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Thread: New Penn Station (Moynihan Station)

  1. #1891

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    SOM NY (Childs) did the basic design for Bear Stearns. BS wasn't originally happy with the facade treatment and SOM Chicago (Adrian Smith a man of real talent) redid/refined the facade including the crown.

  2. #1892
    Moderator NYatKNIGHT's Avatar
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    ^which are its best features. It's got stumpy proportions too.

  3. #1893

    Thumbs up Any announcements yet?

    Last week, the ESDC & MTD stated they would release plans TODAY. Any public announcements yet in the media today?
    Last edited by Adyton; December 5th, 2007 at 04:23 PM.

  4. #1894
    Forum Veteran TREPYE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASchwarz View Post
    I don't think SOM is bad at all. They aren't great, but they generally get the job done.
    Just out of curiosity ASchwartz, in all seriousness, are you a developer or are in the development business??

  5. #1895

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    Quote Originally Posted by TREPYE View Post
    Just out of curiosity ASchwartz, in all seriousness, are you a developer or are in the development business??
    I am not a developer, but I work with affordable housing developers, mostly in Brooklyn and Queens, so you could say I am in the "development business."

  6. #1896

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    Developers Reportedly Try To Lure Macy's To New Penn Station

    December 06, 2007

    There is word that the developers of the new Penn Station are reportedly trying to lure Macy's away from its Flagship location at Herald Square.

    Public officials and real estate executives tell the New York Times that developers are talking with Macy's in the hopes of convincing the department store to move from its 105-year old landmark building on 34th Street to a glass-enclosed mall inside the new train station.

    Macy's and the developers declined to comment.

    Last month, the developers unveiled a conceptual model for an eight-story station west of 7th Avenue.

    The proposal hinges on whether Madison Square Garden is willing to move to a new home inside the walls of the Farley Post Office. The old MSG would then be demolished to make room for a new Penn Station with 1.1 million square feet of retail space.

    A public hearing is scheduled for today at the Farley Post Office on the $14 billion proposal.

    Copyright 2007 NY1 News. All rights reserved.

    Unnecessary.

  7. #1897
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    When I was in Las Vegas this past July I visited a really nice hotel across the strip from my hotel (Venetian), this mall had two Macy's. One was a high end Macy's which was more along the lines of a Bloomingdales or Nordstrum, the other Macy's was more affordable with Charter Club etc..

    I would think Macy's folks would balk at moving from their current location unless..

    A.) The new development site would offer a remarkable product which would be both modern and timeless, something people who are visiting "must see".

    or..

    B.) Macy's splits their operations between two facilities across the street from one another.

  8. #1898
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    More ...

    An Effort to Tempt Macy’s From a Century-Old Home

    NY TIMES
    By CHARLES V. BAGLI
    December 6, 2007

    Is New York ready for a Miracle on 33rd Street? The developers behind the long-gestating plan to rebuild Pennsylvania Station and redevelop the surrounding neighborhood are trying to lure Macy’s from its 105-year-old landmark building in Herald Square to a glass-enclosed mall that would sit inside the new train station, public officials and real estate executives said.

    The developers — Stephen M. Ross of Related Companies and Steven Roth of Vornado Realty Trust — are in the early stage of negotiations with Macy’s, which inspired the 1947 movie “Miracle on 34th Street.” It is the latest wrinkle in a complicated $14 billion proposal, which is the subject of a public hearing to be held today at the James A. Farley Post Office on Eighth Avenue, between 31st and 33rd Streets.

    Even the project’s critics agree that there is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to rebuild the cramped and confusing waiting rooms, tunnels, platforms and retail spaces that make up Penn Station, the nation’s busiest railroad station. Advocates say it is also an opportunity to create a monumental gateway to the city, redress the demolition of the original train station in the 1960s and develop a vibrant new business district.

    But it is also enormously complex, requiring the coordination of Amtrak, the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, New Jersey Transit, the Long Island Rail Road and the city subways, as well as the creation of new zoning districts. And the work must be done without interrupting transit services.

    In addition, the project could involve a public investment of well over $1 billion at a time when New York is engaged in a series of other multibillion-dollar transportation projects, including the Second Avenue subway, the extension of the No. 7 line, and a new train tunnel under the Hudson River.

    So far, the developers have offered to put up $450 million toward the estimated $2 billion cost of the station. But since the project could be enormously lucrative for the developers, that number is expected to grow. The developers have lobbyists in Washington trying to obtain federal financing, but the project will also require hundreds of millions from the state and the city.

    “This is a tough, complicated deal,” said Patrick J. Foye, a co-chairman of the Empire State Development Corporation, which is overseeing the proposed project. “We’re guardedly optimistic that we’ve got enough momentum now that we’ll be able to resolve all the issues.”

    It seems unlikely that Macy’s would abandon the landmark building, despite its age and inefficiencies. Macy’s and the developers declined to comment.

