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Thread: 4 Dead in Metro-North Train Derailment in the Bronx

  1. #46

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    How does that change the fact that folks will be paying more to ride a statistically more dangerous railroad?

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by EastMillinocket View Post
    How does that change the fact that folks will be paying more to ride a statistically more dangerous railroad?
    Before this year there weren't any deaths for a long time , now a few happen and its a dangerous railroad? Every Railroad has deaths , accidents and other mishaps....if it were an ongoing problem...year after year then id be concern but its not and I don't foresee any more accidents.

  3. #48

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    I wonder if folks would be happier riding a "statistically more dangerous railroad" if fares were lower. Maybe get it down to a few bucks and have a genuine India railroad.



    Before this year there weren't any deaths for a long time , now a few happen and its a dangerous railroad?
    No, but maybe something has changed that should be looked at. Don't you think?

    Metro-North derailment: Federal Railroad Administration to begin investigation

  4. #49

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    I think the point is that it is especially galling to propose a fare increase at a time when rider safety considerations seem to be less than a priority.

  5. #50

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    The fare increase was already in place.

    Do we want to less galled or less safe?

  6. #51

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    I rode Metro North for 3 years while commuting from NYC to Stamford. I hated every second of it. The cars are old and uncomfortable, and the conductors are rude. Riders pay a fortune for the privlidge of riding over crowded trains that are standing room only by the time they reach their desitination,and regardless of the reported times, the trains are often late.

    And that was for the REVERSE commute.

    They act like they are doing you a favor by letting you ride their trains.

    This organization knows nothing about public relations, it is like they are completly illiterate on the topic. The MTA does so much of a better job with public relations on the NYC subway system than they do with Metro North - it is startling. Even the LIRR seems more modern and rider friendly. I don't really know enough about the organziational construct of the MTA to comment as to why Metro North seems so much worse, but it does, at least to me.


    The timing of the fare increase with the accident may be nothing more than a stroke of bad luck. The fact the MTA doesn't understand how the public connects the two events is an indication that they have no sense of public perception.

  7. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddhead View Post
    The timing of the fare increase with the accident may be nothing more than a stroke of bad luck. The fact the MTA doesn't understand how the public connects the two events is an indication that they have no sense of public perception.
    The fare was a package authorized years ago. The upcoming increase is the third or fourth annual event; there have been ongoing complaints about it.

    It has nothing to do with the safety of the railroad; two years ago it received an international award for performance.

    Something has changed in 2013. If Metro North suspended the fare increase, it would be seen as an attempt to placate public opinion and minimize any problems.

    In my opinion, that would be bullshit. Attention needs to be focused on finding out what's wrong.

    There are complaints about the GW bridge tolls. What is it now, $13?

    There are complaints about every aspect of a commute into Manhattan.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by eddhead View Post
    I rode Metro North for 3 years while commuting from NYC to Stamford. I hated every second of it. The cars are old and uncomfortable, and the conductors are rude. Riders pay a fortune for the privlidge of riding over crowded trains that are standing room only by the time they reach their desitination,and regardless of the reported times, the trains are often late.

    And that was for the REVERSE commute.

    They act like they are doing you a favor by letting you ride their trains.

    This organization knows nothing about public relations, it is like they are completly illiterate on the topic. The MTA does so much of a better job with public relations on the NYC subway system than they do with Metro North - it is startling. Even the LIRR seems more modern and rider friendly. I don't really know enough about the organziational construct of the MTA to comment as to why Metro North seems so much worse, but it does, at least to me.


    The timing of the fare increase with the accident may be nothing more than a stroke of bad luck. The fact the MTA doesn't understand how the public connects the two events is an indication that they have no sense of public perception.
    But Connecticut has had fare hikes every year since 2008 to pay for the New Trains ....do you not want newer higher capacity trains? CT also raised fares on its bus division to pay for a high capacity bus fleet for Stamford and New Haven.

