PDA

View Full Version : Kahn's Franklin D. Roosevelt Monument


Kris
January 9th, 2005, 11:19 AM
January 9, 2005

An Elegy for a Memorial, and for the Man Who Designed It

By JULIE V. IOVINE

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/01/09/arts/09iov.xl.jpg
A model and a sketch by Kahn of the proposed memorial on Roosevelt Island. Open to the sea and sky, the granite-walled room at the island's tip would have Roosevelt's "Four Freedoms" speech inscribed on one wall.

SUE ANN KAHN vividly remembers hearing the news of Franklin D. Roosevelt's death in 1945, while eating dinner at her grandmother's house. Her father, the architect Louis I. Kahn, had turned on the radio in the dining room, an unprecedented breach of decorum. The whole family stood up to observe a moment of silence. "I didn't understand what it was all about," said Ms. Kahn, only a child at the time. "But I knew something momentous had just happened."

Years later, in 1972, Louis Kahn, widely recognized as one of America's most original modern architects, set to work creating a monument dedicated to Roosevelt for New York City. Designed to adorn the southernmost tip of Roosevelt Island, the memorial - a double row of trees narrowing to a single stone room open to sky and sea - framed views of the harbor and skyline with the simple but stirring monumentality of a Greek temple.

Although Kahn completed the design, and a local architect prepared the documents needed for construction, the memorial was never built, the victim of a city fiscal crisis. The Franklin D. Roosevelt Monument turned out to be one of the last projects completed by Kahn, who died while traveling in 1974. His body was found unattended in the men's room at Pennsylvania Station. A notebook with sketches and jottings about the memorial was found with his belongings.

Now the Roosevelt Island Operating Corporation, the state-appointed organization that runs the island, has commissioned a new design by a New York landscape designer for the 14-acre site, known as Southpoint Park. Taking into account feedback from residents and visitors, the design would substitute the granite memorial and overarching linden trees of Kahn's plan with a lawn for 7,000 spectators to view performances on a removable stage. There would also be a sledding hill and a skate pond.

Devotees of Roosevelt and of Kahn are hoping that it is not too late to reconsider Kahn's 2.8-acre memorial as part of the 14-acre site. With renewed interest in the art of memorial-making (because of plans for ground zero) and in the work of Kahn (because of a film made last year by his son, Nathaniel), the time is finally ripe, they say, to realize Kahn's plan.

Peter Reed, a curator at the Museum of Modern Art who worked on the 1992 Kahn show at the museum, described the memorial project as "a great opportunity for New York City to get a building by Kahn."

"It addresses in architecture," he said, "the same spirit of optimism that Roosevelt expressed in his leadership."

Beginning Monday, a show at Cooper Union will allow a larger audience to see for the first time much of the project's original documentation, including Kahn's drawings, the first presentation model, the sketchbook found at his death and construction documents made on waxed linen by his associate architects, Mitchell/Giurgola of New York. At a symposium on Jan. 25, historians and architects will consider the project and changing ideas of monumentality.

"Of all the unbuilt projects, this is the one that really could be done, and now, more than ever, should be done," said Nathaniel Kahn, whose film "My Architect," tracking the indelible imprint left by his brilliant but emotionally opaque father on family, colleagues and the world, was nominated for an Academy Award last year. "Surely that incredible site cannot be given over to just another public space. It has to be something really special. New York City needs a great monument to Roosevelt."

But those opposed to the memorial say supporters waited too long. "Kahn's memorial was played out in a different time, a different era, a different world," said Herbert Berman, president of the Roosevelt Island Operating Corporation. "It was right for 30 years ago, not for now." Today, he said, those who live on Roosevelt Island are interested in less formal uses for the land.

In a survey, residents complained that the memorial would cost too much, that the trees in the Kahn proposal would block their front-row view of Fourth of July fireworks and that the granite structure was too severe.

