpg)

And across the street, four lots on two streets were used to assemble this pastiche of styling cliches.
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/6331/rockaway10uf7.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway10uf7.jpg) http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4907/rockaway11ga0.th.jpg (http://img80.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway11ga0.jpg)

I have no photos of Belle Harbor, but it's a downscale version of Neponsit, smaller lots and houses (except at the beachfront). The neighborhood runs to B125th St. Predominately Irish and Jewish, many police and firefighters live in Belle Harbor.

Old photos Neponsit and Belle Harbor (http://www.farrockaway.com/carol/morpBelleHarbor_Neponsit.html)
The "Entrance to Neponsit" is now the malled Rockaway Beach Blvd.

ZippyTheChimp
June 13th, 2008, 12:47 AM
At B 125 St, the boardwalk resumes, and the neighborhood is Rockaway Park, with a decidedly different look.
http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/1104/rockaway23mj1.th.jpg (http://img166.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway23mj1.jpg)

Beachfront houses
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/5299/rockaway16yk3.th.jpg (http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway16yk3.jpg)

were replaced with apartment buildings, pre and post war.

http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/6107/rockaway15du3.th.jpg (http://img166.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway15du3.jpg) http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/5334/rockaway17pn1.th.jpg (http://img112.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway17pn1.jpg) http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/109/rockaway18xd9.th.jpg (http://img112.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway18xd9.jpg) http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/2102/rockaway19nf5.th.jpg (http://img71.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway19nf5.jpg)

Sidestreets remain lowrise.
http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/7433/rockaway21bt2.th.jpg (http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway21bt2.jpg) http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/9202/rockaway22oi0.th.jpg (http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway22oi0.jpg)

A former small hotel?
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/7843/rockaway36kz3.th.jpg (http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway36kz3.jpg)

New building, about ready for occupation. The Seavon (http://www.theseavon.com/)
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/9800/rockaway14bg1.th.jpg (http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway14bg1.jpg)


At the ocean side of B 116 St, the main commercial street. another new building, and the Flight 587 Memorial.

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/9177/rockaway37jr8.th.jpg (http://img73.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway37jr8.jpg) http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/2025/rockaway05cl6.th.jpg (http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway05cl6.jpg) http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/6202/rockaway04wu1.th.jpg (http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway04wu1.jpg) http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/6074/rockaway30bp4.th.jpg (http://img388.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway30bp4.jpg) http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/7505/rockaway06zh0.th.jpg (http://img182.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway06zh0.jpg)

Faded glory
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/9122/rockaway03po1.th.jpg (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway03po1.jpg)

Lat year. the A-train station was being renovated.
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/341/rockaway01ao1.th.jpg (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway01ao1.jpg)

An old photo of the station here. (http://www.farrockaway.com/carol/morpSubway_Nostalgia.html)

view south on B 116 St
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/889/rockaway28ey7.th.jpg (http://img123.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway28ey7.jpg) http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/1103/rockaway02ns9.th.jpg (http://img123.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway02ns9.jpg)

B116 St and Beach Channel Drive. Anywhere USA. A mess.
http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/7982/rockaway27ut1.th.jpg (http://img181.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway27ut1.jpg) http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/8268/rockaway29px5.th.jpg (http://img376.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway29px5.jpg)

The bay side of B 116 St also has a memorial, to 09/11.
http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/456/rockaway12af0.th.jpg (http://img376.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway12af0.jpg) http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/2609/rockaway13yo3.th.jpg (http://img376.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway13yo3.jpg)

East past B 116th, Rockaway Beach Blvd deteriorates.
http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/6563/rockaway24fg2.th.jpg (http://img361.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway24fg2.jpg) http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/7334/rockaway25jb5.th.jpg (http://img361.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway25jb5.jpg) http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/382/rockaway26jw6.th.jpg (http://img361.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway26jw6.jpg)

ZippyTheChimp
June 13th, 2008, 01:44 AM
Rockaway Park becomes Rockaway Beach at B 98 St, and continues to Arverne at B 73.

Rockaway Beach has probably suffered most from mid 20th century destruction. Besides the wholesale land clearing at Arverne, there was the influence of Robert Moses.

Good Moses built the two bridges which increased access to the peninsula, but Bad Moses intended to build a parkway to drive through it from the Hamptons to Brooklyn. A segment was built, Shore Front Parkway (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shore_Front_Parkway), from B 108 to B73. It was intended to be wider than the present two lanes, encompassing the playgrounds that now abut the boardwalk. Add the towers-in-the-park to the mix, and you get a non urban landscape.

In addition, the parkway cut off Rockaway Playland from the boardwalk, hastening its demise.

Six pages of Rockaway Playland photos (http://www.farrockaway.com/carol/morpPlayland1.html). Last one is depressing.

There's quite a bit of construction going on here. none of the architecture is particularly impressive, and some is really awful.

B 94th leads to the Cross Bay Bridge.
http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4855/rockaway38fe2.th.jpg (http://img354.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway38fe2.jpg) http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/3340/rockaway39rn3.th.jpg (http://img354.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway39rn3.jpg) http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/3024/rockaway40jn5.th.jpg (http://img354.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway40jn5.jpg)


http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/7388/rockaway41zr8.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway41zr8.jpg) http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/3820/rockaway42kz5.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway42kz5.jpg) http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/1868/rockaway43jk7.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway43jk7.jpg) http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/7610/rockaway44ys1.th.jpg (http://img403.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway44ys1.jpg) http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/1729/rockaway45ky2.th.jpg (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway45ky2.jpg) http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/2104/rockaway46pw9.th.jpg (http://img511.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway46pw9.jpg)

B 84th St. At the end of this line of buildings is Arverne.
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8609/rockaway47kq7.th.jpg (http://img511.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway47kq7.jpg)

The big bad Hammel Houses are up the street.
http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8338/rockaway48vn0.th.jpg (http://img511.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway48vn0.jpg) http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/5347/rockaway49np3.th.jpg (http://img511.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway49np3.jpg)

Hammels is one of two towns (the other was Holland) that in 1897 merged to form the village of Rockaway Beach, but it was gobbled up by Greater New York the following year, despite several attempts at secession.

The church in the photo is St Rose of Lima, and can be seen in the old photo on this page. (http://www.farrockaway.com/carol/morpHolland_Hammels2.html)

Like I've been saying, the main problem at Rockaway is too much of this:
http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/4371/rockaway50vp9.th.jpg (http://img116.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rockaway50vp9.jpg)

Main page of Old Rockaway Photos. (http://www.farrockaway.com/carol/moreoldrockawayintro.html)

Good resource.

sfenn1117
June 13th, 2008, 04:20 PM
Thanks a lot for those photos Zip. Outer borough neighborhoods don't get covered on here nearly enough.

ASchwarz
June 13th, 2008, 05:26 PM
Not sure whats going on here but ASchwarz is wrong about new developments, there is a gated development in Brooklyn that used to be housing projects, right here- http://www.meadowwoodatgateway.com/ ]
Hi, Submachine! Nice to have you back!

Meadowwood at Gateway was NOT a housing project. It was a middle-income Mitchell-Lama development that has since been converted to condos.

Mitchell Lamas are NOT low-income. In fact, they have no maximum income limits. There are many six-figure households in Mitchell Lamas.


They are extremely low-priced for new NYC construction, as are the prices in Arverne- http://curbed.com/archives/2008/01/04/friday_reader_rant_about_those_100k_brooklyn_condo s.php ]

What does a condo development in East New York have to do with townhouses in Arverne? Take a look at a map - they are many miles apart. Why not compare Arverne to McMansions in outer NJ while you're at it?


