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Thread: 1715 Broadway - Marriott Hotel - 67 Stories - Arch.: Nobutaka Ashihara Associates

  1. #1
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    Default 1715 Broadway - Marriott Hotel - 67 Stories - Arch.: Nobutaka Ashihara Associates

    DOB lists this new hotel project as 1715 Broadway, and as Derek2k3 posted, DOB shows SIX (6) new Applications were filed this week regarding a NEW Building and accompanying work.

    NEW BUILDING Application: Filed 6.09.09

    Developer: Harry Gross

    Marriott International


    Occupancy Classification: R-1 - RESIDENTIAL: HOTELS, DORMITORIES
    Height: 716'
    Stories: 67
    Dwelling Units: 1 [ ]
    Zoning Area SF: 301,682

    The project covers three zoning lots and has a FAR of 10.

    DOF shows a deal for Development Rights using the Theater Transfer:

    Al Hirschfeld Theater: 7,438 sf
    St. James Theater: 77,840 sf

    DOF also shows an Easement agreement with the apartment building property that sits at 1721-1727 Broadway / 220-238 W 55th (on the SW corner of Broadway / West 55th Street) for "light, air, view and access" over the exiting building.

    The Schedule A at DOB for the NB shows:

    Floors 1 > 5 will contain Lobby, Eating / Drinking Establishment(s), Offices.

    Floors 7 > 31 shows 14 hotel rooms per floor.

    Floors 35 > 65 shows 9 hotel rooms per floor.

    Ashihara Associates claims responsibility for the pile of a hotel on Sixth Avenue / W 38th Street

  2. #2


    Any word on when construction will start?

  3. #3

    Default Word on the street...

    As to when the Marriott construction will start, word on the street now is as soon as they get their building permit, apparently the last one Harry Gross needs.

  4. #4


    Are these pieces of junk still standing?

    I wonder what crap is planned for this site.

    The cheap, greedy schmucks who build things in NY should look to Europe to see how real architecture is designed -- not that guys like Ross, Zuckerman, Silverstein, Macklowe, Chang, et al care about anything but their profits.

    Last edited by londonlawyer; November 15th, 2009 at 04:34 AM.

  5. #5

    Post 1715 Broadway

    Quote Originally Posted by londonlawyer View Post
    ............. look to Europe to see how real architecture is designed -- not that guys like Ross, Zuckerman, Silverstein, Macklowe, Chang, et al care about anything but their profits.
    A good reminder that the final appearance of a building is more in the hands of the developer, than it is in the hands the architect.

    This is one of the many reasons why I believe the artist & the fine arts are fair game for 'serious critique', whereas the architect & architecture are not: or at least, not to the same extent.

    And yes LL, unfortunately these pieces of Junk are still standing.
    Last edited by infoshare; November 15th, 2009 at 10:58 AM.

  6. #6


    I agree with your assessment, Infoshare.

    People criticize SOM, but they have a lot of amazing towers on their website.

    PS: Thanks for the update about the crap buildings.

  7. #7


    Oh, dear. Mr Ashihara appears to be a pea of the Kaufman pod.

    His other hotel projects can be glimpsed here.

  8. #8
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    Default @ londonlawyer

    Do you even know anything about SOM?

    Do you know that SOM-NY (David Childs) and their other offices such as SOM-Chicago (Adrian Smith) are like night and day in terms of design talent?

    Adrian Smith (Chicago) did the Burj Dubai and Jin Mao Tower.

    Burj Dubai

    Jin Mao

    David Childs gave us Times Square Tower and 300 Madison.

    7 Times Square

    300 Madison

    Enough said.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stroika View Post
    Oh, dear. Mr Ashihara appears to be a pea of the Kaufman pod.
    Yeah, that is unfortunate but I remain hopeful (although in this city, I don't really have any reason to be).

    Like they say, even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then. At 67 stories and right on Broadway, let's hope this will be that nut.