Further interviews revealed that residents enjoyed the disrepair that characterized the site, especially the ruins of a smallpox hospital built in the 1850's when the island was used to quarantine the sick. But locals said they also wanted the park to be a place for contemplation, not just for sporty recreation. More than a fifth of the island's 9,500 residents are handicapped (patients, outpatients and former patients from the Coler-Goldwater Specialty Hospital). There are many playing fields for children elsewhere on the island.

Last April, the operating corporation invited the Trust for Public Land, a national nonprofit organization that helps communities protect and conserve land by developing parks and recreational activities, to come up with new proposals for attracting people to the park and to the island.

In November the trust presented the operating corporation with "Wild Gardens/Green Rooms," a picturesque park designed by Mark K. Morrison, a local landscape designer who is currently working on security fencing for the United Nations, as well as on numerous Manhattan playgrounds. The design includes a cafe in the ruins of the smallpox hospital and an earth mound providing enough contour for sledding in winter. The removable stage at the edge of a large lawn would be located at the southernmost tip, where Kahn put his granite room open to the sea.

The 14-acre "Wild Gardens" would cost approximately $34 million to complete, with a first phase planned at $10 million needed to stabilize the collapsing hospital ruins and clear pathways on the west side to the now inaccessible point. That's $4 million more than Kahn's 2.8-acre memorial design would cost, according to a revised budget prepared in 2003 for the Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt Institute by the Plaza Construction Corporation.

In February the Trust for Public land will present "Wild Gardens" to the board of directors at the Roosevelt Island Operating Corporation for final approval; the board will then seek the necessary financing from public and private sources.

"Louis Kahn would have done it differently if he were alive today," said Charles McKinney, the consultant in charge of the Roosevelt Island park proposal for the Trust for Public Land. "He was well known for his concerns about creating communal spaces, and he would have understood the importance of this community's concerns, and he would have responded."

"Hundreds of thousands of people see the island from their apartment windows or their cars and are intrigued," he continued. "Some take trams out to see it, but when they get there, nothing happens. There needs to be something for them to look at and to do."

Certainly, the mandate was different 30 years ago. Kahn's commission was part of an ambitious island redevelopment plan begun by the New York State Urban Development Corporation. The island, then known as Welfare Island, It had been not only a quarantine spot, but also a prison, a lunatic asylum and a quarry.

The plan, announced by Mayor John V. Lindsay in September 1973, was to turn the island into a varied-income urban utopia (along the lines of the planned community in Reston, Va.), with the Roosevelt memorial, the only one in New York City, as its centerpiece and chief attraction.

Kahn was inspired by Roosevelt's famous "Four Freedoms" speech (about freedom from want, freedom to worship, freedom from fear and freedom of speech) delivered to Congress on Jan. 6, 1941, at one of the darkest hours of the war, after France had fallen, but before Pearl Harbor. As he developed his design, Kahn, an émigré from Estonia, was keenly aware of the United Nations' presence right across the river.

"Roosevelt said he didn't want any memorial, only a plaque in front of the National Archives" in Washington, said William vanden Heuvel, a chairman of the Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt Institute. "But the 'Four Freedoms' speech was very much part of how he thought of the world he wanted to see." With the announcement of the plan, the island was renamed Roosevelt Island.

Kahn worked on the design for about a year, said Harriet Pattison, a landscape designer (and Nathaniel Kahn's mother) who worked with Louis Kahn on the project. All Kahn's revisions, she added, were aimed at making the design simpler and more timeless.

The site was to be on an elevated platform of land - arduous earth-moving work was done in the mid-1990's in anticipation of the Kahn plan's being realized - so that a grand staircase could be positioned as a threshold. (At that time, Mitchell/Guirgola also added ramps for handicap access.) From the top of the stairs, a wide lawn would line both sides with rows of linden trees, narrowed to the point. There, looking out to sea, a square room would be built of monumental granite blocks standing side by side, with a one-inch gap allowing sun to filter through. Two parallel walls were to stand 12 feet high, but there would be no roof. On one wall, the "Four Freedoms" speech would be inscribed. There was also talk of a statue and a bust of Roosevelt. On the side facing south toward the harbor, the room was to be left open, with a low wall for sitting. At high tide, water would rise up stone banks, and the room would appear from a distance to be almost floating.

