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Thread: Potential new large tower in Midtown (Roosevelt Hotel Site)

  1. #31

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    This is a much nicer building than the Hotel Penn. Whatever they replace it with better be good.

  2. #32
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    Bear Stearns had proposed to raze it and build a WTB on the site about 10 years ago, before they killed the idea and went with their new building next door.

  3. #33
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek2k3 View Post
    Whatever they replace it with better be good.
    In this city? I wouldn't bet on it.

  4. #34

    Default Roosevelt Hotel Demo: I HOPE NOT!!!!

    NY's decline is hastening. The following sad story is in the JUly 11th edition of the NY Post. I can't believe that Midtown's gems are being destroyed. Midtown sucks. It will look like Chicago with all new buildings.

    ROOSEVELT'S UP FOR SALE AT COOL $1B July 11, 2007 -- NO sooner did we whis per the Roosevelt Hotel as being a potential development site last Friday then we were tipped that it was actually coming to market - and could sell for, gulp, $1 billion as an office development site. Just over a year ago, the Pakistani government, which owns the 1,013 room hotel as PIA Investments, bought out its 50/50 Saudi partner, Prince Faisal bin Khalid of Saudi Arabia.

    Infighting and Pakistani political factionalism stopped an earlier sales effort in 2003 that would have brought in around $225 million slated to be used to purchase new jets for its airline.

    Sources said Cushman & Wakefield will be marking the hotel through its Fab Foursome: Richard Baxter, Ron Cohen, Scott Latham and Jon Caplan. The company declined comment.

    At a breakfast meeting at Michael's yesterday morning, C&W executives were bullish on the ongoing sales and leasing markets, as vacancy rates have dropped to 5.3 percent and asking rents are up to $75.79 a foot in Midtown, a 35 percent jump since this time last year.

    The hotel occupies nearly a full-acre block just north of Grand Central Terminal bounded by 45th and 46th Streets, Vanderbilt and Madison avenues.

    Its 43,000 foot site can be built to 800,000 feet as-of-right, but attorneys say that special district air rights can be piled on to create a skyscraper that could leap to 1.5 million feet.

    Potential bidders are being advised to compare the hotel to the site next to the Museum of Modern Art which sold for $775 a buildable foot, but is mid-block near Sixth Avenue.

    Over a number of years making strategic land and air rights purchases, Macklowe Properties paid around $950 a foot for the Swisshotel Drake New York at Park Avenue and 56th Street, which they have changed from a residential hotel to offices.

    Office rents have since climbed markedly in the city with 18 deals completed at over $125 a foot this year alone versus 16 in all of last year.

  5. #35

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    Roosevelt Hotel "The City Review"

    http://images.google.com/imgres?imgu...it-it%26sa%3DN


    Bring it on! : dark, dreary, boring, flea-bag, run-down, no-big-deal, like-so-many-other-buildings-in-the-area, there-are-better-examples, we-need-the-office-space...


    ---
    Last edited by Fabrizio; July 11th, 2007 at 09:18 AM.

  6. #36

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    Based on a number of similar threads, I guess many at Wired New York vehemently oppose the development of any site that isn't a taxpayer or a parking lot. Quite sad, and completely antithetical to the idea of New York. I am very thankful that your opinion is rare; under your vision New York would be a giant Detroit. There would certainly be no Midtown, nor would the vast majority of existing landmarks been built.

    It's especially ironic that LondonLawyer claims a 1.5 million trophy Grand Central office tower (guaranteed to be filled with bulge bracket firms and private equity and hedge fund shops, all paying massive corporate and income taxes and directly linked to the remainder of Grand Central and Terminal City) is indicative of decline, while the crappy Roosevelt Hotel, home of airline crews and tourists and languishing under absentee ownership, is somehow indicative of prosperity.

    Recently, Wired New York seems less of an architectural and development forum, and increasingly just another NIMBY powwow.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by ASchwarz View Post
    ...It's especially ironic that LondonLawyer claims a 1.5 million trophy Grand Central office tower....
    The Roosevelt is a beautiful, old building that simply needs to be spruced up. I favor redevelopment of dilapidated sites. I can show you at least 100 in Midtown that should be redeveloped. In my opinion, this is not one of them.

  8. #38

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    There are many office development sites, but they all have substantial older buildings that will need to be demolished or extensively altered.
    The various little isolated taxpayers and the like are not appropriate for office space, because modern office towers need big floorplates. Those little taxpayers will likely see hotel or residential construction, but not office space.

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by londonlawyer View Post
    NY's decline is hastening. The following sad story is in the JUly 11th edition of the NY Post. I can't believe that Midtown's gems are being destroyed. Midtown sucks. It will look like Chicago with all new buildings.

    ROOSEVELT'S UP FOR SALE AT COOL $1B July 11, 2007 -- NO sooner did we whis per the Roosevelt Hotel as being a potential development site last Friday then we were tipped that it was actually coming to market - and could sell for, gulp, $1 billion as an office development site. Just over a year ago, the Pakistani government, which owns the 1,013 room hotel as PIA Investments, bought out its 50/50 Saudi partner, Prince Faisal bin Khalid of Saudi Arabia.