  10. #10


    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
    Do you even know anything about SOM?

    Do you know that SOM-NY (David Childs) and their other offices such as SOM-Chicago (Adrian Smith) are like night and day in terms of design talent?

    Adrian Smith (Chicago) did the Burj Dubai and Jin Mao Tower.

    David Childs gave us Times Square Tower and 300 Madison.

    Enough said.
    David Child's designed the Times Square Tower. He did not design 300 Madison Avenue, Roger Duffy did.

    David Child's also designed the Bear Stearns Building, Time Warner Center, 7 World Trade Center, 450 Lexington Avenue, the Bertelsmann Building, the Freedom Tower, and One World Wide Plaza, all of which I like.

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    You're going to have to provide evidence that Roger Duffy did 300 Madison.

    Either way, he is from SOM-NY and works for/with David Childs. My point is still valid. Which is that SOM-NY is inferior to their other offices, mainly Chicago.

    Out of all the buildings you listed above, the only one I can praise is One World Wide Plaza but that is one out of many boring boxes that his NY office has done (Bear Stearns and 450 Lex is somewhere in between).

    Inexcusable and certainly not understandable.

  12. #12


    Commercial Real Estate; Bank to Consolidate Staff In New Tower on 42nd St.
    Published: Wednesday, July 4, 2001

    CIBC, formerly the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce, has had a presence in New York since 1869, two years after it was founded in Toronto. But that presence has become diffused. CIBC World Markets, the investment and merchant banking operation of CIBC, is scattered throughout Manhattan, with employees at 200 Liberty Street in the financial district; at 425 Lexington Avenue, across from Grand Central Terminal; and in other locations.

    That separation is scheduled to end in two years, when CIBC World Markets is to move into the 35-story tower now rising at 300 Madison Avenue, at the southwest corner of 42nd Street. The company has leased the entire 1.2-million-square-foot building for 30 years, with options.

    ''It will be our U.S. headquarters,'' said Sal Iannuzzi, the CIBC World Markets chief administrative officer for the United States, ''and we expect we'll have close to 3,000 employees in the new building.''

    The ground floor will have what Richard Clark, the president of Brookfield Financial Properties, the building's owner, called ''a modest amount'' of retail space, less than 10,000 square feet. Asked why there would not be more retail space, as many other new Manhattan buildings have, Mr. Clark said, ''Because we're in the commercial office property business and we're building a home for a very large financial institution.''

    Mr. Clark added that Brookfield had been working with CIBC for about two and a half years to find a suitable site for its United States headquarters. CIBC World Markets has offices in 17 other cities in the United States.

    Brookfield bought the site in June 2000, 80 percent of it from Credit Suisse First Boston, which had acquired the bulk of the site, dominated by a 22-story office building, from Harry Macklowe. Mr. Macklowe had assembled it for an office tower, to be financed by Credit Suisse First Boston, but eventually lost control of the site to his lender.

    Brookfield also bought three brownstones along 42nd Street between Madison and Fifth Avenues, but its plans were complicated for a time by the refusal of the owners of two other brownstones to sell them. McDonald's Corporation owned the building at 22 East 42nd Street, and an offshore entity owned the one at 20 East 42nd Street.

    Brookfield persuaded McDonald's to swap its building for one Brookfield owned at 18 East 42nd Street, refurbishing it to McDonald's specifications, but keeping the air rights. It also was able to buy the air rights to 20 East 42nd Street from the owner who would not sell. The rights from those two buildings were transferred to the new building, allowing it to be larger than zoning regulations would otherwise have allowed, said Larry Graham, the senior vice president of operations and development for Brookfield.

    Clearing the property required demolishing nine buildings, including the 22-story building at 300-310 Madison Avenue, a 12-story building and a 10-story building, said Richard C. Bach, the operations manager of Turner Construction Company.

    ''It's a fairly straightforward construction job,'' Mr. Bach said. He noted that the contractor needed approval from the Metropolitan Transportation Authority because of the building's proximity to Grand Central.