"Kahn made monuments that address nature like the ancients did, with a sense of the infinite," said Michael Lewis, a professor of art at Williams College who has written the introduction for the Cooper Union exhibition catalog, noting that monumentality was a subject always on this architect's mind. (Kahn designed several memorials, including the Memorial to Six Million Jewish Martyrs in Battery Park.) None were built. "But this was the most important of all his monuments, summing up 50 years of his thinking about it," Mr. Lewis said. "It was the ripest of all his monuments and it would be a coup for New York City to have it."

In addition to the drawings from the Kahn archive in Philadelphia, which are rarely shown in public, the exhibition at Cooper Union will include a digital projection showing Kahn's memorial as it would look on Roosevelt Island, against a backdrop of New York City as it would appear in 2007, complete with the new Queens West housing development just across the river.

Mr. Berman at the Roosevelt Island Operating Corporation said that the next step was to try to secure state financing to go forward with the "Wild Gardens" proposal, while supporters of Kahn's Roosevelt Memorial said that theyd hope the exhibition would attract enough attention to revive serious interest in building Kahn's plan.

Kahn would probably have been philosophical about the new twist of fate for his last monument design. At a lecture last year about his unbuilt works, Ms. Pattison read a statement by Kahn.

"That which is not built is not really lost," he wrote. "Once its value is established, its demand for presence is undeniable. It is merely waiting for the right circumstances."

Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company

ablarc
November 26th, 2007, 05:30 PM
http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0020.jpg.http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0040.jpg.http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0120.jpg

Plan revived for FDR memorial in NYC

By RICHARD PYLE, Associated Press Writer Sun Nov 25

NEW YORK - George Washington, a Virginian, has his statue on Wall Street, Ohio-born Ulysses S. Grant has his tomb overlooking the Hudson. But for reasons nobody can easily explain, New York native son Franklin Delano Roosevelt has no official memorial in this city.
Not that the name is forgotten: There is FDR Drive in Manhattan, Roosevelt Avenue in Queens and Roosevelt Island in the middle of the East River. There is also a memorial to FDR's wife, Eleanor.

Now, after lying dormant for three decades, plans are being revived to give Roosevelt his due as the 32nd president and author of the New Deal, who led the United States through most of the Great Depression and World War II.

It would come in the form of a stone edifice at the southern tip of Roosevelt Island, a two-mile-long sliver of land renamed for FDR in 1973.

For more than a century before that it was Welfare Island, with hospitals, a poorhouse, a penitentiary and a lunatic asylum. In 1841, Charles Dickens visited the asylum; in 1888, muckraking reporter Nellie Bly posed as a patient for 10 days to expose its deplorable conditions.

Roosevelt Island today is a high-rise village of 10,000 people including United Nations diplomats and staff from the cluster of hospitals on Manhattan's East Side.
The only remnant of the past is the skeletal remains of the Smallpox Hospital, which is known as the Renwick Ruin and is eerily illuminated at night with funds from an anonymous donor.

The name change in 1973 was in anticipation of an FDR memorial being built. Famed architect Louis I. Kahn drafted a design, but a city fiscal crisis delayed the project.

When Kahn died of a heart attack in a men's room in Penn Station a year later, drawings of the memorial in his pocket helped police identify the body.

Money problems, political inertia and faded public interest kept Kahn's plan on the shelf until it was recently dusted off as the centerpiece of a new effort to honor the former president.

The design features a sloping lawn and V-shaped promenades leading to an open space with granite walls, framing views to the south and west of the river and Manhattan towers, including the U.N. complex. It would border a 10-acre park, being developed separately.

