Sky House - 11 East 29th Street - Condo - Flatiron

[billyblancoNYC]

A Curbed exclusive by way of a special correspondent: the much loved and landmarked Little Church Around the Corner (aka the Church of Transfiguration) on East 29th Street (above, looking east) just off Fifth Avenue has apparently struck a deal with the devil... er, with developers. The church's auxiliary structure, a modern addition to the east, will be demolished and combined with other properties to the north on 30th Street to create a thru-block parcel for a 50-story residential tower. Writes our correspondent,

How do we know this? We live on the block and for several weeks have noticed surveyors taking measurements. Then we noticed architect-types with interesting eyewear loitering on the block, snapping digital photos. When approached they were all hush hush, refusing to answer questions and walking back into the church. Then last week we saw two church workers on the block and asked them what was up. One remained silent but the other was good enough to give us the gory details. Demolition will begin in about a year. The church will take the first two or three floors of the tower for their programs. We lose our morning sunlight. And Manhattan loses a little piece of its soul.
What happens now? Expect the preservationists to come out in force against the demolition. The Little Church, for its part, was made famous in 1870 with the exclamation, "God Bless the Little Church Around the Corner!" The chants may well be different this time.
· History of the Little Church [littlechurch.org].

http://www.curbed.com

[Derek2k3]

"We lose our morning sunlight. And Manhattan loses a little piece of its soul".....um, yea :roll:

[BrooklynRider]

Then we noticed architect-types with interesting eyewear loitering on the block, snapping digital photos.

Well, this made me laugh.

It seems that, in the future, the only buildings that will appear built to human dimensions are the churchs and cathedrals originally built to "Godly heights".

[sfenn1117]

From cityrealty.com

http://www.cityrealty.com/new_developments/

"A 54-story condominium apartment tower to be known as Sky House will rise at 11 East 29th Street using air rights from the adjacent Church of the Transfiguration, known familiarly as the Little Church Around the Corner, at 1 East 29th Street.

The new, 138-unit tower will rise across the street from the Madison Belvedere, a 50-story, 400-unit rental tower at 10 West 29th Street.

The Clarett Group is the developer of Sky House. Clarett is also erecting the 36-story Plaza 57, another condo tower, on the former site of the Sutton Theater at 207 East 57th Street.

According to Fox & Fowle, the architects for the 138-unit Sky House, “to help the building blend with its lower-scale surroundings, the building was divided into three slender masses,” each clad in a red-brown iron-spot brick. “The element facing 29th Street and overlooking the church is set back from the street and has an architectural expression of vertical piers….Like a belfry or campanile, this almost-square tower soars into the sky celebrating and defining the presence of the historic landmark. The church’s parish house is a new three-story structure at the base of the tower that projects forward to the sidewalk, thus extending the scale and refined architectural detail of the church compound toward the east.”

The new tower will have an extremely high height-to-width ratio, perhaps somewhat like that Trump World Tower on First Avenue. While it clearly towers over the charming church complex and gardens, it is considerably thinner than Madison Belvedere at 10 West 29th Street.

The church building was erected in 1849 on what were then the outskirts of the city.

In 1923, the Episcopal Actors' Guild was founded and it carries on an active program at its national headquarters in the church's Guild Hall and such theatrical greats as Basil Rathbone, Tallulah Bankhead, Cornelia Otis Skinner, Charlton Heston, and Rex Harrison served on its council."


Any renderings? Going to be a very narrow tower for sure. I remember that prelim. rendering didn't look that great, and the article says it's still brick. :eek:

[londonlawyer]

It's a shame that so many buildings are going up just off the avenue. There are several dilapidated sites on 5th that should be redeveloped.

[Derek2k3]

Sky House
11-13 East 29th Street
54 stories 588 feet (DOB)
Fox & Fowle Architects
Dev-Clarett Group
Residential Condominium
139 units 263,972 Sq. Ft.
Proposed Summer 2005-2007


http://www.clarett.com/images/skyhouse.jpg

The Clarett Group
Sky House
Luxury Condominium Homes

http://www.clarett.com/flatiron.html

Currently under construction, Sky House is a 54-story luxury condominium located at 11 East 29th Street in Manhattan’s Flatiron District. This dynamic building designed by Fox & Fowle Architects features 138 one, two and three bedroom homes.

[sfenn1117]

I dunno if I like it lol. Looks a little bland, but at the same time, not so bad. Very very slender though. It should rise fast.

[Stern]

Very tall, but, eh.

[czsz]

Ha, so much for that church ever getting any light.

[lofter1]

Sky House
11-13 East 29th Street
http://www.clarett.com/flatiron.html

Currently under construction, Sky House is a 54-story luxury condominium located at 11 East 29th Street in Manhattan’s Flatiron District. This dynamic building ...

Dynamic? hmmmmmm...

Wouldn't it be stronger if the angles above the entry and at the top were designed to correspond in some way to the roof tops of the church?

It looks like the "sliver" buildings of the 80s are making a big comeback.

At ~ 37 feet wide (at the street front) and 500+ feet tall this is an odd one. I wonder what kind of wind situations that sheer wall will create for the church grounds...

btw: on 7.05.05 DOB gave an approval to the Kohn Pederson application for this new building

[sfenn1117]

588 from the DOB, which must be discounting the water tower action on the roof, we have ourselves a 600+ footer, maybe around 615'? This thing is as tall as the Orion!

And at 37 feet in width @ street level, even though the design is banal that is impressive. That's the length of my 2 family house. Amazing

[Fabrizio]

It could have been worse ( the wall looks nice....and no balconies sticking out) but still, this indeed looks like one of those notorious "sliver buildings". I thought this sort of stuff was outlawed long ago. Put up a few more and you´ve got a nice formula for making a neighborhood ugly and unlivable. As usual the building´s PR department will certainly create a web site showing the charms of living in a neighboorhood of low and intimate scale buildings. Funny ain´t it?

[pianoman11686]

From the New York Times:

Sky House, at 11 East 29th Street, a 54-story condo being developed by the Clarett Group, will be on the site of the parish house for the Church of the Transfiguration, better known as the Little Church Around the Corner. "The parish house was not landmarked," Ms. Hackett said, "so we will take it down, and they will have the first four floors of our building."

Marrying a slender contemporary tower to the Gothic Revival-style church was a challenge. "As architects there were two strategies we could have pursued," said Dan Kaplan, senior principal at Fox & Fowle Architects. "We could have aped the existing building on a larger scale, which we thought was wrong, or we could do a neutral backdrop. So we have created a slender tower with piers of brick interspersed with floor-to-ceiling glass."

The condos, three per floor starting at the sixth floor, will look out either on the church's garden or over the West Side. Prices for the one- and two-bedroom apartments will range from about $870,000 to $2.2 million. "We will have a mix of smaller units that are not typically available," Ms. Hackett said.

Bishop Andrew St. John, vicar of the church, is hoping that the proliferation of new buildings nearby will bring in an infusion of new worshipers. "People are coming from nearby blocks and introducing themselves," he said.

Full article here (http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/10/realestate/10sofi.html); also posted in this thread (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6346&page=2)


Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company

[Master of Jumbo Loans]

Real estate is about place and space; better understanding of each allows more successful and inspiring developments. This building illustrates the typical architecture in Hong Kong. Tall, slim buildings in small groups that look like asparagus planted in the bay. Certainly, a home is a place--perhaps the place!; that's why the ownership of one defines a person's feeling of achievement. So whether you live on the 76th floor penthouse at One Central Park (http://www.wirednewyork.com/aol/condominium.htm), or in this tall SLIM building, remember one thing - home sweet home.

[krulltime]

Ok here are some photos:

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51768211.IMG_0525.jpg

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51768215.IMG_0530.jpg

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51768213.IMG_0528.jpg

This is across the street from Sky House:

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51768217.IMG_0531.jpg

That tall residential tower was built in the last couple of years:

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51768220.IMG_0532.jpg

[krulltime]

Here is the site:

http://i.pbase.com/v3/55/435155/1/51771066.SkyTower.JPG

[BrooklynRider]

That is such a beautful church and setting. It's going to be one big shadow.

[krulltime]

November 17, 2005


Design of tall Sky House project at 11 West 29th Street modified



http://www.cityrealty.com/graphics/uploads/1132264602_skyhouse.gif



The Clarett Group has redesigned its very tall and slender Sky House project at 11 East 29th Street.

