440 West 42nd Street (60 Story Tower) at 10th Avenue

[krulltime]

Earlier Rendering:

http://www.pbase.com/image/37698122.jpg

Latest Rendering:

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51359424.440a.JPG

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51358422.440.JPG

http://www.twiningproperties.com/properties/current_projects/new_york_city/overview

According to Crains in the "Developers home in on far W. Side" article date December 13-19:

Prices moving up


Developers already are paying top dollar for some prime sites. In a sale recently closed by Massey Knakal, Mendel Mendlowitz bought the entire eastern block on Ninth Avenue between W. 35th and West 36th streets for $22 million. The price had jumped 57% over the $14 million paid one year ago by the seller, AAG Management.

Some developers are so confident in the area and the city's need for more housing that they're not waiting for any more government approvals. Twining Properties-in partnership with The Related Cos. and MacFarlane Partners-recently closed on a site at 440 W. 42nd St., at 10th Avenue, without the promise of any zoning changes. The developers plan to construct a tower with retail stores, rental apartments and condominiums.

"The far West Side has got to happen," says President Alex Twining. "There's only so much land left in Manhattan."

Also on Twining Properties Website:

Twining Properties is pleased to announce 440 west 42nd Street, a 60-story high rise residential tower with over 600 luxury apartments in Midtown Manhattan. 440 west 42nd Street will be developed by a joint venture between Twining Properties, The Related Companies and Macfarlane Partners. The project will occupy an entire city block and will include two retail levels above underground parking and rental apartments and condominiums with dramatic views of the Hudson River and Times Square. Construction will commence in the Fall of 2005.

[TLOZ Link5]

Can I get a w00t?

[Stern]

Nice proportions, tall and glassy. Now lets see if it stays this way. :roll:

[krulltime]

Yeah it looks quite nice. I wonder what that oval glassy thing will be. It looks kind of weird for a residential building. It might be the retail stuff. maybe a mini-mall.

Oh I have no idea how tall in feets it is, but it looks tall to me.

[krulltime]

Secret city land deal a whopper

http://www.nydailynews.com/ips_rich_content/100-for_juan.JPG
Property at 42nd St. and Dyer Ave., on far West Side,
that Bloomberg administration indicated it planned to condemn -
but then quietly sold to developer Steve Ross.


When the City Council approved the massive Hudson Yards development project last week, it gave the Bloomberg administration permission to condemn and acquire several parcels of land on Manhattan's far West Side.

One of those parcels is a city-owned block along 42nd St.'s Theater Row, between Dyer and 10th Aves. The buildings there would be torn down to facilitate construction of the No. 7 line subway extension and eventually a new station on the site.

But the Council was never told the city had no intention of condemning the site.

The city had quietly decided last fall to sell it to one of this town's biggest real estate developers, Stephen Ross, for the price of a song: $100,000.

If it sounds like a sweet deal, Ross must have thought so: He and his partners, TRM Associates, paid $107 million for the lease rights to the property, and sources say they plan to build a 60-story building there.

Ross, chief executive of the The Related Companies, is a close friend and former business partner of Deputy Mayor Daniel Doctoroff.

He bought the site's lease in early November in a federal bankruptcy court settlement from the partnership that controlled the block for 25 years.

Among the small buildings on the block are the former West Side Airlines terminal and two off-Broadway theaters, neither of which produces much rental income.

But the block's real value is its development potential, thanks to the city's decision to build a new subway station that will have four escalators and two elevators emptying into it.

On the surface, it smacks of a back-room agreement.

The city issued no press releases on its deal with Ross, and the settlement papers weren't filed with the city Finance Department until Jan. 18 - the night before the Council's vote.

Bloomberg aides said last week that the lease sale was a private transaction, and that City Hall had no favorites.

But according to documents in the bankruptcy case, the Ross group won City Hall's support as far back as July.

At the time, several developers were feverishly bidding to win control of the site.

Theater Row Phase II Associates held the site's lease but was in bankruptcy and owed the city nearly $14.5 million - making City Hall's approval a necessity.

The Theater Row group, headed by William Condren, had bought the site's lease in 1980 for just $450,000.

After the sale, the Condren group paid the city $9.5 million to settle its debt, and walked away with a profit of nearly $100 million.

One of the developers who competed with Ross for the lease was Robert Gladstone of Madison Equities LLC. His lawyers have charged in court papers that the negotiating process was unfairly skewed in favor of the Ross group.

Madison Equities points to an unpublicized July 22 agreement among the city, Condren and one of the partners in the Ross group, in which the city agreed to back the Ross partnership.

"There was never really a conversation between our side and the city," a Madison Equities source said last week.

David Burger, Condren's attorney, scoffed at the claim and said Gladstone is a sore loser.

As for Bloomberg officials, they insist their only concern from the start was for Condren to pay his debts. They added that the Ross group was the only suitor to agree to provide the city all the easements it needed to build the subway and the new station underneath the site.

"It not only cleared up a longstanding dispute, but it provided the city with money it was owed," said Michael Sherman, spokesman for the city's Economic Development Corp., and "will allow the No. 7 subway extension to be completed."

But at the Council, all were shocked to learn about the secret sale of a property it had just approved for condemnation.

"It's very surprising," said Councilwoman Christine Quinn, who took part in marathon talks with City Hall over the Hudson Yards plan. "When you don't make complete disclosures, for any reason, it raises questions."

Ross recently built the giant Time Warner headquarters at Columbus Circle. His side wouldn't confirm plans to build a 60-story skyscraper.

Jeff Blau, Ross' second in command, would say only that it will be a "mixed use" commercial and residential structure.

Given the close relationship between Doctoroff, the city's economic development czar, and Ross, it's natural to ask if the deputy mayor had anything to do with the transaction.

Doctoroff, once a co-owner of the New York Islanders with Ross, did not return calls for comment.

"Neither Doctoroff nor the mayor had anything to do with this," said one city official involved in the deal. "[Doctoroff] is recused from any decisions involving Ross.

"It was a team decision," the official said.

Originally published on January 25, 2005


All contents © 2005 Daily News, L.P.

[James Kovata]

Any information as to height?

[Kolbster]

Any renderings?

[PHLguy]

Office or residential?

[ZippyTheChimp]

Read.

[Stern]

http://www.twiningproperties.com/properties/current_projects/new_york_city/:v_get/3447/overview/_res/id=sa_Image

[Kolbster]

Hmmmm, can't wait for some more renderings; that one is too vague

[Gulcrapek]

5/29/05

http://img173.echo.cx/img173/2069/4somethingw420zk.th.jpg (http://img173.echo.cx/my.php?image=4somethingw420zk.jpg)

[sfenn1117]

Steel is rising already????

[Gulcrapek]

Rebar, yes.

[Gulcrapek]

But it does seem odd... given that they gave 2006 as starting date, and there aren't any permits filed... is there anything else u/c on that block?

[Derek2k3]

The construction in that pic is of a building on the next block on the opposite side of the street.

519 West 42nd Street
http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5949&page=1

[pianoman11686]

From http://cityrealty.com:

New West 42nd Street tower will have about 800 rental and condo apartments 01-AUG-05

The site for a major new tower that may contain about 800 rental and condominium apartments as well as retail, cultural and transportation uses on West 42nd Street is being cleared.

Alex Twining, the principal of Twining Properties, said today that the design for the development at 440 West 42nd Street is "still being adjusted" and that the mix of apartments is "still being finalized." "There are a phenomenal number of cooks," he said.

When asked what was the the timetable for construction, he laughed and said "three months ago," adding that the complex, mixed-use project is "as-of-right," that is, it will be built within existing zoning and building regulations and not require any special permits or variances.

It will be at least 60 stories tall, he said.

The development is a joint venture between Twining Properties, MacFarlane Properties and The Related Companies, a co-developer of the Time Warner Center at Columbus Circle.

Arquitectonica, the Miami-based architecture firm that is famous for designing bold and brightly colored towers such as The Palace and the Atlantis in Miami and geometrically very interesting projects such as a bank in Lima, Peru, is the architect for the project. Its first major high-rise development in the city was the Westin Hotel on the northeast corner of Eighth Avenue and 42nd Street that has a tall tower with an incised curved light that runs up its full height. The tower, whose top is angled, sits on a multi-angled box and the facades utilize several colors.

Twining Properties, founded by Alex Twining, formerly with Morgan Stanley and AvalonBay Communities, has offices in Boston and New York.

The planned tower does not yet have a name and it is one of several huge residential projects being built or planned for the western end of 42nd Street.

[Edward]

The site of 440 West 42nd Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/440w42nd/). 16 July 2005.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/440w42nd/440w42nd.jpg (http://www.wirednewyork.com/real_estate/440w42nd/)

[lofter1]

New West 42nd Street tower ... that may contain about 800 rental and condominium apartments as well as retail, cultural and transportation uses on West 42nd Street is being cleared.
This site contains a number of performance spaces. It will be interesting to see in the "cultural" uses will include theatres.

Also curious what "transportation" uses might be? Possibly ... new station for the extension of the 7 line??????

[ablarc]

^ ^ Elsewere there's a discussion on "Is New York dirty?" Just look at Edward's photo: immaculate. If he had taken this picture in 1975 there would have been litter (and worse) all over the place.

Hope they replace those trees when they're through with construction.