"It's now or never," says City Councilwoman Jessica Lappin, the FDR project's leading advocate, noting that once construction begins on the park next year, plans for the memorial could be imperiled.

One big problem is the financing: the nonprofit Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt Institute has so far raised just $6 million, a fraction of the memorial's $40 million projected cost.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg and Gov. Eliot Spitzer have declared support for the project, as have members of Congress and other politicians. But no government funds have been forthcoming.

Gina Pollara, who manages the institute's fundraising effort, said she expected an infusion of more money soon. "We hope this will include contributions from the city and the state, as they promised when this project began 35 years ago," she said.

The FDR memorial would be built to Kahn's design or not at all, its advocates say.
"We are in this amazing position to build to a design by the 'architect's architect,' a master of the 20th century," Pollara said.

In an interview at the deserted, windblown memorial site, Lappin called Kahn's concept "a timeless, elegant design" sure to draw visitors from around the world.

"Having 14 undeveloped acres in the middle of the river is a one-time chance to do something right, that people will enjoy forever," she said. "If the FDR memorial doesn't happen, there's no other plan for those three acres. People could put up luxury condos. It's up for grabs, and that makes me nervous."

Island residents don't appear to be jumping with enthusiasm for the project.
Comments on a community Web site tilted toward the negative, with critics saying it was too isolated; did not reflect FDR's legacy of social reform; would ruin a goose nesting ground; or was too expensive.

Dick Lutz, managing editor of The Main Street WIRE, the island's community newspaper, said that while some people support the plan as a way to block real estate developers, resistance stems from residents' desire for more green space, and a view that the project is "more a memorial to its architect than to FDR."

In any case, he said, funding is the key question.

"Without it, the project could linger for another decade."

http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0180.jpg.http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0060.jpg.http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0100.jpg


From the Roosevelt Island NIMBY rag:

Memorial to lous kahn or fdr at southpoint park?

The images above are from the proposed Louis Kahn Memorial purported to be for President Franklin Roosevelt that some hope to be installed at Southpoint Park on Roosevelt Island, (Top image is from Architectural Record, bottom from NY Times). The New York Sun is reporting today that:

A plan to build a memorial to President Franklin Roosevelt on Roosevelt Island is getting a boost from city leaders, who are meeting today to underscore their support for the initiative. The movement for the memorial, which was designed by architect Louis Kahn almost 35 years ago, needs to raise $40 million by the end of the year; as of July 20, it had collected $5.1 million.

The city leaders set to attend the event include Democratic Congresswoman Carolyn Maloney; City Council Speaker Christine Quinn; City Councilwoman Jessica Lappin; New York State Assembly member Micah Kellner, and the president of Manhattan, Scott Stringer.
As I have stated before, my impression is that for many proponents of the Memorial, their support is based more upon the desire for a Louis Kahn project in NYC than to honor President Franklin D. Roosevelt, particularly since there is an existing FDR national memorial near the National Mall in Washington DC and Roosevelt Island as well the FDR Drive are named after the late President.

Those in support of this proposal should know that there are many residents of Roosevelt Island who do not want this massive granite structure with rows of trees obstructing the beautiful waterfront views from Southpoint Park and further impeding access to the East River. This NY Sun article had the following statement indicating opposition to the Louis Kahn memorial by Roosevelt Island residents:

The president and CEO of the Roosevelt Island Residents Association, Matthew Katz, said he is concerned that the memorial will cut off views to the east and west. A survey of residents found that most want "the greenest thing possible" in that space, he said.

"The Roosevelts were gods in my house, growing up," Mr. Katz said. "Whether this is the appropriate memorial is another question."

The association's secretary, Sherie Helstien, said that by resisting Kahn's memorial design, residents are trying to "save the last big community park" in the city. "I think a lot of us are just hoping they don't get the money," she said. "We don't want that thing here."
I agree. We do not want any green space nor access to the water from Southpoint's Park removed because of this proposed memorial.