The reason for both is the same, those neighborhoods are extremely undesirable to live in. Not sure why this is even in debate. :confused:

The pricing at Arverne is five times higher than that of Meadowood at Gateway.

A neighborhood with million-dollar rowhouses is "undesirable"? Maybe compared to Park Avenue.



As far as Rockaway, there is a part that is a highly desirable place to live because it is a private gated development called "Breezy Point". Likewise, the pricing reflects that, it is very high, for old homes.

The most expensive parts of the Rockaways are not private, nor gated. They are public, and right on the ocean.

Breezy Point is hardly the nicest or most expensive part of the Rockaways. It certainly doesn't have an upscale reputation. In fact, I think it's cheaper than Arverne.

L00SH
June 17th, 2008, 06:21 AM
The actions of one moderator "ZippyTheChimp" such as banning members as well as censoring and editing posts that do not praise certain developments suggest he has a paid interest for promotion. The most recent evidence is below, a post was completely deleted and the reason given was "Blatant Spam". There is no spam, as can be seen here: http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s42/ArthurLange/x.gif Edward has already been contacted to take notice if this post will be deleted, as I and others are very interested to learn if this mods actions reflect the Wired New York owners. If it does, we will spend considerable time making it known that if you have a negative comment about a development, your post will be removed (excuse:"spam", your account will be canceled because the moderators have a hidden interest in promotion. If the actions of the moderator "ZippyTheChimp" do not reflect the website than we will take notice of Wired New Yorks action against the moderator.

ZippyTheChimp
June 17th, 2008, 06:48 AM
Submachine:

You were given a one-week suspension. During that time, you had registered twice with other user-ids. I took no action, other than a warning.

Last night, one day before your suspension would have expired, you made another post under an assumed ID. Again, I didn't ban you, just extended the suspension. The post was removed for a rules-violation, not content.

Once again, you ignore me and re-register with a 4th ID. "Submachine" is permanently banned.


I sent you two PMs. Why didn't you post both of them.


Recipients: Loosh

http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/statusicon/post_old.gif June 16th, 2008, 10:44 PM
http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/image.php?u=2463&dateline=1191720346 (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/member.php?u=2463) ZippyTheChimp (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/member.php?u=2463) http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/statusicon/user_online.gif
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Battery Park City
Posts: 10,781


http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif Suspension
Submachine,

Your suspension has been extended 2 more weeks.

Do it again, and it's permanent.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/buttons/forward.gif (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/private.php?do=newpm&forward=1&pmid=33132) http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/buttons/reply_small.gif (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/private.php?do=newpm&pmid=33132)

NYatKNIGHT
June 17th, 2008, 05:23 PM
Submachine, you have been given more than ample leeway here. Don't flatter yoursellf that only someone with paid interest could disagree with you and your unsubstantiated negativity. If it makes you feel any better I would have suspended you weeks ago had I been part of the discussion.

BrooklynRider
June 22nd, 2008, 12:55 AM
Loosh-

You certainly showed poor form by posting a PM in a public post and an incredible depth of stupidity. We can usually depend on some entertaining posts from idiots. In that area, you disappointed us.

I fully agree with Zippy's actions and NYatKnight comments.

Edward is the Administrator of WiredNewYork. No one gets banned without his review and approval.

So, to answer your question, Zippy's actions enforce and demonstrate the intentions of the owners. As Moderators are recruited from long-term forum veterans of Wired New York, I'd go a step further and say that your ban represents a consensus of the forum community.

ZippyTheChimp
April 13th, 2009, 03:39 PM
Wonder how this project is doing. Haven't been out there since the econ collapse. Beach weather soon.

ZippyTheChimp
May 21st, 2009, 08:58 AM
I expected the worst, but the "Breakers" phase has been completed, and the sign says 90% sold.
http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/1614/arverne065c.th.jpg (http://img29.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne065c.jpg)

http://www.housingzone.com/probuilder/article/CA6646903.html

But nothing on the YMCA or the two retail sites.

No house building yet on the next phase, but site prep looks to be complete.

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/3604/arverne066c.th.jpg (http://img29.imageshack.us/my.php?image=arverne066c.jpg)

At the eastern edge of Arverne by the Sea (B 62 St), there's a smaller development, Waters Edge (http://www.briarwoodorg.com/A_Co_watersEdge.cfm).

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/2901/watersedge01c.th.jpg (http://img29.imageshack.us/my.php?image=watersedge01c.jpg) http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/4041/watersedge02c.th.jpg (http://img29.imageshack.us/my.php?image=watersedge02c.jpg)

Concrete block construction.
http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/1455/watersedge03c.th.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/my.php?image=watersedge03c.jpg) http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/733/watersedge04c.th.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/my.php?image=watersedge04c.jpg)

How much effort would it have taken to set the AC units flush with the facade?
http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/5340/watersedge05c.th.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/my.php?image=watersedge05c.jpg)

BrooklynRider
May 21st, 2009, 10:03 AM
I lived at the beach in Long Beach for 10 years.

I was three houses in from the beach proper itself. I never had an air conditioner. It's not necessary.

nyn8tv
August 2nd, 2010, 12:47 AM
Hello: I'm a displaced New Yorker who's been residing in Virginia for nearly 20 years. My husband and I are contemplating moving back to NY to be closer to my parents (who are in Nassau County) and we want easy access to Manhattan. My mother had suggested a condo development in the Rockaways called Waters Edge Condominiums at Averne.

I was looking more on Long Beach. However, I pulled up some info on the Condos at Averne, but the city profile was less illuminating indicating crime levels, especially personal crime (murder, rape, etc.) are much higher in that zip code compared to the NY State average and national average.

One article I read about these particular condos was that some (or maybe all, I don't remember) are government subsidized. Years ago, that meant public housing/low income. Is that the case here? We're looking for more of a middle to upper middle class environment, better yet, a socio-economic mix, and I've not been able to find those sort of details in my online searches.

Does anyone have opinions on this neighborhood and the condos? I love the idea the development is on the beach and the A train is right there, plus it's an easy drive to to Merrick. However, the crime stats are of concern to me, and if any one lives in this area and can share their thoughts that will very much be appreciated, as we'd like to know more. Also, I'm concerned about the closeness to JFK. Is flight noise a problem?

Here is the link that provided the profiles so it's clear where my information came from:
http://www.moving.com/real-estate/city-profile/details.asp?format=popup&Zip=11692&SectionID=6&SectionName=Personal+Crime+Risk#Personal_Crime_Ris k

Thank you for your input, it is greatly appreciated.

