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Thread: Proposed Jets Stadium on West Side

  1. #121

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    Quote Originally Posted by TLOZ Link5
    It looks like Union Square in Hong Kong.
    Thats exactly what I thought but I like the stadium more now.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by kliq6
    Ive heard the city plans, 30 million sf and over 4,000 new aprtments
    I think 28 mill of office and 12mill of residential, so it should be more than 4K.

  3. #123

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    November 29, 2003

    Jets Stadium in Manhattan Moves Closer, but Issues Remain

    By CHARLES V. BAGLI

    State and city officials say they are inching toward a tentative agreement with the owners of the New York Jets to split the $1.5 billion cost of building a new football stadium over Manhattan's West Side rail yards.

    An announcement could come as soon as January, the officials said. Under the terms of what officials said would be a nonbinding agreement, the Jets would pay up to $800 million for a modern riverfront stadium, which would also serve as an Olympic stadium if the city wins its bid for the 2012 Summer Olympics. The city and the state, in turn, have generally agreed to pay $300 million to $400 million to build a retractable roof, the air-conditioning system and a platform structure over the rail yards on which the stadium would sit.

    But lurking beneath the expected announcement are a number of contentious unresolved issues that could delay or even scuttle the stadium project.

    There is no agreement on how to pay for the extension of the No. 7 subway line from Times Square to the stadium, which is considered a crucial element of the West Side redevelopment. Nor is there consensus on the size and scope of a related project, the $1.5 billion expansion of the nearby Jacob K. Javits Convention Center, say state and city officials involved in those projects. Proponents of the Javits expansion contend that it is more important than the stadium to the city's economic life.

    Finally, the city has yet to release its long-promised financial plan for the transformation of the West Side, including the stadium, an expanded convention center, new zoning for commercial and residential construction and parks and the subway extension, as the cost has climbed to $5 billion from an estimated $2.68 billion. The financial plan would presumably detail how the various projects could be turned into reality without tapping into the state's or city's current revenues, something the city has promised not to do.

    "There are a series of questions that have yet to be answered about the financing, phasing and urban design," said Robert D. Yaro, president of the Regional Plan Association, a nonprofit research and advocacy group for the metropolitan region. "This is the city's most ambitious and important economic development plan in the last quarter century."

    Nevertheless, Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg dropped broad hints during his weekly radio program just before Thanksgiving that he hoped the city would soon strike a deal with the Jets, just as Business Week reported that a deal was imminent. But in an interview Friday, Daniel L. Doctoroff, deputy mayor for economic development and the founder of the city's Olympic bid committee, refused to set a date for any announcement.

    "Progress is continuing to be made on virtually every front," Mr. Doctoroff said. "But this is an incredibly complicated jigsaw puzzle. We want to make sure that we have all the right pieces in all the right places."

    In an effort to cut costs, city and state officials are considering scaling back the expansion of the Javits Center and reducing the number of stations on the subway extension, at least in the first phase. Mr. Doctoroff has said that the city's stadium obligation and the subway extension will be financed under a still unreleased plan using tax revenues from new development in the area over the next 30 years.

    But the city has several reasons for wanting to move more rapidly on the stadium. The team owners, who have spent $10 million on lobbyists and designs for a stadium, have demanded that the state and the city issue "a letter of intent, or some kind of moral commitment" for the project before the team spends any more money, according to a team executive. The Jets' lease at Giants Stadium in New Jersey, their current home, expires at the end of 2008 and the team wants a home of its own for the 2009 season. That means construction has to begin soon.

    Officials say the Bloomberg administration also wants to convey a sense of momentum for its Olympic bid with an announcement about the stadium, which would be used for Olympic opening and closing ceremonies. The International Olympic Committee will not select a 2012 site until the summer of 2005, but competing cities have to show some progress on their plans before then.

    "It's important that decisions about the stadium get made fairly quickly," Mr. Yaro said.

    The Jets and city and state officials point to the team's $800 million commitment as the largest single contribution toward stadium construction by any professional sports team. But the cost of the proposed West Side stadium is also double or triple that of the new stadiums built in Seattle, Philadelphia and Chicago, which cost $400 million to $500 million, according to the National Football League.