    The CIBC building, designed by Skidmore, Owings & Merrill, will have adjoining sets of entrance doors, one on 42nd Street and the other on Madison Avenue. The base will go up 150 feet, and will include the retail floor at ground level, the lobby above that -- reachable by escalator, stairs or elevator -- and two trading floors above the lobby. The 28 floors of offices will encompass the 8th through 35th floors. An atrium will rise 150 feet at the corner of 42nd Street and Madison Avenue.

    Roger Duffy, the partner in charge of designing the building, said the major architectural challenge was ''to come up with something architecturally striking but also dignified, appropriate to our client.''

    The idea of ascending 18 feet to the lobby is fairly common in the Grand Central area, Mr. Duffy said, because railroad tracks or underground portions of the terminal often preclude elevator pits, the space beneath the lowest stop of an elevator.

    Mr. Iannuzzi of CIBC World Markets did not rule out the possibility that the company would sublet some floors, but no more than a half-dozen. ''We've been trying to bring all our people together,'' he explained, ''so this way we can feel like a family.''

    Photo: An architect's rendering of the building at 300 Madison Avenue. (Philip M. Brown)

    Commercial Property; Lessons of 9/11 Shape an Office Tower
    Published: Sunday, February 1, 2004

    AT the shiny glass and stainless steel office building soon to open at the southwest corner of 42nd Street and Madison Avenue, both the design and the tenancy reflect the realities of life in the post-Sept. 11 era.

    The 35-story, 1.2-million-square-foot building has been ''hardened'' to protect its occupants from attacks by car or truck bombs, which are considered more likely urban hazards than the jumbo airplanes that felled the twin towers of the World Trade Center. Although changes to the Building Code that grew out of the World Trade Center tragedy are wending their way through city government, the adjustments made by a private developer here could set a de facto standard for future office buildings in Manhattan.

    ''Users have concerns and the lenders will demand this level of safety and comfort in the future,'' said Mary Ann Tighe, chief executive for the tristate region of CB Richard Ellis, the brokerage and services company, which was recently involved in bringing a client to the building.

    ''In the past when people asked about safety,'' she added, ''they were asking about the neighborhood. Today they are interested in things like progressive collapse.''

    Richard B. Clark, the president of Brookfield Financial Properties, which developed and will continue to own the property, said: ''I don't know if it is an industry standard yet, but it certainly is our standard. I cannot imagine building to a lesser standard.''

    Progressive collapse is what engineers call what happened to the buildings at the Trade Center. Although the final judgment on the towers' fall has not yet been reached, it is generally thought that the intense fires at the crash sites weakened the lightweight trusses that supported the floors, causing them to pull away from their vertical supports and fall.

    Both the developer of the new building and one of its principal tenants experienced the events of Sept. 11, 2001, firsthand. Brookfield is a Canadian company that owns the World Financial Center and One Liberty Plaza, both just across the street from the Trade Center.

    Brookfield has its offices at One Liberty, and one of the new Midtown building's lead tenants, CIBC World Markets, was at One World Financial Center. Both buildings were damaged by the collapse of the twin towers and were closed for a time while being repaired.

    ''I was in the lobby of One Liberty when the first tower came down,'' said Lawrence F. Graham, Brookfield's executive vice president for development. ''For a while there, we didn't have any offices downtown.''

    Even before Sept. 11, the building at 300 Madison, had been designed to be more robust than the standard office building, with trusses added to the building's midsection and top that would spread loads if one or more vertical columns were knocked out by a blast or crash. And special attention had been paid to the connectors that attach the floors to vertical columns. These unseen links are often simplified to hold down costs, Brookfield executives said.

    But the attack on the trade center happened at a point when there was still time to make the 300 Madison project even more sturdy. Although the design was complete and some materials had been ordered, the building's site at the time was simply a hole in the ground. Workmen were digging for the foundations -- and doing so by mechanical means rather than blasting because the shuttle and No. 7 subway lines were only eight feet away.

