Atlantic Yards Development - Commercial, Residential, Retail, NBA Arena

[GordonGecko]

There's nothing wrong with pre-fab construction, IMO the issue would be if he used sub-standard materials. If the design is nice and everything is well made with quality materials, I don't see the problem

[BStyles]

If the design is nice, sustainable, cut costs, and will be up faster than we know it, who could be mad?

[lofter1]

The construction trades, who under the AY / Ratner deal were assuming high priced jobs, but instead will be getting jobs paying half the wages (per the details from the article).

[GordonGecko]

I guess some poor factory working will have to "get by" on $35 an hour building the modules instead of $85 on the field. I'm not crying for anyone here

[lofter1]

At $35 / hour that comes out to about $70K / year, less taxes = ~ $40 - 50K / year net

$85 / hour = ~ $170K / year, less taxes = ~ $100 - 120K / year net

[RoldanTTLB]

'Sup-date!!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5066/5615249550_9da362965b_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/5615249550/)

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5066/5614666041_134db12ce8_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/5614666041/)

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5065/5614654089_836d7b058c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/5614654089/)

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5266/5614647735_b99063867a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/5614647735/)

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5068/5614641535_d70e90197d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/5614641535/)

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5143/5614636561_9c267c7faa_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/5614636561/)

[BrooklynLove]

Future site of UFC 200.

[GordonGecko]

I thought UFC was banned in NY State

[BrooklynLove]

There is a lot of time between UFC 129 and 200.

[futurecity]

God, this thing looks like a pile of dog mess.. Just b/c it is in brooklyn doesn't mean it has to be brown and shitty.

[Tectonic]

Thought it was just me...

[arcman210]

I actually like it... much different and has a rustic and raw feel to it.

[Tectonic]

I think that's left to be seen.

[arcman210]

I think we can already say 'rustic' being that the exterior cladding will actually be weathered steel (aka rusted)... the section from the mock up photo that we've seen was only a plastic replica.

[BrooklynLove]

People would rather complain than compliment anything. Fact is that this arena is better looking than at least 80% of the other NBA venues, including MSG and Newark.

[GordonGecko]

I agree that MSG is butt ugly, which is sacrilege in NYC but the love is for the history and people have blinders on for that POS. But this new Nets arena in Brooklyn someway, somehow manages to create something uglier by an order of magnitude. It's a giant turd complete with a toilet seat loop.

The Rock in Newark is a very very nice arena. It may not be cutting edge architecture, but it's clean, polished, and well done all the way around

[BrooklynLove]

Seriously? This looks like a convention center in Toledo.

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQXo2ZNUEqzDx4rUd-KgCwxailgRJVchOYsp5MMDLGch_m78UDLHw

[GordonGecko]

Does that make it ugly? I think it's a clean look, like I said not cutting edge but nothing offensive either

http://media.nj.com/setonhall_main/photo/prudential-center-8b180282eaa9f8b0_large.jpg http://www.thebusinessofsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/prudentialcenter.jpg

[arcman210]

The Rock is very eye appealing in person, the inside is tremendous (this from a fan of the teams that play at MSG). Newark has a great building, Brooklyn will too.

The biggest mistake of the Barclays Center is that it's basketball specific. Only creates the potential that the Islanders build an arena in Queens to compete with it.

[TREPYE]

I agree that MSG is butt ugly, which is sacrilege in NYC but the love is for the history and people have blinders on for that POS. But this new Nets arena in Brooklyn someway, somehow manages to create something uglier by an order of magnitude. It's a giant turd complete with a toilet seat loop.

This looks more like a toilet than MSG????

http://www.nyc-architecture.com/MID/Madison_Square_Garden_ad.jpg

[GordonGecko]

Hey look, a BBF guy :)

[GordonGecko]

Islanders probably staying in Nassau

Nassau County Plans $400 Million Bond Sale for New York Islanders Arena
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-05-11/nassau-county-plans-400-million-bond-sale-for-new-york-islanders-arena.html

[Tectonic]

05.29.11

http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/1465/dsc0371sn.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/4589/dsc0369sn.jpg

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/8756/dsc0362sn.jpg

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/1406/dsc0358sn.jpg
©tectonic (http://www.tectonicphoto.com)

[Tectonic]

Another update from 07.30.11

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/250268_10150248460422903_330613722902_7491899_8205 317_n.jpg

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189386_10150248460297903_330613722902_7491896_2104 906_n.jpg

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/281673_10150248459762903_330613722902_7491866_3203 882_n.jpg

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/198774_10150248459592903_330613722902_7491856_4878 368_n.jpg

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/205869_10150248459297903_330613722902_7491841_2591 784_n.jpg

©tectonic (http://www.tectonicphoto.com)

[lofter1]

Barn Raising!

(hmmmm ... The Brooklyn Barn ....)

[GordonGecko]

But more accurately, is it the barn or the compost shed behind the barn?

[RoldanTTLB]

I don't know, but this all looks like a serious erection to me....

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6073/6025700774_cc54d524da_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/6025700774/)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6141/6025149231_80ff16475a_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/6025149231/)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6208/6025151491_838ece1c8f_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/6025151491/)

[antinimby]

Will make any airport hanger proud.

[Tectonic]

Windows on Barclays Center (http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2011/08/windows-on-barclays-center/)

http://cdn.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/glass-installation-barclays-center-brooklyn.jpg (http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2011/08/windows-on-barclays-center/#)
Big news at the Barclays Center construction site: Workers are starting (http://mlkshk.com/p/627H) to install glassy sections of the arena’s facade. The Ellerbe Becket and SHoP Architects design (click through for renderings), is heavy on the steel, but it will also have a glass curtain wall entrance and a swoop of glass at its midsection.
Photo by dahliat (http://mlkshk.com/p/627H)

http://cdn.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/barclays-renderings.jpg (http://cdn.brownstoner.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/barclays-renderings.jpg)



By Gabby (http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/author/Gabby/) | 08/16/2011 9:30 AM

Drove by today, its looks rusty and ready to go.

[BrooklynLove]

This is progressing nicely. I especially like the introduction of so much new pedestrian space at the Atlantic/Flatbush intersection on all sides. A nice unanticipated benefit of the arena plaza space is that there will be more consistent cleaning of the pedestrian space on the Atlantic Terminal pedestrian island nearby.

[Tectonic]

This area needs more Greenery, it's too barren.

[antinimby]

Seriously, why brown?

:confused:

[RoldanTTLB]

There's some really puerile jokes that could be told here, but I am sure the architects would say that it was designed to evoke brownstone Brooklyn with a modern twist etc. To their credit, not many brown stadiums come to mind (although maybe there's a good reason for that? We'll find out soon).

[infoshare]

......... but I am sure the architects would say that it was designed to evoke brownstone Brooklyn with a modern twist etc.

That is as good an 'Archi-speak' justification as any I can think of: and you may be right. But, I recall seeing something where - the shoP website I think - where the metal panels used on the facade were 'weathered' to the point where a 'patina' appeared - thus the 'brownish' color. That being said - don't quote me on this bit of recollection.

BTW - The color looks great - overall, the stadium design is brilliant.

[Music Man]

It kind of makes me think of wicker basket..

[Fimiak]

This stadium could be cement gray and it would still blow madison square garden away. It's that disgusting teal in the renders that ruins the project for me. If the brown resembles brownstones, what is the teal supposed to represent?

