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Thread: 130 Liberty St - Post 9/11 Demo - Deutsche Bank Building - by Shreve, Lamb and Harmon

  1. #16

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Right.
    That's why they would dismantle it, not implode it.

  2. #17

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    In my opinion, I think it'd be a mistake demolishing the building. Granted, it might cost more to fix, but the damage to the Deutsch Bank building was almost as severe in scale as the damage to the American Express building that was across from One World Trade. Whole sections of tower facade were imbedded in it, as well as nearly wiping out the eastern end of the Winter Garden. They didn't demolish the Amex Building, instead they rebuilt it AND the Winter Garden.

    I think the Deutsch Bank building deserves the same kind of treatment. Rebuild it, not demolish it.

    (Edited by StevenRosenow at 4:10 am on Mar. 21, 2003)

  3. #18

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    You have that backwards. The damage to Amex was much less severe than Deutsche Bank. 2WTC was closer to it than 1WTC was to Amex. 1WTC fell almost vertically, while 2WTC toppled
    toward the southeast, sending more debris into the building.

    During recovery, all the buildings around the site were inspected for danger of collapse. Amex was declared stable, while Deutsche Bank remained a question mark for months, and generated several evacuation alarms.

    Amex was sealed off, while Deutsche Bank remained open to the elements.

    Why would it be a mistake to demolish it?

  4. #19

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Deutsche Bank also wants more space. Amex didn't.

  5. #20
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    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Yeah, but I'm sure DB would love to have a nice, shiny new, more modern facility to work in. *This building is not hideous, but it's far from great. *If the WTC has any value architecturally (we can all hope and assume), then this building would not complement the site well at all. This is just my opinion, but it would be great to have, maybe, a taller, beautful glass structure to push along the DT rebirth and increase it's value as a great destination. *Besides, wouldn't a nice mixed us building be better for the area (condos, offices, retail, cultural)?

  6. #21

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Quote: from billyblancoNYC on 11:41 am on Mar. 21, 2003
    Yeah, but I'm sure DB would love to have a nice, shiny new, more modern facility to work in. *This building is not hideous, but it's far from great. *
    How do you know DB didn't love its building ?
    After all, they chose it for a reason.
    Some people might just like squat, black boxes...

  7. #22

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    The DB building became the DB building when they bought Bankers Trust. DB had nothing to do with building it. They also took a number of floors across the street in the WTC because there wasn't enough room in 130 Liberty. DB is also spread across 3 buildings in midtown that they want to get out of. The original plan was to put everyone in 60 Wall St and 130 Liberty.

    My point is that DB didn't build 130 Liberty and wasn't necessarily fond of it. They would have preferred it if it was bigger and they didn't need to take space in the WTC.

  8. #23

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    This is the worst possible scenario for DB. *

    The city inspector(s) must still pass EPA guidelines and inspection that the toxic mold "has been removed". *The EPA standards are even more stringent and depending on the inspector...could be almost impossible to pass.

    If DB gets the green light from the EPA...the building would not be allowed to be imploded since it had a mold infestation at one time and could return. *Therefore, if DB wants a new structure or modify the existing structure, Liberty 130 would have to be dissembled room by room, floor by floor. *Regardless of what they do, it will be a very expensive and time consuming process.

    Hopefully, they can get moving on it soon. *

    I agree w/ JMGarcia...DB definitely wants more space to consolidate all of their operations into a newer building and would prefer a new landmark tower to go along with 60 Wall Street. *Thus, Libeskind tower 5, a larger more interesting design would be preferred. *


    (Edited by diVinci at 1:33 pm on Mar. 21, 2003)

  9. #24

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Quote: from JMGarcia on 1:07 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
    The DB building became the DB building when they bought Bankers Trust. DB had nothing to do with building it.
    Why do you think they bought Bankers Trust ?
    I'm telling you, they just loved 130 Liberty.

    They also took a number of floors across the street in the WTC because there wasn't enough room in 130 Liberty. DB is also spread across 3 buildings in midtown that they want to get out of. The original plan was to put everyone in 60 Wall St and 130 Liberty.

    My point is that DB didn't build 130 Liberty and wasn't necessarily fond of it. They would have preferred it if it was bigger and they didn't need to take space in the WTC.
    Apparently, nothing is big enough for DB.
    Now, please, someone explain me again why super-tall buildings don't make sense.

  10. #25

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Had DB ever heard of consolidation?

  11. #26

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    June 20, 2003

    Last Days for a Survivor of Sept. 11

    By EDWARD WYATT and CHARLES V. BAGLI


    The Deutsche Bank building, draped in netting and seen through Thursday's muggy air, is just south of the World Trade Center site.

    The battered and disfigured Deutsche Bank building in Lower Manhattan, among the last remaining buildings damaged in the Sept. 11 terrorist attack whose fate has not been decided, has been deemed beyond repair and is expected to be taken down beginning next month, according to people involved in negotiations on its future.

    It will be the end of an unlikely symbol. In the days immediately after Sept. 11, 2001, the boxy, 40-story skyscraper next to the ruined World Trade Center became a talisman of hope to many rescue workers at ground zero. Human remains were found on its roof.

    Sentiment downtown was overwhelmingly in favor of repairing it if possible, the thought of another building coming down being too much for many people to bear. At least eight buildings were destroyed and at least seven were seriously damaged in the terrorist attack.

    The weeks have stretched into months, and now the building at 130 Liberty Street, veiled in black netting, has become an unwelcome symbol of decay "an ever-present reminder of the darkest moment in our past," Gov. George E. Pataki said in April in a neighborhood that is struggling to revive itself.

    Mr. Pataki also directed that rebuilding officials "replace the shroud with a mural trumpeting a new symbol to rise at ground zero," the 1,776-foot tower designed by Studio Daniel Libeskind.