It is now 55 stories tall and has a setback on its north side and a total of 139 one- and two-bedroom condominium apartments.

It previously was 54 stories with no setbacks with 138 units.

The building has been designed by FX Fowle and uses air rights from the adjacent Church of the Transfiguration, known familiarly as the Little Church Around the Corner, at 1 East 29th Street.

The new tower will rise across the street from the Madison Belvedere, a 50-story, 400-unit rental tower erected a few years ago at 10 West 29th Street.

Clarett is also erecting the 36-story Plaza 57, another condo tower, on the former site of the Sutton Theater at 207 East 57th Street.

According to the architects, "to help the building blend with its lower-scale surroundings, the building was divided into three slender masses," each clad in a red-brown iron-spot brick. "The element facing 29th Street and overlooking the church is set back from the street and has an architectural expression of vertical piers….Like a belfry or campanile, this almost-square tower soars into the sky celebrating and defining the presence of the historic landmark. The church’s parish house is a new three-story structure at the base of the tower that projects forward to the sidewalk, thus extending the scale and refined architectural detail of the church compound toward the east."

The new tower will have an extremely high height-to-width ratio, perhaps somewhat like that Trump World Tower on First Avenue. While it clearly towers over the charming church complex and gardens, it is considerably thinner than Madison Belvedere at 10 West 29th Street.

The church building was erected in 1849 on what were then the outskirts of the city.

In 1870 Joseph Jefferson was rebuffed at a nearby church in arranging for the funeral of his friend, George Holland, an actor. Told that there was a little church around the corner where "they do that sort of thing," Jefferson fervently and memorably exclaimed, "God Bless the Little Church Around the Corner." In 1923, the Episcopal Actors' Guild was founded and it carries on an active program at its national headquarters in the Guild Hall and such theatrical greats as Basil Rathbone, Tallulah Bankhead, Cornelia Otis Skinner, Charlton Heston, and Rex Harrison served on its council.

The church’s fourth rector, Father Orin Griesmyer, led the parish in opposing a city plan in 1962 to build a cross-town arterial highway that would have left the church stranded between the east- and west-bound lanes.


Copyright © 1994-2005 CITY REALTY

[sfenn1117]

out-dated design, but it's a tall one

[czsz]

Look at the blank space between the tiny windows on the left-hand side...what a lost opportunity.

[vc10]

Man, I really hate that sort of thing. Blank walls are an abomination in my mind.

Look at the blank space between the tiny windows on the left-hand side...what a lost opportunity.

[krulltime]

From the top of the Empire State Building. March 1, 2006:


http://i.pbase.com/o4/55/435155/1/56705305.13.JPG

http://i.pbase.com/o4/55/435155/1/56705309.14.JPG

[czsz]

Those people in the preexisting tall building are going to have some blocked views...

[krulltime]

Finally some activity!


March 24, 2006:


http://i.pbase.com/o4/55/435155/1/57696531.IMG_8143.jpg

[Kris]

http://www.triplemint.com/triplemint/2006/04/sky_house_condo.html

[BrooklynRider]

When you consider its height, it is one very tiny footprint.

[bigkdc]

I definitely agree with triplemint's take on the neighborhood. It is very convenient and all of the new development in the area definitely will help. That being said, the area on broadway between 26th and 32nd is still a disaster.

[londonlawyer]

I definitely agree with triplemint's take on the neighborhood. It is very convenient and all of the new development in the area definitely will help. That being said, the area on broadway between 26th and 32nd is still a disaster.

I can't open the triplemint link. Can you post what it says?

I agree with your statement regarding that stretch of B'Way. However, with the redevelopment of a few sites, that segment could be magnificent. There are some truly stunning buildings along that part of B'Way.

P.S.: This part of Madison has some truly glorious architecture.

[bigkdc]

You are right about broadway and the beauty of those buildings. I know this conversation has been had before but I don't fully understand how all of those stores on that strip stay in business. Who is buying that stuff?

Here is the blurb from triplemint:

Sky House Condo

http://www.triplemint.com/photos/uncategorized/skyhousesm1a_1.jpg We've been watching this project ever since our friends at Curbed (http://curbed.com/) scored the original scoop about this extremely tall and narrow apartment tower in the Manhattan neighborhood that developers are now calling "Madison Square North." Sky House, a 139 unit condominium at 11 East 29th Street, is a Clarett Group project designed by the firm of Fxfowle. The slender 55 story tower will have just three apartments per floor. Its height-to-width ratio reminds us of the Metropolitan apartment tower on West 57th Street. Reflecting a new turn toward smaller, more saleable units (as the New York condo market cools a bit), the mix here will be mostly one and two bedroom apartments. More on the design and the neighborhood after the jump.

http://www.triplemint.com/photos/uncategorized/skyhouselobby.jpg
Most of these apartments will either have dramatic city views or overlook the adjacent "Little Church Around The Corner" and its charming oasis-like garden. The first few floors will house a new parish house. Above will rise 139 apartments using the air rights purchased from the church. Fxfowle has used a dark red brick to compliment the old structure, and while we usually don't care for brick used at this scale (its detail becomes pointless after a certain height), this seems to bring a necessary warmth to the design--mostly because they got the color right. Above is a rendering of the condo's lobby.
A word on this part of town. We have always called it the Persian Rug district, but that may be just us. It's a short walk to the Flatiron District or Chelsea, and just a five minute cab ride to Union Square. It is served by both the Lexington Avenue subway and the R train. As a residential location this certainly beats the desolate canyons of Wall Street that developers have been breathlessly hyping of late. Across the street from Sky House Geoffrey Zakarian just opened his new restaurant Country which has drawn a crowd, and there are at least five nearby loft condo conversions in various states of progress. Over time we think Madison Avenue will be a much better bet than Pine Street.
http://www.triplemint.com/photos/uncategorized/skyhousemodel.jpg
The image above shows how the new structure fits into the church property.

[londonlawyer]

Thanks for posting that.

It would be nice if the City made a zoning incentive for that stretch of B'Way. That would be a great area for hotels.

[lofter1]

Sky House is going up ...

First is the back end on West 30th, then 3 shots from the front along West 29th ...

***

[lofter1]

An up-date of the future "view" to the south shown at www.skyhousecondo.com (http://www.skyhousecondo.com) :

***

[sfenn1117]

Oh forgot about this one. Thanks for the update.....what is it, about 8-9 floors?

[lofter1]

Seems so ...

I was so busy dodging traffic to get those shots I forgot to count :o

[lofter1]

This one is up to about the 15th Floor -- and beginning to show what will be a HUGE expanse of blank brick running up one side :( ...

***

[antinimby]

From yesterday by JACKinNYC over @ ssp.

Appears to have a large expanse of blank wall on the eastern side. :mad:

This was never shown in any renderings because we always saw the west facing side (which also featured a blank wall, although it is smaller).

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f117/JACKinNYC/Skyhouse-3.jpg

[lofter1]

Oh, yippee!!

Another POS blank 50-story wall to match the one on the block to the south :mad:

[lofter1]

This sucker is up to about 25 Floors ...

The blank east wall is hardly visible from Madison Avenue yet, except as it rises over a little 4-story brick structure at mid-block:

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_03c.jpg

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_03a.jpg

[londonlawyer]

With very limited exceptions, the buildings in this area are unbelieveably beautiful.

[Drexel]

why would a builder do such a large blank wall.....is the blank wall related to lot lines or is the builder being cheap...

[lofter1]

Glass and Bricks have started to go up on the Sky House where they are up to about floor 25 ...

The bricks are pretty good (they are pre-constructed panels) and seemingly an attempt to correspond to the old bricks on the church -- the brick surface is mottled & multi-toned with some sheen, but the glass is looking pretty wavy ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_04a.jpg

But that HUGE expanse of brick on the northern side of the west facade looks like it will be overwhelming ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_04b.jpg

[antinimby]

Churches overall have contibuted a lot to new developments in the city (this, the Friar's tower, etc.).

Is God pro-development and is he telling us something? :D

[krulltime]

I have to say that the facade on this one is looking rather nicely, I am very surprice.


January 24, 2007:


http://www.pbase.com/image/73540762.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/image/73540766.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/image/73540772.jpg

http://www.pbase.com/image/73540770.jpg

[Stern]

The thing I like best about this building, no exposed floorplates. When was the last time we saw that in a brick residential construction in NYC?