[BrooklynLove]

All the teal is just silly Barclays marketing accent. The real thing will be way muted.

[RoldanTTLB]

The teal represents Barclays Capital (http://www.barcap.com/). You know, the people who paid approximately $400 million to have their name written any color they felt like on the stadium. I'm not a huge fan, but I mean, that's how the $400m cookie crumbles.

[RoldanTTLB]

Beat me to it! Snap.

[Tectonic]

If 745 7th is an indicator, the teal may not be so muted.

[oquatanginwan]

I hereby make "The Shitdome" the unofficial name of this arena.

[BrooklynLove]

yawn

[infoshare]

The patina on the facade panels does not 'come across' well in the photos. The same thing happened with the 'textured' brick facade on their Mulberry/Houston Street project: the condo building facade on Mulberry/Houston Street looks much better in person - both the color and texture appear quite different than what we see in photos/renderings.

Give this one a chance for completion; it will be a beauty.

Weathering in progress.
http://www.shopdoes.com/2011/04/01/weathering-in-progress/#more-511

[GordonGecko]

It kind of makes me think of wicker basket..

yes, a wicker basket from the 70's in a room full of tacky wood panelling

[GordonGecko]

This stadium could be cement gray and it would still blow madison square garden away. It's that disgusting teal in the renders that ruins the project for me. If the brown resembles brownstones, what is the teal supposed to represent?
Not any more, the Garden is currently being rebuilt, the reconstruction will end in 2013 and will be a 95% new building

[BrooklynLove]

You're joking, right? As far as I've heard the planned reno is internal only.

[arcman210]

I cant believe the Barclays Center logo still uses the Frank Gehry inspiration. The Barclays bird has a backdrop that mimics the second design of the Frank Gehry design of the building. Barclay's normal logo is just the bird, without the three wavy panels.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8a/BarclaysCenterLogo.png

[stache]

Really. The bird should be sitting in a vacant lot.

[ASchwarz]

Not any more, the Garden is currently being rebuilt, the reconstruction will end in 2013 and will be a 95% new building

Is this a joke? MSG is an internal renovation only.

It will look 100% the same to New Yorkers unless you're attending an event. Even then, it will still be the old MSG, but with improvements.

MSG will remain outdated, and will still need to be replaced in the near-term if the Dolans want to stay competitive.

[Tectonic]

They starter installing the lower section see here.
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/1038/screenshot20110820at204.png
I'll try to get some shots later today.

[RoldanTTLB]

Man, if that render is to believed, Atlantic avenue is going to come out as an 8 lane super highway. Perfect for driving to the b-ball game. Then I don't need to go underground to any of the dozen or so subway lines that stop here. JACKPOT.

[Tectonic]

Was looking at that. Fantasy.

[GordonGecko]

You're joking, right? As far as I've heard the planned reno is internal only.


Is this a joke? MSG is an internal renovation only.

It will look 100% the same to New Yorkers unless you're attending an event. Even then, it will still be the old MSG, but with improvements.

MSG will remain outdated, and will still need to be replaced in the near-term if the Dolans want to stay competitive.

You are mis-informed, MSG is effectively being replaced in a $1B "transformation" project, it's happening RIGHT NOW as we speak (24 hour construction shifts). Yes the exterior shell will remain (with new windows all around on a couple floors), but that's about it, and they may well eventually spruce that up too. I'm not the biggest fan of MSG's exterior, but it's not THAT bad IMO the Barclay's Center is worse by an order of magnitude.

[stache]

Your taste level leaves much to be desired.

[Tectonic]

Barclay Center is a lot more dynamic.

[antinimby]

They're both ugly in their own ways: MSG is boring, outdated ugly, BC is dynamic contemporary ugly.

How's that? :cool:

[Tectonic]

:D

Let's take a look

http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/9282/dsc1149sn.jpg

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3599/dsc1168sn.jpg

http://img830.imageshack.us/img830/103/dsc1167sn.jpg

http://img806.imageshack.us/img806/4056/dsc1166sn.jpg

http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/6530/dsc1163sn.jpg

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/3796/dsc1154sn.jpg

http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/7274/dsc1153sn.jpg

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/6829/dsc1151sn.jpg

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/2600/dsc1150sn.jpg

http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/4922/dsc1148sn.jpg

©tectonic

[infoshare]

That is one terrific photo tour of the site: thanks a million to Tectonic. Those photos - almost - depict the subtle 'suede-like' texture of those weathered panels. I say 'almost' because I was there yesterday for an in-person viewing.


What I like about this design is that it is not only a beautify dynamic form: but it is also clearly 'purpose' built - that is, the programmatic requirements have been well attended to on every level of function.


The Architects on this project are not simply 'shape-driven' aesthetes manipulating the form to suit their artistic whim; this is tried and true form-follows-function done in a contemporary aesthetic, executed using the latest in computer aided engineering/architectural design methodologies.


I don't follow sport all that much, but I intend to frequent this place just to 'experience' the architecture.


Here are some exterior renderings and a video that I recently found after reading this thread: http://barclayscenter.com/venue/venue_5.shtml#5d

[ASchwarz]

You are mis-informed, MSG is effectively being replaced in a $1B "transformation" project, it's happening RIGHT NOW as we speak (24 hour construction shifts). Yes the exterior shell will remain (with new windows all around on a couple floors), but that's about it, and they may well eventually spruce that up too. I'm not the biggest fan of MSG's exterior, but it's not THAT bad IMO the Barclay's Center is worse by an order of magnitude.

I don't think any of us are misinformed here. You seem to be saying the exact same thing as us.

As you stated, the MSG renovation only consists of internal improvements. The outside won't be touched. The footprint won't be touched. MSG will remain largely as-is.

As previously stated, the MSG renovation is a temporary stop-gap. It's actually less comprehensive than the the mid-1990's renovation. It will continue to be an inadequate facility until its inevitable demolition and replacement by a modern facility.

In fact, it would have long since been demolished, but the Dolans do not want to lose the tax break on the site, and they have a terrible relationship with the city and potential developers. They're basically impossible to work with.

And please don't compare MSG with the Barclays Center or the Prudential Center. Such comparisons are bad jokes. MSG was built in the late 60's, and no amount of sprucing up can hide this fact. It needs to be demolished ASAP.

[USSManhattan]

Ack, I dunno how I feel about that exterior... it looks like a sea of pre-rusted material.

Will it be enhanced in any further way, or is that the outer skin as it'll look?

[scumonkey]

All it needs is little bits of corn sprinkled throughout ;)

[lofter1]

Looks like Cor-Ten Steel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weathering_steel) but is apparently a new and improved product ...

Facade Begins to Encircle Barclays

NetsDaily (http://www.netsdaily.com/2011/8/15/2363267/facade-begins-to-encircle-barclays)

The exterior "skin" of the Barclays Center, the weathered steel facade that architects hope will give the arena an iconic look, is going up. With little fanfare, the facade is being installed along the arena's Atlantic Avenue frontage, both at its base, behind a construction fence, and high along the roof line.

In all, 921 "mega-panels", designed by SHoP Architects and fabricated by ASI Limited, will be installed. The facade wraps the original (and much criticized) design by Ellerbe & Becket, the arena's principal architect, in "bands" that extend inside the arena.

