View Poll Results: Who Will Win the 2008 AL Penant?

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  • Tampa Bay Rays

    2 14.29%
  • Boston Red Sox

    0 0%
  • New York Yankees

    10 71.43%
  • Chicago White Sox

    1 7.14%
  • Minnesota Twins

    0 0%
  • Detroit Tigers

    1 7.14%
  • Los Angeles Angels

    0 0%
  • Texas Rangers

    0 0%
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Thread: Red Sox v. Yankees

  1. #61
    Moderator NYatKNIGHT's Avatar
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    Oct 2002
    Manhattan - South Village


    Curt Schilling: "I'm not sure I can think of any scenario more enjoyable than making 55,000 people from New York shut up."

    Sorry to disappoint you, Curt. :P

  2. #62


    Hopefully I'll be eating the proverbial hotdog tonight. *crosses fingers*

  3. #63


    New York Daily News -

    Nation mourns its Red Sox

    Friday, October 15th, 2004

    BOSTON - Well, at least they still have that nice little football team to temper the winter gloom.
    The wicked buzz generated by the current batch of idiots in red stockings lasted about as long as Johnny Pesky held the ball. The players might not have succumbed to the mass moroseness that descended upon New England early yesterday morning, but the salsa music blaring from the Fenway clubhouse barely buffers the truth.

    This is one bummed out Olde Towne. A Nation mourns, and there are still 18 innings in which to hide under the couch.

    The Red Sox are down 0-2 to the Yankees in the American League Championship Series, Curt Schilling likely won't pitch again until the snow thaws, Johnny Damon swings like Delilah and the Patriots don't play again until Sunday. Once again, it appears Boston fans must find consolation not in achievement, but in Yankee failure.

    The hottest selling T-shirt in Kenmore Square still pays homage to Derek Jeter's mother - don't you just adore a series with family values? - but the most telling garment is this: a shirt with the words "Red Sox' Fans Favorite Moments" on front, and on back, a list. "Yankees lose to Marlins. Yankees lose to Diamondbacks. Yankees lose to Reds." Vendors are leaving room for one last line: "Yankees lose to Cardinals."

    And so it goes, for the 86th year and counting. The Red Sox fans who bothered to crawl out of bed on this dreary afternoon admitted to looking forward to a few bright spots tonight, when Bronson Arroyo starts against Kevin Brown at Fenway. Arroyo could go inside again on the precious Alex Rodriguez, which would turn the little bandbox on its side. Brown's back could crimp, and surely he would hear a few special chants about parasites and punches. The skies could also open up, flooding the Back Bay with frogs and locusts, and that might be the best harbinger of all because it would mean Derek Lowe wouldn't have to start Game 5, in Schilling's place.

    If there is a Game 5. What once had the look and smell of a series going to the ultimate zenith now feels as if it's been slapped into its rightful place. "If he can't go for the rest of the series," Arroyo was saying yesterday of his buddy Schilling, "I definitely think it's hurting us."

    Unless this is the ultimate cat-and-mouse game, unless the Red Sox doctors can rig a space-age contraption that will keep Schilling's ankle tendon sheath from completely snapping while still affording him mobility, Boston has little hope of returning to the Bronx. Baseball fans, whatever their stripes, will be the poorer for it.

    This year's Aaron Boone moment occurred subtly, unaccompanied by flair or drama. What if Mark Bellhorn clung to Jason Varitek's throw from the plate, and Jeter was tagged out at second base in the first inning of Game 2, before Pedro Martinez threw a zillion pitches? Or this: What if Schilling had bowed out of that Game 1 start after his ankle began barking in an awful bullpen warmup? Remember, if David Wells hadn't lied about his back in Game 5 of the World Series last year, Red Sox fans might have one less line on those Yankee-hating T-shirts.

    A series bursting with such drama and macho posturing now seems so deflated. Not so long ago, everything appeared to be lined perfectly for the Red Sox: the planets, their rotation, Schilling's off-the-cuff script. He's always been mouthy, and when he upped the noise level to another extreme with that preseries comment about making "55,000 people from New York shut up," a Nation nodded in brazen harmony. Cockiness does not come naturally to Red Sox fans; they are having a bad century and don't mind moaning about it every single second of every single day.