[finnman69]

The thing I like best about this building, no exposed floorplates. When was the last time we saw that in a brick residential construction in NYC?


All of the crappy new Kondylis boxes have exposed slabs, even the nicest of them, 777 Sixth. Cheap Cheap Cheap. There is a premium to install steel lintels instead of resting the brick directly on the floor slabs, but for a few hundred thousand dollars more, it makes a big big difference.

I think so many typical residential rental buildings are so devoid of architectural life, it's really just a bad trick to try to jazz up a lifeless facade by expressing the floor slabs.

Most of the new Related rental towers these days dont have exposed floor plates. Kudos to them for slightly better than usual buildings.
http://www.relatedrentals.com/Luxury_Manhattan_Apartment_Rental/our_rental_properties.html

[lofter1]

Previously someone posted info regarding the amount of heat / cold that escapes / enters a building due to exposed floor plates ...

Could it be that we're seeing fewer of them due to "green" building policies?

[Front_Porch]

help me out here:

What's a "floor plate?" Do all buildings have them? Houses? How do I see them when I look at a building to know whether they're exposed or not? Why is it such an aesthetic crime to handle them wrongly?

I feel like I need this knowledge to get to the next wiredny level;)

ali r.
{downtown broker}

[bigkdc]

Look at the building on the left...if you notice there is a line of cement between each floor. That is the cement slab that divides each floor. Having that slab exposed is an exposed floorplate. now that you know, as you walk around the city you will see TONS of buildings with exposed floorplates....


http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f117/JACKinNYC/Skyhouse-3.jpg

[ManhattanKnight]

^^In WNY-Speak, floorplate also means the size (area) of each floor in a building, as in "trading firms require buildings with large floorplates." Floors has the same meaning and is preferable, unless verbosity is a writer's goal, but there are a few -- just a few -- around here who want to sound like architects even if they're not.

I believe that, in the other sense of the term (uncovered concrete floor edges), exposed floorplates are often thought to be ugly and cheap. Over time, they often weather poorly, even in very new buildings.

[lofter1]

Re: Exposed Floorplates

At The Link you can see that the floorplates were exposed during construction ...

http://www.graffitibiz.com/link-02.jpg

But have since been covered with metal panels ...

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r260/pianoman11686/NewYorkJanuary092.jpg

[stache]

Exposed floorplates don't do as well during earthquakes.

[antinimby]

I think this picture does a better job of illustrating exposed floor plates.

It's by H. Thomas O'Hara, who along with Gene Kaufman are New York's very own CRAP-O generators.

http://i2.tinypic.com/ouw2ee.jpg

[Front_Porch]

wow, now I see them everywhere! Thanks all!

ali r.
{downtown broker}

[MidtownGuy]

^That has to be the most hideous new building in Manhattan. Something like this should never be approved, and I don't care how cheap they were trying to be, something better could have been designed.

The Link is ugly too, very little style or flair for the price those units will sell for. Since wealthy Americans aren't very discerning and there's no accounting for bad taste, I guess it doesn't matter to them what the OUTSIDE of the building even looks like. Just give them an impressive address and windows big enough to look out at yesteryear's buildings that are actually handsome.

[antinimby]

Well, since I know you like looking at them so much MidtownGuy, here's some more just for you. :D

More exposed floorplate goodness from O'Hara, this one on East 35th (just off Fifth Ave.!!)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/144/345160689_9731f57467.jpg

Are you taking notes, Front_Porch? :D

[krulltime]

^ They are all so ugly-ly the same! There is also a new one like those on First Avenue between 61st and 62nd. Really bad.

[Fabrizio]

This would look cool with barbed wire coiled around the balcony and a German Shepard running back and forth.

http://i2.tinypic.com/ouw2ee.jpg[/QUOTE]

[montecarlo]

Oh, yippee!!

Another POS blank 50-story wall to match the one on the block to the south :mad:

According to developers, blank walls were put in on the sides of the building where, in future years, other developments could go up, thus blocking out views and diminishing apartment values. On the west-facing side, the building has acquired the air rights from the church, so the views will never be blocked.

[ramvid01]

Exposed floorplates don't do as well during earthquakes.

Why dont they do well in earthquakes? Does it have to do with the fact that the wall is built inside the floorplate as opposed to outside?:confused:

[lofter1]

According to developers, blank walls were put in on the sides of the building where, in future years, other developments could go up, thus blocking out views and diminishing apartment values. On the west-facing side, the building has acquired the air rights from the church, so the views will never be blocked.

So what explains the design decision to build an ~ 50-story expanse of blank brick wall up the entire west facade overlooking the church

\/ :confused: :confused: :confused:

http://www.cityrealty.com/graphics/uploads/1132264602_skyhouse.gif

[ramvid01]

Hopefully something gets built there to block out that blank wall. Otherwise I like this building a lot, plus they are apparently using real bricks, which is a complete surprise to me.

[montecarlo]

So what explains the design decision to build an ~ 50-story expanse of blank brick wall up the entire west facade overlooking the church

\/ :confused: :confused: :confused:

http://www.cityrealty.com/graphics/uploads/1132264602_skyhouse.gif

Same idea. They told me that it was because something could one day be built over on that side of the street closer to 30th which would take away from the views. The idea was to preserve value by taking into account future developments, hence the small windows over on that side of the building. Those units have large windows facing north, where views won't be blocked.

[lofter1]

Aha -- I'd always assumed that nothing would go up there -- but looking again at a map I see there is the possiblity that another tall (~ 50 story) buillding will go up on the north side of the block along the north property line of the Church and abutting the north wing of SH -- and thus together enclosing the Church property on both the north and east ...

Folks who buy at Sky House should be aware of that -- and enjoy their fantastic views of the ESB while they can (one of the biggest plusses of this building). Another tower next door will wipe out the views for any of the units in the southern wing of SH.

[BrooklynRider]

I'm liking the building too. That wall is diappointing, but 325 Fifth makes this wall seem tame. 325 Fifth is an architectural crime scene.

[montecarlo]

I recently purchased a 1 bedroom apartment at sky house and I read this forum a lot before making that decision. Yes, the large expanses of blank walls aren't the most beautiful things in the world (although the apt I purchased was the "B" line which is the middle portion of the building) but I understand why they had to do those as I pointed out in my previous posts. And maybe I would have liked some outdoor space, but otherwise I felt that the apts they were offering were a really great deal (starting at a little over 1000 a square foot, and more like 1100 for the floor I purchased) with some really nice layouts and lots of light. The finishes in the apt were significantly nicer than some of the other new developments that I looked at over the last few months (in particular the kitchen - I found that a lot of the new developments were trying to be too modern and just ended up looking cheap), and overall I really like that neighborhood and think that in the next few years it will really change for the better. I like being near Madison square park, and it's really quiet over there by the church which will be a welcome relief from the ambulances I hear all night now.

Still, there are some people on this forum and others who seem to have really strong opinions against this building and I'm wondering what, specifically, those problems are. It's fine if you don't like the way the building looks, but then out of curiosity, can you post an example of the type of building that you would like to see instead?

[jennicak]

i remember getting a price list... and while the price was lower per sq foot, the maintenance and post 421a abatement taxes were high.. also i personally didnt like the fact that it was in the middle of the block.. but i agree, i think it will be a nice addition to the area.

[Derek2k3]

At 588', this will be taller than the Belvedere (the pink crap in the center; 554') and very thin. Also, soon will rise The Saya (604') and 400 Park Ave. South (475').
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/153/385877028_e291f6179e.jpg
hale_popoki (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hale_popoki/385877028/)
1-16-07
There are 470,000 square feet of development potential in the Metlife Building complex and I'm waiting any day now for a proposal to finish 11 Madison Avenue. Anyone know if zoning could even still allow it?

[antinimby]

400 Park Ave. South (475').Meanwhile, in the span of the past few years that we've been discussing about this beauty, a good dozen or more McSams have not only sprouted up but are open for business already.

This world is so twisted.

[SilentPandaesq]

I'm waiting any day now for a proposal to finish 11 Madison Avenue. Anyone know if zoning could even still allow it?

Is that the shorter of the two? The one that was supposed to be 100 stories but was never finished during the depression? If so, I am always wondering if they can finish it off. I guess if it gets sold then it is a possibility?