The project, (http://tinyurl.com/3h9ze4c) which costs $39 million, starts with the fabrication of 12,000 panels. The panels are then hung on a customized assembly line (http://www.shopdoes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Panels.jpg) at ASI's Indiana facility, put through a wet/dry cycle 30 times a day for four months to make them look "weathered" before being assembled into mega-panels (http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/544419/PMU_Josh_044.jpg), each weighing several tons. The intended effect: mimic the brickwork of brownstone Brooklyn and "break the mass" of the building.

***

Weathering...In-Progress
(http://www.shopdoes.com/2011/04/01/weathering-in-progress/)
BDS / SHoP Construction

Earlier this year ASI Limited, the facade contractor for Barclays Center, flipped the switch on for their custom built 2500′ linear conveyor system designed to accelerate the weathering process for the 12,000 individual panels and supporting rails that make up the weathering steel portion of the facade designed by SHoP Architects. To arrive at this milestone, SHoP Construction began working under contract with ASI Limited in the summer of 2010. A transfer of design information immediately began taking place between SA and SC where essentially the surface or wireframe model as we call it, began to go through a series of automated processes resulting in both the folded and unfolded panel geometry complete with material thickness, fastener locations and a 2d output that includes pdfs for the fabrication ticket and the cut files for each panel nested by SC delivered directly to the water jet on ASI’s shop floor. The result of this collaboration is now hanging on the line … weathering.

[scumonkey]

Not trying to be nasty, but it reminds me more of a reptile skin than that of a Brownstone?
By the way, GREAT pics as always tectonic!

[Nexis4Jersey]

My photo from Today...

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6065/6075081670_0361cdde48_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/42178139@N06/6075081670/)
DSC06406 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/42178139@N06/6075081670/) by Nexis4Jersey09 (http://www.flickr.com/people/42178139@N06/), on Flickr

[GordonGecko]

As previously stated, the MSG renovation is a temporary stop-gap. It's actually less comprehensive than the the mid-1990's renovation. It will continue to be an inadequate facility until its inevitable demolition and replacement by a modern facility.

In fact, it would have long since been demolished, but the Dolans do not want to lose the tax break on the site, and they have a terrible relationship with the city and potential developers. They're basically impossible to work with.

And please don't compare MSG with the Barclays Center or the Prudential Center. Such comparisons are bad jokes. MSG was built in the late 60's, and no amount of sprucing up can hide this fact. It needs to be demolished ASAP.
Like I said, you are clearly mis-informed, it IS being demolished and rebuilt on the inside (including the playing surface floor). Once the renovation job is complete there will be plenty of media attention and a lot of people will be surprised. I'm the first person to tell you that MSG has been a total dump, but this is going to be a whole new place

http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/5787/msgdemonight2050511.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Nm3xA.png

http://i52.tinypic.com/hrn0p1.jpg

[ZippyTheChimp]

http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/1456/atlanticyards01c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/824/atlanticyards01c.jpg/) http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/2771/atlanticyards02c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/855/atlanticyards02c.jpg/) http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/2010/atlanticyards03c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/269/atlanticyards03c.jpg/) http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/449/atlanticyards04c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/828/atlanticyards04c.jpg/) http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/7028/atlanticyards05c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/828/atlanticyards05c.jpg/) http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/4738/atlanticyards06c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/684/atlanticyards06c.jpg/) http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/7136/atlanticyards07c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/638/atlanticyards07c.jpg/)

http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/7442/atlanticyards08c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/41/atlanticyards08c.jpg/) http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/2787/atlanticyards09c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/805/atlanticyards09c.jpg/) http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/1933/atlanticyards10c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/36/atlanticyards10c.jpg/) http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/5986/atlanticyards11c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/824/atlanticyards11c.jpg/) http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/6978/atlanticyards12c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/713/atlanticyards12c.jpg/) http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/204/atlanticyards13c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/820/atlanticyards13c.jpg/) http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/4812/atlanticyards14c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/196/atlanticyards14c.jpg/)

[lofter1]

I hear that Pamela Geller has some issues with the Burlington Coat Factory across the street from this.

[stache]

Not enough bunny fur maxi coats in her size? :p

Edit: oops, I thought you wrote Pam Grier :o :o :o

[ZippyTheChimp]

She had a tantrum when they told her the store didn't carry fuzzy slippers?

[TREPYE]

:D

Let's take a look

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/2600/dsc1150sn.jpg

http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/4922/dsc1148sn.jpg

©tectonic
Fascinating. It creates an awesome contrast of materials; rustic eathy juxtapositioned with sleek modern that envelops a very unique shape. My biggest fear that the material would not look rustic enough has been alleviated, the panels look splendid. If only current architecture could manifest this type of complexity in its design this city would have a better archtiectural standing when it comes to contemporary design.

Looks like Cor-Ten Steel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weathering_steel) but is apparently a new and improved product ...

Facade Begins to Encircle Barclays

NetsDaily (http://www.netsdaily.com/2011/8/15/2363267/facade-begins-to-encircle-barclays)


The project, (http://tinyurl.com/3h9ze4c) which costs $39 million, starts with the fabrication of 12,000 panels. The panels are then hung on a customized assembly line (http://www.shopdoes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Panels.jpg) at ASI's Indiana facility, put through a wet/dry cycle 30 times a day for four months to make them look "weathered" before being assembled into mega-panels (http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/544419/PMU_Josh_044.jpg), each weighing several tons. The intended effect: mimic the brickwork of brownstone Brooklyn and "break the mass" of the building.



The treatment of panels as descibed above does beg the question: is the material ever going to whither away after several years of rain/snow driven wet/dry cycles?

[RoldanTTLB]

That seems very unlikely. Think of this as a patina. Like the statue of liberty (which does not appear to have withered away).

[Alonzo-ny]

That cladding looks fantastic. This could turn out decent after all.

[TREPYE]

That seems very unlikely. Think of this as a patina. Like the statue of liberty (which does not appear to have withered away).

Yeah but Im not sure if its quite the same as copper.

http://i780.photobucket.com/albums/yy90/Bucket2NYY/frieze1copperweatheringchart1.jpg

I remember hearing that the Woolworth buildings copper roof had to be replaced due to weathering, and the statue of liberty was painted sometime in the 80's

Is the material for Barclays metal cladding going to be better or worse??

[infoshare]

Take a look at the blog post for shop (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4322&p=372472&viewfull=1#post372472): from what I gather the metal panels have be 'aged/weathered' in some sort of climate controlled environment. Those facade panels will surly be subject to some additional chemical reaction over the years; unlike 'most' people - they will probably become more & more lovely as they age. (LOL)

I recently enjoyed viewing this little news (http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/09/09/new-design-unveiled-for-atlantic-yards-arena/) item.

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/09/09/new-design-unveiled-for-atlantic-yards-arena/

http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4322&p=372472&viewfull=1#post372472 (http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/09/09/new-design-unveiled-for-atlantic-yards-arena/)

[USSManhattan]

I remember hearing that the Woolworth buildings copper roof had to be replaced due to weathering, and the statue of liberty was painted sometime in the 80's

The Woolworth's roof was actually removed for scrap during World War II. What you see now is metal painted as if patinad.

The Lady had a lot of repairs in the 80s, but she certainly wasn't painted.

[ZippyTheChimp]

and the statue of liberty was painted sometime in the 80's.The Statue of Liberty was not painted.