[Fabrizio]

I remember this block from 1975 very well. Before it became a theatre row. The Manhattan Plaza apts was an empty lot. It was all hand painted signs and boarded-up windows. You had the "Hello Deli"... before the one made famous by Letterman...I used to eat there! Really squalid but we were broke. You had the Club Zsa Zsa, the Tomcat Theatre, The French Model house.... do I have to describe what these places were? Ah...NYC in 1975.

[billyblancoNYC]

I believe new developments on W42nd are required to have cultural spaces like theaters, so I hope that is what goes there. Would be nice if the same theaters got a chance to come back to some shiny new digs...

[BrooklynRider]

I agree with Billy. I think development of West 42nd Street requires new Off-Broadway or Off-Off Broadway caliber theater space as well as rehearsal space. This particular parcel is losing three theaters and televsion studios (the old NY1 news studios). I would looking for something akin to Theater Row building with Playwrite's Horizon and Little Schuber Theater (which is a wonderfully designed and very comfortable space).

[buff]

Demolition has begun between Dyer and 10th Avenue on 42nd street:

[BrooklynRider]

Good bye Douglas Fairbanks Theater

[sfenn1117]

Good point ablarc.

The new tower will certainly be better looking, from the outside, than what's there now. Thankfully there will be space for "cultural" uses. Maybe not what's there now, but something similar.

I think this will be taller than the Orion.

[czsz]

I was actually astounded by that photo. I've never seen such a clean stretch of street in New York. Only a matter of time, though, before the hyperdevelopment of this street results in the overflowing trash cans and littered sidewalks common elsewhere in the city.

[ablarc]

^ Do you look for it?;)

I have three photo threads in the New York pictures section without any litter, and I made no particular effort to set that up.

I remember New York when it was really dirty. Nothing like what you see now.

[Fabrizio]

"The new tower will certainly be better looking, from the outside, than what's there now".

I´m not so opitimistic.

The small characteristic buildings should be preserved with the tower built around them. Those that have been nicely restored are charming. And that´s one thing most of these new residential buildings are not. We shall see...

Any renderings of what´s going to go up there?

[Stern]

"The new tower will certainly be better looking, from the outside, than what's there now".

I´m not so opitimistic.

The small characteristic buildings should be preserved with the tower built around them. Those that have been nicely restored are charming. And that´s one thing most of these new residential buildings are not. We shall see...

Any renderings of what´s going to go up there?

Look at the first page of the thread.

[buff]

I've seen this on other threads:

[Gulcrapek]

Site 8/08/05

http://img320.imageshack.us/img320/7076/blocksite1gv.th.jpg (http://img320.imageshack.us/my.php?image=blocksite1gv.jpg)

[buff]

Oops! That building's gone now:

[BrooklynRider]

The changes on 42nd Street from river to river have been monumental.

[krulltime]

Is this the site where a whole block on 42nd street is been clear?

[NewYorkYankee]

This site looks huge! This building will be quite massive.

[Drexel]

This property is going to be great....will it be taking up the whole block?

[macreator]

Another WorldWide Plaza project in the making

[krulltime]

according to The Real deal news....

September 2005,

Twining Properties is collaborating with the Related Companies and MacFarlane Partners on an 800-unit project at 440 West 42nd Street that was originally planned as two rental towers to be built in phases side by side. Now, due to price increases, developers have chosen to go with one condominium and one rental tower, stacked one upon the other.

Copyright © 2003-2005 The Real Deal

[londonlawyer]

I wonder if the new design is still the one that will be built. It's no longer on Twinings' website. Personally, I don't like it.

Does anyone know how tall this building will be in terms of feet?

[krulltime]

^ I don't know but I bet this one is going to be bigger than the Orion! 800 units!!!

[buff]

demoliton as of 9-29-05:

[BrooklynRider]

Well, that's the end of an era.

[lofter1]

Two positive aspects of this project:

1. It will help to hide the corny striped building to the east.

2. It will help to hide the utilitarian but homely orange brick building to the south

Where will Robin Byrd shoot her cable show now that the studios on 42nd / 10th Ave. are gone? (Is she even around anymore?)

[lofter1]

BTW: The unimpeded views (thanks to the Port Authority Terminal) from the upper floors of this building to the SE should be spectacular: NY Times tower, ESB

[Rhwobwoy]

Two positive aspects of this project:

Where will Robin Byrd shoot her cable show now that the studios on 42nd / 10th Ave. are gone? (Is she even around anymore?)

Is it true that Robin Byrd shot her cable show in the 42nd/10th ave studios? It is still being aired but not sure if the shows are new...

[BrooklynRider]

I thought it was shot on 26th Street in Barry Z's studio / sex club.

[lofter1]

^ She may have shot there too, but I'm pretty sure she shot at the 10th Ave studios at one point.

[lofter1]

Offstage Drama Surrounds Theater Space on 42nd Street

New York Times
October 27, 2005
By CHARLES V. BAGLI (http://query.nytimes.com/search/query?ppds=bylL&v1=CHARLES V. BAGLI&fdq=19960101&td=sysdate&sort=newest&ac=CHARLES V. BAGLI&inline=nyt-per)

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/27/nyregion/27cirque.html


The developer Stephen M. Ross's plan to bring Cirque du Soleil to West 42nd Street in Manhattan (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/classifieds/realestate/locations/newyork/newyorkcity/manhattan/?inline=nyt-geo) has sparked a bitter drama worthy of the Broadway stage, a collision of art and commerce in a city where real estate development is constantly making and remaking neighborhoods.

Mr. Ross is not considering a late-life career change to Broadway producer. But he does want to insert the impossibly contorting human circus into a permanent home in a 60-story apartment building he plans to build three blocks west of Times Square.

The project has touched off an imbroglio that pits the developer against theater enthusiasts, the local community board and some city officials and seeks to plumb the definition of "legitimate theater" - a murky rubric that has come to embrace drama, musicals and even puppets.

Mr. Ross, chairman of Related Companies, wants to take advantage of a city zoning regulation, a "theater bonus" created last year to encourage the building and preservation of theatrical space on the stretch of 42nd Street just west of Theater Row. The bonus would enable him to build a taller tower than would normally be allowed and reap the sales of ever more valuable apartments, in exchange for building a $140 million, 1,800-seat theater for Cirque.

To make way for the project, Related has already demolished the 286-seat Houseman Theater and the 199-seat Fairbanks Theater on 42nd Street.

But critics say that the zoning bonus was intended to nurture struggling, and often homeless, Off Broadway theater companies, not a commercial juggernaut like Cirque du Soleil. And, they say, the large complex Mr. Ross has in mind does not belong in the residential neighborhood that is emerging there.

"Cirque can go anywhere it wants," said John Schultz, executive director of MCC Theaters, the company that originated the plays "Wit" and "Frozen." "It doesn't have to be on 42nd Street, a neighborhood for Off Broadway theaters. You took theaters out and you should put theaters back."

MCC Theaters has been forced by rising rents and a scarcity of space in the theater district to jump from a home in Hell's Kitchen 20 years ago to West 28th Street, then to the Lucille Lortel Theater in Greenwich Village, where it now resides. But next year, when its lease expires, the troupe will have to move again.

In contrast, Cirque du Soleil, based in Canada (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/canada/index.html?inline=nyt-geo), performs all over the world, pulling in revenues of $500 million a year. It has four theaters in Las Vegas and is building a permanent theater at Disney Tokyo that will open in 2008. During the summer, it joined Related and Clear Channel Communications in proposing a takeover of the Jackie Gleason Theater in Miami Beach.

Anna Hayes Levin, a co-chairwoman of the land use committee at Community Board 4, which covers 42nd Street, said the board had initially supported Related's application for a theater zoning bonus based on its original proposal: to replace the two small theaters it demolished and build a "classical music center" that would be overseen by the Orchestra of St. Luke's. That project also had the city's blessing.

But in a move that Ms. Levin described as a case of "bait and switch," Related soon abandoned that idea, proposing instead to create space for House of Blues, a large nightclub and music hall. When that proposal ran into opposition from the City Planning Department and the community board, she said that Related quietly began talking about building a large theater for Cirque, as well as the classical music center.

"It's a Times Square entertainment use that brings large crowds all at once to what is fundamentally a residential area," Ms. Levin said of the Cirque theater.

Related executives contend that they never committed to replacing the Off Broadway theaters. On Oct. 6, Mr. Ross and executives from Clear Channel, his partner, took the Cirque project to the Planning Department. City officials and real estate executives who have spoken to Mr. Ross say that Related is planning a tower with about 800 apartments and has hired the architectural firm Arquitectronica to design it. They said Mr. Ross wanted the zoning bonus so he could build additional commercial space.

Jeff Blau, the president of Related, who has spearheaded the effort to persuade city planners and community groups, did not return calls requesting comment.

The zoning bonus, potentially worth millions of dollars, was the city's attempt to persuade developers to build and preserve space for Off Broadway theaters, which have been a launching pad for many actors and productions.
Officials are now debating whether Cirque can be classified "legitimate theater," as zoning regulations require, and whether it should get the benefit.

The city has long wanted to find a permanent home for Cirque, which has performed under a tent at Battery Park City and on Randalls Island. Indeed, Deputy Mayor Daniel L. Doctoroff had backed an ultimately unsuccessful Related plan to build a Cirque theater at the South Street Seaport.

But determining whether Cirque qualifies for the bonus on 42nd Street is all the more difficult because the zoning regulations do not define the term "legitimate theater."

Critics contend that Cirque productions are wonderfully entertaining shows of high-wire and trapeze acts, clowns and contortionists, not theater. Further, Cirque is a robust profitmaking entity.