[v70cat]

Does anyone have the offering plan for SKY House?

[finnman69]

I'm liking the building too. That wall is diappointing, but 325 Fifth makes this wall seem tame. 325 Fifth is an architectural crime scene.

Such a skinny tower site, it has to be the core pushed to one side to maximize views/layouts. On edit, it may be a structural shear wall, required to stiffen a slender building like this.

I like the vertical ribbed portion a lot, and the massing of the forms a lot. It reminds me of the early Chicago Style brick towers wih heavy rusticated piers. Very strong. Too bad they did use a form like that over the blank wall to hide it. Instead, the horizontal floor bands read. Obviously done to save $$$. This will be much better than the POS down the street, The Epic
http://www.theepic.com/

[Derek2k3]

Is that the shorter of the two? The one that was supposed to be 100 stories but was never finished during the depression? If so, I am always wondering if they can finish it off. I guess if it gets sold then it is a possibility?

Yup.

[stache]

OMG that tower would have been fantastic!

[jennicak]

Yup.

i used to work in this building. 11 madison. loved it. lobby is beautiful too. all marble and gold with some beautiful 7 foot high paintings of dead presidents. you guys should stop by and peek in one day.

[v70cat]

I was wondering how Sky House is selling do any of you know?

[SilentPandaesq]

Yup.

Sweet Mama Jamma - That would have been "super sweet" To think that the ESB would have had a partner 10 blocks south....damn depression. Does anyone know who owns this building?

Is there any talk of finishing this one off ? (oh thats never going to happen - it would be too cool... NYC dosen't do 'cool' any more, I am sure someone would protest)

[posterboy]

i believe the building houses some of CSFB's offices.

[guin]

I just purchased a 1 bedroom in the Sky House. Right when we were about to sign the contract, they told us that there were no more 1 bedrooms on the B line and if we didn't go through with it, they were going to put ours back on the market and raise the price. At first I didn't believe them, but then I had a colleague call the sales office and pretend to be an interested buyer. They told him the same thing - no more 1 bedrooms on the B line. In fact, only one more 1 bedroom in the entire building.

[bigkdc]

I just purchased a 1 bedroom in the Sky House. Right when we were about to sign the contract, they told us that there were no more 1 bedrooms on the B line and if we didn't go through with it, they were going to put ours back on the market and raise the price. At first I didn't believe them, but then I had a colleague call the sales office and pretend to be an interested buyer. They told him the same thing - no more 1 bedrooms on the B line. In fact, only one more 1 bedroom in the entire building.


May be that they meant only one 1BR left in what has been released to date. Could be that as soon as they sell this particular unit, they will amend the offering plan to raise prices and release more units for sale. So...you are getting the last 1BR at this price which is a good thing as your unit will be worth more

[montecarlo]

When I was purchasing my apt, they "released" any B-line apartment that I wanted, so they are not holding back apartments until the price increase. I am curious as to what they raised the prices to - do you know?

[Front_Porch]

Really??

I have a list from eight days ago with six one-bedrooms on it. (I am a buyer's broker in this transaction, not a seller's broker).

Have five of them gone that quickly?

My prices run from $1075 a square foot to $1300 per.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

[guin]

I don't know what they raised prices to, but I'm sure it isn't so difficult to find out, just have to get ahold of the new availabilities list. Montecarlo, were you able to negotiate any of the costs/fees or terms of your contract?

[infoshare]

I have to say this is one of my favorite new Architectural additions to NYC. From a recent visit to the site it appears to me that the interior finishes and care/quality of construction is exceptional - far better than what I have seen at the orion/lumier/link and other new luxury condos.

I am planning to go photo this project tommorrow afternoon: I will post them here asap.

This will be (for me) another great project to follow. :eek:

[jennicak]

thought you guys would be interested in a recent picture. from 2 days ago. everytime i walk past this always amazed at speed of building.
also, fyi looks like the bricks are done for 1/2 the bldg. looks like not boring red bricks, but more interesting.

[sfenn1117]

Thanks for the update. Looks like about 18-19 floors to go.

[montecarlo]

You like the bricks? When I walked by the other day I thought they looked a little washed out, but I am not sure if they are supposed to darken over time to better match the bricks on the church.

With about 20 stories to go, do you think Sky House has a chance of actually being finished on time (ca. November 2007).

[montecarlo]

Just got revised price list from Sky House. 1 bedrooms previously started at 800,000 - now up to 874,000 and 5-10,000 per floor after that.

[guin]

i got the amendment yesterday too. they seemed to have made changes primarily to the 1 bedrooms and moreso on the lower floors than the higher floors. When we called 2 weeks ago we were told that all the 1 bedrooms had sold out. What was the purpose of increasing the amount on the offering plan?

[sberg25]

Really??

I have a list from eight days ago with six one-bedrooms on it. (I am a buyer's broker in this transaction, not a seller's broker).

Have five of them gone that quickly?

My prices run from $1075 a square foot to $1300 per.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

Would you be willing to help. I'm interested in buying a 1 bed however whenever I call the sales office they say there are none left. Does the developer insist their sales staff to play these games. If you're willing to discuss offline I would be interested in you representing me.

Thanks

[Front_Porch]

This is what I hate about new condos . . . all you want to do is spend a million bucks of your hard-earned money, and they give you attitude.

I PM'd you. I'll call Sarah tomorrow and see what's up.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

[sberg25]

Sky House is going up ...

First is the back end on West 30th, then 3 shots from the front along West 29th ...

***

I have to admit Skyhouse is an unique and good building. However, the sales tactics employed by their staff is atrocious. They have been re-pricing units indiscriminately. They have a right to do this however when you call and they say the unit is sold or sold to a the developer's friend/family left me a little suspicious. What do you know a few days later the so called sold apartments become available with a significant bump in price. They will try and convince you all the units will be gone unless you purchase it immediately. Just be weary of their motives and be informed before you literally buy into their lies. For those of you who bought early you were the fortunate ones who didn't have to deal with sales staff misrepresenting facts.

[condowatcher]

Here's an update.

They are trying to sell Apt #8C for 1.520mm. The apartment up until a month ago was being offered for 1.4mm. 120k mark up for a unit on a low floor and terrible views.

Also, 34B offered at 1.575 is not selling because is a 2 bed 1159 sf apt. Do the math on the price per square foot. Also you will only have W views because the north view is blocked by the C lines.

Finally, the 3Bed A lines and 2 bed B lines are not moving at all so expect them to try and convince you how great these units are. They want to unload the undesirable units now

You can see these listings on the NY times real estate website. Search for " Sky House, 11 East 29th Street"

[infoshare]

They have been re-pricing units indiscriminately.

Welcome to the "Church (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showpost.php?p=38474&postcount=1) of the Transfiguration", :cool:

[Stanley74]

I bought a one bedroom at Sky House but it was very frustrating dealing with the developer's representative, who told me that "there will be no transparency" in my efforts to buy an apartment there. I, too, was told about supposed purchases made by "friends and family". Trying to buy an apartment at Sky House was like trying to spend over a million dollars on a purchase by throwing darts and hoping to strike a good apartment on the chart -- that's how random and haphazard it all was. Even my realtor was stressed and felt unable to get clarity from these people.

[sberg25]

Sorry to hear about your experience with the salestaff. I'm sure you will be happy with your apartment.
However, people need to be aware of how they go about selling at the SkyHouse.
If you feel pressured and uncomfortable because of their lack of transparency you should just walk.
They will ultimately have to capitulate once sales begin to slow.

[lofter1]

It's not even that great a building. I don't know what folks are so excited about.

[Front_Porch]

It's not even that great a building. I don't know what folks are so excited about.

1) Folks who want new want brand brand-new, and to them Madison Green isn't a comparable building;

and 2) something about real estate taxes that run only $100 a month is appealing . . .

ali r.
{downtown broker}

[montecarlo]

I'm surprised by your experiences because when I bought my 1 bedroom they were extremely helpful and transparent, and let me have my pick of any 1 bedroom B-line, even those that weren't "released," that wasn't already sold, which back in January wasn't that many. There ended up being only one apartment in the floor range I was looking for that was actually sold, and a few that were in contract. When the ones in contract fell through, they called me immediately and let me know so that I could have my pick of the highest floor in my price range.