Merry
October 1st, 2010, 08:36 PM
The South Edgemere Wasteland

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_CQxI0Yhn97w/TKLJzvMKkDI/AAAAAAAACTg/TjvoFW6VSv0/s400/kensinger_edgemere_DSC_1953_small.jpg (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_CQxI0Yhn97w/TKLJzvMKkDI/AAAAAAAACTg/TjvoFW6VSv0/s1600/kensinger_edgemere_DSC_1953_small.jpg)

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_CQxI0Yhn97w/TKLMAyf3FYI/AAAAAAAACVQ/bZSws6cAJkw/s400/kensinger_edgemere_DSC_0196small.jpg (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_CQxI0Yhn97w/TKLMAyf3FYI/AAAAAAAACVQ/bZSws6cAJkw/s1600/kensinger_edgemere_DSC_0196small.jpg)

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_CQxI0Yhn97w/TKPijLl_DhI/AAAAAAAACWg/JWFiHHzuzxA/s400/kensinger_edgemere_DSC_2271_small.jpg (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_CQxI0Yhn97w/TKPijLl_DhI/AAAAAAAACWg/JWFiHHzuzxA/s1600/kensinger_edgemere_DSC_2271_small.jpg)

Edgemere is a Queens waterfront neighborhood split in two. In the north, residents live on the shores of Jamaica Bay. In the south, a vast plain covers more then 20 blocks of abandoned oceanfront. This city-owned wasteland is a part of the Arverne Urban Renewal Area, and may soon be redeveloped as Arverne East. Stretching along the Rockaway shoreline from Beach 32nd Street to Beach 56th Place, this property has remained empty for decades. Forgotten New York (http://www.forgotten-ny.com/STREET%20SCENES/endofqueens/bridge.html) once called it "one of the eeriest places in New York City," while New York Magazine (http://nymag.com/realestate/neighborhoods/2010/65358/) has described the Arverne renewal area as "barren blocks and de-mapped streets merging with the emptiness of the ocean to form a single great desolation... a testing ground for urban entropy, a place where a man was once chased and mauled by a pack of wild dogs, a legacy of Lindsay-era slum clearance, Moses-era central-planning hubris, and native New York development inertia."

In a different era, Edgemere's seaside was a thriving resort, with grand hotels, a bustling boardwalk, and thousands of residents. Today, it is devoid of buildings and permanent residents, and "has stood vacant, except for plant life and wild dogs, for more than 35 years, when thousands of summer bungalows and stores were plowed under as part of the Arverne Urban Renewal Project, a massive building project that was put on hold and never revived," according to the Rockaway newspaper The Wave (http://www.rockawave.com/news/2007-01-12/Front_Page/001.html). The city continues to maintain the streets in south Edgemere - to some degree - with signs lurking in the bushes and new curb cuts floating like islands in the urban wilderness. But few sidewalks remain intact, most roadways are pockmarked with potholes or covered in shifting sands, and the entire area is used as a communal dumping ground. Clothing, mattresses, toys and used condoms are discarded in the middle of streets. Some remain undisturbed for over a month.

full article on Nathan Kensinger Photography blog (http://kensinger.blogspot.com/2010/09/south-edgemere-wasteland.html)

Merry
July 7th, 2012, 02:17 AM
Very nice (except for flooding http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6XMg0x52Uw).


Broad Channel Cottage for the Wildlife-Lover Asks $585K

by Jessica Dailey

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716af85216d32d3008aa8/House_deck01.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b085216d32d3008aab/House_deck01.jpg)

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b285216d32d3008ab8/House_deck02.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b185216d32d3008ab5/House_deck02.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b485216d32d3008ac2/House_deck6.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b385216d32d3008abf/House_deck6.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b685216d32d3008acc/Kitchen_01.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b585216d32d3008ac9/Kitchen_01.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b785216d32d3008ad6/Interior_bedroom2.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b785216d32d3008ad3/Interior_bedroom2.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b985216d32d3008ae0/Interior_bathroom.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716b885216d32d3008add/Interior_bathroom.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716ba85216d32d3008aea/Interior_bedroom.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716ba85216d32d3008ae7/Interior_bedroom.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716bc85216d32d3008af4/House_front.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716bb85216d32d3008af1/House_front.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716be85216d32d3008afe/House_deck5.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716bd85216d32d3008afb/House_deck5.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716bf85216d32d3008b08/House_deck4.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716bf85216d32d3008b05/House_deck4.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716c185216d32d3008b12/House_deck3.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ff716c185216d32d3008b0f/House_deck3.jpg)
(click to enlarge)

This 2-bedroom, 1-bath bungalow on Broad Channel island is currently listed for $585,000. Located at 34 West 12th Road, right on a canal off of Jamaica Bay, the 692-square-foot house has a private deck and boat dock. The current owner rents the cottage out for nightly, weekly, or monthly stays, and it is being sold fully-furnished, so the buyer can immediately start to do the same.

Listing: Broad Channel Canal Cottage (http://www.trulia.com/property/3089246537-34-W-12th-Rd-Broad-Channel-NY-11693) [Trulia]

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2012/07/06/broad_channel_cottage_for_the_wildlifelover_asks_5 85k.php#4ff7164385216d599c003e8d

Merry
July 21st, 2012, 01:14 AM
Really nice, but $3 million, wow.

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU756_hodqns_H_20120718173115.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU735_hodqns_H_20120718165522.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU736_hodqns_H_20120718165624.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU746_hodqns_H_20120718171538.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU749_hodqns_H_20120718171959.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU725_hodqns_H_20120718164339.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU751_hodqns_H_20120718172215.jpg

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-TU752_hodqns_H_20120718172341.jpg

Rachell Sirota, 62 years old, and her husband Howard, 63, purchased two lots on Rockaway Beach in 1993, according to public records. The couple moved to this sandy section Queens in order to build a home with panoramic ocean views that wouldn't require a trek to Long Island.. Ms. Sirota said they spent about $135,000 to buy the land, which included a bungalow that was torn down, and about $1 million to build the new home. Photo: Bryan Derballa for The Wall Street Journal

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444873204577535282954498496.html?m od=WSJ_RealEstate_LeftTopNews#close

kyle
July 23rd, 2012, 10:15 AM
I see this house all the time and wondered the story behind it.

lofter1
August 1st, 2012, 07:43 PM
Sandcastle Competition

CREATIVE TIME (http://creativetime.org/programs/?v=programs)
Multiple Artists
2012

Rockaway Beach, NY

Ricci Albenda, Jen Catron & Paul Outlaw, Jen DeNike, William Lamson, Marie Lorenz, Mary Mattingly, Ryan McNamara, Kenya (Robinson), Dustin Yellin, and others

This summer, Creative Time is heading to Far Rockaway to host its inaugural artist sandcastle competition!

On Friday, August 17th starting at 3PM, artists including Ricci Albenda, Jen Catron & Paul Outlaw, Jen DeNike, William Lamson, Marie Lorenz, Mary Mattingly, Ryan McNamara, Kenya (Robinson), and Dustin Yellin will gather on the beach beneath the 86th Street Boardwalk on Rockaway Beach in Queens to battle it out for special prizes from esteemed judges. Local food vendor favorites, including DiCosmo’s Ices, The Big Banana, Santa Salsa and more will be onsite to keep artists and audiences alike well provisioned with summer snacks and refreshments. Starting at 6PM, we’ll move the party from the beach to the boardwalk for burgers and beer at Rippers, featuring tunes by DJ iDEATH. Just take the A train to Broad Channel and then the Shuttle to 90th Street for a fun-filled day in the sun. See you on the beach!

Merry
April 17th, 2013, 08:26 AM
What a gorgeous little building.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/cornerspotter-041513.jpg

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/04/15/hint_a_changed_streetscape_but_this_building_looks _the_same.php

Not so its ridiculously close modern neighbour.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/cornerspotter-reveal-041613.jpg

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/04/16/cornerspotted_the_former_national_bank_of_far_rock away.php

Merry
April 27th, 2013, 01:39 AM
Good to see.