"The idea of theater bonuses is a key to the quality of life in the city," said Fred Papert, president of the 42nd Street Development Corporation, a nonprofit organization that has overseen the development of Theater Row. "But the idea that Related, Cirque and Clear Channel would get a bonus is plain flat-out greed, corporate charity, and simply an appalling idea."



Copyright 2005 (http://www.nytimes.com/ref/membercenter/help/copyright.html)The New York Times Company (http://www.nytco.com/)

[krulltime]

Oh wow... I love Cirque du Soleil... Although I wish they will reconcider downtown again. But I will be ok with them to be anywhere else in the city.

Hope they get in on 42nd street.

[BrooklynRider]

It would be ideal on the SE corner of 42nd & 8th Ave or, as you said, downtown. (Or, in the new Downtown Brooklyn!).

The last line of that Times article is some of the worst press Related has received.

[lofter1]

Bad Press -- but right on the money.

Bait & Switch is exactly what this is.

As the article states, the incentives mentioned were intended to protect / encourage small theatre operations (such as were taken down to build this project).

Another problem for Cirque de Soleil regarding these incentives is that they have often operated as a non-union production, which just won't go in the Times Square area -- especially if they are asking for breaks / bonuses as described.

[ld876]

It's not quite bait and switch. They aren't just slipping Cirque in without telling anyone. Although Related was planning on a 'music center' or whatever, everything in NYC is theoretical until it opens.

I personally would love to have Cirque there. Maybe it would spur the 7 getting expanded (I live on 12th avenue, I am a bit partial :) ). Also, I saw Cirque when i was little in a half-sized theater, thus limited effects, it would be nice having the New York home to it up the street from me.

What is best though is people claiming Cirque De Soleil isn't a form of theater. It's not as if the performers just stand there, do a trick and leave; it's all extensively choreographed to well timed music, utilizing talented, strong (and flexible) individuals. People in New York are great at being hypocrites I guess...they use whatever they can to get only what they want, then change the definitions if somone else tries to introduce something along the same lines.

Ahhhh, good times.

[antinimby]

It's not quite bait and switch. They aren't just slipping Cirque in without telling anyone. Although Related was planning on a 'music center' or whatever, everything in NYC is theoretical until it opens.

I personally would love to have Cirque there. Maybe it would spur the 7 getting expanded (I live on 12th avenue, I am a bit partial :) ). Also, I saw Cirque when i was little in a half-sized theater, thus limited effects, it would be nice having the New York home to it up the street from me.

What is best though is people claiming Cirque De Soleil isn't a form of theater. It's not as if the performers just stand there, do a trick and leave; it's all extensively choreographed to well timed music, utilizing talented, strong (and flexible) individuals. People in New York are great at being hypocrites I guess...they use whatever they can to get only what they want, then change the definitions if someone else tries to introduce something along the same lines.
Ahhhh, good times.

What a breath of fresh air!
Great quote BTW, Id876. I would characterize you as a YIMBY.
That's an acron. I just made up to describe people who want construction in their neighborhoods as opposed to the selfish, ever-present NIM's.
Good to see people like you exists in NY--just wished you guys were more vocal in support of projects.

As for the Related/Cirque proposal, call it what you will but ultimately it is good for the city. Cirque won't be around forever and when they depart, the theatre will still be there, providing a large space for performances of any kind and enriching the city's cultural richness. Here's hoping Mr. Ross gets what he wants.

[lofter1]

^ Cirque de Soleil rakes in multi-millions of dollars in profit each year.

I'm all for them finding a permanent home in NYC -- as long as NY tax payers don't pay part of the bill.

Why should any publicly-funded / tax-break initiative be given to the building a home for such an enterprise?

[LeCom]

Yesterday

View to the west
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9163/pict00232440west42nducoct05tot.jpg

Along 42nd Street
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6093/pict0024440west42nducoct05site.jpg

All I could get of the site (through a slit between the gates)
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/1504/pict0025part440west42nducoct05.jpg

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9163/pict00232440west42nducoct05tot.th.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict00232440west42nducoct05tot.jpg) http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6093/pict0024440west42nducoct05site.th.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0024440west42nducoct05site.jpg) http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/1504/pict0025part440west42nducoct05.th.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0025part440west42nducoct05.jpg)

[antinimby]

^ Cirque de Soleil rakes in multi-millions of dollars in profit each year.

I'm all for them finding a permanent home in NYC -- as long as NY tax payers don't pay part of the bill.

Why should any publicly-funded / tax-break initiative be given to the building a home for such an enterprise?

. . . where in that above article does it say that Related is seeking any "public-funded / tax-break initiatives?":confused:

[buff]

... in the "zoning bonus, potentially worth millions of dollars," intended to foster SMALL theatres.

[lofter1]

^ Thank you, buff

[antinimby]

Buff, my dear, you are wrong and so are you, Lofter1.
Please re-read the article.

Related is looking for a "zoning bonus." This means they want to build more space than the zoning allows. Taxpayers are NOT paying for or financing this additional space or for that matter, the theatre.

There is also no mention of this added space being tax exempt, so if anything, the city gets ADDITIONAL tax revenue if Related is allowed to build more.
Nice try.

Also from the article:"Cirque can go anywhere it wants," said John Schultz, executive director of MCC Theaters, the company that originated the plays "Wit" and "Frozen." "It doesn't have to be on 42nd Street, a neighborhood for Off Broadway theaters. You took theaters out and you should put theaters back."

Let me get this straight, he's saying that "Cirque can go anywhere it wants" but then says that they shouldn't be on 42nd St.?
Hmm . . . so he doesn't really mean anywhere, does he?
Typical.

[lofter1]

A "zoning bonus" in this area was meant for specific types of businesses, in this case small developing theatres. I won't go into the details and reasoning behind this, but Cirque de Soleil doesn't fit into that.

If Ross wants to also include spaces for the types of theatres that were removed -- along with Cirque de Soleil -- then I would have no problem with that at all. But Ross should not be rewarded with a "bonus" unless he makes good on his implied contract with the citizens.

[Drexel]

Does anyone know what the final design is for the new building at 440 West 42nd....how many stories the building will be and when will they start construction?:confused:

[buff]

As I understand it, the design hasn't been finalized because the major commercial tenants (including theatrical and/or orchestral) haven't been confirmed. This will determine the configuration of the building's base, and possibly change the zoning, determining the number of floors allowed. Right?

[antinimby]

From the article:
. . . Mr. Ross say that Related is planning a tower with about 800 apartments and has hired the architectural firm Arquitectronica to design it.
This should be a good one.

[Derek2k3]

http://www.pbase.com/archit_kderek2k3/image/52172143.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/archit_kderek2k3/image/52172144.jpg
11-11-05

[buff]

A "zoning bonus" in this area was meant for specific types of businesses, in this case small developing theatres. I won't go into the details and reasoning behind this, but Cirque de Soleil doesn't fit into that.

If Ross wants to also include spaces for the types of theatres that were removed -- along with Cirque de Soleil -- then I would have no problem with that at all. But Ross should not be rewarded with a "bonus" unless he makes good on his implied contract with the citizens.

A City Planning Commission meeting was held on Tuesday, November 15th to discuss this issue.
A large and well-organized group from Manhattan Plaza attended to state their concerns that the small theatres that were demolished be replaced, that 'Cirque' is a circus and not legitimate theatre and violates the spirit of the zoning bonus, and that a venue of that size would change the area, making it an extension of Times Square and does not belong in the residential area that it is now.
We'll see how the Commission responds...

[lofter1]

Equity Opposes Cirque du Soleil Venue

December 02, 2005
By Roger Armbrust

http://www.backstage.com/bso/news_reviews/unions/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001613714


Actors' Equity Association is opposing a real estate developer's efforts to build an 1,800-seat performance venue for Cirque du Soleil on 42nd Street in Manhattan. The actors' union has also proposed updating the definition of "live or legitimate theatre" in New York City's zoning ordinance.

The Related Companies and its chairman and CEO, Stephen M. Ross, have applied with the New York City Planning Commission to build a 60-story apartment complex between Dyer Street and 10th Avenue. The company has also proposed amending the "theatre bonus," a city zoning regulation designed to foster the construction of theatres on 42nd Street west of Theatre Row. The amended bonus would let Related build an apartment tower higher than allowed under normal city building regulations and include the performance facility.

Lee Compton, chair of Community Board 4, whose area includes the proposed construction site, told the Planning Commission on Nov. 16, "Currently the bonus is available only to developments that include 'new legitimate theatre uses.' " He said that his board opposed amending the bonus to allow the Cirque du Soleil space, which he referred to as a "very large Times Square-style entertainment venue."

While the community board supports the effort to build new apartments, Compton said, the plan for the performance space was "very distressing to us and to members of our community." He added that the bonus "was intended to provide for small theatres."

Siding with the community board, Equity followed up with a Nov. 18 letter to Amanda Burden, chair of the Planning Commission. Equity provided Back Stage with a copy of the letter this week.

"Actors' Equity strongly opposes any change...that would permit uses other than legitimate theatre" for the Related Companies development, wrote Alan Eisenberg, Equity's executive director.

Clarifying the union's reason for its opposition, Eisenberg went on to write, "The selection of the theatre bonus was appropriate to the site at the time, and it remains so today. Legitimate theatre thrives on the principle of critical mass. That is why theatres historically congregate in districts. Attendance supports attendance. Additional theatre activity bridging Dyer Avenue will extend and greatly strengthen Theatre Row as a legitimate theatre destination point, increasing the box office of existing theatres and providing additional employment to all of the professional theatre crafts. Overwhelming or underperforming non-theatre entertainment uses in such close proximity to the theatres will, each in its own way, have the opposite results."