    Because work on the building itself had not started, it was possible to modify the design without driving costs out of sight. ''If you do that sort of thing early, it can be handled,'' said Alfred SanFilippo, Brookfield's senior vice president for development. ''But if you have to retrofit, it gets very expensive.''

    Shortly after the attack, Brookfield officials met with representatives of CIBC -- the investment banking subsidiary of the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce -- and architects from Skidmore, Owings & Merrill to decide on changes needed to harden the building against attack. ''We did it in four to six weeks,'' Mr. Graham said. ''We made decisions on the spot.''

    MEANWHILE, work continued at the site, despite the diversion of men and equipment to deal with the disaster at the southern tip of Manhattan. ''We never stopped the job,'' said James C. McKenna, a senior vice president for Turner Construction, which managed the project.

    The upshot of the redesign was that the structural steel columns on the outer shell facing streets were reinforced from the street level up to the second story to enable the building to better resist a truck or car bomb. Steel plates were welded over the open flanges of the ''H'' shaped columns, producing stronger box columns.

    Adding the plates allowed the basic structure of the building to stay within design limits, including the decorative metal cladding used where the columns are exposed in the second-story lobby. ''We could have done it with concrete, but that would have messed up the design,'' Mr. Graham said.

    Zoning requirements in the area added some special problems, said Roger F. Duffy Jr., the Skidmore partner responsible for the building. ''Zoning requires continuous retail on 42nd Street and Madison Avenue, except for one 30-foot opening on each street,'' he said.

    Since the stores would be vulnerable to an attack by somebody walking in their front doors, the concrete block walls separating them from the main building were reinforced by adding steel reinforcement bars and filling the empty spaces with concrete.

    The areas around the loading dock and messenger center on 41st Street were similarly reinforced, and movable bollards were added in front of the loading dock to keep out unwanted trucks.

    On the wider lower section of the building, known as the podium, all of the windows were fitted with blast-resistant glass. Some of it is tempered, because it resists breakage and if broken crumbles to small pieces rather than producing flying shards, as happens with standard glass. But much of it is double-pane glass, with the outer layer tempered for strength and the inner laminated, like the windshield of an automobile, to prevent flying shards in case of an attack.

    ''The outer layer is sacrificial, and the inner layer is supposed to remain,'' said Mr. Clark of Brookfield. ''That's how it worked at the Winter Garden,'' the large glass-enclosed hall at the Financial Center.

    ''We had already ordered the facade for the building,'' said Mr. Graham, referring to 300 Madison. ''So we had to find glass that would fit into existing frames.''

    Because of the devastating fires in the twin towers and at 7 World Trade Center, which also fell, more attention was paid to fire tolerance and suppression. The amount of fireproofing insulation throughout the building was increased to three hours of resistance from two.

    Pipes to feed water to sprinklers were installed in both stairwells, instead of just one, as is customary, to ensure that damage to one part of the building would not stop firefighting elsewhere. And because of the role that fuel tanks are thought to have played in the fire at 7 World Trade Center, the fuel for backup generators has its own foam fire protection system, separate from the sprinklers.

    Brookfield officials said the physical changes added only $3 million in costs to the $600 million project. They say that as the building's long-term owner, as well as its developer, they had an interest in providing for the safety and comfort of tenants.

    ''We had a sequence of goals,'' Mr. Graham said. ''The first was to prevent collapse, then protect people from flying glass. After that we wanted to keep building systems operating.'' There are multiple sites where telecommunications cables enter the building, and a provision has been made for a second electrical entrance, if needed.

    Some of the electrical generators are dedicated to keeping the lights and other building services in operation, while others are assigned to keeping the bank's financial transactions going in a power failure.

    Sept. 11 even changed the way the building is going to be used. Brookfield, which is based in Toronto, took over the New York real estate portfolio of the financially ailing Olympia & York in the early 1990's. One of its clients was CIBC, which wanted to consolidate its scattered New York operations. The bank is also an investor in Brookfield.