The centennial restoration was complex, due to galvanic corrosion and improper sealants that were used over the years to repair leaks. Most of the problems involved the iron armature and steel straps. The entire strapping system was refabricated in stainless steel.

The copper plating lost just .005 inch of material from 100 years in the harbor. Only the torch copper was replaced. Copper rivets and saddles were used to attach the plating to the steel armature to eliminate galvanic corrosion.

[RoldanTTLB]

I know these are 3 weeks old, but it's been a little while anyway.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6178/6134450814_878f370a68_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/6134450814/)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6210/6134453066_5c9b546054_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/6134453066/)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6170/6133900549_cdcebf7105_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/7799907@N05/6133900549/)

[Gulcrapek]

10/05/11

Not great pictures.

The facade is not to my personal taste but I appreciate that it's interesting and different.

From Pacific St

http://i.imgur.com/cVATg.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/meEMb.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/GYb1L.jpg

From 6th Ave



http://i.imgur.com/mwOi5.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/mZlIK.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/ArJxX.jpg

From Atlantic Ave

http://i.imgur.com/PXtqy.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/e5kTz.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Lj5jW.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/jzIlF.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/vRR5n.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/risnA.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/to0Wp.jpg

[lofter1]

It looks cool in photos. What's it like when you're walking right up against it?

[londonlawyer]

I walked by on Oct. 5, 2011 and was impressed.

[RoldanTTLB]

I've liked it up close, but it's still not guaranteed to be great at the street level. That whole side of the street is currently closed off (on both sides ), and since it's effectively a 4 lane highway in between, there's limits to approachability at the moment. I hope they redo Atlantic Ave to be less lanes more sculpted median ala Jackson Ave in Queens.

[ShaMegro]

I think the finished version will look better than the renderings

[MidtownGuy]

I hope so...but when you compare this to the sleek and clean designs of many arenas and stadiums in Europe and Asia, this looks fussy/busy/messy/hulking.

If only we could have gotten something like the Allianz Arena here. Simple and gorgeous.

[futurecity]

Oh no, that wouldn't do at all. Dear me! Allianz looks like a huge white UFO. Imagine that in the middle of brooklyn :D

Don't get me wrong, I love Allianz, but not in Brooklyn. It is suited to a more remote location IMO.

What I would have liked would be a more modern disign, but at least this one has some kind of character and isn't cookie cutter.

[MidtownGuy]

But I happen to love things that look like huge UFOs! and I think contextualism is too often a big fat sacred cow that needs to be unceremoniously slaughtered. A UFO sitting over a transit hub would be glorious.

People have some sort of holy attitude about Brooklyn, as if it has one style. If they can build the ugly canker sores that have been sprouting all over my old 'hood (I used to live on St. Felix and then on Ashland Pl. right around the way from this site, before moving to Manhattan), I have no problem if they would have built something unusual and extraordinary there. I care about how beautiful an object/building is, not slavishly following some sort of arbitrary judgment on what is "suited" there. I suppose a certain famous museum in Bilbao would never have been built if that was the prevailing line of thinking.

But that's just me. I'm an artist and a designer, and I don't care about coloring inside somebody's sacrosanct lines.

[BrooklynLove]

It looks cool in photos. What's it like when you're walking right up against it?

Even better in person. This bad boy is turning out fabulously. Just in time to pull the Islanders.

[futurecity]

But I happen to love things that look like huge UFOs! and I think contextualism is too often a big fat sacred cow that needs to be unceremoniously slaughtered. A UFO sitting over a transit hub would be glorious.

People have some sort of holy attitude about Brooklyn, as if it has one style. If they can build the ugly canker sores that have been sprouting all over my old 'hood (I used to live on St. Felix and then on Ashland Pl. right around the way from this site, before moving to Manhattan), I have no problem if they would have built something unusual and extraordinary there. I care about how beautiful an object/building is, not slavishly following some sort of arbitrary judgment on what is "suited" there. I suppose a certain famous museum in Bilbao would never have been built if that was the prevailing line of thinking.

But that's just me. I'm an artist and a designer, and I don't care about coloring inside somebody's sacrosanct lines.

Good for you, but I disagree that you should design beautiful objects without any care to the surroundings. That can end up very good in a few instances, but usually ends very badly and has ruined cities in the past because beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It is wise not to build monuments to one's ego alone as architecture is not public art and respect must be given to the surrounding buildings and the public who will be living with this thing for years to come. Although that arena works well in suburban Munich, it may not work here. It may be a fantastic piece of futuristic architecture, but it may also overwhelm and destroy if the context isn't right.

Can you imagine the Taj Mahal in the middle of Manhattan? Just b/c it is beautiful means nothing in architecture. I think context matters, otherwise we will end up with areas with an ugly confusing mess of different styles - a hellish pastiche.

[GordonGecko]

Design Unveiled for Tower at Atlantic Yards

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2011/11/18/nyregion/yards1/yards1-blog480.jpg http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2011/11/18/nyregion/yardsb/yardsb-articleInline.jpg

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/11/17/design-unveiled-for-tower-at-atlantic-yards/

[Sid]

Those towers aren't bad...I guess. The towers though, should have been placed closer to the subway station so that people can access them through either a direct underground entrance, or a VERY short walk outside after exiting the subway, instead of having to walk hundreds of feet along the side of the arena. I don't believe the arena itself is going to have underground subway access, so I can't see there being a tunnel of any kind for office denizens to use between the subway and the towers. I know it's too late now, but this is a consideration that should have been made initially.

[GordonGecko]

If they made the roof transparent they could sell the arena-side apartments for more. Just saying :)

[Ed007Toronto]

People in condos can watch the The Toronto Blues Jays play when the Skydome roof is open

[RoldanTTLB]

You could theoretically cross the street (A. Ave.) and walk inside Atlantic Center to get to the subway indoors.

[BrooklynLove]

i love it

[Merry]

Thank god :eek:.


What Could (Not Ever) Have Been at Ratner's Atlantic Yards

by Kelsey Keith

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922785216d58e8009875/gehry%20july%204%202005.jpg

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922985216d58e8009885/gehry%20model%202005.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922985216d58e8009882/gehry%20model%202005.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922a85216d58e800988f/extell2lg.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922a85216d58e800988c/extell2lg.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922c85216d58e8009899/unity%20model.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922c85216d58e8009896/unity%20model.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922d85216d58e80098a3/siteplanbig.gif (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922d85216d58e80098a0/siteplanbig.gif) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922e85216d58e80098ad/01yards.600.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922e85216d58e80098aa/01yards.600.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922f85216d58e80098b7/050508b15.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6922f85216d58e80098b4/050508b15.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6923185216d58e80098c1/atlantspan.jpg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6923085216d58e80098be/atlantspan.jpg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6923285216d58e80098cb/AYmodularhousing_3_11.jpeg (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6923185216d58e80098c8/AYmodularhousing_3_11.jpeg) http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6923385216d58e80098d5/Screen%20shot%202011-11-18%20at%2012.11.44%20PM.png (http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs/4ec6923385216d58e80098d2/Screen%20shot%202011-11-18%20at%2012.11.44%20PM.png)
(click to enlarge)

Yesterday's big reveal (http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2011/11/17/atlantic_yards_modular_rental_tower_will_be_worlds _tallest.php)of the pre-fab residential tower planned by Forest City Ratner and designed by SHoP Architects whipped up commenters and news media alike, fanning the flames for yet another hurdle (unions vs. developer) in the development of the Atlantic Yards megaproject. Six years on, we're feeling some design whiplash, between Frank Gehry's initial overwrought masterplan and several sideshow solutions put forth along the way. We've recapped some of those designs above, in a gallery's worth of images depicting what could have risen between Flatbush and Atlantic Avenues.

