Page 263 of 968 FirstFirst ... 163213253259260261262263264265266267273313363763 ... LastLast
Results 3,931 to 3,945 of 14513

Thread: WTC Tower One - by Skidmore, Owings & Merrill

  1. #3931
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    in Limbo
    Posts
    8,976

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TonyO View Post
    The PA is a gorilla too, but your point was that a public agency was not savvy enough to make money on the deal. That is not the case here.
    That is not my point.

    Once again as usual on this forum, someone misreads someone else's comment and then here we go again...

    My point is not that the PA cannot make money. The PA making money is hardly earth-shattering news.

    The guy on the corner selling hot dogs makes money.

    Instead, my point is that government agencies such as the PA don't always have the foresight, for one reason such as bureacracy, less motivation, culpability or obligation to stockholders, etc. that people in private industry do.

  2. #3932
    Forum Veteran
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    1,752

    Default

    Don't get all testy...these are your words:

    I'm sure a savvy private real estate giant like Blackstone can see the value in this building that the dumb government agencies just can't.
    It's just not true in this case. Most of the time I would agree with you, but not here.

  3. #3933
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    in Limbo
    Posts
    8,976

    Default

    This very lack of foresight is what makes the PA undervalue its own assets such as the FT.

    From all indications, the PA views the FT as a burden that it would be better off unloading.

    Someone from the outside obviously sees a certain value (beyond what they will pay for to buy it) in the FT that the PA does not.

    In the end, I think this is actually good news for the future of the FT and the whole WTC.

    Private ownership is always IMO better than government ownership.

  4. #3934
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    in Limbo
    Posts
    8,976

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TonyO View Post
    Don't get all testy...these are your words:
    And I'm tellling you what I meant.

    Even went through explaining it once again but you just want to focus on that statement your way.

    There is a value that the FT will have in the future.

    Its value will only appreciate and appreciate a lot because of the lack of developable sites in Lower Manhattan.

    The PA trying to get rid of it shows that it either does not recognise this or does not care too much about making a profit.

    That's my point.

  5. #3935
    Forum Veteran
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    1,752

    Default

    ^ The PA is considering selling this at the height of the market, when other landlords are selling their buildings for record numbers. I don't think the PA's timing is off in this case at all. They took the risk and kept ownership responsibility of the FT and now they are going to sell it before they get a dollar in rent...pretty savvy in the real estate world.

    It all comes down to the price they get. When that number is eventually announced we'll know just how savvy they are overall.

  6. #3936

    Default if Blackstone buys, does the FT change again?

    If leases are signed, it would be hard to change, but......

  7. #3937
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    in Limbo
    Posts
    8,976

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TonyO View Post
    ^ The PA is considering selling this at the height of the market, when other landlords are selling their buildings for record numbers. I don't think the PA's timing is off in this case at all. They took the risk and kept ownership responsibility of the FT and now they are going to sell it before they get a dollar in rent...pretty savvy in the real estate world.
    It all comes down to the price they get. When that number is eventually announced we'll know just how savvy they are overall.
    The PA didn't get into this mess because they wanted to be savvy in the real estate world.

    It was their responsibility brought onto them from long ago (I don't need to go into the history of the original idea for the WTC) to see this site rebuilt.

    They had no choice but to take ownership, as you say, of this whole thing seeing how much inertia there were with Silverstein for the past few years.

    You seem to get stuck on the fact that I considered them unsavvy but you know full well that government entities in general are never about being business savvy.

    Do they want to be successful and make money? Of course, but that's not their motivation.

    And frankly they don't have to be. Just look at the MTA.

    Any private company that operated like that would have been out of business a long time ago but they're still around because they can get away with it.

    Not so for private companies, that's why they must be savvier than the agencies.

    If a company as successful as Blackstone wants to buy the FT now, then you know that they will make a lot of money from it, down the line so apparently they are savvier.

  8. #3938
    Forum Veteran
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Manhattan
    Posts
    2,636

    Default

    they wont change it thery are going thru with three renovations projects right now in old Equity buildings and are not changing those so id assum ethey would just go with the flow

  9. #3939
    Forum Veteran
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    1,752

    Default

    In generalities, yes, private sector is much better at making money than public.

