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Thread: The 2012 Presidential Race

  1. #946


    It may well be the case that he has been making policy blunders for over a decade, but it wasn't that long ago that people across the political spectrum looked up to him. Notwithstanding his conservative leanings, his service during Vietnam combined with his willingness to work across the aisle with the likes of Russ Fiengold, and others on campaign finance and enviornmental issues, gave him some credibliy with moderate to right Dems and Independents.

    That all changed when he lost the election. He is completely over the top at this point. It is hard to believe he is the same man. He is working on his legacy now, and not in a good way.

  2. #947


    I don't know who's left on the GOP side of the Senate.

    Richard Luger is the ranking member on the the Foreign Relations Committee. The Tea Bags thought he was too moderate, and he lost the primary to that idiot Richard Mourdock, and will be out of office in January. Mourdock lost the election, so the GOP gave away a Senate seat in a state that Romney carried.

  3. #948


    It is very telling. I remember the time when Lugar was considered part of the conservative wing of the party. Now he is too 'liberal' to run for the Senate on the GOP line probably because he recognizes the need to compromise in in order to govern. Who is next, Orin Hatch?

    I m not sure I know which GOP national office holders of the past hold enough right-wing creds to satisfy the Teaparty. Certainly not Reagan, Ford, Nixon or Eisenhower. I am not even sure Goldwater would make the cut

  4. #949
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    NYC - Downtown


    Quote Originally Posted by IrishInNYC View Post

    Security, or lack thereof is not what I'm discussing.
    Of course not. If you were discussing security (which is a key part of this tragedy) you'd have to acknowledge that the Republicans demanded major cuts in funding for security in embassies & consulates across the globe:

    Libya attack: Congressmen casting blame voted to cut diplomatic security budget

    But since the article is from the Christian Science Monitor perhaps it's not to be trusted ...

    " ... After I wrote a piece earlier this week about the political gain being sought from the deaths of Stevens and three other Americans in Benghazi, a number of diplomatic acquaintances of mine emailed to say I should have looked at the State Department's security budget. Two of them had unprintable things to say about Congress.

    Who can be blamed for that? Well, Chaffetz and Issa among others.

    Since retaking control in 2010, House Republicans have aggressively cut spending at the State Department in general and embassy security in particular. Chaffetz and Issa and their colleagues voted to pay for far less security than the State Department requested in 2011 and again this year ... "

  5. #950


    While everyone else was eating turkey, McCain was eating crow, as his Benghazi conspiracy theory fell apart.

    McCain on Nov 14th:
    Her [Susan Rice] talking points came from the White House, not from the DNI.
    I think it’s patently obvious that the talking points that Ambassador Rice had didn’t come from the CIA. It came from the White House
    On Nov 19th from the DNI:
    The intelligence community made substantive, analytical changes before the talking points were sent to government agency partners for their feedback. There were no substantive changes made to the talking points after they left the intelligence community
    First, the information about individuals linked to al Qaeda was derived from classified sources. Second, when links were so tenuous – as they still are – it makes sense to be cautious before pointing fingers so you don’t set off a chain of circular and self-reinforcing assumptions. Third, it is important to be careful not to prejudice a criminal investigation in its early stages.
    McCain on Nov 20th:
    I participated in hours of hearings in the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence last week regarding the events in Benghazi, where senior intelligence officials were asked this very question, and all of them – including the Director of National Intelligence himself – told us that they did not know who made the changes. Now we have to read the answers to our questions in the media. There are many other questions that remain unanswered. But this latest episode is another reason why many of us are so frustrated with, and suspicious of, the actions of this Administration when it comes to the Benghazi attack.
    So now McCain's complaint is that he wasn't given the information sooner. Back on Nov 14th, he missed a closed-door meeting on Benghazi of the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee; instead he stood before cameras, called for a special committee, and yelled at a reporter who asked him why he missed the meeting.

    The third member of the Three Amigos (McCain, Graham, Lieberman) - Joe Lieberman - was at that meeting, and came out of it with a statement that another independent committee wasn't necessary.

  6. #951
    Forum Veteran Daquan13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    East Boston, MA.


    McCain missed the boat long time ago. He's way out of touch with reality!

    His thoughts and views on int'l affairs are as old as the Dinosaur Age.

  7. #952


    Top Romney Adviser Brags About Losing Poor, Minority Voters To Obama

    This guy forgot one other reason they lost. He, Romney, and the rest of their crew are clueless, and continue to be.

  8. #953
    NYC Aficionado from Oz Merry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002


    See article for short video.