Compton told Back Stage Thursday afternoon that the Planning Commission had separated the Cirque du Soleil "theatre bonus" amendment from the rest of the building proposal and that the Department of City Planning was currently "working on language that better fulfills the intent of the theatre bonus." The commission has not set a time to reconsider the issue, he said.

Wants New Definitions

Eisenberg's letter also asked the commission to revise the city zoning ordinance to include a more contemporary definition of "live or legitimate theatre." He asked that the ordinance be amended to define "play" as "an art form in which live actors deliver lines and in which the spoken word primarily propels the action and the plot."

He also suggested a new definition for "musical": "An art form in which live actors deliver lines, lyrics, and dance and in which the spoken and sung word and choreography, accompanied by live instrumentalists, primarily propel the action and the plot."

Equity's staff chief followed those revised definitions by applying them to the Cirque du Soleil issue:

"These definitions provide a clear standard sufficient to the purposes of common understanding and the zoning ordinance. We submit that an orchestra rehearsal center does not meet this standard and that a circus does not meet this standard. The circus is a distinct form of popular entertainment with its own time-honored traditions, attributes, and characteristics. Cirque du Soleil recognizes that by its very title. It does not style itself Theatre du Soleil."

On Thursday, Back Stage attempted to contact Alicia Goldstein, a spokesperson for the Related Companies. She had not returned the call by Friday afternoon.

Maria Somma, press spokesperson for Equity, said Thursday that the union had not yet received a response from Burden.

[Drexel]

Does anyone know what the progress is on 440 West 42nd Street.....didn't know if they have the design on the building completed yet?

[krulltime]

Equity Opposes Cirque du Soleil Venue

Well that sucks. I find Cirque du Soleil more than a circus. There are elements of modern art expressions to it. There is alot of acting involve aswell.

[macreator]

Well that sucks. I find Cirque du Soleil more than a circus. There are elements of modern art expressions to it. There is alot of acting involve aswell.

Agreed. I don't see why having Cirque Du Soleil present would harm local theatres.

If anything having Cirque Du Soleil in the neighborhood would bring in more theatregoers and tourists who might not otherwise even know that the theatres on far West 42nd Street even exist.

It would also add to the neighborhood's activity and spur more theatre development in the area.

As on the of the Equity people said himself, "attendence brings more attendence" -- and so why wouldn't the huge attendence that Cirque Du Soleil would certainly draw bring more attendence to the area's other theatres. It seems to work in Times Square proper.

[lofter1]

The reason is that the "theatre bonus" was specific to small theatres (99 - 299 seats). These are the types of theatres that have been shut down to build this new building. The developer knew going in that this is what was meant, but is now trying to re-write the bonus after the fact. A bit of bait and switch.

Equity does not oppose Cirque de Soleil -- only this specific venue on this specific site.

[KC99]

I agree that the spirit of the language is being violated. but cirque is unique and having it in west 42nd street should liven up the entire area. perhaps they could reach a compromise by developing smaller theaters in other areas around west 42nd street.

[BrooklynRider]

Cirque belongs in Times Square, Coney Island, or Lower Manhattan - not on West 42nd Street in an area where the zoning specifies "theater." I'd love to see Cirque du Soleil build a permanent home in the city (and lower their ridiculous prices). This is not the right location and it is another example of a wealthy developer showing one thing on paper and attempting another in reality. As there are incentives involved for developers that follow the guideline, there ought to be penalties for those who try this kind of end run around the rules.

[lofter1]

City Denies Special Bonus for Cirque du Soleil

By CHARLES V. BAGLI (http://query.nytimes.com/search/query?ppds=bylL&v1=CHARLES V. BAGLI&fdq=19960101&td=sysdate&sort=newest&ac=CHARLES V. BAGLI&inline=nyt-per)
NY Times
Feb. 9, 2006

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/09/nyregion/09cirque.html

Stephen M. Ross, the city's most active and politically connected developer, suffered a rare defeat yesterday when city officials barred him from getting a valuable special bonus for bringing Cirque du Soleil to West 42nd Street.

The developer had hoped to obtain the zoning bonus for building a $150 million, 1,800-seat theater for the elaborate human circus in the base of a 60-story apartment tower at 42nd Street and Dyer Avenue, a residential neighborhood more than two blocks west of Times Square. The bonus would have enabled him to build a taller tower and profit from the sale of ever more valuable apartments at the top of the building.

But the proposal touched off a chorus of opposition from local residents, Broadway theater owners, unions and the community board. They complained that the theater bonus was intended to encourage theaters for small Off-Broadway companies often left homeless by the real estate market, not for a hugely successful venture like Cirque du Soleil.

Some opponents argued further that Cirque, which has annual revenues of $500 million and performs regularly in New York, Las Vegas and around the world, did not qualify as a "legitimate theater."

The city's Planning Department, whose approval was required, announced its ruling yesterday after more than three months of review.

"We'd love to have Cirque in the city," said Amanda Burden, chairwoman of the Planning Department. But, she added, "at this location they simply do not qualify for a bonus."

Although the city's zoning regulations are not specific about what qualifies for a theater bonus on the site, Ms. Burden said she based her decision on an unambiguous November 2004 city planning report that accompanied the rezoning of the area.

"The new bonus would encourage the development of Off Broadway theaters between Ninth and 11th Avenues, thereby ensuring the continuation of the corridor's 'Theater Row' as additional development occurs," the report stated.

Mr. Ross, who is developing the Gateway mall project in the South Bronx, Moynihan Station in Manhattan and several residential towers, could build the theater without the bonus, but several real estate and theater executives said it was highly unlikely because of the prohibitive size and cost.

Local residents say the site, from Dyer Avenue to 10th Avenue between 41st and 42nd Streets, has taken on the forlorn look of an abandoned project.

More than a month ago Mr. Ross's company, Related Companies, had finished demolishing the 286-seat Houseman Theater, the 199-seat Fairbanks Theater and the other buildings that sat on the block.

The City Council speaker, Christine C. Quinn, who represents the district, said she was "thrilled" by the decision, which prevented the developer from doing an "end run" around the regulations.

Jeff Blau, the president of Related Companies, said: "You can't win them all. But we respect the city's decision. We have to redo our plans and decide what to do."

Asked about rumors that the property was for sale, he said, "The property is not for sale, as of right now."


Copyright 2006 (http://www.nytimes.com/ref/membercenter/help/copyright.html)The New York Times Company (http://www.nytco.com/)

[krulltime]

That is too bad... Now we have to wait a longer time to see what will happen on this big lot.

[ablarc]

Mr. Ross, who is developing the Gateway mall project in the South Bronx, Moynihan Station in Manhattan and several residential towers, could build the theater without the bonus, but several real estate and theater executives said it was highly unlikely because of the prohibitive size and cost.

Local residents say the site, from Dyer Avenue to 10th Avenue between 41st and 42nd Streets, has taken on the forlorn look of an abandoned project.

More than a month ago Mr. Ross's company, Related Companies, had finished demolishing the 286-seat Houseman Theater, the 199-seat Fairbanks Theater and the other buildings that sat on the block.

The City Council speaker, Christine C. Quinn, who represents the district, said she was "thrilled" by the decision, which prevented the developer from doing an "end run" around the regulations.
Another example of using the ideal to defeat the possible. In the end, we're left with...nothing.

[lofter1]

Easily remedied -- Ross / Related could build some smaller theatres in this building -- that way the ones that were torn down to make way for this priject would be replaced and the developer would get the bonus.

[buff]

I'm happy about this. I live across the street from the sight. It is nearly impossible to walk on eighth avenue and ninth is becoming ever more congested with tourists. I would like tenth to remain residential to keep the neighborhood liveable.

[Hrolf]

Yeah, that's terrific.... Another string of storefront theaters where the hygienecally challenged give us indulgent, unattended "drama" that no one goes to see. The friggin' site is better as a parking lot than more of that adolescent bullsh*t. Here's a novel idea: How about something that will actually raise property values?

[ablarc]

^ Anything's better than a parking lot.

[stache]

The whole point of 99 to 299 seat theaters is that they are 'Equity Waiver', meaning Equity relaxes their wage rules in order to foster new productions. For them to endorse these smaller theaters at the expense of their losing dues from a full Equity house says a great deal about their commitment to developing new plays. Cirque du Soleil is hardly unique at this point, it's a corporate franchise playing around the world, like Holiday on Ice.

[Hrolf]

I was speaking (writing) euphemistically--of course I don't want a parking lot. But I walked by that miserable block of "neighborhood theaters" every day, and a more misbegotten bunch of dreck I never saw. All it drew to the area were the borderline indigent, who felt free to drop their garbage anywhere. No new money to the area, no commerce, nothing even artistically redeeming. I have no allegiance to Cirque de Soleil--I've never even seen it, and could care less. But it would AT LEAST have been something enlivening. God only knows what touch-feely nonsense we're in for now--and how long it will take. This is supposed to be 42nd Street, the Deuce, the Big Time. This ain't Minetta Lane. It's no place for high school-level "experimental" theater. A wasted opportunity, on some of the world's prime real estate--what a shame.

[BrooklynRider]

Actually, there were a number of decent theaters in that block, icluding the Douglas Fairbanks Theater and the Pulse Theater Group. The Kraft Diner was a landmark restaurant, the soul cafe was very good and often packed and NY1 news was located in the studios there.