    But then, literally while Brian Cashman was sleeping, Boston general manager Theo Epstein swooped in, and over Thanksgiving dinner, signed Schilling, the stud pitcher who would slay the Evil Empire. It might not be a curse, but it definitely is cruel irony to hear Schilling say his ankle injury occurred not in a playoff game against the Angels, but in his final regular-season start against the Yankees.

    It gets worse - around here, it always does. Millions of mouths dropped simultaneously late Wednesday night, when Pedro reflected in a strange glow of those "Who's your Daddy?" chants at the Stadium. The more he spoke about mango trees and grabbing the attention of all of New York, the more he sounded as if he were auditioning for a role with Steinbrenner, Inc. At least that's the lasting impression for a Nation raised to expect the worst.

    So they pray to their deities, to Stephen King's ghosts and Ted Williams' legacy. Let the storm clouds roll through, let Pedro have the ball one more time. And don't forget, the Patriots go Sunday, and the Yankees haven't won a World Series in four long years.

    Another good idea for a Red Sox T-shirt:


  4. #64


    The Boston Globe

    Naturally, it's a disaster

    By Eric Wilbur, Staff | October 16, 2004

    Oh, so NOW you want the Twins. Hate to say I told you so, but I told you so.

    This series is over. Baseball in Boston is over for another season. If you headed to the game this evening, you’re forgiven for leaving in the seventh. Not to avoid traffic. To avoid watching the Yankees celebrate on your team’s home turf.

    Last night the bats finally came alive. Too little to late in what was an all-time ugly 19-8 win. This time it was that vaunted Red Sox pitching staff that fell apart. You remember, the one that had Boston “favored” in this ALCS. I suppose the Yankees winning is an “upset” then.

    This wasn’t a baseball game. It was a deflating pinball wizard of an all too common disaster in these parts. When the game was more than three hours old, it was in the seventh inning, running at an excruciating pace. Even worse for Sox fans who had longer to watch their team fall into a 3-0 hole. Stay away from Manhattan for some time. The nausea is going to be overwhelming. Doubly so if you try one of those hot dog vendors.

    There will be plenty of eulogies over the next couple days, so we’ll spare you one here now. But know this. This Red Sox team, the vanilla Red Sox for nearly half a season, choked at the wrong moment. The Yankees are their Daddy for reasons unknown. As one New York fan on the Manhattan subway following Boston’s loss in Game 2 put it, “You take those players, put pinstripes on them, and they win the World Series.”

    And he’s right. We don’t know why he’s right, but he is.

    It could be a nuclear winter for the Boston Red Sox roster. But we’ll discuss that at some other time. For now enjoy your last chance this year to watch what was admittedly a fun Boston team. Then prepare to assume your normal position for the winter, wondering where the hell it all went wrong.

    Seeing as we’re sure after the National Anthem most of you ran out and picked up the Cowsills’ greatest hits and were forced to miss the game, here’s a recap…

    First Inning: After spending nine hours over the past two days at a Fenway Park with less action than my post-prom party experience, and more than 68 hours after the last pitch was thrown in this series, Bronson Arroyo unleashes a first-pitch strike to Derek Jeter. Jeter backs away from the plate like it’s far too inside because, well, that’s what Jeter does on EVERY PITCH.

    Following a Jeter walk, Alex Rodriguez drives him in with a double down the left field line. The only chance Manny Ramirez has at throwing Jeter out at home is that he’s not Johnny Damon. It’s not enough.

    Hideki Matsui plants a 1-2 pitch into the bullpens in right field, and it’s 3-0 Yankees less than 10 minutes into the game. Arroyo is not confusing anyone, as the Yankee bats are swatting his pitches around Fenway. In fact, the only person he’s confused in the whole park is Tim McCarver, who still can’t figure out his name.

    I’m seated in the makeshift right field press section the Sox trot out come ALCS time. In Section 3. Should this concern me, particularly after Dan Shaughnessy rode back from New York Thursday on Flight 1918? Maybe this is all a ruse and there’s really no coincidence to it at all. Yeah, that’s it. A ruse.