New life on tap for decrepit Rockaway Courthouse

Developer Uri Kaufman will pump $10 million into project and transform it into a medical facility

By Lisa L. Colangelo

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1327606.1366922289%21/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_635/str.jpg
Jeanne Noonan/for New York Daily News
The Rockaway Courthouse at 90-01 Beach Channel Drive in Rockaway, Queens

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/517a7fbef92ea11f7a03d304/800-8679105240_b4f2f2c980_b.jpg
(NYC Mayor's Office)
http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/04/26/abandoned_rockaway_courthouse_to_become_medical_ce nter.php

The city has finally agreed on a plan to transform the long-abandoned Rockaway Courthouse into a medical center.

Developer Uri Kaufman, whose Harmony Group has converted other historic structures into modern facilities, will purchase and renovate the 24,000-square-foot building into doctor’s offices and outpatient surgery suites, according to the city Economic Development Corp.

The deteriorating courthouse, built in 1932, sits on Beach Channel Drive near the foot of the Cross Bay Bridge. Despite its majestic exterior, residents have tagged it a decaying eyesore.

In return for pumping $10 million into the project, city officials said Kaufman’s company will be able to purchase it for $50,000.

“For over 30 years, the Rockaway Courthouse has sat vacant, a profound waste of this beautiful building,” Mayor Bloomberg said in a statement. “We have selected a developer who will not only renovate the space and return it to its former glory, but also turn it into a medical center. With the recent closure of a major nearby private hospital, this will help improve access to important medical care.”

Local officials, who had once hoped to turn the site into a cultural center for the community, conceded the medical center project makes sense.

“This will bring jobs to the area and restore a historic building,” said Dolores Orr, chairwoman of Community Board 14.

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1327605.1366922285%21/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_635/str.jpg
Jeanne Noonan/for New York Daily News

The courthouse closed in 1962 and was last used by an arts group in the 1970s. An ambitious plan to create a City University of New York facility on the site fell through several years ago.

The city has spent decades looking for a new use for the old building. The Daily News got an exclusive look inside the courthouse last year.

The interior had been gutted by time, weather and vandals. Few of the fixtures remain.

Earlier this year, Kaufman told The News the site had not sustained extensive damage during Superstorm Sandy. Kaufman also said a portion of the center could be used as an urgent care center.

“There’s really a need for this in Rockaway,” said Kaufman, noting that nearby Peninsula Hospital closed last year.

EDC President Seth Pinsky said it will also provide an “economic boost” for the community.

Officials estimate the project will bring 64 construction and 45 permanent jobs to Rockaway.

“This is great news for Rockaway that a blighted building will be cleaned up,” said Assemblyman Phil Goldfeder (D-Rockaway Beach).

https://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/health/new-life-tap-decrepit-rockaway-courthouse-article-1.1327607#ixzz2RZiFeee5

Merry
July 20th, 2013, 02:04 AM
Finalists Revealed for Stalled Rockaway Site's Redesign

by Sara Polsky

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805baf92ea11eb7013270/farroc1_ennead.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805bbf92ea11eb7013273/farroc1_ennead.jpg)
Part of the plan from Ennead Architects


Rebuilding is proceeding in the areas damaged by Hurricane Sandy, and one spot ripe for a new post-storm approach is Arverne East, an 80+-acre site first designated for development seven years ago (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2006/11/10/development_robbing_rockaways_of_postapocalyptic_f eel.php). Progress stopped amid the credit crisis, and the developers (and friends (http://www.farroc.com/sponsors/)) sought a new design through a two-phase competition announced several months ago (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/04/16/competition_launched_to_develop_stalled_rockaway_s ite.php). Four finalists, announced this morning, will each receive $30,000 to develop their proposals.

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805bef92ea11eb701327b/farroc2_ennead.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805bff92ea11eb701327e/farroc2_ennead.jpg)
Ennead Architects

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805c1f92ea11eb7013285/farroc3_white.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805c3f92ea148b301cc38/farroc3_white.jpg)
The plan from White Arkitekter

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805bff92ea148b301cc2e/farroc4_white.jpg
(http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805c1f92ea148b301cc31/farroc4_white.jpg) White Arkitekter

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805bbf92ea148b301cc23/farroc5_seeding.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805bdf92ea148b301cc26/farroc5_seeding.jpg)
The plan proposed by Seeding Office

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805b8f92ea148b301cc19/farroc6_seeding.jpg
(http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805b9f92ea148b301cc1c/farroc6_seeding.jpg) Seeding Office

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805b5f92ea148b301cc0e/farroc7_lateral.jpg
(http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805b6f92ea148b301cc11/farroc7_lateral.jpg) The proposal from Lateral Office

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805b2f92ea1108f02425f/farroc8_lateral.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/51e805b3f92ea1108f024262/farroc8_lateral.jpg)
Lateral Office

The four firms given the finalist nod, out of 117 submissions, were Ennead Architects, Lateral Office, Seeding Office, and White Arkitekter. Only Ennead is based in NYC—the other firms are based in Toronto, London, and Goteberg, Sweden. (Another six firms received honorable mentions (http://www.farroc.com/finalists/)—again with only one NYC-based entrant among them.) Each team has until October 7 to submit its final design, and the winner—to be announced October 24—will receive another $30,000 and the chance to be involved with the actual design of the site.
Here's the site in question:

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/arvernesiteuse_4_13-thumb.jpg (http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/arvernesiteuse_4_13.jpg)

Phase I Finalists (http://www.farroc.com/finalists/) [FAR ROC]

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/07/18/finalists_revealed_for_stalled_rockaway_sites_rede sign.php#more

Nexis4Jersey
July 21st, 2013, 05:35 PM
The Question is after Sandy should we even redevelop the Rockaways?

ASchwarz
July 21st, 2013, 06:08 PM
The Question is after Sandy should we even redevelop the Rockaways?

Why would we not? The vast majority of the Rockaways didn't suffer physical damage. Anything built in the last 50 years was fine. It was the ancient bungalows that got killed.

ZippyTheChimp
July 22nd, 2013, 09:04 AM
That's not true.

We have friends in Neponsit, and I was in the neighborhood after the hurricane. While their house wasn't destroyed, they had extensive damage. And many houses were destroyed. Even discounting the Belle Harbor fire (a direct result of the hurricane), an image search - sandy neponsit belle harbor damage - will convince you.

Also, a house can appear to be little damaged, and still be a total loss. That happened to a friend of mine in Long Beach LI. Foundation damage caused the house to be unsafe, and he has to demolish and rebuild.

The same can be said for public infrastructure. Most of it wasn't built to survive sea surge flooding.

One notable example is Arverne. It was designed to withstand flooding, and survived with little damage.

ZippyTheChimp
November 7th, 2013, 07:42 AM
Arverne View

L+M Development Partners was in contract to purchase the Ocean Village housing complex in Far Rockaway when Hurricane Sandy arrived. The sale was completed and the site renamed Arverne View. It's located along the boardwalk from Beach 59th St to Beach 56th St. To the west is the 117 acre Arverne by the Sea; to the east about a mile of vacant land in Edgemere.

Google boardwalk view (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=%22ocean+village%22rockaways&ll=40.587299,-73.787398&spn=0.015709,0.035834&fb=1&gl=us&hq=%22ocean+village&hnear=Rockaway+Peninsula&t=h&fll=40.593393,-73.78624&fspn=0.015707,0.052185&z=15&layer=c&cbll=40.587228,-73.795893&panoid=wKmz69g-leERVXH9tP8ATQ&cbp=12,80.58,,0,-0.47). To the left is Arverne by the Sea. The buildings at center are Arverne View.

I don't know if there are any plans to develop the over 100 acres of Edgemere. I think it should be made into a natural landscape buffer zone.