I'm frequently on that block there are not (and were not) indigent people loitering about. If you are looking for indigents go hang around the entrance of the Orion and the corner to its west on Ninth Ave. Your frustration is misplaced and your memory appears to be hazy.

[lofter1]

... I walked by that miserable block of "neighborhood theaters" every day, and a more misbegotten bunch of dreck I never saw...This is supposed to be 42nd Street, the Deuce, the Big Time. This ain't Minetta Lane. It's no place for high school-level "experimental" theater.
Hold on to your seat, Hrolf ...
Perhaps you live in one of those fantastic new monstrosities at the west end of 42nd, or perhaps you just make the walk after getting off the ferry. Who know and who cares?

It seems you never bothered to enter or view any of the theatre that was presented along Theatre Row. True? So good of you to be supportive. Ever visited the Signature at 42nd / 10th Ave? Or Playwright's Horizons on 42nd east of Dwyer? FYI: PH started as "experimental" theatre in that area 30+ years ago and has grown, through the support of the community and the city, into one of the premiere developers of writers for theatre, film and television (edify yourself: http://www.playwrightshorizons.org/about.htm ).

I won't hold it against you if you're not a fan of the theatre, but to comment on something that you seemingly never took the time to investigate puts you in the category of an opinionated ass -- whose opinions are based on nothing but assumptions.

[Hrolf]

Wow--how wonderfully smug of both of you! To assume, (a): I never "ventured into" any of the theaters there, and (b) To assume I live somewhere other then nearby! (I guess the "ferry" crack means New Jersey? Or Staten Island, perhaps? I must just be one of the great unwashed bridge-and-tunnel Visigoths!).

As it happens, I've lived and worked in the area for over 10 years, and my connections here, through relatives, are a lot older than that. I live, in fact, less than a block from the site we're discussing. Anyone that pines for the "old" Hell's Kitchen is either full of it or an idiot. I know this neighborhood too damn well to have any illusions about what those rinky-dink theaters brought us. I'm rooting for Hell's Kitchen--and for it to take real steps forward, it needs more than the Pulse Theater group, or those buffoons who ran the Tank. And as for that block not being seedy with indigents, etc: Surely you jest, Brooklyn. I don't know what your definition of indigent is, but that stretch was about the most unsightly west of 8th Avenue. As much of a nostalgic throwback as the Kraft was, it was seriously rundown--and NY1 had abandoned the building long before the Ross deal was finalized. Enough with the bullshit sentimentalizing.

And as for the need for "experimental" theater--I'm all for it. Particularly if it's taking place in a loft space somewhere out in Williamsburg. "Experimental" being, 99.9% of the time, a euphemism for "artistically undisciplined crap conducted by under-employed waiters."

I hope I'm wrong. But I now have very low expectations for that site. What with these vapid cliches floating around. Do me a favor, "Loft": Put your experimental theaters in your own damn neighborhood. 42nd Street deserves better than a bunch of failed drama majors convinced of their own "significance."

[buff]

What are you REALLY angry about?

[BrooklynRider]

...Wow--how wonderfully smug of both of you! ... I know this neighborhood too damn well to have any illusions about what those rinky-dink theaters brought us.... it needs more than... those buffoons who ran the Tank... Enough with the bullshit sentimentalizing ... a euphemism for "artistically undisciplined crap conducted by under-employed waiters...]...But I now have very low expectations for that site. What with these vapid cliches floating around...Do me a favor, "Loft": Put your experimental theaters in your own damn neighborhood. 42nd Street deserves better than a bunch of failed drama majors convinced of their own "significance...

Charming. What a perfect picture into the dark, dusty reaches of a mean-sprited, rotten soul.

I wonder if you'll understand if Lofter forgoes doing you any favors.

Your spiral downward within such a short timeframe and your venmous response with minimal posts to establish yourself as a credible poster makes it clear you have neither mastered critical thinking, artful discourse or socialization.

You'll understand if you are ignored going forward.

[krulltime]

From the top of the Empire State Building. March 1, 2006:


http://www.pbase.com/image/56706007.jpg

[antinimby]

West Nile virus breeding ground.

[lofter1]

Nahhh -- summer swimming hole ;)

[krulltime]

West Nile virus breeding ground.

Nahhh -- summer swimming hole ;)


LOL!... you guys are so funny.

[Drexel]

Is there any new news on the progress on this project...I think the developer was battling the city over what type of theater they can build on that site?

[buff]

They can build whatever kind of theatre they choose, or no theatre at all. It has only been decided that they will not fulfill the requirement to get a zoning bonus if they build a space for Cirque du Soleil.

[chris]

Wow--how wonderfully smug of both of you! To assume, (a): I never "ventured into" any of the theaters there, and (b) To assume I live somewhere other then nearby...
Hrolf, I recently bought on 47th Street after living on 46th Steet for 10+ yrs. and I'm with you 110% on this.

[antinimby]

Instead of another residential on this site, couldn't Related Cos. make this one commercial?
The 7 subway is coming and by the time this one is completed, say in 2-3 years, the gap of time between that and the subway's completion would only be a few years.
I think that is entirely feasible and even smart to do. Face it, this stretch of 42nd should be a mix and shouldn't just be all residential.
The residential market is waning and the office market is as tight as ever and only more so in 3 years when this comes on-line.
Theatre(s), retail on the ground floor and offices on the top.

[alibrot]

related could want to put an equinox there if they build, and that would require apartments too...the whole reason for buying the gym chain is to put it in their projects. the real estate market is slowing, but certain segments show no sign of weakening. there is a very high demand for a high end condo building on this location, proven by orion.

i am not sure how its zoned, but it would be great to have a mixed use building like bloomberg tower. except it would have theatres instead of a home depot. because of the potential height and the south views that will always be decent (lincoln tunnel ramps), apartments will be a good part of the project.

[antinimby]

I thought the Orion was high end too, but after seeing some of the interior photos, I'm not getting that impression. Or am I just too picky?

[alibrot]

from what i read, orion has 2 levels of finishes...the high end luxury is above the common areas, and below the common areas (~floor 29, not sure) is much less luxurious.

[vc10]

I think a developer would be crazy to count on a subway to be built by any particular time -- or at all. I'm not saying it won't happen, I am saying that a lot can happen in the meantime.

A commercial (or partially commercial) building might work anyway, but to build a building that depends on a subway seems like a very risky move to make.

(perhaps a building that could be converted to partially commercial?)

Instead of another residential on this site, couldn't Related Cos. make this one commercial?
The 7 subway is coming and by the time this one is completed, say in 2-3 years, the gap of time between that and the subway's completion would only be a few years.
I think that is entirely feasible and even smart to do. Face it, this stretch of 42nd should be a mix and shouldn't just be all residential.
The residential market is waning and the office market is as tight as ever and only more so in 3 years when this comes on-line.
Theatre(s), retail on the ground floor and offices on the top.

[antinimby]

The subway would be a bonus, an "icing on the cake" - if you will - but I think commercial would work anyway without it, especially in this bullish office market.
And if the subways do come around, you'd be ahead of everyone, who would only be trying to play catch up. See what I mean?
If they can build the Gehry/ IAC headquarters on West St. in Chelsea, which itself has no subway access nearby, I don't see why it can't done here.

[vc10]

You may be right. My only point is that you'd be an idiot to do a project that depends on it.


If they can build the Gehry/ IAC headquarters on West St. in Chelsea, which itself has no subway access nearby, I don't see why it can't done here.

[Drexel]

With all of the articles coming out in the NYT and Real Deal stating that developers are now putting projects on hold due to real estate slowing up.. I wonder if this project and the one down by River Place will be put on hold for a long time...I hate to see an empty lot just sitting there....

[krulltime]

NYPOST: Residential Real Estate


May 3, 2006

Now that its Cirque du Soleil plans for W. 42nd St. are kaput, Related Companies and its CalPERS partner are packing up the tents at 450 W. 42nd St.

Sources say they have hired Vin Carrega of Grubb & Ellis to market the 68,000-foot parcel that can be built to 1.1 million square feet.

The unique full-block deal is expected to trade between $300 million and $400 million. Note to Michael Fascitelli of Vornado Realty Trust: You can tell your price-addled board member that again, there is no building, but the tab does include preliminary plans for a 60-story tower that features retail, theaters and a big health club, because Related was expected to install its own Equinox at the spot.


Copyright 2006 NYP Holdings, Inc.

[lofter1]

The very least that a developer should do in situations like this (and Milstein @ 42nd / 8th) is to create a temporary accessible open space -- rather than leave a half-dug hole with warping plywood enclosure.

Bad, developer >slap, smack< Bad ....

[alibrot]

i was definitely hoping for the equinox - was a great opportunity for related after they bought the parcel. i imagine they still could do it though, if they can buy condo space for the fitness center. this would be a great location to live at, and there is such a strong demand for the equinox brand.

related bought this parcel for almost nothing, and will make a massive profit just by selling the land. once cirque was killed, selling was the best way to go, stealing the quick profit, rather than taking the development risk. there are a limited number of groups who could buy it and really make it into the greatness that would transform the area.

this could easily be a hole in the ground for a long time though, like the bloomberg tower site.

[Drexel]

Does anyone know what the status is on this property...is it on the market again or is Related still planning on building here? Also, if the city can build a platform over the railroads in the Hudson Yards, would they ever build on top of the entry ramps into the Port Authority Bus Terminal?