Who did you work with over there? I worked with Gladys who was extremely nice and helpful, and very forthcoming with information. Whoever is looking at purchasing at sky house should make sure to work with her since my experience was nothing like what is being described above. I can't imagine that their practices have changed so drastically since the initial offering phase.

Also as far as what we like about sky house, if you look at the 1 bedroom layouts (can't speak for the other lines) they are spacious with great views, the finishes are really high end (compared to some other new developments I looked at which just looked cheap), and overall it was a great price for what they were offering. I wish the building had some outdoor space like a roofdeck (the views would be amazing) but that is my only complaint.

[sberg25]

Trust me a lot has changed between now and January.

I agree prior to March and Feb they were very accomodating but things have changed drastically over there.

Just call the sales office and see for yourself.

[jennicak]

everytime i go to this place... it gets bigger and bigger so fast. more pics with closeup of the brick facade.. took pics at 5pm today, so a bit darker than id like but take a look.

[lofter1]

That blig expanse of brick at the northern end of the east facade is horrible.

[Derek2k3]

Up close this building feels oppressive but I like seeing another crane in the skyline from Brooklyn.

Posted by JackinNYC on SkyscraperPage
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f117/JACKinNYC/Skyhouse-7.jpg

[Derek2k3]

This, The Epic, and The Saya will be great buildings for watching new towers rise. Because of their height and relative isolation, you have some well-ensured views of both Downtown and Midtown.

Some views from Sky House.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/26a-NW.jpg
The Magellan looks as nondescipt as ever. I've gotten use to 325 5th's color, many of its southern views will be blocked by 309 Fifth Avenue (34 st.) though.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/26a_E.jpg
400 Park Avenue South should be more interesting rather than aggravating to watch rise in this view. It tops out a little under 500 feet anyway.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/26a_S.jpg
Damn that ugly Madison Belvedere. The Saya will take a sliver out of this view but you would still be able to see the new WTC rise.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/16b_W.JPG

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/26b_W.jpg
To the south is The Aston, another ho-hum Kondylis creation and to the right is the Epic.
Between them a few 20-50 towers should rise. Luckily for Sky House, they're mostly along or west of Sixth. They include The Remy (31 st.), 839 Sixth (45 st.), 855 Sixth (35 st.), Hotel Indigo and a few other random hotels.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/16a_kitchenWindow.JPG

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/26c_N.jpg
Something needs to block O'Hara's red brick trash on 35th Street pronto. 425 Fifth is another tower that must have incredible views.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/16c_N.JPG

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/26c_NE.jpg
Frank Williams' 176 Madison Avenue (35 st) should come into view in a few years, A block south of that, Sundari Lofts & Tower (22 st.) would've been just blocked out along the west side of Madison from this perspective. Maybe they'll get their act together and revive the project. South of that is rumored to be a 26 story hotel near 31st Street and Madison Avenue.

http://skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews/20b_NW.JPG
Tower 31, another ho-hum Kondylis tower.

More pics on Sky House's website. (http://skyhousecondo.com/)

[lofter1]

That last shot ^^^ shows 3 gaw-daawful hulks in a row -- different eras, same POS results.

[Dagrecco82]

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6229/img3295bb5.jpg

[antinimby]

I find myself just gazing at the Skyhouse tirelessly from those photos.

Something about tall, thin towers that I just find mesmerizing. :)

[Stern]

Great picture. It seems whenever I'm in that area, I don't know if its the weather, or just something about the area, but it always seems dark and dreary. That picture captures the atmosphere well.

[Dagrecco82]

Thank you, Stern and I totally agree.

[stache]

It's dreary around there even on pretty days. Not many trees etc.

[Derek2k3]

All from 29th Street...

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/224/459144081_1848ce4a51_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/188/459130440_40b709ec85_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/216/459130450_801b7dc5e3_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/232/459130508_99ddaaf405_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/250/459130512_8e5a728436_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/192/459130518_7dd775f9a2_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/233/459144061_6111b5ba71_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/212/459130516_c77984806b_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/231/459144065_f05eca74ab_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/170/459144077_6775bcc86c_o.jpg

[hey19932]

I like it, it looks like the type thing that is being built in amsterdam.

[antinimby]

You can now follow live, the rise of the Skyhouse over at webcam 2 (http://wirednewyork.com/webcam2/). ;)

[Fahzee]

It's dreary around there even on pretty days. Not many trees etc.

I know what you mean - but I gotta say, I love walking around there - the whol area btwn 34th & 23rd, btwn Park & 6th is filled with awesome buildings - especially awesome lowrise buildings.

It really gives you a taste for what Midtown was once like

[stache]

Really wonderful buildings around there -

[Harvick2933]

I must say that I'm pleasantly surprised by how well this building turned out. When I saw the tower's renderings, I thought we're in for some mediocrity of a uilding that'll only overshadow one of Manhattan's most famous churches. However, the facade turned out to be quite good, definitely above the average facade quality of your typical Manhattan high-rise.

I still wish that they could've found a wider site for this tower though, a site wide enough for them to at least wrap some residences along the west side of the core.

I apologize ahead of time if this question has been posted not too long back, but about how many more floors to go before this tower gets topped out?

[Fabrizio]

Agreed. Too bad about the blank wall, but otherwise it looks like a fine facade.

The real residential garbage is the building across the street, seen in the first 3 photos.

Exposed floor plates..."open-drawer" balconies.... and that pathetic "historical" style roof. Now that's ugly ugly.

[infoshare]

I apologize ahead of time if this question has been posted not too long back, but about how many more floors to go before this tower gets topped out?

I do not know the number of floors that have been completed to date: but, the overall number of floors will be fifty-five (http://www.clarett.com/flatiron.html).

The Sky House website has a link that shows some current veiws (http://www.skyhousecondo.com/constsiteviews.html) from the construction site.

[macreator]

Great shots. They really show how the Empire State Building truly dominates its surroundings, including the relatively tall condos that have sprouted up nearby.

[posterboy]

I walked by 29th street last night and noticed there is another tower crane on the same block as sky house, closer to madison ave. anyone know what it is going up there?

[infoshare]

I walked by 29th street last night and noticed there is another tower crane on the same block as sky house, closer to madison ave. anyone know what it is going up there?

The NYwired splash page has a section with a list of projects currently under construction (http://www.wirednewyork.com/new.htm) - you can see if there is any new construction listed in that area. Other than that; I have not heard anthing about the project.

[investordude]

http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9426

There's already a wired threat. The renderings look nice to me, though I'm sure I'll now be villified for saying that about an O'Hara building.

[infoshare]

http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9426

There's already a wired threat. The renderings look nice to me, though I'm sure I'll now be villified for saying that about an O'Hara building.

Thanks for the hyper-link; that is probably the building in question. I would say mediocre (http://www.cityrealty.com/graphics/uploads/1160159754_29e39as.jpg): but, nice will do too. :D

[posterboy]

Yeah, that must be it. Thanks for digging that up!

Mediocre is probably generous. Don't like the setback. But at least it's overshadowed by Sky House and not right on the corner of Madison.

[BrooklynRider]

I really like this building's north and south elevations. As bad as the west elevation is with that big blank wall, the east elevation is horrendous. Solid wall. I was shocked when I saw it today for the first time (although the building is another appreciated bump in the skyline south of ESB.)

[lofter1]

You're right, BR -- the EAST facade is basically a big "FY, AH" to everyone to the east of this building ...

As seen from Madison @ E. 28th ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06c.jpg

Directly across Madison (between 29th / 30th) ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06e.jpg

From E. 30th just east of Madison ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06f.jpg

From in front of another New Building** going up at 39 E. 30th with the blank wall of Sky House looming in the background ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06d.jpg

What a pair of blank-ended butts :cool: these two make ...

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06b.jpg

** DOB (http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JobDetailsServlet?requestid=12&allisn=0001255527&allboroughname=&allnumbhous=&allstrt=) says this is to be a 30-story building / Arch.: Thomas J. O'Hara. It encompasses four lots on E 29th (39 / 41/ 43 /45 for a frontage of ~ 105 ' and is connected to # 36 E. 30th). Permit was issued in February 2007. Some info in this POST (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showpost.php?p=103584&postcount=952) .