  9. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey View Post
    do you not want newer higher capacity trains?
    Not the ones that were delivered...

    http://www.fairfieldcitizenonline.co...ms-5025634.php

  10. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey View Post
    But Connecticut has had fare hikes every year since 2008 to pay for the New Trains ....do you not want newer higher capacity trains?
    Sure I do (or did, I live in Chicago now). Given the fare hikes began 5 years , when do you suppose we might see them? Because at the time I left NYC, about 1 yr ago, they were still operating 6 car trains during the evening rush to NYC, and it was standing room only from Stamford on. More galling were the conductor rationalizations about how 6 cars were the standard as if to suggest that an articially created SLA is more germane to the comfort of the ridership,than Capacity considerations. You would think they would at least work to add extra cars during the rush to Yankee games, but if you assumed as much, you would be mistaken.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp View Post
    The fare was a package authorized years ago. The upcoming increase is the third or fourth annual event; there have been ongoing complaints about it.

    It has nothing to do with the safety of the railroad; two years ago it received an international award for performance.

    Something has changed in 2013. If Metro North suspended the fare increase, it would be seen as an attempt to placate public opinion and minimize any problems.

    In my opinion, that would be bullshit. Attention needs to be focused on finding out what's wrong.

    There are complaints about the GW bridge tolls. What is it now, $13?

    There are complaints about every aspect of a commute into Manhattan.
    I don't give a damn about whatever reward they received. Ask the ridership how they feel. The MTA is completely tone deaf to the feedback and perception of thierr Metro North, passangers and what it means to public perception.

    Dirty overcapacitized trains that leak during rainstorms (no shit), derailments (although the most significant, this is not the first one in recent memory), blatant efforts by engineers to cover thier work space in order in order to prevent onlookers from observing duty dereliction, over crowded platforms - hell it takes a good 10 minutes just to deboard the train at GCT during the evening rush - this stuff really happens and it is a total mess.

    I had more than one pointed discussion with head conducters about client centric ethics. The bottom line is they do not recognize that this is a for-fee service and they do not view their riders as customers - and more than one has actually said that to me. They are institutionally and culturally complacent. Hell, even the dispatchers at the train stations are rude with their announcements.

    The LIRR is leaps and bounds better.
    Last edited by eddhead; December 17th, 2013 at 01:14 PM.

  11. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddhead View Post
    I rode Metro North for 3 years while commuting from NYC to Stamford. I hated every second of it. The cars are old and uncomfortable, and the conductors are rude. Riders pay a fortune for the privlidge of riding over crowded trains that are standing room only by the time they reach their desitination,and regardless of the reported times, the trains are often late.
    The bad: http://secondavenuesagas.com/2012/06...tion-nepotism/

    The good:

    I'm not sure what "often late" equates to, but Metro North system wide on-time in 2012 was over 97%.

    The Harlem and Hudson Lines have had M7 cars going into service since 2002.

    The New Haven Line started replacing the old M2, M4, and M6 with the newest M8 in 2011. They have 294 in service.

    Upgrades of the New Haven Line were delayed because:

    1. They can't use the M7 in Connecticut; M7 is 3rd rail and Connecticut uses overhead catenary.

    2. The M8 is joint funded by NY and CT, and both legislatures had to authorize funding the new cars.

  12. #57

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    5'59" late is on-time by MNRR standards.

  13. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp View Post
    two years ago it received an international award for performance.
    Oh yeah, that bronze lava lamp. I forgot about that. Well, even the well-renowned Center for Industrial Design in Transportation makes mistakes.

    http://www.mta.info/mnr/html/brunelAward.htm

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp View Post
    There are complaints about the GW bridge tolls. What is it now, $13?
    That is more than a legitimate complaint. The toll amount goes way above beyond what they need to maintain the bridge and is instead used to generate a large profit stream for the Port Authority to waste in their huge bureaucratic empire

  15. #60

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    First, the 97% on time record is pure unadulterated bull shit. They are generally on time for the morning rush leaving out of GCT,although even there 97% is a stretch. The evening rush out of New Haven is late a hell of a lot more than 3% of the time by the time it reaches Stamford. And not by 6 minutes, either.

    Someone is playing fast and loose with the metrics.

    By the time I moved out of NY they were just beginning to implement the newer trains - I am not sure of the model, but there wern't many of them. And they had the appearance of being nothing more than retoold older cars. The interiors were painted bright colors,the lighting improved and the seats were replaced. But they were still over crowded (no extra capacity,no extra cars) they still leaked, and they were still late.

    You are shimming up a greased rope with this one.
    Last edited by eddhead; December 17th, 2013 at 02:09 PM.

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