    Following a Ramirez infield base hit, which must have erroneously put it into his head that he is indeed, fast, David Ortiz singles to right, and Manny makes like the Energizer bunny for third. No contest. It may have been the first time Dale Sveum tried to stop a runner all year.

    Second Inning: The temptation of free cornrows, as one barber salon was dishing out early yesterday morning on Lansdowne Street, really had the gerbil working overtime on my way into the office. Then I remembered the whole balding thing and decided against, thinking I might look like something out of “Hellraiser.”

    Trot Nixon puts the first jolt of caffeine into the sold out crowd with a two-run bomb to right that cuts New York’s lead to one. The first “Yankees Suck” chant also breaks out. The highly offended among us try to explain that it’s not true. Yeah, neither is McDonald’s, “I’m lovin’ it.” So what?

    The crowd really lets Kevin Brown have it, chanting his name. I wonder if Brown likes being the center of attention of the city of Boston. After all, just last year he was in Los Angeles, sitting under a palm tree with barely enough money to rent a yacht to Catalina.

    RIGHT NOW! Kevin Brown is getting hammered.

    Jeter bobbles a ball, and it’s 4-3 Sox. Questions begin to arise about the man’s deity.

    Third Inning: Back to the Cowsills, who in addition to the Anthem, sang their hit, “Hair,” which I guess is apropos with this band of free-flowing locks Red Sox. But who exactly is lining up the singers for these ALCS games? Last year, Joey McIntyre and Michael Bolton were roundly booed during their renditions, and the ‘Sills (the inspiration for the Patridge Family!) didn’t exactly receive an outpouring of acknowledgement from the Fenway fans.

    Then again, I guess it’s one less day that the Dropkick Murphys perform.

    Which brings to mind a suggestions reader Steve Sylven submitted: “Hey Eric- Now that the Sox have proclaimed themselves "idiots" do you think we can implement a new theme song? I'm thinking we go with Jane's Addiction's "Idiots Rule" and finally dropkick the Murphy's over the Green Monster? I can't stand the thought of winning it all this year and having to hear Tessie for the rest of my lifetime.”

    I like it. Although I’m sure when Charles Steinberg hears the lyrics, it won’t fly. Where’s Dickie Barrett when you need him most?

    A-Rod plants one over the left field wall and ties the game back up. A couple more hits later, Terry Francona makes his way to yank Arroyo, who obviously doesn’t have it. Ramiro Mendoza makes his way to the mound, and actually receives applause from eight fans down the first base line.

    In the ALDS, Arroyo threw the best start of all Boston starters. This series, by far the worst with two-plus innings, allowing six runs. As Chris Berman would call a strikeout, “Ughagh.”

    Torre lifts Brown after just two innings, in favor of Javier Vazquez. We can only assume this is because Ja-Ve-Air is tougher to chant.

    Fourth Inning: It is 10 p.m. and I did just write fourth inning correct? At the rate this one is going, it’ll be a nice little three hour nap before we’re all back here again tomorrow.

    Which reminds me…must tape “Desperate Housewives.”

    They ran out of Swiss Miss up here and I thought more than a few of the New York media guys were going to lose it. Like BA Baracus before he flies.

    Sheffield. Bomb. 9-6. It is THE FOURTH INNING.

    Triple. 11-6. FOURTH INNING. This game in the end is going to have more runs than your average day at Taco Bell.

    Fifth Inning: Before the game, Howie Long, in town for Sunday’s Patriots-Seahawks game, and the rest of the FOX NFL crew were hanging out down by the Red Sox dugout. Long was giving Mets pitcher Al Leiter, who by all accounts has been great in the booth, some advice about the broadcasting business. Hopefully he passed some on to McCarver.

    They should have Francona miked for this game. I can only imagine the Boston manager. “Get an out. Please, can’t someone get a &^%$#@& out?” 13-6 Yankees. The 19 runs combined thus far set an ALCS record for most runs in a game. Can we mention it is the FIFTH INNING?