[lofter1]

That ^^^ O'Hara project at 39-45 East 29th has its own THREAD (http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9426)

Here's what it will look like (with its own blank butt facing east -- and another facing west toward Sky House):

http://www.pbase.com/image/60824937.jpg

[fioco]

Help to enlighten a philistine. Could the scourge of these towering blank walls be lessened by inexpensive design solutions? Such as, adding some texture or variance to tease the eye, or (cover your ears, the horror!) adding fake windows. (I realize that this an architectural sin worthy of eternal damnation, but at least it would look better . . . in that brief interim before Satan snatches you away.)

[pianoman11686]

Taken a few days ago:

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r260/pianoman11686/SA700837.jpg

[antinimby]

Not much more to go.

[RandySavage]

What's that terrific white building that looks like it belongs in London?

[Derek2k3]

I hate this building, luckily it has sexy proportions.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1111/543632833_f4403980f2_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1062/543624343_bb43a85a98_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1308/543624339_f0ff3f5890_o.jpg


These I took today.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1202/543623741_63e642f462_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1009/543624371_af70afc637_o.jpg


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1123/543624375_1d238dfb81_o.jpg
It has lots of ugly new friends to play with too...

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1271/543624383_461239d83b_o.jpg

[Fabrizio]

In Dereks pics, it looks to me like a "real" building. Look at the facade and compare it to the older buildings in the photos... fits right in. Nice deep rich somber color, inset windows with verticle proportions, no exposed floor plates, no balconies sticking out, no lame attempt at a crown. Look how garish by comparison is the new building to the left with the "now renting" sign... or the building with exposed floor plates and balconies.

Of course all of this effort is going to RUINED if the blank wall side (seen in Lofters pics) is going to be raw concrete and not covered with brick. What will it be?

[ablarc]

Look how garish by comparison is the new building to the left with the "now renting" sign...
Heartily agreed. Worst of all is the graphicky, tacked on egg-crate styling trick. Yuck!

[lofter1]

Is the egg carton by Kaufman? He loves using that trick to break up the mass of his buildings :mad:

[pianoman11686]

That's Kondylis for you. Or, at least it was...he seems to be going for cleaner designs these days. Building's thread: 9 West 31st Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6160&highlight=west+31st+street)

What do you think of the other tall residential, with the gold-colored crown? It's no masterpiece, but at least it made an attempt at contextuality. Not the easiest thing to do in this neighborhood.

[sfenn1117]

Cool shots Derek. Looks like you were a few floors up....what building?

[Derek2k3]

From the office I work at on 29th & 6th. Too bad it's only 12 stories and there's new stuff rising all around it.

[sfenn1117]

^Cool. One day soon I'll have to come into the city and we can go take some pictures. Maybe next week....I'll PM you if I can.

[Derek2k3]

^Sounds good. Anytime.

That's Kondylis for you. Or, at least it was...he seems to be going for cleaner designs these days. Building's thread: 9 West 31st Street (http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6160&highlight=west+31st+street)

What do you think of the other tall residential, with the gold-colored crown? It's no masterpiece, but at least it made an attempt at contextuality. Not the easiest thing to do in this neighborhood.
I use to hate it but now I've grown so accustomed to it. It fits in nicely from the ESB and it's nice that they still light the top.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1066/545637215_f38ea8f694_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1340/545637257_1c73c87c11_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1146/545637231_8cc3ac45b3_o.jpg

[lofter1]

That ^^^ is the red brick step-sister of the fugly Kondylis thing at 12 Barclay :mad:

[Fabrizio]

THOSE are the ugliest buildings in NY. Those faux luxury condos with the exposed floor plates and dinky balconies.

The crown they stuck on the top of this is particularly gruesome. Dig those proportions.

It's McMansion architecture and if it were not for the height it would be contextual in certain suburbs ...but not in this neighborhood.

And WHAT is going on with the front lawn? It looks like a dead soldiers monument ...or maybe a re-interpretation of Stonehenge? I wonder if it tells the time.

-----

Flimsey tacked on "historical" details.... goofy proportions... delusions of grandeur...

[ablarc]

The crown they stuck on the top of this is particularly gruesome. Dig those proportions...

Flimsey tacked on "historical" details.... goofy proportions... delusions of grandeur...
All true, and it gives you something to look at.

You could think of it as amusing: incongruous, like a party hat.





I wonder if it was thought of by the developer or by the architect.

[pianoman11686]

I'll give you guys this much: the backside with the exposed floor plates is rather hideous. But the other side (visible in Derek's first 2 photos of the first set) is pretty good. The mass is broken up so that it's not overwhelming (which 6-10 Barclay suffers from), and the attempt is made to give it some grace at the top. Does the crown look a little clumsy, like 60 Wall's? Yes, it does - as does that first "hollow" setback, which they should have just filled in. But all in all, I see several attempts at contextuality and the result is a building that's much better than the standard brick/balconied box residential.

[Fabrizio]

That is not my idea of contextual.

Contextual would, most of all, mean fine proportions and good build quality...a good black-glass International-style box would be contextual here... in all it's honesty and rigor.

This is just kitschy junk and that's not what's on the skyline in this area.

Classic NYC architecture employed elements from historic European architecture, but did it with the materials (proportions, color etc,) that were up to the task.

The out-of-wack proportions, spindly columns, yellow color and white molding (!) of that mansard roof says "fast food" more than anything else...

The sublime to the ridiculous:

[stache]

Wright was making the same argument about historic-styled ornamentation 100 years ago.

[Spoon]

haha....great Arby's hat. This building is terrible, no slicing it any other way.

Can't the building code specifically state you can no longer build with exposed floorplates. Is that even possible. Also can't they say no more blank brick walls. That also sucks.

[macreator]

I'm afraid we'll always have blank brick walls as long as high rises are constructed adjacent to buildings that still have their air rights. Blank wall isn't new.

[Fabrizio]

Wright and other moderns: the argument was different. Their's was a genuine philosophy... almost a religion of modern architecture.... with very little leeway: form follows function...less is more.... etc and etc.

But today we are in a post-modern, eclectic era with few hard and fast rules.

Although perhaps not to everyone's taste, dipping into past styles is perfectly OK. Robert Stern is not going to be ostracized any time soon.

But he's doing it with style (and a proper budget) and then we've got this junk...

[Derek2k3]

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1118/556678967_0010b26416_o.jpg
West 30th St.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1118/556678955_11464e19be_o.jpg
West 28th (McSam Central)

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1237/556678983_c6cc0424d3_o.jpg
Madison Ave.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1150/556678975_42838fe0ee_o.jpg

How unassuming.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1413/556682133_a854013e8e_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1327/556678997_77bdeb4482_o.jpg

[stache]

A giant sliver!

[sfenn1117]

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1118/556678955_11464e19be_o.jpg


There's the remnants of the Flower District.

[tigerchen]

have they started selling in here yet? any idea what apts will go for?

[Derek2k3]

Topped out today I think. A flag is flying.

[londonlawyer]

I assume that the back entrance pictured above will be loading docks.

[sfenn1117]

Yes it is topped, ESB cam:

http://i16.tinypic.com/67ds8ip.jpg

[lofter1]

Standing within the newly completed Father Demo Square at Bleecker / Sixth Avenue you can see the top of this one in the distance (it helped today that the crane was sticking up).

[stache]

Supposed to be 30 ft. taller than the Belvedere upon completion.

[pianoman11686]

6/23:

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r260/pianoman11686/SA700008.jpg

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r260/pianoman11686/SA700009.jpg

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r260/pianoman11686/SA700011.jpg

[vanshnookenraggen]

I just walked by this tower this morning and my god is it dominating. What is interesting is you don't really see or feel it when you are walking up 5th or Madison, it just blends in with all the tall buildings but then when you walk up to it on E29th it is just amazing.

[Derek2k3]

Nice pics piano...

Supposed to be 30 ft. taller than the Belvedere upon completion.

They're about the same height. I'm almost disappointed but when looking at this photo, 30 feet is pretty irrelevant.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/217/499434131_d97c721b31_b.jpg

[TREPYE]

^ The design is irrelevant :rolleyes:

http://www.cityrealty.com/graphics/uploads/1132264602_skyhouse.gif

[Derek2k3]

Yea, the brick and blank walls suck. It shouldv'e been sheathed in some high-quality reflective glass, showing off it's slender profile as a kind of sculptural object. Anyway here are some pics today. I have so many pics that I wish I had time to post....