[pianoman11686]

Does anyone know what the status is on this property...is it on the market again or is Related still planning on building here?
If you take the time to look at the previous page, you'd see that Related has put the parcel on the market, complete with the preexisting plans for the residential tower that they were going to build, but ultimately abandoned because of the Cirque de Soleil dispute.
Also, if the city can build a platform over the railroads in the Hudson Yards, would they ever build on top of the entry ramps into the Port Authority Bus Terminal?
I really doubt it. Covering up railyards that are below street level, and building above (and around) these entry ramps is like apples and oranges. I don't think anyone would like to live or work in a building that has noisy, dirty buses driving through a few feet away. I doubt that this will ever be done, unless they somehow rearrange all the ramps to be underground.
Now, covering up some of the feeder tubes into the Lincoln Tunnel is a different story. Plans were recently announced to build two rental towers on a platform above a feeder tube somewhere in the upper 30's.

[stache]

They built a residential tower above the GW bus terminal entrance to the bridge, but it's not exactly anbody's idea of a dream location!

[Kris]

July 30, 2006
Hell’s Kitchen
Living Lakeside on 10th Avenue
By JOHN FREEMAN GILL

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/30/nyregion/thecity/lake600.jpg
The West Side waters, as they looked on July 24.

As the sun set over Hell’s Kitchen on Monday, Kenneth Karan, a freckled 41-year-old financial analyst, gazed out a ninth-floor window of his West 41st Street rental building and pointed out the effect of the wind on the water below. “You get the nice ripples on the shore there,” he said.

Many people dream of living on waterfront property, but Mr. Karan was less than thrilled because he was referring to a water-filled crater in a vast vacant lot. The hole, in a lot whose borders run between 41st and 42nd Streets and 10th and Dyer Avenues, was created about six months ago, after the Related Companies demolished several buildings to make way for a 60-story tower, which then ran into zoning problems.

Ever since, neighbors like Mr. Karan say, water has accumulated in the hole during every rainfall, earning it the nickname Lake Related and spreading fear that mosquitoes carrying West Nile virus may breed there. “Anybody with children, if they’re aware of it, is concerned about it,” said Kathleen McGee Treat, chairwoman of the Hell’s Kitchen Neighborhood Association.

State Senator Tom Duane, whose district includes Hell’s Kitchen, pointed out that Manhattan Plaza — a housing complex across 42nd Street from the lot — is home to many elderly and some HIV-positive tenants, who are especially vulnerable to West Nile virus.

“Clearly, if you have standing water, it’s a risk,” said Dr. W. Ian Lipkin, a professor of epidemiology at the Mailman School of Public Health at Columbia University. “It’s not just West Nile; there are all sorts of other infectious agents that are carried by mosquitoes.”

The Related Companies hired a contractor to pump out the lot periodically after demolition was completed, said Jeff Blau, the Related Companies’ president. Water was pumped out the week of July 17, he said in a phone interview on Tuesday, and would be again soon.

Indeed, the “lake” had been reduced to a few puddles by Thursday, but neighbors said they expected water to collect again the next time it rains.

The city’s Department of Buildings issued violations relating to the failure to drain water at the site after inspections on Jan. 5 and Feb. 24. On June 9, the city’s Department of Health and Mental Hygiene issued a citation that said stagnant water had been found there.

Local residents and Mr. Duane have continued to complain about the site since then. And the Health Department will inspect it again soon, Sara Markt, a department spokeswoman, said. If standing water is again found, the agency will consider evaluating the property for extermination of mosquito larvae, she added.

It’s unclear what the Related Companies intends to do with the site. “We don’t have any plans right now,” Mr. Blau said.

Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company

[ablarc]

It’s unclear what the Related Companies intends to do with the site. “We don’t have any plans right now,” Mr. Blau said.
What happened?

The city should enact a time limit for land to be vacant or parking lot. To do that, it would have to streamline its own approval process to avoid being blamed for the delay.

.

[lofter1]

Perfect case for Eminent Domain ^^ ??

Kick them where it hurts and force Related et al to remove this self-imposed BLIGHT

[lofter1]

What happened?

The city should enact a time limit for land to be vacant or parking lot. To do that, it would have to streamline its own approval process to avoid being blamed for the delay.

.

What happened here is that Related tried to do a sneak job on something that wasn't allowed by zoning -- and something they knew in their gut from the start, although their egos and pocket books might not have allowed them to see it.

The city's review process worked perfectly as planned / discussed / laid out here --

Related has refused to alter their business plan regarding this snow job of a project.

Meanwhile Related sits on a piece of fallow land and watch as the value (hopefully) rises, waiting for the next buyer.

"Good business" in this case does not make for good neighbors.

[NYguy]

NY Times

Living Lakeside on 10th Avenue

***

[lofter1]

Living Lakeside on 10th Avenue

It’s unclear what the Related Companies intends to do with the site. “We don’t have any plans right now,” Mr. Blau said.

Might I suggest that Related show some civic responsibility -- put a nice metal fence around the site and plant the pit with wildflowers & grasses. Nothing too big that would require much maintenance ...

Put a call out to Piet Oudolf (http://www.thebattery.org/gardens/piet.html) and give the community something they can live with while the number crunchers at Related try to figure out a workable scheme for this site.

[BrooklynRider]

Perfect case for Eminent Domain ^^ ??

Kick them where it hurts and force Related et al to remove this self-imposed BLIGHT

Well, we have seen that it is predominantly - if not ALWAYS - small owners who get hit with emminent domain laws. It is incredible that we now have this and Times Square Plaza wallowing (despite reports about the purchase of the T.S. Plaza parcel) on 42nd Street. The city ought to grab it and build AFFORDABLE HOUSING that bars the purchase of units by any individual, couple or family exceeding an earning or assest cap.

[ablarc]

The city ought to grab it and build AFFORDABLE HOUSING that bars the purchase of units by any individual, couple or family exceeding an earning or assest cap.
What happens if they strike it rich while living there? Do they have monitors who check your tax returns?

[pianoman11686]

Something about that last statement brought to mind a certain Steinbeckian quality about the whole situation: a (relatively) large, barren wasteland, amidst such great prosperity, where the economically disadvantaged are transferred to try to make do in the best way they can. Then, an unexpected turn of luck: while squatting on the dirt, they discover a precious natural resource: perhaps gold, or oil, and are lifted out of poverty. Miracle on 42nd Street.

Well, enough imagination for a day. In any case, I don't believe public housing would do well here. The land is far too valuable. Have the city take over it by eminent domain, and sell it to the highest bidder, using the profit to invest in public housing elsewhere. Oh, and just to prevent the same thing from happening again, set a limit on how long the new owners can take before real construction begins.

[BrooklynRider]

What happens if they strike it rich while living there? Do they have monitors who check your tax returns?

I am talking about an entry requirement, not a reporting requirement going forward. People moving in are all at the same level. Where their lives go is none of the city or state's business. Simply a requirement to qualify.

Once in, you don't need to re-qualify.

Free Market simply does NOT work in NYC. We keep hearing that the more market rate housing we allow to be built and the faster we do away with the dwinding supply of rent controlled and rent stabilzed apartments, the faster rents will come down. Well, nothing is coming down. Rents are not down. Housing costs have not dropped. Nothing that depends on the Free Market or that utilizes Free Market theories has proven to be true.

It's time to go back to Mitchel-Llama Housing and for the state to take the lead.

[stache]

If you live in Manhattan Plaza you have to turn in a copy of your tax return every year. If you choose not to do that you get charged what they call market rate for your apt. for the next year.

[ablarc]

I am talking about an entry requirement, not a reporting requirement going forward. People moving in are all at the same level. Where their lives go is none of the city or state's business. Simply a requirement to qualify.

Once in, you don't need to re-qualify.
Maybe I could get a poor relation to qualify for me.

[lofter1]

Now ^^ you're talkin' like a NYer :cool:

[Derek2k3]

I'm skeptical this is a current proposal. I guess this would be our version of the Aqua going up in Chicago.

From Kevin Kennon Architect
http://www.kkarchitect.com/


http://static.flickr.com/64/203861692_011ee0d380_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/74/203861693_08fed3fd2f_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/59/203861695_5758a40b4a_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/58/203861694_e6682de20f_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/78/203861696_05398ac790_o.jpg

[krulltime]

I'm skeptical this is a current proposal. I guess this would be our version of the Aqua going up in Chicago.

From Kevin Kennon Architect
http://www.kkarchitect.com/


http://static.flickr.com/64/203861692_011ee0d380_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/74/203861693_08fed3fd2f_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/59/203861695_5758a40b4a_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/58/203861694_e6682de20f_o.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/78/203861696_05398ac790_o.jpg


Wow cool desingn... yes it reminds me of Aqua in Chicago... but I think is a little too fat looking at it from the north or the south though.

[stache]

http://static.flickr.com/58/203861694_e6682de20f_o.jpg



Proposed porn shop on the street level?

[pianoman11686]

I think I prefer the design that Related had planned for this site originally. This one's certainly creative, and it has its positive attributes, but that view in the final rendering looks absolutely hideous. The thing's too darned bulky, and the swerving stripes created by the balconies look like they've been pasted on. I agree that the Aqua Tower executed this concept much better.

[BrooklynRider]

I like it.

[krulltime]

If I was the developer I would built two similar towers on the corners of the lots instead of one tower. Kind of what silverstein plans on the other empty lot. But I guess I am not the developer.