2005 began the Era of Gehry, with the starchitect-Bruce Ratner alliance still strong. The 22-acre masterplan was massive and expensive and a perfect example of developer frenzy during the boom years, expectant of a completion date by 2011. Also in 2005, Gary Barnett and Extell submitted an alternate bid to the MTA, proposing "11 buildings ranging from 4 to 28 stories," substantially smaller than Gehry's initital masterplan, which called for 17 buildings, many of them 40 to 50 stories tall and creating what he intended as a "dense urban skyline" in the middle of brownstone Brooklyn.

Extell's alternative would have only been built only over the Vanderbilt Rail Yards (no eminent domain, superblocks, or demapping streets) and its tallest tower would be equivalent to one of the same height in Downtown Brooklyn. Later, in 2007, an activist group submitted a bid for the "UNITY Plan," a segmented masterplan divided between eight developers which included more affordable housing than Ratner’s project, no arena and no eminent domain. In 2008, Ratner scrapped plans for Gehry's capstone 620-foot tower, "Miss Brooklyn," for a 511-foot tall commercial tower called B1, replete with signature metal waves, and another housing 350 market-rate and affordable apartments, colored red and pink in order to “speak to the residential fabric of the neighborhood."

Fast forward to 2009, after a brief attempt at value engineering, when Bruce dumps Frank and his $1 billion of starchitecture for a more modest and universally reviled hangar vision drummed up by Ellerbe Beckett. That didn't go over so well, so SHoP was brought on to class up the proceedings later that year. Barclays Center broke ground in 2010 and is now trucking along nicely; as for that residential building, rumors about the modular build-out first lit up the 'wire back in March, and now: voila.

As many have pointed out, the repeated focus on subsidized housing from the beginning was what cleared many of Ratner's development hurdles; even back in 2005, Forest City Ratner promised that half the housing units would be reserved for tenants making less than $100,000 per year.

http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2011/11/18/what_could_not_ever_have_been_at_ratners_atlantic_ yards.php#more

[Gulcrapek]

The towers are better than the average new residential building and I like how the volumes are broken up. I hope they end up being a bit more varied though, which they probably will be since it's a phased plan. Not really interesting when everything matches.

[stache]

I don't like the red brick.

[Tectonic]

12.03.11

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/7424/dsc2652sn.jpg

http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/9193/dsc2646sn.jpg

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/4531/dsc2634sn.jpg

http://img848.imageshack.us/img848/2074/dsc2630sn.jpg

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/8064/dsc2619sn.jpg

http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/7905/dsc2609sn.jpg

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4738/dsc2600sn.jpg

http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/7518/dsc2598sn.jpg

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/2065/dsc2595sn.jpg

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/2163/dsc2591sn.jpg

http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/483/dsc2583sn.jpg

http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/9053/dsc2568sn.jpg

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/8234/dsc2556sn.jpg

©tectonic

[lofter1]

This could change the security situation at the new arena ...

Russian Billionaire Prokhorov To Take On Putin

FORBES (http://www.forbes.com/sites/briansolomon/2011/12/12/russian-billionaire-prokhorov-to-take-on-putin/)
December 12, 2011

“It is better to fight with strong people. You can’t be strong with the weak. You have to be strong with the strong,” Mikhail Prokhorov (http://www.forbes.com/profile/mikhail-prokhorov/) told Forbes in 2009, in perhaps the first feature story on the Russian billionaire in the U.S. press.

Now Prokhorov, the owner of the New Jersey Nets and Russia’s third wealthiest person, will try to back up that bold statement. He announced Monday at a press conference that he would challenge Prime Minister Vladimir Putin (http://www.forbes.com/profile/vladimir-putin/) in the 2012 Russian presidential election.

“I have made the most serious decision of my life. I am running for president,” Prokhorov said, after tens of thousands of people protested the internationally-condemned, likely-fraudulent parliamentary election results that re-elected Putin’s United Russia party.

In September, Prokhorov was ousted from his own political party, a pro-business effort that was challenging United Russia in the parliamentary elections. He blamed the Kremlin for instigating an internal power struggle.

“I think that our society is waking up, and that part of the government which is not capable of establishing a dialogue with society, those authorities will have to go,” Prokhorov said on Monday, according to The New York Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/13/world/europe/billionaire-to-oppose-putin-in-russian-presidential-election.html). “The world is undergoing serious changes, a new kind of person has arisen as the result of the internet, and communication between the authorities and society will have a more honest character.”

... Putin is the second most powerful person in the world, according to Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/powerful-people/). So does Prokhorov stand a chance?

Prokhorov told Forbes in 2009, “I never accept the risk I can’t control.” Let’s hope he’s right, and that he fares better than the last billionaire to take on Putin.

Mikhail Khodorkovsky, once the richest person in Russia, has been behind bars since 2003, convicted on fraud charges and tax evasion....

FULL STORY (http://www.forbes.com/sites/briansolomon/2011/12/12/russian-billionaire-prokhorov-to-take-on-putin/)

[lofter1]

Inside the Barclays Center Build-Out (http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2012/02/inside-the-barclays-center-build-out/)

BROWNSTONER

A Sneak Peek Inside Barclays Center (http://parkslope.patch.com/articles/a-sneak-peek-inside-barclays-center-video#video-9049300) [PS Patch]

Park Slope Patch took a tour of the Barclays Center construction site on Friday, getting a first-hand look at what will become the home of the Brooklyn Nets. (Judging from another detail in the article–there are only 1,100 parking spots slated for the 20,000-capacity stadium–this will also be the home of many future traffic jams and frustrated neighborhood car owners.) The AOL-owned local blog notes that the steel roof is now 80 percent complete and the glass panels that coat the buildings exterior will all be in place by March.

Video by Matthew Hampton

[BPC]

Inside the Barclays Center Build-Out (http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2012/02/inside-the-barclays-center-build-out/)

BROWNSTONER

A Sneak Peek Inside Barclays Center (http://parkslope.patch.com/articles/a-sneak-peek-inside-barclays-center-video#video-9049300) [PS Patch]

... Judging from another detail in the article–there are only 1,100 parking spots slated for the 20,000-capacity stadium–this will also be the home of many future traffic jams and frustrated neighborhood car owners. ...


Why on earth would anyone drive there? The site is across the street from the Atlantic Terminal, and is probably the most train-accessible site in the five boroughs.

[BenM]

Jay-Z Determined to Make the Nets Stylish (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204136404577211581599161916.html?m od=googlenews_wsj) (WSJ)



In addition, the Nets are set to begin marketing 11 luxury suites that will be known as "The Vault at Barclays Center," a small, high-end space on the event level of the arena. Yes, Jay-Z chose the forks—in addition to offering his input on the Champagne ($300 bottles of Armand de Brignac), the layout (asymmetrical) and much of the décor (lots of black and shimmering metallics). . .