NY Times article Dec 2012:


A New Owner and, Many Hope, a New Lease on Life

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2012/12/26/nyregion/COMINGBACK1/COMINGBACK1-articleLarge-v2.jpg
The Ocean Village apartment complex in the Arverne section of the Rockaway Peninsula
was in poor condition even before Hurricane Sandy hit.

By SARAH MASLIN NIR
Published: December 25, 2012

There is a sparkling view of the now-docile Atlantic Ocean from the window of an apartment on the 19th floor of Building 2 of Ocean Village, an eyesore of a low-income housing complex in the Arverne section of the Rockaway Peninsula. Turn around, and the view is far less lovely. The apartment is empty, one of about 350 vacant units in the disheveled towers, its kitchen uprooted and walls smudged with grime.

The sole occupant is a photograph of a hugging couple; it is adrift on a floor of linoleumlike tiles, some curled back like potato peelings. The snapshot was probably here even before Hurricane Sandy kicked off about a month of waterless, heatless darkness in these buildings, where inhabitants were left in squalid conditions, feeling trapped, abandoned and afraid.

But soon that forgotten photo will be swept away by teams of builders who, beginning a few weeks ago, flooded the complex, even as its transformers remain knocked out, and are in the process of rehabbing each apartment. They are starting with the hundreds of vacant, mostly decrepit ones. It is the first phase of repair to Ocean Village by a real estate development company that assumed ownership of the property just last month, at last closing a deal that began well before the storm.

Once the vacant apartments are repaired, people displaced by the storm will be given priority to rent them, as part of a deal the new owner made with the city last month, said Ron Moelis, a founder and the chief executive of the company, L+M Development Partners.

“People said we were crazy when we closed on this” just after the storm, Mr. Moelis said in an interview. Talks to take over the property began last March, and were nearing completion the day the storm hit. Mr. Moelis cited what he called “a double-bottom line” of both commitment to residents suffering in a long-mismanaged building, and a financial obligation, as why the company went forward with the deal, even as the peninsula was brutalized by the storm.

“We are a for-profit company and we hope to make money doing this,” Mr. Moelis said of the building purchase. “But we didn’t shy away from doing this when it became much more difficult in the last few weeks.”

The company’s ultimate plan — a multimillion-dollar effort to re-clad the Brutalist buildings in warm-toned siding; rehabilitate unsightly common areas; and add social service centers, solar paneling and maybe even a bowling alley — will take two years, the developers say.

They hope to attract new renters to the abandoned apartments, as well as eventually fix apartments that have made residents miserable for years with mold, leaks and infestations, after decades of what critics say was mismanagement by the site’s former owners, Ocean Village Associates.

That company said the blame for the conditions lay with being unable to raise rents enough to cover necessary improvements and upgrades, because the building is part of the city’s Mitchell-Lama affordable housing program, according to a spokesman. “With the rents collected, we were barely able to provide essential services, such as heat, water, electric and security,” Donald Miller, the spokesman for Ocean Village Associates, said in a statement.

In early December, Mr. Moelis sat in a completed “model apartment” in one of the lower-slung buildings in the complex, a representation of what he said would be the finished product for every apartment in about 24 months. Renovations will cost $35,000 to $40,000 for each of the building’s 1,093 apartments.

It was crisp and new, an oasis from the stench of urine that perpetually fills the complex’s staircases. It is a far cry from just about any other apartment in the complex, said Keywan Cohen, 30, who stays at Ocean Village with his girlfriend. Mr. Cohen ducked into the model apartment at a reporter’s request, and found himself agog at the closet’s nonsticking sliding doors, and the fresh, corrosion-free kitchen fixtures.

“If they make all the apartments like this and they kick all the knuckleheads out, it will be a lot better,” Mr. Cohen said. Violence is a frequent occurrence in the complex, and came to a head when a bodega in the courtyard was bashed and robbed shortly after the storm. In the near month without power that followed, a young man was shot to death on Nov. 28 in one of the buildings. He was a friend, Mr. Cohen said, adding, “They’ve got to change more than the apartments.”

Though a majority of the complex’s problems predate the storm, its descent into post-hurricane chaos was exacerbated by poor construction and foolhardy design choices, said Richard Weinstock, the president of construction for L+M. There was no emergency lighting system, even in the windowless stairwells, for example, and the seaside building’s transformers were placed at the lowest elevation. After the surge, they were found submerged in 51 inches of saltwater, he said. “It’s astounding,” Mr. Weinstock said.

The new plans call for placing the building’s installations on higher floors out of the ocean’s path, and perhaps capitalizing on the seashore sunshine with photovoltaic cells on rooftops. On a recent afternoon, out the window of the vacant apartment on the 19th floor, workers could be spotted on nearly every one of the 11 buildings in the complex, shoring up leaky roofs and splashing down blue paint.

The bustle of industry did little to cheer Dianne Dukes, as she leaned against a scaffolding in the courtyard, watching workers cart drywall to and fro. In her apartment, water burbles up through her kitchen floor from leaky pipes, her cabinets are in splinters and her home is infested with cockroaches, she said, hazards for her two young grandchildren who live with her.

Like many of her neighbors, she said she was disgusted by L+M’s plan to spruce up the exterior of the complex and the empty apartments, and leave most of the homes of rent-paying tenants like her for last. “We don’t live on the outside; we live on the inside!” she said.

“They are trying to get it to where they can get new tenants to come into the complex to rent so they can make their money,” she added. “If you’re getting rent from me, why can’t I get what I deserve?” She burst into tears.

But for Ms. Dukes, at least, perhaps it will not matter either way. What happened here after the storm deeply traumatized her, Ms. Dukes said. She fled to her daughter’s house in Brooklyn, and for now returns to Ocean Village only to visit.

High above the courtyard of scurrying construction crews, Ms. Dukes’s apartment sits unoccupied. “It doesn’t feel like my home,” she said.

© 2013 The New York Times Company


From Brownstoner, the first of three articles:


A Post Sandy Renovation in the Rockaways, One Year Later


http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/4.-OV_After-2.jpg
This is the first of a three-part installment on the renovation of Ocean Village, a housing complex in the Far Rockaways.
Today, we look at what happens to building renovation plans after a major storm hits…

by Emily
10/28/13

One year after Hurricane Sandy, we check in with L+M Development Partners, a real estate development company based in New York specializing in affordable housing. When Sandy hit, L+M was in contract to purchase Ocean Village, a 1,093-unit housing development in the Far Rockaways. “L&M specializes in affordable housing, as well as the preservation of existing buildings,” Rick Gropper, of L+M, told us. “Ocean Village is a large complex. It was our first purchase in the neighborhood, and we saw this as our anchor property in the Rockaways.” L+M planned to undergo a large-scale rehab here to the tune of $60,000,000. At the time, Ocean Village had 350 vacancies, a deteriorating roof and persistent leaks. From an economic standpoint, the building was losing roughly $500,000 a year. L+M already started holding tenant meetings about the upcoming purchase before Hurricane Sandy. Once it hit, with the property still under contract, “Nobody wanted to take responsibility,” Gropper said. “So the city asked us to step in.”