[ld876]

Yum, development makes me happy. I love this design, it's a cool building. I think the size of it in the rendering is a bit large, but that's probably just a photoshop thing, not the true size it'd be. If it is right, then maybe calm the undulating a bit, but not much. Quite gorg.

[lofter1]

Oh no -- that would be the size if built as one centralized tower -- it's a huge lot.

[TonyO]

Its unconventional but not in a good way. I like the height.

[BrooklynRider]

I think the design as presented works on that site because it will remain unobstructed due to the Lincoln Tunnel entrance. I'm a sucker for tall in Manhattan (so long as it ain't in a landmarked district).

[lofter1]

... it will remain unobstructed due to the Lincoln Tunnel entrance.


But what about that block of little buildings along the south side of W. 41st between this site and the Tunnel ramps?

I'm envisioning that something will go up along there -- although probably not a big enough site to disturb the soth-facing views from upper floors at the Related site ...

[ld876]

I decided that even with those proportions being correct, we may need this building. NYC needs something tall and unique. We have construction, but in general most the world isn't excited to see anything being built. Most loved the hearst building, lots of comments on Time Warner, but ever since the trade center was originally built, developers in the city seem to playing it safe, going for shorter, more conservative designs. I just want to see something, residential and commercial, to reach that unprecedented level again. NY'er are abrasive, blunt, in your face and unique, our buildings should be too!

[finnman69]

Wow cool desingn... yes it reminds me of Aqua in Chicago... but I think is a little too fat looking at it from the north or the south though.

It could be cool, or cheap. Sort of Architectonica looking. the base has to go though, totally foreign to the building. Could work as it's own unique building. I just hope it does not translate the way this:
http://www.epinions.com/images/opti/60/58/Westin_Times_Square-resized200.jpg


ended up like this.:http://www.forbesconferences.com/assets/images/venues/westin%20times%20square.jpg


The ultimate wavy facade in the right context.
http://ist-socrates.berkeley.edu/~lpark/europe2/lapedrera.jpg

[krulltime]

Between The Bricks


Lois weiss
December 20, 2006

Meanwhile, Related Cos. Chairman Stephen Ross tells us that rather than selling the full-block West 42nd Street site where the firm had hoped to install Cirque du Soleil, it will build the mixed-use project itself. Related has a $100 million mortgage on the block.


Copyright 2006NYP Holdings, Inc.

[Derek2k3]

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/141/346200036_e544d78cb6_o.jpg

[krulltime]

I walk there today hoping I will see something exciting! But didn't get that excited after all.

[krulltime]

Hell’s Kitchen Site Developer Is Sued; Lot Is Called an Eyesore


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/01/05/nyregion/600_site.jpg
An unidentified worker was at a lot in Hell’s Kitchen at 42nd Street, between Dyer and 10th Avenues, which was going to be the site of a 60-story tower.


By CHARLES V. BAGLI
January 5, 2007

Community groups in Hell’s Kitchen fought one of the city’s most powerful developers to a standstill a year ago, blocking his attempt to build a 60-story tower over a new home for Cirque du Soleil.

Since then, neighbors have complained that the rubble-strewn, 1.5-acre site on 42nd Street, between Dyer and 10th Avenues, has become a breeding ground for mosquitoes in the summer and cockroaches, rats and other vermin year-round.

In the latest skirmish, Fred Papert, who built Theater Row nearby, filed a lawsuit yesterday against the developer, Stephen M. Ross, chief executive of Related Companies, saying the site had become an eyesore.

Mr. Ross appears to be considering a new plan for the site, possibly with a hotel, luxury apartments and shops. The plan also includes two small theaters that community groups and leaders want.

After meeting with elected officials in December to discuss complaints about the site, the developer installed floodlights along the blue construction fence on 42nd Street and periodically picked up the wind-swept garbage around the parcel.

But the problem has gotten to the point where it is cutting into business, said Glenn Isaacs, the manager of the Travel Inn, west of Related’s site, and the owner of the Theater Row Diner, at Dyer Avenue and 42nd Street. “Our hotel guests are coming back to the hotel saying it’s dangerous,” Mr. Isaacs said. “There’s rats, mice, garbage all over the place.”

Yesterday, a worker was pumping the stagnant rainwater that gathers in an eight-foot-deep hole on the site into a nearby sewer drain. The city’s health and buildings departments found a series of violations last year relating to water that accumulates every time it rains. Some residents call the site “Lake Related.”

Mr. Papert’s lawsuit, filed in State Supreme Court in Manhattan, involves more than a dollop of revenge from a figure who was Mr. Ross’s ally in acquiring the parcel. It seeks $500,000 in damages and says that the health and safety conditions at the Related site, which sits “at the epicenter of a renewed and thriving neighborhood,” are hurting the whole community and undermining property values.

A new plan could be in the works for the site. According to a real estate executive who has been briefed on the developer’s plans, Related wants to form a joint venture with an unnamed hotel operator to build a 60-story, one-million-square-foot tower. The tower, with a hotel and luxury apartments at the top, would sit above shops, an Equinox gym and a couple of small theaters.

But Jeff T. Blau, the president of Related, said “there’s no deal at the moment.”

He added, “We’re exploring everything, given the Cirque deal not happening.”

He said he had not seen the lawsuit and could not comment.

The city and the community wanted Related to replace the two Off Broadway theaters it had demolished. “Nothing would make us happier than if Related did what they originally promised us they would do,” said Mr. Papert, president of the 42nd Street Development Corporation. “The minute we know it’s going to happen, we’ll withdraw the lawsuit.”

Therein lies the story.

In 2004, Related was one of two developers vying for the site. Mr. Papert, who owned a minority interest in the land, helped steer the deal to Related. In the 1980s, Mr. Papert and his nonprofit group replaced several massage parlors on 42nd Street between Ninth and Dyer Avenues with Theater Row, a collection of small Off Broadway theaters. But they were unable to do the same thing on the next block.

Mr. Papert said he helped Related buy the land for about $107 million, because he understood that the developer would find a new home for the theaters in his proposed tower. Indeed, Related talked to city officials about an apartment building that would house two small theaters and a performance space for classical musicians.

Related, in turn, would have been able to take advantage of a city zoning regulation, a “theater bonus,” to build a taller tower than would have normally been allowed. But the company ultimately proposed to build an 1,800-seat theater for Cirque du Soleil, the human circus extravaganza. That plan was opposed by officials who argued that the bonus was intended to nurture struggling theater companies, not an economic blockbuster like Cirque.

The city’s Planning Department ruled last February that the project did not qualify for a bonus. Related then put the parcel up for sale, asking about $350 million. But no one was willing to go that high.

Marisa Redanty, president of the tenants’ association at Manhattan Plaza, which sits across 42nd Street from the site, said yesterday that Mr. Papert’s lawsuit was premature. But, she added, the company is trying to clean up the area.

“If they do not continue to make the site more community-friendly, then all options are open,” Ms. Redanty said. “And if they give us the theaters, I’m happy as a clam.”


Copyright 2007 The New York Times Company

[antinimby]

As bad as the situation looks now, I really believe this site will offer the potential to have the best looking tower in all of the W. 42nd St. developments.

We just gotta be patient and also keep our fingers crossed.

[Hamilton]

What's going on here? Does the sun still rise and set on the shores of majestic Lake Related?

[posterboy]

Yup. Walked by there last week and there's nothing happening as far as I can tell. Not even a proper lake.

[Saffster]

I'm dying to know what's going to be going in there. I hope it's something that's eco-friendly and fabulous!

[antinimby]

I wouldn't count on the fabulous part, in this city. That is unless you consider something with four flat sides that goes straight up as fabulous.

[Stern]

I wouldn't count on the fabulous part, in this city. That is unless you consider something with four flat sides that goes straight up as fabulous.

In stark contrast to what you said four posts earlier, what specifically happened in those four months that is making you see the glass as half empty?

[antinimby]

Good question. I guess because coming in here everyday and constantly getting disappointed by a lot these new projects (with that Chase monstrosity at the WTC being the latest) has brought my spirit and faith in this city down.

I have become an embittered cynic. :(

That plus, Related leaving the site languishing like this does not give me the impression that the will on their part to create something nice is still there.

[Punzie]

I have become an embittered cynic. :(
If they are capable of doing this, then they have won!
Don't ever let them win, you hear me?:)

[Saffster]

I doubt that related will be the ones to build on that site. If they were building, I feel like they would have started already. Isn't it for sale?

[antinimby]

^ For the right price, anything is for sale. After not getting the extra air rights for their Cirque du Soleil proposal, they seem to have lost interest in developing that site with any urgency.

If they are capable of doing this, then they have won! Don't ever let them win, you hear me?:)Very good advice. I'll try my best to stay positive. ;)

[ASchwarz]

No, Related is developing the site, with two other partners. Mixed-use (condo/rentals/retail) tower. It was reported in the Post a few months back.

[sfenn1117]

Their current 3 projects are using Robert AM Stern for the architect. I don't think he would be the best choice for this site.

[ASchwarz]

Their current 3 projects are using Robert AM Stern for the architect. I don't think he would be the best choice for this site.

Agreed. This calls for something bold and modern. I would be surprised if it weren't very tall and glassy.

[macreator]

Their current 3 projects are using Robert AM Stern for the architect. I don't think he would be the best choice for this site.

Normally I'd agree, but now that I've seen recent photos of his Comcast Tower in Philadelphia, I'd love to see him design a glassy skyscraper on this site. His Comcast Tower is fantastic and employs a beautiful curtainwall.