    The building must be disassembled more than torn down, covered in an airtight tarp to contain the asbestos and other contaminants that have made the building unusable. As a result, the cost of the work has been estimated at more than $100 million, according to people involved in planning the project. Insurance payments to Deutsche Bank are expected to cover most of the cost. The mural the governor ordered is expected to be installed on the tarp in September at a cost of $1.5 million.

    Downtown residents and businesses have pushed government officials to force a decision about the Deutsche Bank building. "The only hope we have down here is in the rebuilding of this area," said Madelyn Wils, the chairwoman of Community Board 1, the neighborhood advisory board for Lower Manhattan and a director of the Lower Manhattan Development Corporation. To many, she said, the building "represents the slowness of the progress down here."

    What will happen to the property once the building is removed is still uncertain, although many people have made their interest clear. Deutsche Bank has expressed a willingness to sell it, according to people who have participated in discussions.

    The Bloomberg administration has indicated its interest in acquiring the property, possibly for residential construction. Daniel L. Doctoroff, the deputy mayor for economic development and rebuilding, said the area south of Liberty Street was "an emerging residential neighborhood," adding that the building "could be a mixed-use site, with a trading floor at the base with a separate entrance for apartments up above."

    Officials at the Lower Manhattan Development Corporation and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey are also interested in the future of the property. One version of Daniel Libeskind's plan for ground zero places a 1.67-million-square-foot office building there.

    Matthew Higgins, chief operating officer of the development corporation, said rebuilding officials had always considered the possibility of including the Deutsche Bank property in the overall planning for the site. But, he said, "it's premature to say whether we'd have an interest in the property."

    Because of its proximity to the area's transportation hub, it might be attractive to a commercial developer, although it would be difficult to justify an office building there when 10 million square feet of space is scheduled to go up across the street over the next decade.

    Since the Sept. 11 attack, Deutsche Bank has been battling with the building's four insurers over its fate, and the bank has maintained for at least six months that the structure is beyond salvage. The insurance companies disagreed, wanting to rebuild, at least until recently. Last week the bank reached a tentative settlement with the lead insurer, the Chubb Group of Insurance Companies, which would allow the demolition to proceed, according to three people involved in planning the building's future.

    Rohini Pragasam, a spokeswoman for Deutsche Bank, declined to comment on the settlement or the building's future. "We continue to work toward a final decision on the fate of the building," she said. Mark Schussel, a spokesman for Chubb, also declined to comment. A final deal requires approval by the three other insurers AXA, Allianz and Zurich and negotiations continue.

    The building, known as the Bankers Trust Building until Deutsche Bank merged with Bankers Trust a few years ago, was built in the early 1970's and contained 1.4 million square feet of office space. It was connected to the World Trade Center by a footbridge across Liberty Street and was designed by Shreve, Lamb & Harmon Associates, the architecture firm that also designed the Empire State Building, and Peterson & Brickbauer.

    Although steel falling from the south tower of the trade center ripped a 24-story gash in its northern facade, the building remained structurally sound. Its sprinkler system was triggered, however, and the combination of standing water, contaminants from the trade center, sealed windows and little direct sunlight spawned a robust strain of mold throughout much of the building.

    After an intense cleaning, the city health department declared the building free of mold earlier this year. The dismantling of the building will still require engineers to pay close attention to environmental hazards, accounting for most of the costs of taking the building down.

    Raising scaffolding around the building to support the tarp enclosing the project will cost more than $10 million, according to a real estate executive familiar with the project. The removal of asbestos and other contaminants is expected to cost more than $70 million, while taking apart the structure will run at least $25 million.

    The fate of one other building near ground zero remains unresolved: Fiterman Hall, a 15-story building at 30 West Broadway. On Sept. 11, 2001, its owner, the Borough of Manhattan Community College, was three weeks away from unveiling a $64 million renovation. The college has been working with the State Dormitory Authority and its insurers on the building's future.


    Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company

  12. #27

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    I guess we all saw it coming...

    (Daily News)

    Skyscraper to be razed at WTC site

    By MAGGIE HABERMAN and GREG GITTRICH

    A office tower at the edge of Ground Zero that was badly damaged in the Sept. 11 attacks will be demolished because of mold infestation, the Daily News has learned.

    The steel and glass tower, owned by Deutsche Bank, has been vacant since debris from the twin towers tore a 24-story gash into its facade.

    The black fungus apparently grew rapidly because of dark and damp conditions in the abandoned tower.

    Sources told The News yesterday that Deutsche Bank is expected to raze the 40-story building in the next few months.

    A Deutsche Bank spokeswoman would only say that bank officials are "continuing to work toward reaching a final decision."

    The bank has reached an agreement with one of the four companies that insured the $178 million tower, a source said.

    Demolishing the tower at 130 Liberty St. could give state and city rebuilding officials greater flexibility as they move to rebuild Ground Zero.

    A version of architect Daniel Libeskind's site plan for Ground Zero contemplates building a new commercial tower on the Deutsche Bank property.

    The land could be purchased by the state and city. But no decisions have been made.

    A spokeswoman for the city Buildings Department said the bank has not filed for a demolition permit. Its most recent application indicates that significant repairs would be made.

    But sources said those repairs are needed to prevent the mold from spreading to adjacent buildings during demolition.

  13. #28

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Pardon my language, but this sucks!!!

  14. #29

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    I worked for years in 130 Liberty. It was a sucky building and I'm not surprised DB should want to get rid of it. Especially now that they own 60 Wall St.

  15. #30

    Default Toxic mold cleared from Deutsche Bank building

    Quote: from StevenRosenow on 8:07 am on June 20, 2003
    Pardon my language, but this sucks!!!
    Why does this suck?

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