    The bank agreed in the summer of 2001 to lease the entire building, which was to be built for it by Brookfield in its first major construction project in the United States. Then came the attack, which devastated some companies that had concentrated their operations in the twin towers.

    After that, the bank decided, for what Mr. Clark delicately terms ''business continuity reasons'' that it did not want all its operations in one place. With the assistance of Brookfield, the bank set out to seek a subtenant for two-thirds of the building.

    Lease in hand, Brookfield went ahead with construction of the building on a desirable, but difficult to build on, location a block west of Grand Central Terminal.

    The site was a complex assemblage of land involving the acquisition of the four buildings that made up the old Union Carbide headquarters as well as town houses and air rights over town houses to the west -- and even some air rights from Grand Central. It was begun by the developer Harry Macklowe, who lost control of the project to his mortgage holder, CS First Boston, in 1999.

    To complete the deal, Brookfield had to agree to move a high-grossing McDonald's restaurant two doors to the west on 42nd Street and build it while demolishing the asbestos-laden buildings on the eastern end of the block. The land and air rights cost $150 million, according to Brookfield, and required the signing of 190 documents.

    One complicating factor in the design is that the land slopes about 15 feet from 41st Street to 42nd, a reminder that Manhattan once had hills and valleys. Since the building had to be level, excavation went below the old foundations on the site, where there are two and a half levels below grade.

    The underground levels will include an auditorium, a cafeteria and executive parking for 42 cars, Mr. Graham said.

    The same subway lines that required such care in digging could also be a problem because the rumbling trains might send unwanted vibrations into the building. As a result, some spaces in the lower part of the building have been structurally isolated to minimize disruptions.

    In January, CIBC found its tenant and agreed to sublet 800,000 square feet in the building's tower to PricewaterhouseCoopers, the accounting and consulting firm.

    A spokesman for PricewaterhouseCoopers said additional physical security was not on the minds of its executives when they started searching for a place to consolidate their New York operations, but the building's features ''weighed positive'' in the decision to sign the sublease at 300 Madison.

    The bank itself will occupy the podium section on the lower floors, where financial trading operations will be housed. On two trading floors, capable of holding 500 people each, the design included lowering the basic floor slab so wiring and a raised floor could be installed. And with such a concentration of people -- four times the normal density of an office building -- the trading floors had be equipped with more services than usual, and triplewide staircases were installed to permit a quick evacuation, if necessary.

    The building is designed so that all of its emergency evacuation routes exit directly to the street instead of forcing people to go through possibly crowded lobbies.

    WITH the building's basic shell complete, Brookfield officials say they expect it to be occupied in six to nine months, once interior construction has been completed to tenants' specifications. The only spaces left to be rented are stores along 42nd Street and Madison Avenue.

    Because zoning rules permitted only one 30-foot entrance on each street side of the building, designers decided to combine them at the corner of 42nd Street and Madison Avenue and use escalators to take visitors up to a big lobby on the second floor atop the retail space. The space above the escalators is an atrium for the eight stories of the podium to admit natural light and provide views of Grand Central and the Chrysler Building to the east.

    (All this space is part of the 1.2 million square feet that Brookfield considers part of the building's rentable area. Zoning rules, however, do not count common areas, including mechanical floors, elevator shafts and underground floors, in space calculations, even though they are proportionately added to each tenant's rent. Thus, for zoning purposes, the building's space is put at 850,750 square feet.)

    The new building, which will probably be named for PricewaterhouseCoopers, is the first new construction for Brookfield and its predecessor, Olympia & York, since the last of the World Financial Center buildings was completed in the late 1980's. Mr. Clark said the company is happy to be back in the development business and is prepared to build on a site it controls at 31st Street and Ninth Avenue, just west of the Farley Post Office, if a suitable project develops.