[Saffster]

I feel like this site begs for something REALLY unique. All of the buildings west of Port Authority are beginning to look so boxy and predictable. I'd like the architect on this project to take a risk. No need for conformity in new york. That's what makes architecture here so special.

[BrooklynRider]

No, Related is developing the site, with two other partners. Mixed-use (condo/rentals/retail) tower. It was reported in the Post a few months back.

Pretty sure that McFarlane and Twining are part of the joint venture.

[ld876]

A huge, classic, even gothic-type stone building would be a great change from everything in the area. Something like The Pierre or Dakota (but taller). Even the Woolworth building would be a good jumping-point.

Also - they need to demo those food emporium towers across the street (Manhattan Plaza? is that the name? I walk by every day but block it from being saved in my memory).

[Saffster]

manhattan plaza isn't going anywhere.

[lesterp4]

I can't understand why anyone would think Manhattan Plaza should be demolished. These are okay buildings fillled with lots of regular people who otherwise might not be able to live in the neighborhood. Manhattan is not lacking for places for the wealthy. Does ID want another luxury condo built in its place?

[antinimby]

^ I think ld876 was talking more about their appearance than anything else.

[ld876]

^ I think ld876 was talking more about their appearance than anything else.

Exactly -- whoever wants and can live there, I just think that this actual building is hideous.

[buff]

Maybe it's ugly, but it has been the anchor for the neighborhood.
Built in the late 70's, no one but actors would move in because the surroundings were considered so dangerous.
Little by little... and look at the area now!

[Derek2k3]

dangerously ugly.

[lofter1]

Nice enough on the inside, though.

[stache]

The complex does not offend me nearly as much as some other projects from that era. I'm not a big fan of the 42nd. St. base.

[lofter1]

The 42nd Street base of Manhattan Plaza (http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/cx/?id=manhattanplazaapartments-newyorkcity) was created in response to what existed on the south side of 42nd back then (the mid-70s, a whole different time (http://images.villagevoice.com/issues/0543/ann-1975.jpg)). The street was then essentially a wasteland of apparently decrepit buildings housing lots of porn shops (http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a13/ChmnofBrd/Movie%20Ads/DoorEve1975.jpg) and some spaces which had been (or were to be) transformed into off-off broadway theater-type venues ...

From The Metropolist (http://cosmopolity.typepad.com/cosmopolity/2005/06/this_day_in_new.html) (June 1, 2005):

... let's remember that Manhattan Plaza did NOT revitalize 42nd Street. 42nd was so bad at the time that Manhattan Plaza put all of its entrances on 43rd Street, hoping to convince prospective tenants that they were safe from the dangers of 42nd. In fact, Manhattan Plaza's contribution to 42nd Street was not a leap of faith ... rather it was a character-less brick facade, the back end of a fortress meant to keep the block at bay, and killing the hope for dynamic street life on the north side of the street.

Even this effort to become a 43rd Street enterprise left Manhattan Plaza an undesirable location. Nobody would move there. In fact, the only way they could fill it by was appealing to the most desperate of New Yorkers: artists.

[LeCom]

Hell’s Kitchen Site Developer Is Sued; Lot Is Called an Eyesore
Nimbies continue to amaze me. If someone wants to build, they sue. If that same someone doesn't want to build, they still sue.

[Gulcrapek]

450 West 42nd is listed at Kevin Kennon's site, http://www.kkarchitect.com , looks interesting...

[lofter1]

Thanks ^^^ I love that design ... it deserves a abump.

Kennon images previously posted in this thread, back HERE (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showpost.php?p=112606&postcount=122)

[BrooklynRider]

I like it too.

Nice to have you back, Gul.

[ld876]

450 West 42nd is listed at Kevin Kennon's site, http://www.kkarchitect.com , looks interesting...

I remember when that first popped up, still my favorite -- i can deal with my gothic Pierre clone elsewhere for ^ instead.

[antinimby]

Don't know how current the design is, but here's a couple of images from that website I don't think I've seen posted here before.

http://img395.imageshack.us/img395/6588/450w42ii5.jpg

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/5484/450w42auz2.jpg

[NewYorkDoc]

I REALLY like this!

[Saffster]

I like it too. Is he just proposing this design to a potential develloper, or is it actually going to be built?

[eddhead]

echo the previous posts.. that is a really nice building.

[buff]

Those drawings have been around for a while. I don't think there is any plan to build yet. I think Related wants to sell the lot to another developer...

[ASchwarz]

Those drawings have been around for a while. I don't think there is any plan to build yet. I think Related wants to sell the lot to another developer...

As previous noted, Related announced back in the Spring that they were going to develop the lot into a mixed-use tower, with condo, rental and retail portions. They have two partners in the development.

[Scraperfannyc]

If the footprint is large enough, this would be a great place to build a 1500 foot tall office building. Wishful thinking at least.

[Skylimitone]

Nice looking building, it reminds me of Aqua, under construction in Chicago:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/46/Aqua_Chicago.jpg

[Derek2k3]

Lake Related has become New York's premier pigeon refuge.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1398/1110924254_8e07c045ce_o.jpg


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1262/1110924366_2828aff2c8_o.jpg


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1260/1110924646_3c609ce099_o.jpg


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1121/1110924146_44bbe3d859_o.jpg

[londonlawyer]

I remember when that first popped up, still my favorite -- i can deal with my gothic Pierre clone elsewhere for ^ instead.

This guy is a good architect. The project for 350 West B'Way looks awesome!

[stache]

Lake Related has become New York's premier pigeon refuge.


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1262/1110924366_2828aff2c8_o.jpg


Sur la plage!

[alibrot]

the reason it's a pigeon refuge is because there's a guy who brings the equivalent of at least 4 loaves a bread every day and feeds them all. i think he feeds about 150 to 200 pigeons. i want to call 311 on him. the pigeons crap half the length of the block all over the sidewalk across 10th ave (they on the fire escape above CVS and lamp posts). complete mess on the ground, and you gotta watch out for crap falling from the sky as you walk by. they are also on the lamp posts on the lake related side of 10th, and i pity the people who park their cars underneath. their cars become disasters in half a day.

agh.

[LeCom]

Can we arrest that guy on suspicion of being a biological terrorist that contributes to spreading disease?

[Derek2k3]

New permits were filed last month. This will be another fat-ass building.
56 floors, 617', 968,731 Sq. Ft., and designed by Ismael Leyva.
617' is shorter than the Orion by the way.

http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=3&allisn=0001400677&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=

[Scraperfannyc]

New permits were filed last month. This will be another fat-ass building.
56 floors, 617', 968,731 Sq. Ft., and designed by Ismael Leyva.
617' is shorter than the Orion by the way.

http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=3&allisn=0001400677&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=


According to skyscraperpage.com, the Orion is listed as being 604 feet tall and 58 floors. Pretty respectable height for residential building. Hope the design is as good as the last one.

http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?

[Derek2k3]

The Orion is actually 637', 604' is the height listed on the D.O.B. permit.

It's likely the height given on 440's permit is shorter than it actually will be too.

[lofter1]

DOB heights rarely include the extra height required for roof-top mechanicals -- hence the discrepency in numbers.

Leyva to be the architect, eh?

Renderings or links to same, please ....

[alibrot]

the orion plot is so small...440w42 will be about the same height, on a plot that looks 3 times the size of orion's, but less than twice the sq ft.

will likely be a huge base with a tower the shape of atelier (wide and thin) to take advantage of the permanent southern views.

[londonlawyer]

I assume that Twinings is no longer the developer. I stopped following this after the Cirque du Soleil deal collapsed.

[krulltime]

I wish they will built two skinny twins here aswell. Just like the project to the west on 42nd.

[buff]

Look! There is some action here. These two people are measuring sections of the surrounding wall and labeling them A,B,C, and 1,2,3, etc. Anyone know what's up?

[buff]

This morning a truck from Hydro Tech Environmental Corp. Drilling Division is at work on the lot.

[investordude]

Looks like plumbing work for this project was approved on 11/7 (see link below). Hopefully they'll at least dig a foundation before the subprime crisis freezes up Manhattan real estate. If we get this, and they really build an office tower on the Port Authority site, I think 42nd street will finally be fairly nice from river to river.

http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=2&allisn=0001440013&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=

[lofter1]

And lookee here :D :

A NEW BUILDING Application / Exam Dated NOVEMBER 8, 2007 (http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=6&allisn=0001400677&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=) from Ismael Leyva (Disapproved):

Comments for Document 01: 56 story new building.

Odd that this took so long: DEMO finally signed off (http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=13&allisn=0000543238&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=) just yesterday 11.07.07

[lesterp4]

Lo and behold, there was construction equipment and tractors actually working today at the site.

[londonlawyer]

....A NEW BUILDING Application / Exam Dated NOVEMBER 8, 2007[/B][/URL] from Ismael Leyva (Disapproved):



Anything by Leyva is likely to be nice.

[lofter1]

NB Permit (Partial) issued ...

PERMIT ISSUED - PARTIAL JOB 11/09/2007

[hey19932]

Fantastic that this one is starting!! It's nyc's aqua:)

[ramvid01]

Does anyone know if this is still the same design or are we getting something else? :confused:

[londonlawyer]

Does anyone know if this is still the same design or are we getting something else? :confused:

I assume something different, since, to my knowledge, Leyva did not design the prior proposal.

[buff]

go?

[SmithBarnGrl]

Hopefully we can get some good retail in there. That area is sort of a retail dead-zone!
I'm suprised that there's so little, given the high level of residential occupancy in the area (not to mention 'high-inc