Ocean Village, like many of the large complexes in the Far Rockaways, was under five feet of water after the hurricane. The storm fried the transformer and also completely flooded 20 apartment units that were partly below grade. The building went two weeks without power, until L+M could secure emergency generators from Ohio. Until then, the elevators, water pumps, and lighting were all out of working order. “We closed [the sale] when this building had no power,” said Gropper. “The storm was traumatic for everyone, including us, but we weren’t living there.” Some of the elderly residents who didn’t leave for the storm were stuck in upper-level apartments while the elevator was out of service. L+M set up a food and supply distribution center in the building’s common room and hosted Doctors Without Borders at the site. L+M also held four “Sandy Refugee” open-houses following the hurricane, coordinating with various city agencies. They were able to move around 12-15 Sandy refugees into vacant apartments after the open houses, and all but two are still living in the complex. And of course, L+M had to rethink their entire renovation plans in the wake of the storm.

According to Gropper, L+M’s greatest challenge at Ocean Village post Sandy was rethinking the electrical infrastructure. Sandy wiped out all electrical power, which was located below grade. The building, constructed in 1974, “was not designed with severe weather events in mind.” They replaced all the electrical infrastructure – transformers, switch-gears, ground feeders, you name it – and moved it above-grade. They are working on installing emergency generators for the building. L+M is also currently building out a flood barrier on the beach side of the property.

The renovation didn’t stop at storm-related improvements. As part of the original plan, L+M completely renovated apartment units – today, all but five units received kitchen and bathroom upgrades, window replacements as needed, painting, new doors, new hardware, and new intercoms. L+M is in the process of replacing all of the roofs and has added new emergency stairwell lighting, new hallway lighting, new hallway tiling, hallway painting and upgrades for the three community rooms. There’s a totally new security system, new building entrances, and a new laundry room to come. They restored the building facade and are upgrading outdoor pathways, landscaping, and onsite lighting. There are also several playgrounds and courtyards currently in the making.

The massive renovation project came just in time for Ocean Village, which was ultimately renamed Arverne View. The building is now fully occupied after 350 vacancies one year ago. Gropper says that he hasn’t seen many storm-resistant measures taken at other large-scale buildings in the neighborhood, however. “The community groups learned a lot as far as preparation and the importance of a central place to gather in an emergency,” he says. “But I haven’t seen many resiliency measures executed here.” He says L+M is working with the city to set up a central location for Arverne View residents to gather in case of another storm.

Stay tuned for our next installment, in which we take a tour of Arverne View. In the third and final installment we will talk to residents about their experience during the storm and the renovation over the last year.

Ocean Village before:
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Arverne View after:
http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2.-OV_After-1.jpg

http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/7.-OV_After-3.jpg

Rendering:
http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/13.-OV_Rendering-6.jpg

Interior renovations:
http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/15.-OV_Interior_LR1.jpg

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© Brownstoner Media LLC
Source (http://queens.brownstoner.com/2013/10/a-post-sandy-renovation-in-the-rockaways-one-year-later/)

ZippyTheChimp
November 7th, 2013, 08:09 AM
Brownstoner

Part 2:


Inside Arverne View, an Under-Renovation Housing Development in the Far Rockaways

by Emily
11/06/13

The other day we hopped on the A train to visit Arverne View, a 1,093-unit housing development in the Far Rockaways now under renovation by L+M Development Partners. The scope of L+M’s work is truly impressive — not only has the company made the complex more resilient for future storms, it renovated all the apartments, upgraded the buildings, redid the facade, replaced the roofs, and is completely landscaping the grounds. Currently, L+M completed 70 percent of the project (they began work soon after Sandy hit, installing emergency generators to bring power back to the development); they expect to completely finish by March of next year. After the jump, tons of pictures from our tour with L+M’s Rick Gropper, who showed us the entire complex and explained the details of this large-scale rehab.

The first step L+M took after they closed on the building (which had no electricity at the time) was to secure the development. Under the previous owners, the doors were open 24 hours a day to the public. L+M locked the doors and eventually added more security controls, like security cameras and electronic access controls. Another early step was to give the once-drab complex a brand new facade. This is an EIFS facade — exterior insulation and finishing system — a type of cladding system that provides exterior walls with an insulated finished surface and waterproofing.

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Here’s an under construction section of the interior courtyard. This will be a seating area.

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This will soon be a basketball court. L+M will also add three new playgrounds to the grounds.

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Much of the landscaping is still under construction. Previously, the planter box pictured below was completely empty. L+M plans to spiff up that beat-up wall as well.

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Lots of sea grass ready to be planted.

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The walking paths under construction are meant to resemble the boardwalk.

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This under-construction path will lead straight to the ocean.

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L+M is building a protective seawall along the beachfront side of the property to protect against future storms.

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Right along the beach, the Parks Department also added storm reinforcement.

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A view of Arverne View from the boardwalk:

http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/IMG_5350.jpg

Below, shots of the model apartment unit. It’s the only unoccupied unit in the whole complex. When L+M took on this project, there were 350 empty apartments. They were gutted and totally renovated, but L+M worried about actually filling them, especially after the storm. (At that point, all L+M had were renderings of what the rundown complex would become.) They launched a heavy marketing campaign in the neighborhood and began with a slow start. After the first families started moving in and construction work moved along, more and more Rockaway residents wanted to be in the building. It reached the point where L+M received 800 calls a week from interested parties.

L+M worked with the city to provide the affordable housing units. Through city vouchers, the existing tenants do not have to pay a higher rent despite renovations happening in all the units. The newly occupied units are priced higher, though they still fall into the affordable housing category. L+M streamlined the move-in process with the city so they could accept a housing application and move that individual in on the same day. They brought in around 50 households displayed by Sandy.

http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/living-room.jpg

Kitchen renovations took around three days to complete. Residents didn’t need to relocate during apartment renovations, and L+M set up showers and toilets in vacant units for residents to use during their renovation.

http://queens.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/kitchen.jpg

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Bathrooms took two to three days to fully renovate.

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After Sandy, L+M completely redid the building’s electrical infrastructure. The transformers are located both inside and outside, all are placed above grade.

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The development also came with commercial space, some of it occupied, although this 15,000-square-foot space was completely unused. 5,000 square feet will be used as the building manager’s office. L+M is building out the other 10,000 square feet with plans to add a food incubator, a kitchen space, or a job training area.

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© Brownstoner Media LLC
Source (http://queens.brownstoner.com/2013/11/inside-arverne-view-an-under-renovation-housing-development-in-the-far-rockaways/)

mariab
November 7th, 2013, 03:47 PM
Good for the Rockaways. Haven't read the entire article yet, but some of those buildings remind me of Soviet-era apartment complexes. They need some color.

EastMillinocket
November 7th, 2013, 06:15 PM
It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to say that these Rockaway buildings are Soviet-era apartment complexes. Now some might say how can that be when the US was not a Soviet socialist republic. However, the US was also not part of the British Empire in the 19th century, but many US cities have examples of Victorian architecture.

ZippyTheChimp
November 7th, 2013, 06:41 PM
Doesn't that overlook the influence of European settlement in colonial America?

EastMillinocket
November 7th, 2013, 07:00 PM
In San Francisco, houses built during the reign of Queen Victoria are referred to as examples of Victorian architecture. That city was not settled by the British. So it's really about the time period and not the history.

ZippyTheChimp
November 7th, 2013, 09:47 PM
In San Francisco, houses built during the reign of Queen Victoria are referred to as examples of Victorian architecture. That city was not settled by the British.But Victorian architecture originated in the UK and was spread throughout the British Empire, including the US. Early America was an immigrant country and culturally connected to Western Europe. Most American building styles were a "revival" or "neo" of a European form.