    GOP's All-White, All-Male House Leadership Bothers Newt Gingrich Too

    By Margaret Hartmann and Caroline Shin

    According to Newt Gingrich there is something wrong with this picture. Recently Gingrich has been making the talk show rounds to promote his book and share his election-related epiphanies. Last night on the Tonight Show, he told Jay Leno that he's troubled by the lack of diversity in his party, as exemplified by the news that the 19 new House committee chairs are all white men. He plans to spend the next few months doing a "very deep dive" into the lessons the GOP need to learn from the election, since next time they can't offer "the same glib answer from the same guys who were wrong" — though that slogan is kind of catchy.

  9. #954


    the lessons the GOP need to learn from the election,
    This election?

    It was evident after 2008. There were projections made that Texas could be a purple state by 2020. That's Texas! Now that prospect is only two election cycles away.

    I think the significance of the 2010 midterm elections have been overlooked. It's really what the 2012 election was all about - not so much a choice about continuing 2008, but more about continuing 2010. That's what was rejected. The Tea Bags helped the GOP gain control of the House, but overall, they hurt the party.

    There was a time when a politician from either party would have told Grover Norquist, "Who the hell are you?"

  10. #955


    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp View Post
    This election?

    The Tea Bags helped the GOP gain control of the House, but overall, they hurt the party.
    To further illustrate, they likely would have lost House seats in 2012 if not for Gerrymandering. More people voted for Dem House candidates than GOP candidates.

    THe only thing that could potentially save the GOP are the relatively lower voter turnout rates that seem to prevail during midterm cycles. If the Dem coalition turn out during midterm elections to the same extent they do during presidential elections, the GOP will be underwater.

  11. #956


    It is pretty much the consensus opinion that the 112th Congress is the worst in the history of the republic. We live in historic times.

    Two revealing charts.

    Doing their job. You know, legislating.

    Their popularity among the citizenry.

    14 reasons why this is the worst Congress ever

    But the nonsense that went on in the Senate yesterday takes the cake. 38 Senate Republicans voted against the U.N. Convention on the Rights of Persons With Disabilities, and while a 61 majority voted yes, it was 6 short of the necessary 2/3 for ratification.

    The rationale was paranoia - the UN was trying to take over the US, the World Order, and other such crap. In reality, the treaty would have been completely transparent to the US; it was directly modeled after the 22 year old US ADA law, something you would think that Congress would regard as flattering. So instead, we have the embarrassment of 126 countries accepting rules that are commonplace here, while we reject them on tin-foil-hat principles.

  12. #957


    Harry Truman referred to the 80th Congress as the "Do Nothing Congress". They are All-Stars next to this crew.

    And there is no hope in sight. GOP's in the Senate threaten to filibuster any bill that does not carry a super-majority. And Boehner has threatened to kill any legislation that undercuts the filibuster.

    The House Republicans are an insane bunch of ideologs who think compromise is a dirty word. We are all doomed.

  13. #958

  14. #959


    The Magical Mitt-ery Tour: The Return Of The Romneys

    by John Avlon Mar 3, 2013

    The Romney Revival Tour is underway.

    After a winter’s shame-cation at their beachfront La Jolla estate – replete with reports of crying jags and aimless days – Mitt and Ann are reaching back out to the American public with a Chris Wallace interview on Fox News Sunday, followed by a pilgrimage to the conservative enclave CPAC mid-month.

    The question is whether anybody cares.

    The transition for would-be first families after the election can be brutal. Expectations and adoration evaporate overnight.

    This is especially true for the Romneys, who by all accounts genuinely believed they were going to win the White House until the final results came in. In a sign of just how insular the hyper-partisan echo chamber has become, they trusted their own pollster more than all the other, independent polls—setting themselves up for a rude awakening.

    In What It Takes, the late great Richard Ben Cramer captured the surreal post-election life of Michael and Kitty Dukakis in 1988 – “… it was what they didn’t see. The barricades were gone. And the agents. And the cop cars, the van, the people… The phone wasn’t ringing, there was no schedule, no cars waiting, no Secret Service… no Chief of Staff, no Press Secretary, no Advance, no airport, no planes, no pilots… no itinerary… [Kitty Dukakis] wasn’t going anywhere today, this week, or next, or next. She’d get up and there was nowhere she had to go.”