    Infighting and Pakistani political factionalism stopped an earlier sales effort in 2003 that would have brought in around $225 million slated to be used to purchase new jets for its airline.

    Sources said Cushman & Wakefield will be marking the hotel through its Fab Foursome: Richard Baxter, Ron Cohen, Scott Latham and Jon Caplan. The company declined comment.

    At a breakfast meeting at Michael's yesterday morning, C&W executives were bullish on the ongoing sales and leasing markets, as vacancy rates have dropped to 5.3 percent and asking rents are up to $75.79 a foot in Midtown, a 35 percent jump since this time last year.

    The hotel occupies nearly a full-acre block just north of Grand Central Terminal bounded by 45th and 46th Streets, Vanderbilt and Madison avenues.

    Its 43,000 foot site can be built to 800,000 feet as-of-right, but attorneys say that special district air rights can be piled on to create a skyscraper that could leap to 1.5 million feet.

    Potential bidders are being advised to compare the hotel to the site next to the Museum of Modern Art which sold for $775 a buildable foot, but is mid-block near Sixth Avenue.

    Over a number of years making strategic land and air rights purchases, Macklowe Properties paid around $950 a foot for the Swisshotel Drake New York at Park Avenue and 56th Street, which they have changed from a residential hotel to offices.

    Office rents have since climbed markedly in the city with 18 deals completed at over $125 a foot this year alone versus 16 in all of last year.
    Chicago today is building taller than in Midtown Manhattan. They have been having less issues with replacing well built buildings with short fat boxes. Chicago seems to find the right spots to build to begin with. The same is true with downtown NYC. Downtown NYC development impresses me, but midtown development depresses me.
    Last edited by Scraperfannyc; July 11th, 2007 at 07:09 PM.

  10. #40

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    The Roosevelt Hotel is one of a dying breed of grand old hotels, of the sort that are not built now and will never be built again. This City has a chronic hotel shortage. Yes, it has an office space shortage as well, but as LL notes, there are lots and lots of developable parcels without destroying the City's elegant old buildings.

  11. #41

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    Scraperfan, Chicago is completely different from Midtown Manhattan.

    Chicago has high commercial vacancies, low commercial rents and relatively little office space planned or U/C. If anything, they have too much existing office space relative to demand.

    The tall Chicago buildings proposed, planned or u/c are residential.

    Chicago also has completely different zoning and little or no NIMBYism.

    Finally, Chicago doesn't have even a tenth of the historic streetscape of Manhattan. Most new buildings are built on one of the many surface parking lots.

    There's no comparison.

  12. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by BPC View Post
    The Roosevelt Hotel is one of a dying breed of grand old hotels, of the sort that are not built now and will never be built again. This City has a chronic hotel shortage. Yes, it has an office space shortage as well, but as LL notes, there are lots and lots of developable parcels without destroying the City's elegant old buildings.
    Where are these "lots of lots of developable parcels" in Midtown East?

    There are development parcels, but they are on sites with large existing buildings like the Roosevelt Hotel.

  13. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by ASchwarz View Post
    Scraperfan, Chicago is completely different from Midtown Manhattan.

    Chicago has high commercial vacancies, low commercial rents and relatively little office space planned or U/C. If anything, they have too much existing office space relative to demand.

    The tall Chicago buildings proposed, planned or u/c are residential.

    Chicago also has completely different zoning and little or no NIMBYism.

    Finally, Chicago doesn't have even a tenth of the historic streetscape of Manhattan. Most new buildings are built on one of the many surface parking lots.

    There's no comparison.
    OK, but even assuming everything you say is true regarding Chicago, this still does not explain the differences between Midtown and Downtown Development. I have a feeling, although I could be wrong, that Sheldon Silver has an interest in making sure Downtown keeps its wonderful old buildings and builds the tallest and most splendid buildings at the same time. I just believe that Midtown can build much better buildings and at locations that either do not have anything or at locations with rundown walkups that NYC has too much of.

  14. #44

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    I'm not sure I understand. The vast majority of future office space will be in Midtown. Hudson Yards alone will have a tremendous amount of space. How can you judge before we've even seen renderings?

  15. #45
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    Based on a number of similar threads, I guess many at Wired New York vehemently oppose the development of any site that isn't a taxpayer or a parking lot. Quite sad, and completely antithetical to the idea of New York. I am very thankful that your opinion is rare; under your vision New York would be a giant Detroit. There would certainly be no Midtown, nor would the vast majority of existing landmarks been built.

    It's especially ironic that LondonLawyer claims a 1.5 million trophy Grand Central office tower (guaranteed to be filled with bulge bracket firms and private equity and hedge fund shops, all paying massive corporate and income taxes and directly linked to the remainder of Grand Central and Terminal City) is indicative of decline, while the crappy Roosevelt Hotel, home of airline crews and tourists and languishing under absentee ownership, is somehow indicative of prosperity.

    Recently, Wired New York seems less of an architectural and development forum, and increasingly just another NIMBY powwow.
    ^Bile.

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