    Many economists contend that stadiums are relatively poor public investments because they do little more than enrich the teams. But city and state officials say that the economic value of the Jets stadium is enhanced by its links to the Javits Center, whose site is between 34th and 39th Streets along 11th Avenue, just north of the rail yards. With a retractable roof, the Jets say the stadium could be used for 150 other events a year, including convention meetings and plenary sessions, concerts and other sporting events.

    But there still is a great deal of controversy surrounding the stadium, its connection to Javits and other issues related to the West Side plans.

    The city's stadium plan and rezoning proposal for commercial and residential development will face almost inevitable legal challenges by community groups and others who oppose the projects. Jerry Schoenfeld, chairman of the Shubert Organization, which owns half the Broadway theaters, has become increasingly outspoken about what he says are the potentially negative impacts of a stadium on the nearby theater district, Times Square and the surrounding neighborhood.

    "This is all fantasy," said John Fisher, a member of the Westside Coalition, an amalgam of 35 community groups, referring to the size and complexity of the city's plans.

    The Metropolitan Transportation Authority has said it favors extending the No. 7 line, which would bring office workers and football fans to the West Side and spark development of the relatively low-slung neighborhood. But the agency says it has no money in its capital budget for the project, whose cost ranges from $1.6 billion to $2.3 billion.

    Peter S. Kalikow, chairman of the M.T.A., has also made it clear that his agency wants to be compensated for allowing the Jets to build over its rail yards, on the blocks bounded by 11th and 12th Avenues, between 30th and 34th Streets. But in what could be a stumbling block, Mr. Kalikow wants to be able to sell far more development rights from the yards than the city now envisions in its proposed rezoning of the West Side.

    But the most public dispute reveals the fault line between stadium supporters and advocates for the expansion of the Javits Center over the pace and priority of their respective projects. It also illustrates the interlocking relationship between the stadium, the convention center and the subway line.

    On Nov. 19, the board of the Javits operating corporation passed a resolution stating that the city's and state's current plans for the Javits center were "unacceptable," because they would result in a long delay.

    For nearly a decade, the Javits Center's operating corporation and the hotel industry have sought to double the size of the convention center by expanding north to 42nd Street, which they said would generate an additional $600 million a year in convention, hotel and restaurant business. Robert E. Boyle, chairman of the Javits operating corporation, has expressed doubts about how much the stadium could really be used for conventions, and the agency's Web site does not even mention the plans to the stadium.

    "The mayor constantly refers to travel and tourism as being an industry that is ripe for growth," said Jonathan M. Tisch, chief executive of Loews Hotels and chairman of New York City and Company, the city's convention and visitors bureau. An expanded convention center, he said, "would be an enormous catalyst to achieve that goal."

    State officials tried to quell the uprising, telling reporters that the resolution adopted by the Javits board was unauthorized. They said that the planning and development of the Javits Center would be handled by the center's development corporation, which is headed by Charles A. Gargano, chairman of the Empire State Development Corporation.

    "We could have several alternatives," Mr. Gargano said. "We're working with the governor and the mayor on a plan that will work."

    One problem is that the M.T.A.'s Michael Quill bus depot lies in the path of the Javits expansion, on 11th Avenue between 40th and 41st Streets. The M.T.A., which bought and renovated the depot in the mid-1990's for about $120 million, does not want to give up the garage until a new one is built, probably under the stadium platform.

    But it now appears that construction of the new $400 million garage cannot start until 2009. That would delay the Javits expansion until the garage is completed in 2013, which infuriates the hotel industry.

    One possibility is that Javits would be expanded only to the Quill garage on 40th Street, until a second phase could start sometime in the future, a move that Javits supporters greet with dismay.

    "We need to get this built," Joseph E. Spinnato, president of the Hotel Association of New York City, said of the convention center. "This is a moneymaker for the city and the state. But to be held hostage to any other part of the West Side development is not something that we're particularly happy about."


    Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company

  4. #124
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    So frustrating in so many ways.

  5. #125
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    What's frustrating is Doctoroff's and the mayor's breathtaking lack of honesty and transparency on this whole project.

    I, for one, would love to see something spectacular happen on the Far West Side. But the city needs to (1) stop trying to strongarm the Javits Center into embracing a stadium that it doesn't need, and (2) come clean with the public about how much this whole thing will cost and how it will be financed. The idea that this could be funded with tax increment financing, without competing with other city or MTA investment needs, is just silly.