    Still the governor of Massachusetts, Dukakis could rebound from the loss by returning to work at the State House the next day. But the radius of damage couldn’t be contained by brave faces or workday responsibilities. In Cramer’s account, “Kitty Dukakis saw him off, then went to the liquor cabinet in the dining room, measured out four ounces of booze, drank it down, and went back to bed, to pass out.”

    The Romneys will presumably not have that particular problem, as proud teetotalers, consistent with their Mormon faith. The Romney’s problem is rebounding from the deep presumption that victory was destined to be theirs.

    That was always the word Mitt used on the campaign trail, “I presume I’m going to be president”. To that extent at least, theirs was a faith-based campaign. Fond of reciting the Friday Night Lights mantra, “Clear Eyes, Full Hearts, Can’t Lose” in the closing weeks of the campaign, they found reality less accommodating.

    In advance excerpts from the Fox News Sunday interview, Ann’s comments are revealing: “In our church, we're used to serving and you know, you can be in a very high position, but you recognize you're serving. And now all of a sudden, you're released and you're nobody ... And we're used to that. It's like we came and stepped forward to serve. And ... the other part of it was an amazing thing, and it was really quite a lot of energy and a lot of passion and ... a lot of people around us and all of a sudden, it was nothing.”

    In a close reading of those comments, two words jump out – “Nobody” and “Nothing.” Without putting Ann Romney on the couch, there is an existential quality to that word choice that’s hard to miss. Either defeat has been a spiritually positive exercise in self-transcendence or there have been some tough days and nights by the ocean in La Jolla.

    Beyond the expected barbs at the “liberal media” and sad ruminations on President Obama’s lost opportunity to prevent the sequester (ignoring, of course, the Republicans role in blocking a balanced deficit and debt reduction plan), the real Romney red meat will offered up at CPAC in a 1 o’clock slot on Friday, March 15th.

    There will be few dire-hard Mitt Romney fans
    when the history books are written.

    Romney’s relationship with the conservative movement has always been fraught. In 2008, he campaigned as a conservative alternative to John McCain, becoming the favorite of the right-wing talk radio crowd before dropping out of the race at CPAC. Four years later, the Republican primaries were consumed by a search for a credible conservative alternative to Mitt Romney. Post “Obamneycare” there was such desperation among the base that Michele Bachman, Herman Cain, Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum all got a serious look before the party reverted to form and nominated the conventional-wisdom frontrunner, without much enthusiasm. It can’t be lost to Romney that his late campaign surge came only when he pivoted expertly back to the center in his strong first debate. But in a crowd where Sarah Palin is still more beloved than Mitt Romney, this won’t be the place to reframe his once-proud northeast Republicanism for a new generation.

    Behind the Romney Revival Tour is a question of purpose going forward – what’s in the windshield rather than the rearview mirror. In recent political history, there are only two examples of nominees or wives who went on to receive political redemption. The first was Elizabeth Dole, who rebounded from her husband’s 1996 defeat to win election to the U.S. Senate from her home state of North Carolina. The second is our current Secretary of State, John Kerry, who reached almost as great a height as the White House by working hard back in the Senate on the issue he always cared most about: foreign affairs.

    Additional electoral effort seems to be uninteresting to the Romneys, despite Ann’s felicity on the stump – son Tagg Romney likewise just declined a chance to run for the open senate seat back home in Massachusetts this June. Appointed office is not impossible to imagine – Mitt Romney would make a great Treasury Secretary in some future Republican administration – but it could feel like a slight compared to his over-riding ambition to live next door on Pennsylvania Avenue. Mitt Romney remains very wealthy (though apparently not as wealthy as Al Gore post-Current) and that fact alone means that he’ll retain a role as an party influencer, but the only dynasty that Republicans seem to have an appetite for is named Bush.

    Expect plenty of semi-polite anti-Obama-isms alongside resentful reimaginings of what he’d be doing differently as president in the Romney revival tour. It’s a necessary catharsis, part of the process of bridging their past with their future. There will be few dire-hard Mitt Romney fans when the history books are written, though his candidacy is likely to seem more moderate in the rear-view mirror, especially when seen alongside the other speakers at CPAC.

    The “roller coaster” of the campaign, as Mitt Romney calls it, is definitively over. There isn’t a comparable Act 2. But there is one redeeming quality that even cynics and hardened opponents can’t take away from the Romneys – “fortunately, we like each other” as Ann Romney says in the interview, as her husband looks adoringly on. That’s more than some political couples can say when the crowds depart and the cheering stops.

    © 2013 The Newsweek/Daily Beast Company LLC

  15. #960


    Any bartenders I cross paths with this week get an extra special tip.

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