    Neither the state nor the developers have released any renderings of what a new station might look like, or cost estimates for the public investment. But at a Nov. 29 meeting, the developers unveiled a conceptual model for state, city and transit officials that showed an eight-story station west of Seventh Avenue with an undulating glass canopy that would allow light into the underground waiting rooms and ticket areas.

    There would be station entrances on both Seventh and Eighth Avenues and vast public halls larger than those at Grand Central. The big retail spaces would be concentrated on the station’s north and south sides.

    After more than two years of work, the developers scrapped a plan this summer to replace Madison Square Garden with a pair of massive skyscrapers over Penn Station, after determining that it would be almost impossible to do the work while trains continued to run.

    The city and the state are now proposing the creation of a special zoning district that would allow the developers to transfer more than 6.3 million square feet of development rights across a 20-block area surrounding Penn Station. The development rights could be transferred, for example, to the site of the Pennsylvania Hotel on Seventh Avenue, which Mr. Roth’s company already owns, and the block currently occupied by Macy’s.

    Over the last year, the various transportation agencies have become deeply involved in the planning for the proposed station, something that had not happened earlier.

    A coalition of civic groups, including the Municipal Art Society, the Regional Plan Association and the Landmarks Conservancy generally support the project, but are worried that the original impetus — the creation of a new station with monumental public spaces akin to Grand Central Terminal — is getting lost in the developers’ desire to build office towers, shopping malls and a new Garden.

    “We all think this has enormous potential,” said Peg Breen of the Landmarks Conservancy. “The public has to come out of this with two distinct, well-designed train stations. No one wants to come up from the station into a lingerie department, or the Garden’s lobby.”

    The current proposal hinges on the willingness of Madison Square Garden, which sits above the station, to move to a new, $1 billion home one block to the west, inside the walls of the Farley Post Office, between Eighth and Ninth Avenues. The old Garden would be demolished to make way for a new Penn Station with 1.1 million square feet of shops and department stores.

    The developers, in turn, would build a ring of office towers totaling more than six million square feet of space — the equivalent of three Empire State Buildings — around the new train station, transforming an aging neighborhood into a new commercial district. At the same time, an adjunct transportation station would be created at the Farley Post Office, across Eighth Avenue from Penn Station.

    (The tracks run under both sites out to the West Side railyards.)

    The current design for the new Garden would take up about two-thirds of the Farley building and rise about 30 feet above the roof line, although state officials are encouraging the Garden to lower the profile. Preservationists have objected to the Garden’s plans to install ticket vendors at the historic stamp windows and to replace an interior brick wall with one of glass, which would allow commuters to view the interior of the basketball court.

    State officials, however, say they have not made a decision on the glass wall, and insist that the Postal Service will continue to sell stamps in the lobby behind the Eighth Avenue colonnade.

    Copyright 2007The New York Times Company

  9. #1899

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    Travesty.

  10. #1900

    Default landmark the building

    Clearly, the Macy's building should be landmarked. I'm skeptical Macys will move - part of the appeal of city shopping is the ability to go to places like the Macy's flagship.

  11. #1901

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    Quote Originally Posted by investordude View Post
    Clearly, the Macy's building should be landmarked.
    It is.

  12. #1902

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    When there are whole blocks of nothing but 2 or 3 story shacks and garbage retailers in the area, they want to move the most iconic NYC landmark that is Macy's? Are these people on drugs? The whole area around Penn station excluding a few buildings such as the post office and hotels is garbage, infact Macy's is one of the highlights of the neighborhood if not the whole city. Whoever made this ridiculous proposal needs to be fired from the planning comission. Not to mention that Macy's will never give up what is essentially it's biggest location and it's heart and soul.

  13. #1903
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    As is / was ^ the Hearst Building -- which didn't stop them from building through and above the original landmarked structure.

  14. #1904

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenious View Post
    When there are whole blocks of nothing but 2 or 3 story shacks and garbage retailers in the area, they want to move the most iconic NYC landmark that is Macy's? Are these people on drugs?
    Not surprisingly, I completely disagree.

    Your problem is not with developers; it is with NYC zoning and the economic needs of large financial firms.

    Small taxpayer buildings are generally not useful for big office sites (zoning limitations), and financial firms need larger footprints.

  15. #1905
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenious View Post
    When there are whole blocks of nothing but 2 or 3 story shacks and garbage retailers in the area, they want to move the most iconic NYC landmark that is Macy's? Are these people on drugs? The whole area around Penn station excluding a few buildings such as the post office and hotels is garbage, infact Macy's is one of the highlights of the neighborhood if not the whole city. Whoever made this ridiculous proposal needs to be fired from the planning comission. Not to mention that Macy's will never give up what is essentially it's biggest location and it's heart and soul.
    My first thought about this is that it's such a long-shot that there has to be another reason: bargaining chip with Madison Square Garden. If the MSG is the only potential anchor to Farley West, then they can call all the shots. With Macy's in the picture, no matter how absurd, MSG suddenly has less of an upper hand.

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