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Thread: 50 East 57th Street @ 432 Park Avenue (former Drake Hotel site)

  1. #136
    Forum Veteran TREPYE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnFlint1985 View Post
    Too many people don't care about old buildings -- for them it is a competition with Dubai or Hong Kong. So their philosophy is to build as at whatever price and where ever place. The only thing that matters is height -everything else is irrelevant. it is really sad.
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnFlint1985 View Post
    That too plays a major role. But as I know from a different forum http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...t=96689&page=9 a lot of people like that this building is going to be demolished. Hard to believe -- watch. Check for yourselves.
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnFlint1985 View Post
    Well majority of people there don't like the idea of saving it.

    In that regard I think this site offers a hell of a lot more of genuine NYC flavor that most of us who comment here are REAL New Yorkers. So please dont compare that site to this one because there are huge differences between the 2.

  2. #137

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    Quote Originally Posted by sfenn1117 View Post
    June 1, 2007 -- Macklowe Properties will put up a new office building at the former Drake Hotel site, The Post has learned - rather than an apartment project or hotel as had been widely speculated.

    Insiders said the father-and-son team of Harry Macklowe and his son, Billy Macklowe, have decided on a commercial project with about 30 floors at Park Avenue and 56th Street, one of the world's most valuable corners.

    Although they had earlier considered a 70-story condo/hotel scheme, the shorter height will enable them to create larger floor plates required by office tenants.

    "Park Avenue is the best location for either an office or a residential building," said an industry analyst. "But Park Avenue, particularly below 57th Street, is especially prime for office space."

    The Macklowes are not ready to identify their architect, but are expected to file plans with the city Department of Buildings.

    As The Post first reported in January 2006, Macklowe Properties bought the 80 year-old Drake for around $440 million. It is now being demolished.

    The Macklowes subsequently purchased multiple properties on 57th Street to expand the project into an L-shape that will run from 56th to 57th streets.

    The Post's Lois Weiss reported in February that the Macklowes had yet to decide at the time whether the Drake site would be used for offices, apartments, a hotel, or some combination of those.
    Neither Billy Macklowe nor reps for Macklowe Properties returned calls yesterday.

    http://www.nypost.com/seven/06012007...eve_cuozzo.htm

    I knew it. The 70 story lie that Macklowe made everyone believe he will replace the Drake with is really going to be a 30 story short and fat box built to maximize profits. There is no NYC development god controlling development today for the good of NYC. There are bad developers such as Macklowe destroying our lovely buildings and replacing them with modern smokestacks which I call them. They make everyone believe they will build marvels, get the approval to wreck our precious buildings, and redesign the buildings into s--t to feed their greedy minds.

    NYC----where S--T happens!
    Last edited by Scraperfannyc; July 9th, 2007 at 07:26 PM.

  3. #138

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    Funny that Macklowe will live in the Ritz. If it were not landmarked and he owned it, he'd demo it too.

    A couple months ago we were awaiting 3 exciting proposals, a near 700' tower at 510 Madison, a 70 story tower at the Drake, and a Piano designed tower on First. All dead.

    Unlikely but I seriously hope these buildings sit empty.

  4. #139
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    I think you meant the Plaza hotel but yes, there is no doubt that if given the opportunity, Macklowe would have razed it as well.

    And herein lies the problem...why didn't LPC landmark the Drake and why is there just so much indifference and apathy from the people and preservation groups in this city toward this and the Pennsylvania?

    I just don't get it.

  5. #140

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek2k3 View Post
    Funny that Macklowe will live in the Ritz. If it were not landmarked and he owned it, he'd demo it too.

    A couple months ago we were awaiting 3 exciting proposals, a near 700' tower at 510 Madison, a 70 story tower at the Drake, and a Piano designed tower on First. All dead.

    Unlikely but I seriously hope these buildings sit empty.
    I predicted all along that the Drake site would be short and crappy.

  6. #141
    Forum Veteran MidtownGuy's Avatar
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    How disgusting.

  7. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
    I think you meant the Plaza hotel but yes, there is no doubt that if given the opportunity, Macklowe would have razed it as well.

    And herein lies the problem...why didn't LPC landmark the Drake and why is there just so much indifference and apathy from the people and preservation groups in this city toward this and the Pennsylvania?

    I just don't get it.
    Probably money, lot's of it. Someone is looking the other way or get paid to look the other way. The oldest story in the world. That is why I want to know if there is anything we can actually do to stop this BS? If someone knows -- please share it.