    In this case though, the PA has good timing. That's just fact. I'm going to try and get some work done now.

  10. #3940
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    in Limbo
    Posts
    8,976

    Default

    It's more than just making money. It's also vision, something government just have very little of.

    As for timing, I think this is hardly the result of anything the PA had foreseen or pre-calculated.

    As late as a few weeks ago, they weren't even sure it would be economically feasible to build the FT as designed.

    Miraculously, a few weeks later somehow the market changed?

  11. #3941

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
    You say that now. But when it's built, and the tourists are lined up to get into it, and its the focus of so many photos, postcards, and shots of the city, you'll eat your own words.
    I actually noticed a company logo a few days ago, I forget what company, but their logo incorporated the skyline, and the freedom tower was in it. I thought that was interesting to see it popping up already after seeing the twin towers dropped from so many logos.

  12. #3942
    Forum Veteran
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    1,752

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
    It's more than just making money. It's also vision, something government just have very little of.

    As for timing, I think this is hardly the result of anything the PA had foreseen or pre-calculated.

    As late as a few weeks ago, they weren't even sure it would be economically feasible to build the FT as designed.

    Miraculously, a few weeks later somehow the market changed?
    Spitzer questioned the financing and feasibility, not the PA. He has, as you probably know, backed down from that and is now on board.

    You seem hell bent on proving that the PA is some bunch of imbeciles who suddenly realize that they can actually make some money by selling real estate in a seller's market. Not likely, but who cares?

    I don't know what was going through their head, but as someone who works in real estate finance, I'll tell you this: it's a good move and could be a home run depending on what price they get.

  13. #3943
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    in Limbo
    Posts
    8,976

    Default

    What you've just said is no different than a statement like "George W. Bush initiated the War in Iraq, not the U.S. government."

    George Bush is the U.S. government, like it or not, as much as Spitzer is the PA.

    If he decided to scale down the FT, the FT was going to get scaled down.

    It's that simple.

    You didn't think Corzine was going to fight that, did you?

    As far as NJ's governor's concern, any office space not built in NY would just increase the likelihood that it would be built in JC instead.

    Now on to your hell bent/imbecile and home run comments.

    First of all, call the PA what you want but all I'm saying is that the PA, like all other government entities just aren't as business savvy as the private sector. <<--- That right there, in boldface, is what I was talking about when I said "dumb government."

    No, they're not imbeciles per se, of course not, but compared to private companies, they just don't have the same business sense.

    I even went on to explain to you why they are that way but again, you remain oblivious to my explanations.

    You seem to want to be fixated on my original post even though I have now explained it to you about the fourth time already.

  14. #3944
    Forum Veteran
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    1,752

    Default

    ^ Because you want to prove some overreaching point about how dumb the PA and all gov't agencies are. This despite the fact that selling the FT now is smart. Yours just isn't a logical conclusion here. I'm done with this.

  15. #3945

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
    First of all, call the PA what you want but all I'm saying is that the PA, like all other government entities just aren't as business savvy as the private sector. <<--- That right there, in boldface, is what I was talking about when I said "dumb government."
    Actually, the PA is closer to a private business than it is to pure government.

    It cannot collect taxes, and gets all its funding from operational revenue. Considering it is saddled with two governors as CEOs, it does a pretty good job.

Similar Threads

  1. New 51-story tower Downtown
    By NYguy in forum New York Real Estate
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: January 17th, 2006, 09:20 PM
  2. Renderings CIBC Tower
    By NoyokA in forum New York Real Estate
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: July 19th, 2003, 07:17 PM
  3. 3 Buildings From 1830's Threatened By a Tower - Downtown
    By Kris in forum New York Real Estate
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: March 29th, 2003, 11:08 AM
  4. A Home Depot in the Bloomberg Tower?
    By NYguy in forum New York Real Estate
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: March 15th, 2003, 03:16 AM
  5. Special Issues for Merrill, the Landlord
    By Edward in forum New York Real Estate
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: January 23rd, 2002, 12:04 PM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Google+ - Facebook - Twitter - Meetup

Edward's photos on Flickr - Wired New York on Flickr - In Queens - In Red Hook - Bryant Park - SQL Backup Software