I can't see making a case that mid 20th century US architecture was influenced by the Soviet Union.

stache
November 7th, 2013, 11:45 PM
Germany/Bauhaus.

mariab
November 8th, 2013, 08:17 AM
Actually what I meant was Soviet-era in the Soviet Union. Bland, cookie-cutter boxes.

http://ts1.mm.bing.net/th?id=H.5048726637511828&pid=1.9&m=&w=300&h=300&p=0
www.russia-ukraine-travel.com/russian-and-ukrainian- (http://www.russia-ukraine-travel.com/russian-and-ukrainian-)

Merry
November 23rd, 2013, 12:32 AM
Rockaway's Forgotten Arverne East Awaits New Development

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Arverne East, an 81-acre city property that has been abandoned for decades, may soon be redeveloped] The Rockaway neighborhood of Edgemere is home to one of New York City's last great wastelands, an 81-acre stretch of oceanfront property that has sat abandoned for over 40 years. Now known as Arverne East, this city owned, man-made wilderness has a long history (http://kensinger.blogspot.com/2010/09/south-edgemere-wasteland.html) dating back to the 1800's, when its landscape was dominated by summer bungalows and beachside resorts. By the 1970's, a failed urban renewal scheme had left the area empty, and its crumbling sidewalks and empty building foundations were overtaken by nature. Today, the neighborhood is covered in forests and meadows which hide elaborate homeless camps, communal dump sites, oyster middens, and torched cars.

Onto this blank and lawless canvas, many have projected their ideas for a new community. Failed redevelopment plans (http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/07/realestate/in-rockaways-a-tide-is-coming-in.html?pagewanted=4&src=pm) have come from groups including Forest City Ratner and the Reichmann family, which once proposed to build Destination Technodome (http://www.businessweek.com/stories/1999-11-14/reichmanns-redux) atop the wasteland. The latest proposal to redevelop Arverne East was recently put forward by a group called FAR ROC (http://www.farroc.com/) (For a Resilient Rockaway), which announced the winner of a design contest (http://ny.curbed.com/tags/farroc) for the neighborhood on October 23rd. The plan, called Small Means and Great Ends (http://www.white.se/en/project/284-small-means-and-great-ends), proposes a housing and park complex based on "the Scandinavian Model of economic efficiency and welfare state benefits," to be superimposed over the existing landscape, which is one of the most unique in New York City. Like the Iron Triangle (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/06/20/willets_point_business_owners_await_citys_3b_redev elopment.php) and the SPURA (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/10/03/change_is_bittersweet_for_lower_east_sides_spura_l ocals.php), years of abandonment and neglect have warped Arverne East into a strange and singular environment which may soon be erased.

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The streets in southern Edgemere are ghostly shadows of their former selves, with sidewalks fading into sand and overgrowth.

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Though owned by the city, neighborhood roads are not maintained. Any project created here will have to build new "roadways, water mains, sanitary and storm sewers, utilities, smart grids, etc.," according to FAR ROC (http://www.farroc.com/competition/#history).

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Arverne East's open land stretches for over 20 city blocks. This area, near a public school, has been slated to be replaced by housing and a wetland park by FAR ROC's winning development proposal (http://www.farroc.com/solutions/#white).

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The community playgrounds have been long abandoned. The proposal, by Swedish firm White Arkitekter, plans to create a pair of "storm water parks" and a nature preserve with a birdwatching tower.

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The neighborhood is currently used as a communal dumping sites. Entire households have been emptied into the overgrowth.

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Numerous homeless camps are located in the middle of city blocks, with walkways beaten into the bushes and reeds. The White proposal (http://www.white.se/en/project/284-small-means-and-great-ends) claims it will create "a new home for the community of Arverne East."

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Discarded sofas, mattresses, and dressers are common finds on sidewalks and in streets. Many are undisturbed for weeks on end.

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This abandoned bathtub sat roadside for over a month. This entire area was completely submerged (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2012/11/02/surveying_queens_rockaway_peninsula_after_the_stor m.php) during Hurricane Sandy.

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A household emptied into a street that has been overgrown by a forest. A nature preserve managed by the Parks Department is proposed for this section of Arverne East.

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Household debris blocking a road. Aside from a scattering of street signs, the city does little to maintain south Edgemere.

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New curb cuts were installed several years ago, and they are slowly being overtaken by nature and sand. New sidewalks were not installed.

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An out of service fire department call box, located close to a torched car. The nearby neighborhood in north Edgemere has a long history of violent crime (http://kensinger.blogspot.com/2010/10/north-edgemere-shore.html).

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An impromptu chop shop in the bushes, located across from one of the many abandoned fire hydrants in the neighborhood. A new town square is proposed for this section of Arverne East.

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The city has recently replaced some fire hydrant caps, like the one seen here, which had a 10-year warranty tag still attached. A destroyed section of boardwalk sits in the background.

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Much of the old wooden boardwalk in the neighborhood was washed into the wasteland (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2012/11/02/surveying_queens_rockaway_peninsula_after_the_stor m.php) by Hurricane Sandy, and large sections have yet to be replaced. The proposal by White architects includes several ideas for mitigating storm surges and flooding in the area.

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Down the boardwalk to the west of Edgemere, Arverne By The Sea (http://www.arvernebythesea.com/) has slowly replaced another great wasteland in the Arverne Urban Renewal area with a new community.

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Homes are still being built and sold in Arverne By The Sea, despite the ongoing recovery process in the Rockaways (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/10/28/tracing_a_poststorm_year_of_change_in_the_rockaway s.php) from severe flood and storm damage caused by Hurricane Sandy.

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The future of these new oceanfront developments are difficult to predict, as sea levels continue to rise. A concrete boardwalk along the Arverne waterfront survived Hurricane Sandy, but if Small Means and Great Ends is ever built, will it survive the next superstorm?

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/11/21/rockaways_forgotten_arverne_east_awaits_new_develo pment.php

Merry
October 28th, 2014, 02:32 AM
It's wonderful to see the fruits of the rebuilding effort, but I can hardly believe what's replaced the devastation of Sandy. Pretty much like-for-like, it seems, despite "new building requirements".


Breezy Point Residents Choose to Remain and Rebuild

by Nathan Kensinger

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Breezy Point, a gated community in the Rockaways, has committed to rebuilding after Hurricane Sandy. All photos by Nathan Kensinger (http://kensinger.blogspot.com/).

Welcome back to Camera Obscura (http://ny.curbed.com/tags/camera-obscura), Curbed's series of photo essays by Nathan Kensinger (http://kensinger.blogspot.com/). This week marks the second anniversary of Hurricane Sandy, and Kensinger will return to three neighborhoods (http://ny.curbed.com/tags/the-storm-year) he has been visiting since the storm. Up first is Breezy Point, a gated community in the Rockaways.

In the two years since Hurricane Sandy devastated New York's waterfront, the city has undergone a painful recovery process. In Breezy Point, Sea Gate, Ocean Breeze and Oakwood Beach—some of the neighborhoods hit hardest by the storm—residents have struggled to choose between rebuilding or retreating from the water. With sea levels expected to rise several feet in coming years, the government has also been considering what steps to take next to address a future shaped by climate change, flooding, and storms. "We are rebuilding highways, we're doing dune replenishment, there are massive MTA projects, there are protections for the tunnels," said Barbara Brancaccio, spokeswoman for the Governor's Office of Storm Recovery (http://stormrecovery.ny.gov/). "It's the second anniversary and I would say that the city is extremely prepared."
New York City's most impressive recovery is taking place in the Rockaways, where many communities were destroyed (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2012/11/02/surveying_queens_rockaway_peninsula_after_the_stor m.php) by Hurricane Sandy's storm surge. Today, the peninsula is protected by a newly built system of walls and dunes, and all of its neighborhoods have decided to rebuild. In Breezy Point, a gated community at the western tip of the Rockaways, more than 300 homes were either washed away or burned to the ground during Sandy. Over the past two years, the landscape here has been transformed from scorched ruins into a thicket of new homes, many built in the past few months. One year ago (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/10/28/tracing_a_poststorm_year_of_change_in_the_rockaway s.php), on the first anniversary of the storm, Breezy Point was still dominated by empty lots filled with sand. Today, dozens of new homes have been built, and the sounds of hammers, saws, bulldozers and backhoes echo through the salty air.

