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Thread: Brooklyn - Proposed City Tech Tower - by Renzo Piano

  1. #46
    Forum Veteran Tectonic's Avatar
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    GO BROOKLYN! The building resembles NY Times Tower though.

  2. #47

    Default my take is bank developer politically connected

    I think one thing that's happening with the savings bank is the developer is politically connected, so they are trying to make his building special. But I think given that they aren't really trying to block tall developments that are as of right (yet, at least) this might be mainly a case of "no such thing as bad publicity" marketing for both buildings.

    That's the logical explanation. The illogical explanation is Letitia James seems categorically hostile to all development at times, for reasons that aren't immediately clear to me because her constituents seem to want development more strongly than most of the rest of Brooklyn. My sense is they enjoy kvetching about the neighborhood changing more than they really want to block it from happening - Ms. James will learn that the hard way if she really tries to block a development project.

  3. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by pianoman11686 View Post
    However, City Councilwoman Letitia James (Working Families Party-Brooklyn) reiterated her position that no new construction should be higher than the Williamsburgh Savings building.
    Another idiot.

  4. #49

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    Is this building on Flatbush Ave.?

  5. #50
    10 Barclay = Decepticon Optimus Prime's Avatar
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    Jay Street, a few blocks west of Flatbush.

  6. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus Prime View Post
    Jay Street, a few blocks west of Flatbush.
    Thanks.

  7. #52

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    Nothing spectacular, but Renzo Piano usually comes correct on facade treatments and the height is amazing. Hope this one gets the go-ahead.

  8. #53

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    While I don't agree with Mrs. James, can someone provide a concrete response to her criticisms of height (such as that it is bad, and should not be taller than the WSB), as opposed to labeling her an idiot, or a fool?

    This would be much more helpful to discussion, and for me in particular.

  9. #54

    Default some reasons

    1) New York City is defined in part by tall buildings and this is an exciting opportunity to expand the skyline and reposition Brooklyn as an alternative Manhattan rather than the inferior cousin - we need to build tall to do that

    2) You need relatively tall buildings to redefine the skyline here because downtown Brooklyn is inland and shorter buildings won't look that good from likely viewing points

    3) Economically, higher views will sell better

    4) downtown Brooklyn is ideally situated for this - there's good transportation links and its underutilized

    5) The voters approved the downtown Brooklyn rezoning and a "bait and switch" would be unfair to people who made investment choices and have been planning at this point. Shorter fatter buildings will blot out the sun and cast worse shadows.

    I'm sure there are other reasons as well, but just philosophically she seems averse to change and improvements in an area that could use some major investment.

  10. #55

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    ^ What he said.

    Plus the whole aversion to height thing is kneejerk conventionality to bond with a large (and sometimes imagined) constituency of folks who feel duty-bound to regard tall buildings as the devil's work.

    It's factually untrue, for instance, that tall, slender buildings block more views or cast more onerous shadows than short, fat ones. What view does the seventy story building block, anyway, that the forty story building doesn't --except the ones from the non-existent eighty-story building? Because the shorter building has to be fatter it blocks more views and light at the levels where there actually are windows.

    Since there are few good reasons to oppose tall buildings, these conformists babble nonsense instead, and that's what makes them idiots. You could say an idiot is someone who gets emotionally worked-up in support of a manifestly fallacious argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by GVNY View Post
    While I don't agree with Mrs. James, can someone provide a concrete response to her criticisms of height (such as that it is bad, and should not be taller than the WSB), as opposed to labeling her an idiot, or a fool?

    This would be much more helpful to discussion, and for me in particular.

  11. #56
    Kings County Loyal BrooklynLove's Avatar
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    my 2 cents on the politicians - many times these positions are about politics, not logic - basically take the position that pleases your constituents/supporters (i.e. the voices in your ear and the faces in your face most of the time) regardless of its merits, so query whether l. james even thinks she being logical ...

    technical question - how come this thread is showing up differently on the board - no status info as to latest post?

  12. #57
    Kings County Loyal BrooklynLove's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynLove View Post
    technical question - how come this thread is showing up differently on the board - no status info as to latest post?
    scratch that question - i see now that the full thread with status info is in the nyc board, not the brooklyn board - I LIKE THAT!

  13. #58
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    Most of Leticia James objections to height of buildings have been directly correlated by her to the context of a neighborhood. She objected to Atlantic Yards because it abuts the low-rise neighborhoods of Prospect Heights and Fort Greene.

    In this case, she is dead wrong. The Downtown Brooklyn rezoning is along the Flatbush Avenue Extension north of Atlantic Avenue. This building is in the heart of the "new" Downtown Brooklyn - mainly characterized by Ratner's more horrific creations (aka Metrotech.) This building sits at along another main thoroughfare (Tillary Street), which is used by traffic to get to and from the BQE and Brooklyn Bridge.

    James' arguments at their core are to preserve the character of "neighborhoods." In this case, anyone looking at the location and existing building on the lot would be hard-pressed to find compelling reasons why it should not be demolished and improved upon. The site is not situated in a residential neighborhood and the few apartments closest to it, on the opposite side of Tillary have no argument about quality of life. They live along the Brooklyn Bridge on and off ramps, which hardly passes for peaceful and unique.

    Overall, I think this is James paying back any constituency in this specific area that might have supported her in her fight against Atlantic Yards. It is just an incomprehensible argument.

    This is the exactly right location for a building of this height.

  14. #59
    Forum Veteran MidtownGuy's Avatar
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    I totally agree.
    That woman has a knee-jerk problem with tall, productive, appropriate-for-downtown buildings and that makes me have a problem with her. Yes, there are idiots and she is one of them.
    I just wish Piano could have squeeeeezed out a little bit of creativity in the massing or something of this design. I love the idea of using color, but it has to be done right. The yellow up the side with that window pattern, ugghh...it could turn out nice but more likely will be debatably unpleasant. Why not go for gorgeous? This is an expensive 'brand name' architect, surly he could do better. Again with the spikey mast on top...don't get me started. One-trick-pony, anyone?

    When the whole design hinges on that yellow bifurcated expression up the side instead of giving us a more compelling massing, I'm not enthusiastic.
    Brooklyn is blowin' up and it deserves better. Renzo Piano is one of my least favorite architects.

    All that yellow and he still made me yawn.

  15. #60

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    An architect has a mast on two of his buildings and he is a one trick pony now? Then what is ghery using exactly the same building over and over?

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