    Sixth Inning: Fans in right field start to chant, “We want Tanyon,” as in Worcester’s own Tanyon Sturtze. Speaking of the Sturtzes, The Newark Ledger had a piece Friday about how they were forced to convert to the dark side after their son was traded by Tampa Bay to New York. There is good news for Tanyon’s family though. His performance this season for the Yankees pretty much assures them they can go back to rooting for the Sox once the season is over.

    By golly, we’ve had our first inning last less than 45 minutes. Now we’re cooking.

    Seventh Inning: Mark Bellhorn picked a fine time for one of his worst games of the season. A strikeout hat trick, and now he can’t squeeze a pop fly in the top of the inning. Time for Lobel to whip out those “Pokey would have had it” bumper stickers again.

    As the Yankees run it to 16-6, fans start cheering, “Let’s go Patriots.” Thousands start to file out toward the exit.

    Seventh inning stretch at 11:32. This is ridiculous.

    Jason Varitek homers to make it 17-8. Not exactly the moment that makes the columnists here start to re-write their pieces to alter the outcome.

    Eighth inning: It’s the eighth. One more inning to go. That’s really all the commentary I have left at this point.

    Sweet Caroline is a heck of a lot less peppy tonight for some reason.

    Ninth Inning: Hooray!!!!!

    By the time this game ends, there are going to be about 17 people left here at the rate folks are rushing to the gates, unable to take the pain anymore.

    Matsui homers for two more. Don’t these guys want to go to their hotel already?

    Twenty-one hits by New York tie record for an ALCS game. Boston had 21 against Roger Clemens and New York in 1999.

    Twenty-two hits by New York are a new record for hits in an ALCS game.

    It was the longest game in ALCS history. And quite possibly the worst.

    Apparently this won't be the year the Sox enjoy a pregame ceremony at Foxborough. How many times are they going to have to invite those guys here without a return trip?

    Seeing as we’re sure after the National Anthem most of you ran out and picked up the Cowsills’ greatest hits and were forced to miss the game, here’s a recap…
    Like I said...HAIRBALL

  5. #65


    The Red Sox make the perfect adversary for the YANKEES and Yankee fans. What other team hates them more? What fans hate the Yankees more? (sorry METS fans). What fans have a better reason to hate them? It makes for the perfect rivalry, even if this series is somewhat of a letdown. At least we got some fun t-shirts out of it.

    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

    The BOSTON GLOBE's take on the fans/series...

    Jon Remy ("S" - no relation to RemDawg), Max Schonberger ("O"), and Lee Smith ("X" - no relation to the former Sox closer) want the Yankees to win, but can't bring themselves to root for them against Minnesota.

    Diehard fans Jim Moonan and Joe Bennett from Milton say they definitely want New York next so they can beat them on the way to a World Series.

    Jenna Medeiros and Meaghan Connolly from Framingham State college want vindication for what the Yankees did to the Sox last year... but they won't root for them to beat the Twins.

    Scott Argir (L) and Steve Vafides from Framingham said "bring on the Yankees because it's payback time." They also said it doesn't matter. File under: flip-flop.

    GAME 1

    Ralph Bracco of North Babylon, New York, responds to Curt Schilling’s hope to shut up 55,000 New York fans at Yankee Stadium by inquiring about the rest of the yard’s capacity. Schilling was rocked for six runs over three innings, doing anything but shutting Yankee fans down.

    John Palmieri of Yonkers, asks, “What rivalry?”

    GAME 2

    Rich Tershuny, of Manhattan, proudly displays the MLB-licensed t-shirt that caused the ire of Red Sox Nation. The t-shirt was pulled from shelves following complaints.

    Although there were still plenty of makeshift “Daddy” t-shirts as this Yankee fan demonstrates. There are sure to be plenty more on the mound tonight when Pedro Martinez takes the hill in Game 2.

    Dave McDonald of Spring Lake, NJ proudly displays the very close knockoff of the original and controversial Major League Baseball t-shirt . The shirts were being handed out prior to the game by a New Jersey radio station to anyone who would jump up and down and repeat, “Who’s Your Daddy?”