More background on this issue from this NY Times 2005 article:

the Roosevelt Island Operating Corporation, the state-appointed organization that runs the island, has commissioned a new design by a New York landscape designer for the 14-acre site, known as Southpoint Park. Taking into account feedback from residents and visitors, the design would substitute the granite memorial and overarching linden trees of Kahn's plan with a lawn for 7,000 spectators to view performances on a removable stage. There would also be a sledding hill and a skate pond.

..."Kahn's memorial was played out in a different time, a different era, a different world," said Herbert Berman, president of the Roosevelt Island Operating Corporation. "It was right for 30 years ago, not for now." Today, he said, those who live on Roosevelt Island are interested in less formal uses for the land.

...Last April, the operating corporation invited the Trust for Public Land, a national nonprofit organization that helps communities protect and conserve land by developing parks and recreational activities, to come up with new proposals for attracting people to the park and to the island.

In November the trust presented the operating corporation with "Wild Gardens/Green Rooms," a picturesque park designed by Mark K. Morrison, a local landscape designer who is currently working on security fencing for the United Nations, as well as on numerous Manhattan playgrounds. The design includes a cafe in the ruins of the smallpox hospital and an earth mound providing enough contour for sledding in winter. The removable stage at the edge of a large lawn would be located at the southernmost tip, where Kahn put his granite room open to the sea.

..."Louis Kahn would have done it differently if he were alive today," said Charles McKinney, the consultant in charge of the Roosevelt Island park proposal for the Trust for Public Land. "He was well known for his concerns about creating communal spaces, and he would have understood the importance of this community's concerns, and he would have responded."

Here is a link to the Southpoint Park Conceptual Plans discussed above including the Wild Gardens/Green Rooms concept approved by most residents as well as the Visionary Landscape concept that includes the Kahn Memorial, assuming funding can be obtained.

If the proposed Louis Kahn memorial is built, Roosevelt Island loses opportunities for special events that produce views like this from Thom Sokoloski's The Encampment as well as normal everyday experiences of walking down to beautiful green parkland and listening to the sounds of the East River. Or maybe even the possibility of importing a sand beach to Southoint Park similar to the one in Long Island City at the NY Water Taxi Beach.
http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0200.jpg.http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0140.jpg.http://66.230.220.70/images/post/kahnfdr/0160.jpg

A Roosevelt for Roosevelt Island

Published: November 5, 2007

Slicing into the East River, flanked by Queens and Manhattan, Roosevelt Island should be a destination. Plenty of people take the tram from Manhattan’s East Side, but unless they live, work or go to school on the island, there is little else to do, except take the tram back.

Four decades ago, state planners envisioned something very different. Where there is now wild growth and a relic of a smallpox hospital on the southern end, they began work on a memorial to President Franklin Delano Roosevelt. Fittingly, what was then called Welfare Island — reflecting its use as a site for rehabilitation hospitals — was renamed for Roosevelt.

The eminent architect Louis Kahn was commissioned to design the memorial, and his concept was simple and elegant. Drawing inspiration from Roosevelt’s defense of the Four Freedoms — of speech and religion, and from want and fear — he designed an open “room and a garden” at the bottom of the island. Trees on either side form a “V” defining a green space, and leading to a two-walled stone room at the water’s edge that frames the United Nations and the rest of the skyline.

Unfortunately, the project never got much further than that. The near-bankruptcy of New York in 1975 intervened, and the memorial was given up, until now.

Jessica Lappin, who represents the Upper East Side and Roosevelt Island on the City Council, wants to give it another go. The issue, again, is money. The state, which owns the island and expects its budget to be short more than $4 billion next year, cannot commit large sums. So far, an attempt by the nonprofit Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt Institute to pay for the memorial has raised only about $6 million of an estimated $40 million needed. And if the memorial is to be built, work will need to begin in the next few months, at the same time building starts on an adjacent 10-acre park.