  8. #143

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    Quote Originally Posted by TREPYE View Post
    In that regard I think this site offers a hell of a lot more of genuine NYC flavor that most of us who comment here are REAL New Yorkers. So please dont compare that site to this one because there are huge differences between the 2.
    Well I am not comparing, you got me all wrong. There is no comparison , you are right. I am just analyzing how people think. And I am trying to argue with them even there. And it seems to me that someone from the developers office paid those sycophants to say what they are saying. I just don't see why they are doing it and honestly I am quite concerned because today it is Drake, tomorrow it is Pennsylvania, after tomorrow -- what? If people are really so stupid then it is a problem, but if they are supporting this new "creation" because someone is telling them to do so, I would like to know about it.

  9. #144

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    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
    I think you meant the Plaza hotel but yes, there is no doubt that if given the opportunity, Macklowe would have razed it as well.

    And herein lies the problem...why didn't LPC landmark the Drake and why is there just so much indifference and apathy from the people and preservation groups in this city toward this and the Pennsylvania?

    I just don't get it.
    Yea, the Plaza. Thanks.

    I don't really get it either. I think a lot of preservation efforts are generated by Nimyby's fearful of new development. Not many people live around the Drake or Hotel Penn.

    Then again 2 Columbus Circle had plenty of fans. I guess this building isn't popular enough. Personally, I've never heard of the Drake until it was slated for demo.

    There are still many buildings that look similar to it around the city and I bet only when enough of them are gone, will more effort go towards preserving each one. Wasn't this part of Park lined with these kinds of buildings. The Drake is only getting this much attention because it's among the last.
    Last edited by Derek2k3; July 10th, 2007 at 12:49 AM.

  10. #145

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    I just wish the replacement was larger. It hardly seems worth it to demolish a 20 story structure for a 30 story one without much additional square footage. It's such a waste and will hardly put a dent in office space demands. At least with Hotel Penn, a 2.5 mil sq foot tower is to be developed, here I think it's around 400,000. The Drake might have just been better off as a hotel.

  11. #146

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    Blame the NIMBYs, who downzoned this portion of Midtown in the late 1980's.

    Macklowe is actually building a slightly larger building than the original hotel/residential proposal, but it is of course now shorter and bulkier.

  12. #147
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    ^ Downzoning Midtown was retarded. For what? Is that suppose make the city better somehow?

    Naturally, this city would listen to them and do it, too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Derek2k3 View Post
    I think a lot of preservation efforts are generated by Nimyby's fearful of new development. Not many people live around the Drake or Hotel Penn.
    Bingo! That is precisely the reason. The Drake isn't in anyone's 'backyard' per se.

    Another point I want to make...

    Regardless of whether one believes the Drake is worthy of being saved or not, one cannot argue the irreparable damage to the streetscape and the city when you one by one, replace these elegant and grand old buildings with sterile glass.

    Look at this picture:



    Now, imagine it without the Drake and instead, imagine in its place, a stumpy all-glass tower similar to any of the three flanking the Drake in that picture.

    How much duller is that now?

  13. #148

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    In future history books, the new millenium will be labeled "the dark days when people lived in glass houses and cast stones."

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnFlint1985 View Post
    That is why I want to know if there is anything we can actually do to stop this BS? If someone knows -- please share it.
    Send a letter to each of the following people:


    Landmarks Preservation Commission Chair, Robert Tierney.
    1 Centre St., 9th flr
    New York, NY 10007


    The Municipal Arts Society of New York
    457 Madison Ave.
    New York, NY 10022
    Fax: (212) 753-1816
    info@mas.org


    Historic Districts Council
    232 E. 11 St.
    New York, NY 10003
    Fax: (212) 614-9127
    hdc@hdc.org


    Community Board 5
    450 Seventh Ave., Suite 2109
    New York, NY 10123
    Fax: (212) 465-1628
    office@cb5.org


    ...and last but not least,

    Mr. Harry Macklowe
    Macklowe Properties
    General Motors Building
    767 Fifth Ave.
    New York, NY 10153
    Fax: (212) 554-5893

  15. #150

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek2k3
    I've never heard of the Drake until it was slated for demo.
    Ditto. Although I had noticed the building when walking Park Ave before, it was more because it wasn't a glass box than it was because it had any outstanding architectural merit. However, I have to agree that its loss is a net loss for that area.

    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby
    Downzoning Midtown was retarded. For what? Is that suppose make the city better somehow?
    Well, back then big new towers (Sony, Trump, IBM, Park Ave Plaza, ect.) were sprouting up all around Madison and the surrounding midblocks, and it seemed the area was becoming oversaturated, thus the response. You can argue with it if you want, but I personally am glad that some steps were taken to save the midblocks (even if there was little left to save).

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