​
The suites themselves, which are still under construction, will be unabashedly bold—and that includes the price tag: $550,000 per year, with a minimum three-year term. That works out to $45,833 per month, instantly making them some of the most expensive rental properties in the city.

[londonlawyer]

This arena looks great.

[futurecity]

Do you think the new team will convert many Brooklyn basketball fans? How about Queens fans? Isn't the fan base from NJ?

Will it be -- Knicks for Manhatta/Bronx/Queens, and Nets for Brooklyn/NJ + ? Or will it be a complete mix? A great cross-river rivalry might be setting up? That would be good for the league.

One thing I can say, this looks like its going to nicer than MSG even after renovation. Pity it doesn't serve hockey well, then the islanders could have relocated there. I'm more of a hockey fan than an NBA fan FYI.

[ZippyTheChimp]

The Knicks own New York, even while being dreadful for many years. But the metro area is large enough to support the Nets.

The fan base in New York for all sports is much less - if at all - localized than it was in the past. When TV coverage was limited and tickets were cheaper, people attended a lot more games. So the fan base was somewhat centralized to the stadium or arena.

Now you can watch almost every game for any team on a big screen TV.

[futurecity]

The Knicks own New York, even while being dreadful for many years. But the metro area is large enough to support the Nets.

The fan base in New York for all sports is much less - if at all - localized than it was in the past. When TV coverage was limited and tickets were cheaper, people attended a lot more games. So the fan base was somewhat centralized to the stadium or arena.

Now you can watch almost every game for any team on a big screen TV.

Yes, so you think that in general, Brooklyn will see a higher share of nets fans then anywhere else?
I wonder if there will be any conversions from Knick to nets fans... i'm sure some will, given the Brooklyn identity.

[ZippyTheChimp]

There may be a higher percentage of Nets fans from Brooklyn, but I don't think it will be as pronounced as it was with the Brooklyn Dodgers vs the New York Yankees.

[ZippyTheChimp]

Pity it doesn't serve hockey well, then the islanders could have relocated there. I'm more of a hockey fan than an NBA fan FYI.Even though Islanders owner Charles Wang doesn't want to leave Nassau County, it's extremely doubtful that he will resign the onerous Coliseum lease that the team is stuck with. The arena is a mess, but there is no political will in Nassau County to fund a new facility. And construction would have to start right now to reach completion at the end of the lease.

The Islanders might leave the state.

I was listening to WFAN a while ago, and a caller who was obviously from Long Island - he sounded like that noise when your brake pads need replacement - was in denial about the political and economic realities.

I didn't know that the Wangs and Dolans are neighbors and friendly toward each other. What have those scumbag Dolans have to do with this, you might ask?

The Islanders will play a preseason game against the Devils next October at the Barclays Center. Testing the water? For the Islanders to move to Brooklyn, the Dolans would have to waive their NHL territorial rights to NYC.

The capacity is a little low by NHL standards, but the league has to think about media exposure in major markets.

To the shrill Long Island caller: Hey, topographically, it's still Long Island.

[eddhead]

Now you can watch almost every game for any team on a big screen TV.
...except the Knicks if you have Time Warner.

[ZippyTheChimp]

Or the Rangers. Linsanity may force a settlement.

Yesterday, WFAN had reps from TW and MSG on the show. They couldn't get them to appear together, so TW at 4PM and MSG at 5:30. Earlier, they asked a poll question on which side is to blame: exactly 50% split.

The TW guy made several mistakes:
1. He was on the phone.
2. He didn't grasp that TW was at a disadvantage, since the customers have a contract with them, not MSG. Public relations wasn't going to work.
3. His title was a "director of communications." I assumed that had something to do with the core business, but he was a PR guy. He didn't really know enough about the issues, and couldn't answer key questions. He referred to an agreement that MSG reneged on, but when asked if it was written down, if there was a handshake, if he was in the room - he got evasive.

Francesa is often a knucklehead, but he had his game face on. Whether intentional or not, he led TW into a trap.

Francesa said - look, we all know that ultimately the cost will get passed on to the customers. TW agreed, and the trap was set.

Later on Francesa said - the station has been getting a lot of calls from people wondering about any rebates. TW said, no rebates, and then went into a blah-blah about how the rate structure is complex, involving many channels and providers, infrastructure, and delivery; it's not just adding up all the channels.

The hammer. Francesa said - So you earlier said that an increase in one channel would raise the rate, but now you're saying that a decrease in one channel won't lower the rate. What's the difference?

Lots of stuttering after this.

THe MSG guy showed up in person, and seemed to be involved in the core business. While he may have been lying, he stated directly that there was never any agreement, and the increase was not going to be 50%.

Both sides conveniently hid behind confidentiality agreements between content providers and carriers over their internal contracts.

A pox on both their houses.

[JCMAN320]

Thank god Jersey City has Comcast.

[lofter1]

Ah, yes ... the wonders of the competitive free market that America is so famous for.

[ZippyTheChimp]

Thank god Jersey City has Comcast.So, you thank god for that?

:D

http://www.fiercecable.com/story/comcast-time-warner-cable-worst-company-sweet-16/2011-03-28

Coincided with last years March Madness, and almost as entertaining.

[JCMAN320]

So, you thank god for that?

:D

http://www.fiercecable.com/story/comcast-time-warner-cable-worst-company-sweet-16/2011-03-28

Coincided with last years March Madness, and almost as entertaining.

Lol damn looks like cable companies will never grow up ;). Well atleast I can see my Devils right now. Gotta tip my hat to the Rangers; they are on fire right now!

[eltodesukane]

unable to see big image at Image Shack
I hate ImageShack
please do not use ImageShack

[ZippyTheChimp]

^
I've already explained it so you on another thread. If you can't figure it out, that's your problem.

[Tectonic]

03.15.12

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/262/dsc3656sn.jpg

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/5796/dsc3660sn.jpg

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/9073/dsc3684sn.jpg

http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/4707/dsc3663sn.jpg

http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/5884/dsc3682sn.jpg

©tectonic

[lofter1]

If only Ratner would wrap his cruddy looking mall across the street in something half as interesting as this ...

[ZippyTheChimp]

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/332/atlanticyards15c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/192/atlanticyards15c.jpg/) http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/6725/atlanticyards16c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/190/atlanticyards16c.jpg/) http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/3407/atlanticyards17c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/96/atlanticyards17c.jpg/) http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/3624/atlanticyards18c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/841/atlanticyards18c.jpg/)

Lots of pear trees blooming on 5th Ave.
http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/6865/atlanticyards19c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/718/atlanticyards19c.jpg/)

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/7405/atlanticyards20c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/19/atlanticyards20c.jpg/) http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/4558/atlanticyards21c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/9/atlanticyards21c.jpg/) http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/4380/atlanticyards22c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/818/atlanticyards22c.jpg/) http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/4511/atlanticyards23c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/833/atlanticyards23c.jpg/) http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/3886/atlanticyards24c.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/62/atlanticyards24c.jpg/)

[vanshnookenraggen]

This is a surprisingly interesting design.

[infoshare]

Yes, I like this one a lot: those folks over at shoP never do anything that looks bland, boring, mediocre, building-standard, ect........ The patina on that facade is something that needs to be 'seen' to be fully appreciated: even all this 'professional level' photography we have here on this thread does not quite capture the subtle color/textures of those 'weathered' panels. Beautiful!