There’s a magic to the project. That the task is daunting makes it worthy of the man it honors, who guided the nation through the Depression, the New Deal and a world war. As for Mr. Kahn, he died in 1974, as he passed alone through New York’s Penn Station. In his briefcase were renderings of the memorial, his last completed plan.

BrooklynRider
November 27th, 2007, 03:37 PM
This is a worthy project and an appropriate memorial. I hope it moves forward.

ZippyTheChimp
November 27th, 2007, 08:06 PM
As I have stated before, my impression is that for many proponents of the Memorial, their support is based more upon the desire for a Louis Kahn project in NYC than to honor President Franklin D. Roosevelt, particularly since there is an existing FDR national memorial near the National Mall in Washington DC and Roosevelt Island as well the FDR Drive are named after the late President.So this idiot thinks a ball-joint busting highway is a proper memorial to a giant figure in American history. And he's against a memorial on the island he says is a memorial.

investordude
November 27th, 2007, 11:01 PM
We have so many problems in this city - is this really the best use of government money?

TREPYE
November 27th, 2007, 11:47 PM
Anyways...this monument should have happened a long time ago. The tip of RI is a perfect spot for a prominent and beautiful memorial.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 08:11 AM
This will automatically become a major New York tourist destination; Michelin will give it two stars. It will get tourists onto the Tramway in hordes by giving them a destination on the Island. (The restored farmhouse is not enough.)

Everything of Kahn's is spiritually uplifting; this will be sublime.





The NIMBYs are idiots. As usual.

ZippyTheChimp
November 28th, 2007, 09:11 AM
Go to the Roosevelt Islander blog (http://rooseveltislander.blogspot.com/2007/10/fdr-memorial-exists-at-hunter-college.html). Note the Welcome to Roosevelt Island message up top, then scroll down to the message by hawk. :)

Despite attempts to characterize the FDR Memorial as a late intruder, it was always one of three conceptual plans for Southpoint Park (http://www.markkmorrison.com/roosevelt/pdf/concepts.pdf) prepared by the Trust for Public Lands.

There is abundant recreational space on Roosevelt Island.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 10:14 AM
^ Wow, what a gorgeous set of proposals!

Roosevelt Island could be so cool if rhe NIMBYs would allow it.

Since the early Seventies it's been a fragmentary work in progress.

MidtownGuy
November 28th, 2007, 12:37 PM
Have any of you seen the movie "My Architect" about Kahn, which is mentioned in the article? I saw it a couple of months ago and it was very enjoyable. The last scenes, which highlight his gorgeous National Assembly Building in Bangladesh, were breathtaking.

I hope this is built, it makes perfect sense, a Roosevelt memorial on Roosevelt Island.

MidtownGuy
November 28th, 2007, 12:49 PM
We have so many problems in this city - is this really the best use of government money?

Think of it as an investment.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 12:59 PM
I hope this is built, it makes perfect sense, a Roosevelt memorial on Roosevelt Island.
For the average middle-American tourist, this will be a bigger attraction than the Guggenheim, Whitney or even MOMA.

Not just the Memorial, but also the views from it and from the Tramway.

Might even cause some to linger on the Island's Main Street, which might give a boost to its mostly moribund commercial establishments.

MidtownGuy
November 28th, 2007, 01:12 PM
I always thought the island had potential to be more of an attraction.
There are lovely cherry trees along the island perimeter, making a beautiful display against the skyline in Spring and perfect photo opportunities.

As for the rest of the year, I often considered bringing out-of-town friends for a ride on the tram, but for the time spent, the reward on the other side was debatable. Something like this would change all of that.

The ruins of the smallpox hospital are enchanting, aren't they...

