New Penn Station (Moynihan Station)

[ASchwarz]

I think you're wrong, because the amount of F.A.R. is such that the buildings will be much taller than your estimates.

In all the previous articles we were told both were 1,400 feet, but there was no distinction between spire height and the building height. Now we are told something a little different, but not necessarily inconsistent if the previous articles were referring to spire height for the shorter bldg.

The other two buildings will also be quite tall. I would be surprised if any of the four were under 1,000 feet (total height, not bldg. height). 2.5 million square feet for the Hotel Penn will give us a bigger bldg. than One Bryant Park, and the 34th/7th site has a relatively small footprint for 2 million square feet.

I guess we'll have a clearer picture when the plan is released in the next three weeks.

[Bob]

Zoning, schmoning. NY should let the free market rule, and scrap all building height restrictions.

[elfgam]

I know the chances are slim... but my god -- THIS IS THE KIND OF BIG THINKING THE CITY NEEDS! Everyone keeps saying that we need a Rockefeller Center on the west side to get that neighborhood jump started ... AND THIS IS IT! I've seen images of the two towers... amazing. I just hope people realize that whatever you think of scale in the other parts of the city this area right here is absolutely the right place to do this...

then again, we can already identify the main argument against it: these are talled than the Empire State Building, and are right near it... sadly, i guarantee in the end they'll be forced to 'respect' the height of the ESB... though really to respect the spirit of the ESB represents would be to surpass it in height.

[DarrylStrawberry]

I've seen images of the two towers... amazing.

What do they look like?

[lofter1]

The argument that they're taller than ESB and will thereby block the ESB so shouldn't be built really only works if you're making the argument in NJ

(or maybe as a resident of Penn South)

[ablarc]

The argument that they're taller than ESB and will thereby block the ESB so shouldn't be built

A doleful argument at best, firm in the faith that the past can't be matched.

[lofter1]

On the other hand, if one chooses to build near to and taller than the ESB then one had better produce a F'ing Great Building.

[NYguy]

An entrance at the top of a long flight of stairs is not ideal for a train station. GC has street level entrances, as did the old Penn Stn. That's why the original Farley design had the main ticket concourse midblock at street level..

The concern of those opposed to the MSG plan is not so much the loss of the colonnade entrance for commuters, but that an exclusive arena entrance would destroy the character of the 8th Ave elevation and the interior space.
If the colonnade becomes the entrance to MSG, they're gonna want a sign. That should be a non-starter.

I spent the better part of an hour standing in line at the Farley last weekend, so I had time to admire the features. The Garden won't need that many ticket windows open. Even though the post office doesn't use every window either, it should remain functioning. Let MSG share the windows, the post office will be open more. With all the surrounding office towers planned, the place will be buzzing with even more activity. As far as viewing the interior of the new Garden from the station, although I see nothing wrong with it (an added bonus in my opinion), that will only be to the west. Better to be able to see into it than being buried beneath it. These people need to find something else to worry and complain about.

[NYguy]

The argument that they're taller than ESB and will thereby block the ESB so shouldn't be built really only works if you're making the argument in NJ

And for the most part, not even then. It all depends on the angle. If we had renderings, a lot could be said...

[ablarc]

On the other hand, if one chooses to build near to and taller than the ESB then one had better produce a F'ing Great Building.

Ca va sans dire.

[zarzapan]

Zoning, schmoning. NY should let the free market rule, and scrap all building height restrictions.

Houston is a great example of what results.

[Bob]

That's exactly right. Kudos.

[NYguy]

I think you're wrong, because the amount of F.A.R. is such that the buildings will be much taller than your estimates.

In all the previous articles we were told both were 1,400 feet, but there was no distinction between spire height and the building height. Now we are told something a little different, but not necessarily inconsistent if the previous articles were referring to spire height for the shorter bldg.

The other two buildings will also be quite tall. I would be surprised if any of the four were under 1,000 feet (total height, not bldg. height). 2.5 million square feet for the Hotel Penn will give us a bigger bldg. than One Bryant Park, and the 34th/7th site has a relatively small footprint for 2 million square feet.

It makes more sense to me that the development rights for the 2 msf tower be moved elsewhere (that footprint is so small). Although, it also makes sense to cram as much space as possible as close as possible to Penn Station. As close as the Freedom Tower is to the PATH terminal, there were complaints that it was "too far". The full 5.5 msf will be built at the MSG site, you can bet on it.

(btw, those earlier renderings are consistent with 1,100 and 1,400 ft)

[NYguy]

Also, back to the Farley/MSG thing, from those earlier renderings we saw, the view of MSG from the station was more of a "peek", it wasn't entirely open to it. And even then, it won't be from the main floor of the station.

[ld876]

The argument that they're taller than ESB and will thereby block the ESB so shouldn't be built really only works if you're making the argument in NJ

(or maybe as a resident of Penn South)

I'm having flashbacks of Brooklynites talking about the Williamsburg Savings Bank...