    Photos: Richard B. Clark, Lawrence F. Graham and Alfred SanFilippo at 300 Madison Avenue, where lobby is on the second floor over retail space. (Photographs by Nicole Bengiveno/The New York Times)(pg. 4); (Photograph by Nicole Bengiveno/The New York Times)(pg. 1) Chart/Diagrams: ''Hardening a Building'' To give additional protection from explosion or fire, especially on lower floors, building framework was reinforced. BUILDING FRAME The belt truss and hat truss are designed to prevent progressive collapse of the building, in addition to carrying normal lateral loads like the effects of wind. If a vertical column or columns are lost, the trusses help transfer the loads to the remaining columns, so floors do not plunge downward. Diagram shows HAT TRUSS, BELT TRUSS, and BRACED CORE. BRACING Joints where floor beams and columns meet the crossbracing were made stronger by connecting beam flanges to the column and adding web stiffeners. Diagram shows FLOOR BEAM, FLANGES, WEB STIFFENERS, COLUMN, and BRACE. LOAD-BEARING COLUMNS Typical joint plates were made longer and web plates were added. Diagram shows LONGER PLATE and WEB PLATE. EXTERIOR COLUMNS To provide additional blast resistance, steel plates were welded onto ground-level exterior columns and some interior columns. Diagram shows WELDED STEEL PLATE. INTERIOR WALLS Hollow blocks on lower floors were filled with reinforced concrete, and continous steel angles were used to anchor walls to the structure above. Diagram shows CONCRETE FILL, STEEL BAR, and STEEL ANGLE. Mika Grndahl/The New York Times (Sources by Brookfield Financial Properties; Gilsanz Murray Steficek Structural Engineers)(pg. 1) Chart/Diagrams: ''Building Rights and Building Size'' How ownership of property, or of the unused building rights from other structures, shaped the size of 300 Madison Avenue. Space is expressed as ''zoning square footage'' -- exclusive of space for elevators, equipment and underground floors. SMALLEST PROPOSAL Minimal assemblage would have included site of old Union Carbide building, one small structure on 42nd Street and ''air rights'' -- square footage allowed under zoning but not built -- from another. This would have yielded a tower of 658,631 square feet. TOWER AS CONSTRUCTED The tower as built added the sites of two more small buildings on 42nd Street, as well as air rights from three other properties, and some from Grand Central Terminal. Total square footage is 850,750. A LARGER POSSIBILITY If two of the 42nd Street buildings that sold their air rights had been purchased and demolished, the new building could have grown to 869,892 square feet. Diagrams of buildings highlighting property owned, building footprint, and air rights purchased. (Sources by Skidmore, Owings & Merrill; Brookfield Financial Properties)(pg. 4)

    There are a number of senior partners at SOM, David Child's had nothing to do with this design, making him culpable for something he had no part in is not fair.

  13. #13
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    Yes there are different partners at SOM-NY but they're all cut from the same cloth. That is, they all seem to share the same design philosophy: conservative, boring, staid, glass boxes and that was my point.

    I brought David Childs name up because he is the most well known and in most people's minds, representative of SOM-NY.

    The point is that we don't really want him or his "partners" over there doing 255 57 St. (the thread and discussion where this originated from.)

    If Adrian Smith was picked, I'd be very happy. You can't honestly say the same, if David Childs was picked, would you?

  14. #14


    As I said I like most of David Child's buildings. If they're going to go the corporate route I'd prefer him over Cook+Fox, Fox Fowle, and KPF.

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    LOL, did you meet him in person somewhere before and now you've become a fan and feel the need to defend him (kind of like ablarc with Gehry)?

    Each of those firms have done their share of good and bad projects but David Childs has become too predictable. They're never really awful (although 7 Times Square can be considered to be considering its prime location) and never really good, just very overall bland.

    We've got too many of that already in this city. We need more stand outs: Beekman, New York Times, etc.
    Last edited by antinimby; November 16th, 2009 at 09:47 PM.

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