    Yes, Darth Vader has been at Yankee Stadium before rooting on the Evil Empire, but with Pedro Martinez calling the Yankees his “Daddy,” his presence has taken on a whole new meaning.

    Vinny Milano of Queens hawks “Pedro’s Daddy” t-shirts outside of Yankee Stadium with, who else, but The Babe playing the part.

    Food vendors set up outside the park got into the act as well.

    As poorly as Pedro pitched against the Yankees in back-to-back outings last month, we highly doubt Carlos Acevedo of Hartford, Conn., is in fact Martinez’s father.

    As do we doubt Lenny Lipschitz of the Bronx is of any relation.

    GAME 3

    The Lighter Side took a stroll down Lansdowne Street early this morning in search of a little Red Sox fever. What did we find?

    For starters, there was a Newbury Street salon that had set up shop in front of Gate C to offer free cornrows to fans who wanted to emulate tonight's ALCS Game 3 starter Bronson Arroyo. And we also stumbled into what could very well be the epicenter of Red Sox Nation.

    First, a quick look at the die-hards getting cornrows put in their hair. Here, stylists from Salon Marc Harris transform Leominster resident Michael Paul's 'do from caveman to cornrows. Erin Connors (also from Leominster) gets into the spirit as well

    How do you pass 22 hours in a tent on Lansdowne Street? Playing some Texas Hold 'Em, that's how.

    Meet the self-proclaimed original Yankee Hater from Mattapan (left), Bernie Tulip from Saugus (center), and Tom Demetron from Kenmore Square. Tulip and Demetron claim to have a little more at stake than most of those in the Lansdowne Village.

    "We're definitely losing our jobs today," said Demetron. "We work right there (points to a nearby Best Buy store). We work there just to be close to Fenway. Today, we're not going in, and they know where we are."


    The Prudential building displayed its traditional "Go Sox" message for Saturday night’s Game 3 at Fenway Park, which would turn out to be one of the most disappointing losses in Sox postseason history.

    Damon Disciples Branden Hutchinson and Matt Anders predicted before the game that “tonight’s the night” for their man Johnny to break out of his ALCS slump. Maybe next time, fellas.

    Brad Howe and Matt Thibeault led the cheers for section 26 during Boston’s second-inning rally.

    Manny Ramirez and Pedro Martinez encourage Fenway partisans to “Keep the Faith” as they file out of Fenway after Saturday’s loss. Facing a 3-0 deficit, faith may be hard to come by Sunday morning in Red Sox Nation.


    Hate the Red Sox or hate the Yankees, you have to love this rivalry.... :lol:

  6. #66
    Moderator NYatKNIGHT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Manhattan - South Village


    Great photos!

    Anyway, the sweep would have been humiliating, but it's almost better to let them win one - it's more painful when they think they actually have a chance.

  7. #67


    October 17, 2004

    Maybe Red Sox Fans Enjoy Their Pain

    HERE'S a soothing thought, Red Sox fans: Losing isn't everything.

    True, social scientists who study sports have found plenty of reasons for fans to root for a winner, like basking in the reflected glory of the team, finding a community of friends, even buffering oneself against feelings of despair. The sudden pleasure of watching a walk-off home run or overtime goal can touch the deepest emotional centers of the brain, research suggests, and even make some supporters feel more socially confident and attractive.

    But those who are repeatedly denied the pleasures of winning find other compensations, which psychologists say go beyond the shallow charms of being simply a lovable underdog. "Long-suffering is not quite the right phrase, because at some level, I think, we do like it," said Christopher Peterson, a psychologist at the University of Michigan who is a Red Sox and Cubs fan. "So much of the human condition is about striving."

    Make no mistake: the Red Sox nation wants nothing more than to win it all, shake off the team's history and throw a party to transcend all hangovers. And a defeat of the New York Yankees might be even sweeter.

    But years of futility forces fans to express their identification in ways that go beyond merely celebrating wins and mourning losses. Loyalty to the club at all costs, an interest in the history of the team and emotional resilience often count more to supporters of cursed teams than victorious ones, said Dr. Christian End, a psychologist at Xavier University in Cincinnati who studies the relation between sports affiliation and self-presentation.