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1066/700904622_f295f05c6e_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1040/700904836_23e861c076_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1050/700904700_03ffae078d_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1144/700904674_a13bdcfed7_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1028/700904720_e6e7998094.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1301/700904636_87f01f2f86.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1350/700904600_912bfe32f0.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1162/700904572_c9311bbc03.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1369/700904552_8c051eb893.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1249/700904540_63586fe029.jpg

[Derek2k3]

Seems like my office is being surrounded by the ugliest new buildings.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1383/890854573_3c8c8385c4_o.jpg
That's the O'Hara project behind it.


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1212/890847347_4bb0e8a91b_o.jpg

[ablarc]

I just walked by this tower this morning and my god is it dominating. What is interesting is you don't really see or feel it when you are walking up 5th or Madison, it just blends in with all the tall buildings but then when you walk up to it on E29th it is just amazing.
All those windows...

[Derek2k3]

View from the tower.
http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/5892/181copy2qr7.jpg
N.Y.Panoman
The reason to live in an embarassingly ugly building.

[NewYorkDoc]

Whats that green tower near the center?

[Zephyr]

View from the tower.
N.Y.Panoman
The reason to live in an embarassingly ugly building.

Wow! Could be an instant postcard that might sell enough to help with a few bills. And btw, your building doesn't look ugly to me . . . that is, based on this picture. :D

[Derek2k3]

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1312/1302758763_fb712ece1d_o.jpg
400 Park, if ever built, will look quite prominent from the park.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1080/1302758747_ec2c98d0c3_o.jpg
All these less than stunning towers shoot up like bamboo. The next addition should be 307 Fifth.

[macreator]

Great shot of Sky House from Curbed (http://www.curbed.com) today:

http://curbed.com/2007_9_skyhouse.jpg

[antinimby]

There are so much blank walls (too much, actually) in that picture.

[BrooklynRider]

This was a promising development. Unfortunately, we seem to have only been treated to the south elevation renderings before it went up. It's a hideous design. If you doubt the assessment, you haven't seen it from all sides.

[stache]

It's pretty dreadful.

[Fabrizio]

OK, clobber me.

Somebody help me out here. Am I the ONLY one seeing a perfectly dignified building here? It looks like a "real" building in a certain tradition: nice color brick, vertical windows INSET so they have depth and give the walls substance. Nice thrust. and I repeat: vertical windows.

NO floor plates, no balconies, no reflective glass... no cheap historical doo-dads (look at the hideous mansard party hat on the thing next door.... that's the kind of building, that to my eyes, ruins the vista.)

The blank wall? Perfectly acceptable here. 1- it's brick not raw cement as we've been seeing lately. 2- it's only a third of the wall shown... the rest is windowed. Note the art deco building in front of it. A blank wall too... but also clad in brick and tempered by windows.

Maybe it's a disaster at street level... maybe it ruins the church next door... but the tower is damn handsome.

[lofter1]

Half of it is a good tower -- the half on the southern part of the site with windows all across the facade. But the blank section running up the NW side really downgrades what could have been a terrific building. And don't forget the full-block length of a nearly blank wall on the east facade.

So ...

I'll revise my initial statement to say that a half of half this building is good.

[BrooklynRider]

The East facade is pure blank wall.

Fabrizio, based on what you are seeing, your perception is correct. A walk completely around the building reveals the problems.

[Fabrizio]

I'd like to go around the block in a Mazda Rx7.

[Skylimitone]

I see what Fabrizio is saying but the building is 50/50 with me. The windows are cool but I don't like all that blank brick wall.

[BrooklynRider]

I'd like to go around the block in a Mazda Rx7.

Well, what would you offer for such a ride?

[Fabrizio]

mmmm...let's see...

I understand the Rx7 uses a Wankle instead of pistons.

I could remedy that.

[BrooklynRider]

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd121/BrooklynRiderRob/EighthAve24thStreet200709160090-1.jpg

[macreator]

Oh my god! :eek:

All that blank wall....

I hadn't fully appreciated the size of that offending backside until now. How awful.

[Fabrizio]

As I was saying in my previous posts: this building sucks.

[Peteynyc1]

That back blank wall makes the beauty of the front look like just a cheap movie set. The developer totally chinced it.

[Front_Porch]

As I was saying in my previous posts: this building sucks.

some of the layouts inside are quite nice, although I liked it better at Spring prices than I do at current prices . ..


ali r.
{downtown broker}

[Fahzee]

Whats that green tower near the center?

The Green tower you are referring to (i think) is actually in the midst of being re clad in that photo. It's located on Park Avenue, South of 33rd Street (I think its @ Park & 30th, but I'm not positive)

[Derek2k3]

I can't imagine a tower like this going up in any other 1st class city...well maybe Hong Kong.

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/4553/191xy5.jpg
N.Y.Panoman (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=451877&page=15)

[czsz]

...ouch.

[Fabrizio]

That looks so poverty stricken.

I am amazed New Yorkers are not calling for laws against this.

[lofter1]

When everyone is screaming to loosen the zoning / FAR regulations (meaning allowing to build taller) in established areas of the city and the sites are (for the most part) collections of old 25' x 200' lots butting up against existing buildings then this is what you get. The assumption being that everything short-ish will eventually come down and those blank walls will be built up against. So the lot line facades must be left as windowless expanses of brick or concrete extending up into the sky.

Agree that it looks horrible -- and shows very little in the way of civic-mindedness. But we can only expect more of the same. NYC wants, above all else, to fill the city coffers via Real Estate taxes -- and therefore will not get in the way of most new development, no matter the visual damage it leaves in its wake.

All the more reason to protect the Garment District now, before the inevitable incursion of this type of stuff.

[czsz]

What are the chances that an equivalent-height building is going to be built directly next door to this in the immediate future?

[lofter1]

There is really only one building that would have to come down in order for something taller
to rise which would cover most of the blank east facade of Sky House.

That would be the 12-story offoce building (circa 1916) at the NW corner of Madison / East 29th Street:
102 Madison Avenue (aka 98 - 108 Madison / 15 E. 29th Street), a part of which can be seen behind and
to the left of the Sky House tower below:

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/SkyHouse_Lots_01a.jpg

102 Madison's northern property line is almost in line with the northern edge of exposed concrete
on the east facade of the Sky House tower. Below is 102 Madison with Sky House rising behind,
seen from farther east on E. 29th:

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06c-1.jpg

The 5-story 110 Madison Avenue sits at mid-block between 102 Madison (to the south),
112 - 116 Madison (to the north) and Sky House (to the west):

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_03c-1.jpg

112 - 116 Madison (at the right) barely abuts the tower section of Sky House:

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p242/Lofter1/Midtown/Sky_06e-1.jpg

***

[chelseacondo]

What do you all think about the views to the west? the owners have air rights for little church around the corner, but what about the smaller buildings on 5th avenue?

In the picture below (taken west facing from the 30th floor), you can see a 14 story coop with the green just past the church (this is the SW corner of the block). This will be more difficult to bring down than the buildings just to the right of it.

my concern is that a developer could purchase the buildings to the right. would they provide a large enough footprint to build a tower that could obstruct the view from a 30-40 floor apartment?

[stache]

Go to http://www.nyc.gov/html/lpc/downloads/pdf/maps/madison.pdf -

[lofter1]

Check out the small buildings just to the west of Sky House on the SAME block -- there's a parking garage and then a row of 4 - 5 story buildings all along that block to the corner of Fifth (and then some taller buildings south on that same block) --

IMO those will all eventually come down and tall buildings will go up wo views to the NW will go. The blocks directly to the west all the way to the Penn Station area and beyond could easily see tall buildings -- as that area is not protected.

[Harvick2933]

So will the grey, uncladded center part of the east facade remain that way? Oh whatever, cladding that part will make little diffference in its ugly look.

Someone should commission an artist to paint NYC's biggest mural or something on this building to cover that hideous blank wall. I rather not count on another building being built to the east of the tower since the existing buildings there are 10+ storeys tall and have considerable bulk. Most developers will probably be content with razing the many shorter buildings in the area for their residential towers.

[antinimby]

December 6, 2007

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2255/2132546105_e042edf187_b.jpg
paul victor (http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=2132546105&size=l)

[lofter1]

That poor little church garden ... within 10 years it will be surrounded on all four sides.

Good for growing moonflowers (http://www.moonlightsys.com/themoon/flower.html).