[babybackribs2314]

It seems the design has received lots of criticism, but I actually like it... the facade is something new and refreshing (surprisingly, given it's basically a shade of brown) for a stadium. Looking forward to seeing the residential towers begin to rise around this as phase II of the development commences...

[ZippyTheChimp]

^
The mock-up of the facade panels (back in this thread) had a plastic look, no texture.

[infoshare]

. the facade is something new and refreshing (surprisingly, given it's basically a shade of brown) for a stadium. Looking forward to seeing the residential towers begin to rise around this as phase II of the development commences...
They basically left those facade panels out to rust, BEFORE they were installed: yes, definitely something new and refreshing. The result is a brownish mottled color, and a suede-like texture. A lot a people are just not going to "get it" and will probably wonder why the stadium owners 'forgot' to paint the building.LOL

[BPC]

I agree. The rusted metal is very bad-ass, and certainly not something I have seen before. These arenas tend to be very cookie-cutter, so glad to see this one is not.

[GordonGecko]

http://i655.photobucket.com/albums/uu273/areacode212/Barclays_Islanders.jpg

Who knew the place would come ready with an ice surface?

[BStyles]

They build stadiums to house multiple venues, not just basketball. Jay-Z is also planning a concert on opening night.

[arcman210]

It was really short sighted of Ratner to scrap the ability for the arena to hold enough for an NHL team. Especially since the Islanders have had troubles getting their new arena for nearly a decade. Gehry's arena bowl design would have accomodated an NHL team with no issue.

[ZippyTheChimp]

Barclays Center would have the lowest capacity (14,500) for an NHL team, but that doesn't mean it can't happen.

There are a few giant arenas in the 20,000 range, but the average seems to be 17,500 - 18,500.

MSG ------------------18,200
Prudential Center-----17,600
Nassau Coliseum-----16,200

The smallest NHL venue is MTS Centre (Winnipeg Jets), 15,000.

The Islanders in Brooklyn would retain their connection to Calevision-MSG network. The programming content is one of the reasons the Rangers (Dolan) haven't blocked a move by the Islanders into the city.

Assuming nothing is going to get done in Nassau County, the Islanders will move after their lease expires in two years. Not too hard to move 20 miles into an already built new arena and a big TV network.

[RoldanTTLB]

Considering that the Islanders average attendance is only 13,087 (81% cap.), I don't think it matters much, especially if they can charge more per seat here than they can in Nassau County.

[lofter1]

Exactly ^

Fewer seats at higher prices work better for the arena operator.

Here's the price range that Barclay's website (http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/00004877ACA8C2E8?artistid=805986&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=9) shows for Islanders v. Devils on October 2:

Lower Bowl Seating
US $14.50 - US $156.00US $14.50 Ticket + US $5.35 Fees =
US $19.85
US $156.00 Ticket +US $19.55 Fees =
US $175.55


Mid Bowl Seating
US $14.50 - US $71.00US $14.50 Ticket + US $5.35 Fees =
US $19.85
US $71.00 Ticket +US $10.10 Fees =
US $81.10


Upper Bowl Seating
US $14.50 - US $41.00US $14.50 Ticket + US $5.35 Fees =
US $19.85
US $41.00 Ticket + US $8.45 Fees =
US $49.45

[lofter1]

Price range for B'ball Barclays Center Classic featuring Kentucky & Maryland on November 9 (http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/000048658D79679B?artistid=838134&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=7&brand=barclays):

Lower Bowl Seating
US $45.50 - US $256.00US $45.50 Ticket + US $9.05 Fees =
US $54.55
US $256.00 Ticket +US $26.80 Fees =
US $282.80


Mid Bowl Seating
US $45.50 - US $156.00US $45.50 Ticket + US $9.05 Fees =
US $54.55
US $156.00 Ticket +US $19.55 Fees =
US $175.55


Upper Bowl Seating
US $15.00 - US $30.50US $15.00 Ticket + US $5.35 Fees =
US $20.35
US $30.50 Ticket + US $7.70 Fees =
US $38.20


And for BROOKLYN HOOPS Winter Festival (http://www.ticketmaster.com/BROOKLYN-HOOPS-Winter-Festival-tickets/artist/1710072?tm_link=edp_Artist_Name) December 15:

Lower Bowl Seating
US $45.50 - US $256.00US $45.50 Ticket + US $8.55 Fees =
US $54.05
US $256.00 Ticket +US $31.80 Fees =
US $287.80


Mid Bowl Seating
US $30.50 - US $156.00US $30.50 Ticket + US $7.70 Fees =
US $38.20
US $156.00 Ticket +US $19.55 Fees =
US $175.55


Upper Bowl Seating
US $15.00 - US $30.50US $15.00 Ticket + US $6.35 Fees =
US $21.35
US $30.50 Ticket + US $7.70 Fees =
US $38.20

[GordonGecko]

They're crazy, the Nets are pricing Brooklyn tickets higher than the Knicks. Prepare for a ghost town in there to most games, especially during the last 10 minutes when they're down 120-75 to the Wizards

[ZippyTheChimp]

Those prices are for a single event, so I'm not sure you can use them for a Knicks-Nets comparison.

Some info from articles posted last year at Atlantic Yards Reports:


Notably, the Nets no longer plan Personal Seat Licenses (PSLs), which in both internal Forest City Ratner documents and a KPMG report from 2006 were supposed to bring $20 million in over two years in revenue from 4500 PSLs ($4444 each over two years).

That's likely a reflection of the recession, the drop-off in luxury spending, and the uncertainty of the product on the court.


The new Nets prices are expected to be among the NBA’s highest in their inaugural season in Brooklyn and comparable to what the Knicks will charge at Madison Square Garden.


Yormark said the average Nets ticket at Barclays Center would run $132 — more than double the $60 average for tickets to see the woeful Nets at Newark’s Prudential Center. In the 2006-2007 season, when the team was last a contender, the Nets’ average ticket ran $101.


Knicks tickets now average about $88, according to Forbes, but tickets are being jacked up an average of 49 percent next season following a three-year Garden renovation.

*49% increase in Knicks tickets would make it $131.

Somebody did their homework.

http://atlanticyardsreport.blogspot.com/2011/03/nets-start-selling-tickets-for-brooklyn.html

[JCMAN320]

The Islanders are a joke of a franchise. The Devils will work that minor league team over and I will be there to watch it. The Islanders are last in attendence in the NHL; theyre arena hold 16,000 and they struggle to get 10,000 in there. Even with 14,500, they wouldn't sell out at Barclays or even come close.

[ZippyTheChimp]

The Devils aren't much less of a joke.

Islanders are #29 in the NHL in team valuation, but the Devils are #20. At least the Islanders have the excuse of being a shit team and playing in a dilapidated arena.

Worse, the Devils value dropped 17% during the year, most in the league.

The Islanders lost $8 million; the Devils lost $6 million.

Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/nhl-valuations/list/)

[arcman210]

The Devils are one of the only consistently good teams in the NHL that can't sell out their arena on a regular basis. I'll leave that argument for another time and place though.

The actual number of seats for hockey at the Barclays center isn't what the true issue is. It's the way the seats would be set up. A similar situation existed when the Phoneix Coyotes franchise came into existance and played at a basketball centric arena in downtown Phoenix. Since the seats are closer to the court and an NHL rink is twice the size of an NBA court, an entire end of the arena becomes obstructed view. Thus, capacity is reduced and many prime seats are sacraficed.