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Despite being located on a shifting sand bar surrounded by the ocean, the residents of Breezy Point are committed to staying on the waterfront. They recently spent $130,000 of their own funds to create a protective dune (http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20141020/REAL_ESTATE/310199993/breezy-point-goes-its-own-way-on-sandy-recovery), and are in the process of evolving their housing stock from the single-story bungalows that Sandy destroyed to mammoth multi-story homes that fulfill the new building requirements. The government is supporting the community in their rebuilding efforts, and recently announced a multi-million dollar "Comprehensive Coastal Protection System (http://stormrecovery.ny.gov/governor-cuomo-mayor-de-blasio-and-congressman-meeks-announce-federal-approval-comprehensive-coastal)" for Breezy Point, "to safeguard the community from future instances of extreme weather." This project is just one part of the city's resiliency plan (http://www.nyc.gov/html/sirr/html/report/report.shtml), explains Amy Spitalnick, director of public affairs for the city's Office of Management and Budget. "The plan strengthens coastal defenses, upgrades buildings, protects infrastructure and critical services, and makes homes, businesses, and neighborhoods safer and more vibrant in these communities and beyond."

The refusal to retreat from the water is also part of a much larger city vision (http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/html/cwp/index.shtml). Since Hurricane Sandy, numerous residential megaprojects have been built or announced along the city's coastline, increasing population density enormously in areas which will experience the most flooding during storms to come. Some have questioned (http://science.time.com/2012/11/20/after-sandy-why-we-cant-keep-rebuilding-on-the-waters-edge/) the wisdom of building in flood zones next to the sea, but in the Rockaways and Breezy Point, these concerns have not deterred rebuilding.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/03_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5328.jpg

November 2012: On Gotham Walk in Breezy Point, Hurricane Sandy's devastation was nearly complete. After a fire destroyed over 120 homes in the area, only a handful of houses remained standing.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/04_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_8183.jpg

October 2014: Standing at the same spot today, the changes are disorienting. A new home has been built on almost every empty lot.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/05_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5282.jpg

November 2012: On Fulton Walk, every home was burned to the ground during Hurricane Sandy, in what the Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/25/nyregion/breezy-point-battered-seaside-haven-recalls-its-trial-by-fire.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0) described as one of the "the worst residential fires in New York City's history."

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/06_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_8413.jpg

August 2013: Then months after the storm, rebuilding had begun on only a few new homes in the area. Fulton Walk's concrete paths had been cracked by demolition equipment.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/07_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_6043.jpg

October 2014: Today, the residents of Fulton Walk have enjoyed a nearly complete return, with houses either completed or under construction. Much of the cost has been covered by insurance and private money, according to Crain's (http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20141020/REAL_ESTATE/310199993/breezy-point-goes-its-own-way-on-sandy-recovery).

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/08_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5133.jpg

November 2012: On Irving Walk, humble one-story bungalows were pushed off their foundations by Hurricane Sandy, which destroyed approximately 350 homes in Breezy Point.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/09_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5103.jpg

November 2012: Many of these homes were unsalvageable and were gutted and demolished, with personal belongings taken away to be deposited in a landfill (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2012/11/19/a_look_at_the_postsandy_cleanup_in_the_rockaways.p hp).

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/10_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_8234.jpg

October 2014: On Irving Walk today, these bungalows have been replaced by much larger houses, elevated above the sand to meet new building requirements.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/11_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5787.jpg

October 2014: Seeing a mailman making his rounds through the neighborhood would have seemed almost impossible two years ago.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/12_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5869.jpg

October 2014: Some residents have reportedly had difficulty rebuilding (http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/queens/queens-residents-struggle-hurricane-sandy-damage-years-article-1.1987126), but even the increasingly rare empty lots of Breezy Point have been set up to arrange delivery of mail.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/13_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_8435.jpg

October 2014: This new home was erected in just over a week, with workers laboring through the weekend. Many new homes here are modular in construction, and some, like the building site on the left, have been funded by the city's Build It Back (http://www.nyc.gov/html/recovery/html/home/home.shtml) program.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/14_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_6161.jpg

October 2014: Facing south towards the sea, some of these new houses are isolated, surrounded by sand and situated at sea level.

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/15_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5919.jpg

October 2014: A broad plain separates Breezy Point from the ocean, but provides no buffer from the elements. When it comes to sea level rise, New York is one of the "most vulnerable metropolitan areas" in the world, according to the Times (http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/27/world/climate-rising-seas.html).

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/16_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_8353.jpg

October 2014: Residents constructed this 1,000-foot dune along the south side of their community using their own funds (http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20141020/REAL_ESTATE/310199993/breezy-point-goes-its-own-way-on-sandy-recovery).

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/17_kensinger_sandy_breezy_point_DSC_5744.jpg

October 2014: From atop the dune, the sea is never far away. A new climate change report (http://www.ipcc.ch/) will be approved by the United Nations at the end of this month, which will help shape future plans for waterfront communities.

Nathan Kensinger (http://kensinger.blogspot.com/) [Official]

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2014/10/27/breezy_point_residents_choose_to_remain_and_rebuil d.php

Merry
March 5th, 2015, 04:08 AM
Community Group Wants to Bring Park to Rockaway Peninsula

March 4, 2015, by Jeremiah Budin

http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/Screen%20Shot%202015-03-04%20at%2011.15.34%20AM-thumb.jpg (http://ny.curbed.com/uploads/Screen%20Shot%202015-03-04%20at%2011.15.34%20AM.jpg)

The Rockaway Waterfront Alliance has released a proposal (http://queens.brownstoner.com/2015/03/project-underway-proposes-a-pedestrian-greenway-along-the-rockaway-peninsula/) for a pedestrian greenway underneath the elevated A train tracks that would span the five-mile length of the Rockaway Peninsula. The project, called "Project Underway," would take the mostly neglected space and transform it into a mix or bike paths, footpaths, and green space. According to the proposal (pdf (http://www.brooklyngreenway.org/wp-content/uploads/RWA-Project-Underway.pdf)) the first phase of the three-phase plan is already underway, and the Alliance is working to the owners of the Averne By the Sea (http://arvernebythesea.com/) development to develop a stretch from Beach 62nd Street to Beach 67th Street into a temporary pilot project. The pilot will include green insfrastructure landscaping to reduce stormwater runoff, among other features.

"Project Underway" Proposes a Pedestrian Greenway Along the Rockaway Peninsula (http://queens.brownstoner.com/2015/03/project-underway-proposes-a-pedestrian-greenway-along-the-rockaway-peninsula/) [Q'Stoner]
Project Underway (http://www.brooklyngreenway.org/wp-content/uploads/RWA-Project-Underway.pdf) [PDF]

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2015/03/04/community_group_wants_to_bring_park_to_rockaway_pe ninsula.php