[guin]

We had our 1st inspection/walkthrough yesterday and here are some pictures.

http://images7.fotki.com/v152/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0157-vi.jpg?1199396658

http://images31.fotki.com/v1083/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0158-vi.jpg?1199396735

http://images110.fotki.com/v1112/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0182-vi.jpg?1199397340

http://images32.fotki.com/v1102/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0169-vi.jpg?1199396957

http://images31.fotki.com/v1096/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0177-vi.jpg?1199397203

http://images31.fotki.com/v1097/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0186-vi.jpg?1199397541

http://images105.fotki.com/v435/photos/2/271252/5768712/IMG_0176-vi.jpg?1199397175

[lofter1]

This unit ^ hould have a good view of whatever goes up over at Hudson Yards (at least until they build the inevitable big one on the SE corner of 30th / Fifth -- and that might get built before anything big rises at HY).

[BrooklynRider]

Congrats Guin!

[stache]

That's a nice kitchen.

[infoshare]

Good ceiling height too: looks to be at least 9' feet.

Congratulations on your new home; and thanks for posting the photos. :cool:

News article on sky house here - http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3601/is_10_53/ai_n16820893

[Derek2k3]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2208/2145099785_2f7e9939ec_b.jpg
andydick (http://www.flickr.com/photos/andydick/)

I'm hoping for some kind of nighttime illumination. Maybe light a few of the uppermost piers.

[Derek2k3]

The exterior looks pretty much complete.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2192/2331618766_d30d659560_o.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2023/2331618762_d27ed618c0_o.jpg

[krulltime]

What about the other exterior? The one with the blank wall facing east. Is it at least painted over?

[stache]

Not sure but I think it's all brick veneer.

[Peteynyc1]

This is a prime example of a midblock tower which is out of context with its surroundings, clogging the streets, and casting shadows every where it goes (see MOMA thread)

[stache]

You can thank the Episcopalians for this one! :p

[The Benniest]

Really nice building. The interior of guin's apartment is very nice!

Now I'm curious and want to know how much rent is. *goes to look* :rolleyes:

[The Benniest]

http://www.skyhousecondo.com/pricing.html

:eek:

...nevermind

[Stern]

The maintenance is probably more than you can afford. Just some constructive criticism Benniest, I've seen you posting on a number of threads about how much apartments in this historic building or this new building costs? That's something to think about once you make your first million. All the buildings you asked about the studios will start at $3,000, the average price for a studio in Manhattan is $2,000. Its not impossible to find a studio less than that but you'll have a very hard time finding it online, don't forget there are millions of people doing the same thing you are doing, looking for a steal online for Manhattan real estate. Your best bet is to find some temporary housing in NYC, in other words month to month (you probably can't get this in Manhattan) and then either deal with a broker, make some networking connections, talk to landlords, this is how you find deals is NY.

[The Benniest]

Thank you Stern.
As you said, and as I'm finding more and more as I search online, it's extremely hard to find something under $3,000 in Manhattan unless you're looking wayy up into the Inwood areas. I have found very cheap apartments and houses in the Inwood areas.

The hard part for me is that because I live half way across the United States from NYC, I can't go and visit these apartment buildings to see if I like them. So, instead of visiting, I have to make judgment calls on the number or quality of the pictures these landlords or sellers post.

I'll, like you said, start looking in other areas besides Manhattan and begin looking for network connections. :)

Thanks again,
Ben

[RandySavage]

Looks good from across the Hudson and takes attention away from it's neighbor's awful roof.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2223/2352698027_e8f19eec68_o.jpg

[Edward]

See Sky House condo sales prices and floor plans (http://condos.wirednewyork.com/search/buildingdetails.aspx?bid=4776) in our Condo section.

[kz1000ps]

I like the color brick they used; sometimes maroon, sometimes grey.

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/8017/img7897wg3.jpg

But then any good will towards it disappeared once I walked further down the block

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/7299/img7899cu4.jpg

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/3927/img7902mw7.jpg

Can anyone think of a bigger blank concrete wall than this?

[lofter1]

The way they have enclosed the rear of the garden with flat all-brick walls is unforgiveable.

The least they could have doone was to break up the mass with some variety in the brick work -- nothing flashy, but just something to interest the eye. Seems such craftsmanship is beyond the capabilities of NYC developers in the 21st century (see William Beaver http://www.wirednewyork.com/forum/images/icons/icon13.gif ) ...

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/8017/img7897wg3.jpg

[antinimby]

Maybe some ivy in the future will help.

[Derek2k3]

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3077/2561309629_26105a09cd_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3112/2561309617_062938d99e_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3004/2561090639_3f058c61cd_b.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3027/2561090701_d7e086076c_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3176/2561090727_e34cf86928_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3070/2561090713_7d73ced72a_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3009/2561090685_14d5ae13c5_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3029/2561090735_cfb1c0a970_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3181/2561086205_a345a429c3_o.jpg

[lofter1]

This would look just as good if the residents hung their laundry out the window ...

Reflective glass please!

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3004/2561090639_3f058c61cd_b.jpg

[philvia]

the whole building is disgusting

i do like the little garden area tho :cool:

[stache]

The garden area is part of the church next door.

[Derek2k3]

They're painting the bare wall of Sky House...

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3045/2779553270_15a0432bb9_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3129/2779553230_3f251c8be3_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3039/2779553238_10a4e5eb36_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3014/2779553242_8b1c01974d_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3149/2779553258_616347ec81_o.jpg

[antinimby]

Lipstick on a pig.

Better than nothing but still...

[Antares41]

Could be just a primer layer before the real paint is applied. Well, at least they're doing something.

[RandySavage]

Looks like a prison from the east. Architect should be embarrassed.

[KenNYC]

A friend just moved in there a couple of weeks ago, I have to say I didn't care much for it on the inside either... and it's a fairly pricey building.

[ablarc]

Can anyone think of a bigger blank concrete wall than this?

Looks like a prison from the east. Architect should be embarrassed.
Now that the code has made scissor stairs illegal, you can expect to see more blank walls.

(Another case where you could quite justly direct your ire somewhere besides the architect.)

[RandySavage]

I thought the restrictions on scissor stairs only applied to office buildings of a certain size. But you're right... the developer, site size, budget are factors in these blank walls. I like this building from the west... particularly because it overshadows its neighbor with the ridiculous crown.

[antinimby]

Thanks for pointing that out ablarc. I definitely did not know about that.

We can now know where to the point the finger at: building codes.

[ZippyTheChimp]

Scissor-stairs are illegal in NYC for buildings with floorplates over 10,000 square feet.

In addition, there are requirements for impact and fire isolation between the two stairwells (one-hour firewall, I think). This adds to cost, but doesn't appreciably impact the square footage.

It's only safety, so what the hell.

[RandySavage]

Skyhouse is a far cry from 10,000 sq ft plates. You can see that it does in fact uses scissor stairs (the two entrances to the stairwell show this):

http://www.skyhousecondo.com/plans/55_penthouse.jpg

So it goes back to the architect. Could have clustered the elevators and stairs in the center and added some nice window views to the east.

The catch-22 is for another building to block that massive concrete wall a nice pre-war building would have to come down.

[lofter1]

Any "window views to the east" in the Sky House would have been lot line windows. The full blockfront jsut to the east of Sky House along Madison now houses three older buildings all of which abut the east facade of Sky House. All three are nice to my eye, but undoubtedly they're underbuilt per allowable zoning and there's the possibility that they will come down and something else larger will rise there in the future -- and which has the potential of covering up any east facing windows at Sky House. Hence the vast expanse of newly-painted brown concrete.

[antinimby]

But they wouldn't be able to build it up as high. Realize that the Sky House is only as tall as it is because it's using all of the Church's air rights and distributing it in a smaller plot on which it is on.

That plus the future architect of the potential building to its east may not design their tower in such a way as to cover up Sky House's blank wall. 11 TS and the Hilton next door is an example.

[ZippyTheChimp]

Here's a full floor layout (http://www.skyhousecondo.com/plans/47-49abc.pdf) that shows how the blank wall is utilized. Besides the stairwell - elevators, trash chute, and two bathrooms.

[Derek2k3]

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3226/2789887521_de87350162_o.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3185/2790737846_ba3e3077f3_o.jpg

[mercuricoxide]

Have all the condos in this building sold?

I'm interested in the convertible 3 BR A Line condos.