It would be detrimental for the franchise to block off 30% of the premium lower bowl seats, 30% of the luxury boxes, and then obviously 30% of the upper deck.
http://www.gotickets.com/cached/_images/maintainwidth/521x500/3289d6466a2cd8483042263f956c9f7d/usairwayscenter_hockey-2055.gif

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg17/scaled.php?server=17&filename=2271u.jpg&res=medium

The Coyotes had to eventually build their own building.

Despite what the Barclays Center owners would tell you, the NHL would never allow a franchise to use an arena like this as a permanent home.

[JCMAN320]

The Devils are one of four teams within a 1 hour and half drive and the youngest. We are one of the most succesful franchises in the NHL but we lose out to the Rangers and Flyers. The Devils finances lost are not due to not drawing which we do I go to games consistantly; Vanderbeek mismanaged his funds.

In regards to the Isles playing at Barclays; I agree the NHL will move em elsewhere than rather them play at Barlcays.

[BrooklynLove]

Are we really going to go through several years of NJ hoorah again, but this time about how pro hockey won't come to brooklyn now that the basketball argument is dead?

a small arena can be more profitable than a larger arena if the smaller one consistently sells out and charges more. the montreal expos played in a huge space as did the los angeles raiders. and there is a multitude of examples behind those. btw how does the capacity of citifield to compare to that of shea stadium?

you're so confident that the nhl would not approve a move to the barclays center. let's hear some specific reasoning that bears factual support rather than emotional speculation.

[ZippyTheChimp]

I see Arcman's point, but I don't think a New York Islanders - Phoenix Coyotes comparison is valid.

The Islanders are an established franchise in New York with a good fan base. The Coyotes have been managed by the NHL since the owner declared bankruptcy. They are still trying to find an owner. Wang wants to own the Islanders; he has withstood annual losses, but he needs a new facility. I doubt he will keep the team if they move to another city.

The NHL has financial problems (http://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2011/11/30/the-business-of-hockey/), I don't think they're in a position to dictate policy that could lose them a good owner. And the Islanders don't have to permanently move into Barclay Center. They could sign a five-year deal, while Wang tries to find a permanent home in the area.

Again, you can't overlook the NY media market as a revenue source. The LA Angels didn't give Pujols a huge contract because their stadium attendance went up; they now have a TV network similar to those of the Yankees and Red Sox.

As for the Devils, they almost defaulted on loan payments last year; what saved them is an NHL policy not to allow teams to go bankrupt during the season. But they have another day of reckoning in July.

If teetering on bankruptcy is successful, I'm Warren Buffet's mentor.

[arcman210]

you're so confident that the nhl would not approve a move to the barclays center. let's hear some specific reasoning that bears factual support rather than emotional speculation.

Where do you see emotional speculation? Why would I be NJ hoorah-ing for the Islanders (...an existing New York team)? I gave some reasoning based on arena facts. Not to mention Gary Bettman has said he doesn't see the Barclays Center as being a feasable home for the Islanders long term. Personally, I wish Ratner had went with a larger arena so that the Islanders could move there. Would make the most sense for everyone and I would love nothing more than for the Islanders to find a permanent home in the NYC area.

If the Barclays Center could work as a permanent home, it would have been used as leverage in the past few attempts at an arena in Nassau County. The only reason the Islanders to Brooklyn talk continues is because of the media (and the Barclays Center owners) driving it. Obviously any arena would love to have multiple tenants, but they simply wouldn't be able to host the Islanders on more than a temporary basis. The most logical scenario for the Islanders in Brooklyn is for them to play there on a year to year basis if and when the Nassau Coliseum is renovated or rebuilt. If the Islanders wind up in NYC, the most likely place would be Willets Point.

[BrooklynLove]

Ok so now we've already gone from never going to happen to maybe a year or two. Quickly not sounding so unrealistic that a more permanent move could happen.

[Tectonic]

05.11.12

Oculus frame assembled:

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/582201_10150816135492903_330613722902_9593613_1502 715112_n.jpg
©tectonic

[BStyles]

Oh we definitely need an overshot photo, now. This looks great!

[Tectonic]

Some more from today:

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/398226_10150820136167903_330613722902_9608612_9201 04304_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/531405_10150820136607903_330613722902_9608615_1255 589093_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/579661_10150820137277903_330613722902_9608622_1990 273503_n.jpg

With a 1 WTC cameo

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/401704_10150820137467903_330613722902_9608623_2144 300769_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/148748_10150820174017903_330613722902_9608777_2019 069798_n.jpg

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/579467_10150820174712903_330613722902_9608783_1270 46981_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/535728_10150820175027903_330613722902_9608787_1735 340526_n.jpg

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/462422_10150820192662903_330613722902_9608914_7521 69572_o.jpg

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/465430_10150820190772903_330613722902_9608904_8720 54567_o.jpg

©tectonic

[infoshare]

Kandy Kakes: "the lady & the truss"
http://www.examiner.com/article/kandy-kakes-iron-men-s-first-lady

The "iron men" TV show has some on-site filming of the iron work currently underway: featuring 'kandy Kakes' the female iron worker.

[GordonGecko]

Is this place really going to be ready for the start of the 2012-13 NBA season?

[infoshare]

Is this place really going to be ready for the start of the 2012-13 NBA season?

Would Bloomberg's "Olympic Stadium" at Hudson Yards have been completed in time for the 2012 Olympic games: a big NO to both. The 'cost' and 'project completion time frames' for constructions projects - particularly in NYC - seems to be completely 'blue sky' wild guesses. Alas, it takes, whatever time it takes: we all just have to grin a bear it. LOL

BTW: This subject is good opportunity to put in a plug for my friends at CASE and 'design reForm' - "voices going viral".
http://designreform.net/event/2012/05/09/designreform-“voices-going-viral”-organized-aiany-global-dialogues-committee

[Fimiak]

I'm sure if NYC got the olympics then they would have found a way to speed up construction by two months. This thing is still supposed to open in September with Jay-Z's concert.

[BStyles]

It's only May, and all the steel is basically in place(or somewhere near 95% complete). Cladding is about 20% behind that, and that could be done by the end of june. All that's left is grade work and interior outfitting. I definitely look forward to a September opening.

[lofter1]

Is that oculus going to be open to the sky or does it get glassed over?

[Tectonic]

The oculus stays open.

[Tectonic]

Some from yesterday:

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/428397_10150838854152903_330613722902_9658540_7584 46299_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/559519_10150838854362903_330613722902_9658542_1362 751917_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/551184_10150838854517903_330613722902_9658545_2132 272526_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/579633_10150838854712903_330613722902_9658547_1550 56890_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/310077_10150838854922903_330613722902_9658549_1117 075695_n.jpg

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/399170_10150838855087903_330613722902_9658551_9825 32994_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/181228_10150838855307903_330613722902_9658555_1973 538507_n.jpg

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/547429_10150838855482903_330613722902_9658558_2287 85098_n.jpg

©tectonic

[antinimby]

It's different, but not exciting.

[Fimiak]

http://www.seats3d.com/nba/barclays_center/

That is a 3D interior mockup of the arena. Click it and see what the arena will look like from each section.