    And these fans can be very appealing. In one study among 87 college students, Dr. End found that supporters of losing squads are if anything viewed more positively by their peers than fans of successful teams.

    "No one can accuse you of being a lightweight fan," Dr. End said. "You've creatively changed the dimensions of comparison to include not just the outcome, the score, but measures of character."

    People who root for losers also quickly learn how to explain and adjust to failure, skills that psychologists say are emotionally protective. Fans often come up with a short list of bad omens, wrong-headed decisions and misfortune.

    "Injuries, officiating, the weather, some player's attitude, the curse - fans of unsuccessful clubs are particularly good at finding explanations other than their team is a bunch of chokers," said Dr. Daniel L. Wann, a Cub fan and psychologist at Murray State University in Murray, Ky., who has spent a career studying sports affiliation. Some explanations are no more than excuses or superstition. Many Cubs supporters still blame a fan who interfered with a foul ball during last year's National League playoffs for sinking the entire season, despite costly errors made by players on the field.

    In special cases, fans agree on the cause of the loss, like the 1986 World Series, when Bill Buckner, the Red Sox first baseman, missed a ground ball, allowing the New York Mets to win. Other legitimate explanations, like injuries to key players, allow fans to take their team off the hook, soften the emotional blow of losing and salvage their emotional investment in the franchise.

    This ability to consider multiple and combined reasons for failure - of spreading blame, if appropriate - can be especially helpful to people who blame themselves for things they have very little control over. It's a strategy that comes in very handy in other areas of personal life, said Dr. David Zald, a psychologist at Vanderbilt University. For instance, it can help any parent explain to a 7-year-old why her soccer team just lost by five goals.

    Finally, supporting a losing team gives fans a psychological trump card. The long-denied supporters of teams like the Chicago White Sox, the Los Angeles Kings, the Colorado Rockies - the list is too long print, but you know who you are - know that one day, their team will almost certainly win it all, and the magnificence of that coming victory grows in the imagination with every blown save, every fumble, every mind-boggling collapse.

    They know, too, that the fantasies of this deliverance are so cherished that the championship itself, if and when it happens, may somehow fall short.

    The party will end, the curse vanish, and there will be no more heroic striving toward a paradise not yet found, but therefore not yet lost.

  8. #68


    Did I ever mention I grew up in Boston?

  9. #69


    Let me be the first to say:


    Ha to all you mourning Yankee fans.

  10. #70

    Default The worst choke in baseball history.



  11. #71


    I guess we derserve that for all the years of abuse. But remember, you've been down this road before.

    As for you Stern: The expected, typical response from Mets fans - who usually lose interest in baseball by Labor Day. Quite different from '86, when most Yankee fans wanted the Mets to win.

  12. #72
    Moderator NYatKNIGHT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Manhattan - South Village


    For some reason I never had the urge to flip a car over last night.

  13. #73


    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp
    But remember, you've been down this road before.
    I can see a Pedro/Rocket game 7 where Clemens will pitch a no-hitter or some craziness like that.
    It's funny, the most surprising thing would be a Sox World Series victory. At this point I can't even fathom it, much less hope for it. I almost feel guilty for even entertaining the notion. :?

  14. #74


    Personally, the only good to come out of this is a repair of my decades-long friendship with a Boston native, which was put under intense pressure after Aaron Boone. His wife advised me to "call back in a few days." After enduring his moronic rantings last night (I should have tossed the phone), all is well.

    Of course, if the Red Sox lose (tsk tsk, you've assumed Houston), it will somehow be my fault.

  15. #75
    Senior Member Dynamicdezzy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Queens, New York


    i really hope houston wins game 7 to face off against boston. i am a die hard yankee fan but they deserved it. they played with so much heart, something the yankee team lacked. If houston wins, i would love to see pettite and clemens celebrate, which would be a huge slap for steinbrenner. yankees had NO ptching what so ever. All that money WASTED on AROD.... atleast we'll entertain ourselves with all the changes for next season. I could go on for a while about what was wrong with the yankees, but oh well its over. congrats to boston.

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