NYatKNIGHT
November 28th, 2007, 01:14 PM
And for those taking a boat ride, how cool would this look as seen from the water.

Seems like a no-brainer if this portion of the island is ever to become something, and shut up nimbys already.

MidtownGuy
November 28th, 2007, 01:32 PM
As for Mr. Kahn, he died in 1974, as he passed alone through New York’s Penn Station. In his briefcase were renderings of the memorial, his last completed plan.

another reason why it will be poetic to have this plan finally realized.

alonzo-ny
November 28th, 2007, 02:07 PM
Is there a chance RI would ever become a popular neighbourhood? I mean i has a subway stop making it one stop from manhattan, with great views and space, whats stopping it?

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 02:26 PM
Is there a chance RI would ever become a popular neighbourhood? I mean i has a subway stop making it one stop from manhattan, with great views and space, whats stopping it?
Planning.

BrooklynRider
November 28th, 2007, 03:07 PM
FDR's mother has a park named after her on the LES. This memorial is the least they can do for him.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 03:09 PM
^ 20th Century's greatest president.

MidtownGuy
November 28th, 2007, 07:20 PM
:eek:you mean it wasn't Reagan?:rolleyes:

Stern
November 28th, 2007, 07:33 PM
As for the rest of the year, I often considered bringing out-of-town friends for a ride on the tram, but for the time spent, the reward on the other side was debatable. Something like this would change all of that.

I've taken friends to Roosevelt Island. The stone isn't laid but other than that the landscaping is in place and in the summer time its really nice, the ruins are interesting, and walking to the tip, its really relaxing as your the only people there and your surrounded by a nice lawn and some wildflowers, and the skyline. Like everyone else I'm anxiously awaiting the memorial, but in the interim Roosevelt Island as it is now is a great experience, its a little upstate getaway a stones throw from the bustle of the city, that will surely change when the memorial is completed.

Stern
November 28th, 2007, 07:41 PM
Planning.

In addition to what ablarc wrote I think another reason why Roosevelt Island isn't a popular neighborhood is because of its location and its size. The island is already about maxed out, and its one stop from the east-side of Manhattan, its the true definition of a bedroom community, people work, eat, and party in the City. Because of the convience to everything the City offers they only need a pharmacy and a late-night eating option when they are there. I don't forsee the day when people from the City will be making a stop at Roosevelt Island.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 07:44 PM
I don't forsee the day when people from the City will be making a stop at Roosevelt Island.
If Main Street were lined with strip joints?

Stern
November 28th, 2007, 07:45 PM
You have Long Island City for that. Strip joints are usually located right by roadways leading out of the city, you have the westside highway, the queensboro bridge, the highways in the BX and Brooklyn, the point is to attract the attention of Manhattan businessmen on their way home to their wife and kids in an area where their business associates presumably wouldnt know them.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 07:57 PM
^ Roosevelt Island sounds perfect.

Stern
November 28th, 2007, 08:02 PM
There are no roadways connecting Roosevelt Island with Manhattan.

ablarc
November 28th, 2007, 08:14 PM
^ There's a subway line.



(And there ought to be a small hotel.)

Stern
November 28th, 2007, 08:18 PM
Talking about a small hotel whatever happened to the proposal for a Marriott on Roosevelt Island, anybody remember that proposal from like 5 years ago?

pianoman11686
November 29th, 2007, 09:26 PM
Planning.

Too much, or a lack thereof? (Maybe a combination of the two.)

ablarc
November 29th, 2007, 10:37 PM
^ Too much. (Definitely.)

BPC
December 1st, 2007, 04:06 PM
Talking about a small hotel whatever happened to the proposal for a Marriott on Roosevelt Island, anybody remember that proposal from like 5 years ago?

I think that was a Michael J Fox movie.

Stern
December 1st, 2007, 04:20 PM
???

BPC
December 5th, 2007, 01:11 AM
http://www.tug44.org/hudson.river/roosevelt-island/