    I think DCP is doing a great job with its planning efforts for Lower Manhattan, Downtown Brooklyn, and other areas. But on the Far West Side, the city seems to be wearing honesty blinders loaned to it by the Bush Administration.

  6. #126
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    WHY does it have to be SO complicated??? :? Just built something...The area needs something to start the whole West Side Development. If the stadium is being offer half/half of $$$... well that sounds fair. Doesn't it?

  7. #127
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    'Many economists contend that stadiums are relatively poor public investments because they do little more than enrich the teams.' By CHARLES V. BAGLI, November 29, 2003

    :? - If they refer when stadiums are built in areas where it doesnt benefit the city at all such as in Philadelphia...where the Football and Beseball Stadiums are being built in an area where they are surrounded by parking garages and no restaurants or nothing else that benefits the community in the 'Cities' as opposed to the 'Suburbs', then I agree with the economists. But if they are built within an area where there are stores, restaurants, hotels, and public transportation and who knows other uses that can be used to revenue in taxes that will sure benefit the city then built the thing. That area in the West Side has nothing but car dealerships, wherehouses and parking garages. While most of manhattan feels like 24/7, not a single soul is found in that area after night fall. Lets bring people and put it to more use.

  8. #128
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    the javits expasnion is the most important, leave it to NYc to build bus depot, above grtound in one ofthe most valuable undrdeveloped areas in the whole world

  9. #129

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    Krultime,

    The key word in that statement is relatively. If you compare the benefits of the stadium to what's there now, of course the benefit is obvious. In this case it should be weighed against the convention center expansion.

    The stadium itself is being promoted as mixed-use, as a facility for the Javitts.

  10. #130

    Default Re: Bloomberg: *new stadium for Manhattan's Westside

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris

    Rendering of the proposed Jets stadium shows the two panels making up the retractable roof.
    Are there actually going to be rather large buildings around the new stadium?

    Thanks
    Last edited by Kris; October 4th, 2009 at 05:47 PM.

  11. #131

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    Most probably. Any excuse for a skyscraper. ( Which im not complaining about, the more the merrier)

  12. #132

    Default Re: Bloomberg: *new stadium for Manhattan's Westside

    Quote Originally Posted by Pottebaum
    Are there actually going to be rather large buildings around the new stadium? Thanks
    The skycrapers depicted in the drawing do not actually exist. Nor have any developers been lined up to build them. Rather, they are just wishful thinking by Doctoroff et al, who want to claim that this boondoggle will generate sufficient new tax revenues to pay back the billion of dollars in city bonds necessary to fund the project. Personally, I have a hard time believing that there will be much interest in such huge office towers in that neighborhood. If there were, they would have been built already. Eight extra Jets home games on winter Sunday afternoons won't make the neighborhood any more marketable in that respect.

    Incidentally, although it is not altogether clear from the picture, one of the reasons the project is so absurdly expensive is because it calls for yet another (!) automobile tunnel for the portion of West Street adjacent to the new stadium. It seems that the politically connected construction interests behind the rightfully-defeated Westway project are determined to reconstruct that project one link at a time.

    As for the stadium itself, I think the actual design is pretty nifty, which is rare for NFL architecture. One practical question, however: The drawing shows a clear glass wall forming the entire western wall of the football field. During football winters, the sun starts setting by this time of day (4:00 pm or so), when the Jets will be still playing many of their games. Won't blinding sunsets interfere with the game?

  13. #133
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    A major reason that the skyscrapers haven't been built is because there isn't sufficient transportation in that area. The extension of the 7 train, which would go along 42nd Street, turn down to the Javits Center, and then loop around to Penn Station, will make or break large-scale development in the area. A light-rail loop is also waiting in the wings.

  14. #134
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    Also, much of the area is zoned for low-rise industrial, I believe. This new zoning would promote skyscraper and hi-rise residential, plus plan for parks and more public tranportation.

    The stadium is the anchor b/c it will not only be for the Jets, but it will host concerts and events as well as be an "expansion" of Javits, which needs it. It will also host many a Super Bowl, as it is in NYC and will have a retactable dome. It could also host NCAA tournament games and be the main attraction in bringing NYC the 2012 games.

    It's a great idea and I hope all the BS is settled soon.

  15. #135
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    The council is suppose to vote on the land zoning next year, however with thge city council in there now, they may keep the zoining the same for all we know

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