View Poll Results: Do you like the final design of Beekman Place?

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  • Yes

    150 85.71%
  • No

    25 14.29%
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Thread: 8 Spruce Street - Beekman Tower - by Frank Gehry

  1. #691

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    Maybe sfenn1117 got that impression because most of your posting on this forum has a negative connotation.

  2. #692

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    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby
    Well, if you bothered to read the article all the way through, you would have seen this:.
    From silvercup thread

  3. #693
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    Maybe sfenn1117 got that impression because most of your posting on this forum has a negative connotation.
    My posts are fine, thank you. In fact, I would gladly put them up against yours for comparison any day.

    One more thing, greenie.
    I wouldn't go around attacking other people's posts as negative if I were you, especially considering your only post above in this thread is not only unsolicited and off topic but its sole intention is clearly to slander.

  4. #694

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    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby
    My posts are fine, thank you. In fact, I would gladly put them up against yours for comparison any day.

    One more thing, greenie.
    I wouldn't go around attacking other people's posts as negative if I were you, especially considering your only post above in this thread is not only unsolicited and off topic but its sole intention is clearly to slander.
    Oh, please. You were rude. You get what you give. - You're off topic as well; it happens. - Stating one's opinion isn't slander. - And you're wrong. I've posted 4 times in this thread. - Unsolicited. Okay, I guess you can have that. But normally discussion on a message board doesn't require solicitation.

    I wasn't trying to diss you. My reason for posting was to agree with sfenn1117 that I too sensed some, for the lack of a better word, 'cattiness' in your post above. Can we try to be respectful in our posts and keep the discussion productive?

    MecEngineer: How long has the plan been on hold? And do you know why it was put on hold?

  5. #695
    Build the Tower Verre antinimby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    Oh, please. You were rude. You get what you give.
    Okay, I see you want to drag this further with insults. It was really a non-issue for me but since you have made this into something personal between us, here goes...

    Like I said to sfenn1117, your impression that my post was rude, is way off the mark. Apparently, you and him seem to be the only ones to feel that way. And apparently even he understands it now, so it's only you that have a problem with it. I don't believe I need to defend that post of mine but since some people--like yourself, just don't seem to get it, so I'll explain it.

    This is what I said:
    I don't get it. Apparently when you say "for some time," you really mean just a month or so because you indicated back on January 26 that work was still going on:
    I wanted to clarify that what he meant by
    "for some time" was not a year or 6 months but only a little more than a month. Is that so rude?

    Like everyone is saying, I think the project is going to go forward.
    MecEngineer, get ready to go back to work on this soon.
    Again, based on the reasoning that the project was only on hold briefly, I felt that it was not in any jeopardy of being scratched and even lightheartedly predicted to him that he will work on it again. That really sounds rude, right? If that is rude, then what kind of wonderland fairy tale world are you living in?

    So now, you are the one who is rude to be so quick in calling someone else rude, when it's due to your own ignorance. If anything, you should apologize to me for your misunderstanding but instead you decided to go on this offensive, making a non-issue into a big deal.


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    - You're off topic as well; it happens.
    Only in response to your inflammatory comments, just like what I am doing right now.


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    - Stating one's opinion isn't slander.
    It is, if the opinion is directed towards another forumer member's conduct and as I have pointed out, is totally baseless. You don't see me labelling you or anyone else on this forum, do you?


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    - And you're wrong. I've posted 4 times in this thread
    Congratulations.


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    - Unsolicited. Okay, I guess you can have that. But normally discussion on a message board doesn't require solicitation.
    It was a discussion between me and sfenn1117, regarding something that has nothing to do with you. But somehow you felt the need to butt in with a disparaging remark on my "posting having a negative connotation." I would definitely call that unsolicited and even rude.


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    I wasn't trying to diss you.
    Yes you are. Your comments so far reeks of resentment. What's the matter?
    Did I say something that had ticked you off?
    You know, a difference of opinion on skyscrapers is nothing to hold a personal grudge over, something apparently you are incapable of grasping.


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    My reason for posting was to agree with sfenn1117 that I too sensed some, for the lack of a better word, 'cattiness' in your post above.
    Yes, this forum really needed you to step in and point out cattiness to us, with some cattiness of your own.


    Quote Originally Posted by greenie
    Can we try to be respectful in our posts and keep the discussion productive?
    I might want to ask you the same thing.
    Last edited by antinimby; March 23rd, 2006 at 02:12 AM.

  6. #696
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    my two cents ...

    I don't see how anyone can claim title to a discussion on an open board. If it was a private discussion then it should move to PMs.


  7. #697
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    antinimby - you're a sensitive one, aren't you? If you're so easily offended, why don't you just skip this topic and read another one?

  8. #698

    Question you know...about the building?

    So is there any new info about....you know.... the building? New height number, design, render?

    Not that don't enjoy getting get my hopes up everytime I see there is a new post on this thread only to find out it is the continuation of a pointless argument.

    but really... any news...

  9. #699

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    One comment on the above side discussion:

    I did not consider antinmby's post to be rude or sarcastic. Maybe the tone was ambiguous. Since you can't get into his head and know his intent, you should accept his explanation that it was not meant to be sarcastic.

    The building: It has to hold some sort of record for the longest time without any visual example. Nothing but numbers and descriptions.

  10. #700

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp
    The building: It has to hold some sort of record for the longest time without any visual example. Nothing but numbers and descriptions.

    Not only that, but it was sometime back in the 70's that we last saw any progress of Gehry's Atlantic Yards project in Brooklyn. April is just around the corner, and we will learn the fate of some of Downtown's more promising developments (Freedom Tower, 80 South St, Beekman, etc.)...

  11. #701

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    http://www.downtownexpress.com/de_15...arentheat.html

    Facing parent heat, Walcott says school deal is close

    By Ronda Kaysen

    An agreement with the state on funding for two Downtown schools is 10 days away, Deputy Mayor Dennis Walcott told Lower Manhattan parents this week.

    Last month, Mayor Michael Bloomberg announced that 21 New York City schools had been cut from the city’s capital budget and another 68 schools were at risk of being delayed, including 11 in which preliminary work had begun. Among the schools on the list were two Downtown schools—an annex for P.S. 234 in Tribeca and the Beekman School, a new K-8 planned for the Eastside.

    The mayor insists the city does not have the money to fund the schools because of a budget shortfall from Albany. Bloomberg said that he needs $6.5 billion in state funds to complete a five-year, $13.1 billion capital construction plan. The governor maintains the city has received its due.

    But as Albany nears its April 1 budget deadline, negotiations between the city and state are heating up.
    “We have 10 more days to go as far as drawing the money from Albany goes,” Walcott told Downtown parents at a

    Community Board 1 public meeting on Tuesday night. “We’re close, we’re really close.”

    Eileen Larrabee, a spokesperson for Assembly Speaker Sheldon Silver, who represents Lower Manhattan, said the speaker and the mayor have had “numerous conversations” about the schools and budget in recent weeks. “In every conversation the speaker presses the issue for the new schools with the mayor,” she said.

    The state Legislature has proposed a multi-year plan to deliver $1.8 billion to city schools. The Senate produced a plan to provide New York City with about $140 million to pay for debt service so the city could borrow $1.8 billion.

    Walcott called the Senate’s plan “totally unacceptable” and voiced support for the Assembly’s plan.

    The money in the capital budget is only a portion of what some say the city is owed. A Campaign for Fiscal Equity lawsuit found that the city was owed $5.6 billion a year in operational funds and a one-time payment of $9 billion in capital funds to city schools. The mayor has not stepped up pressure for those funds and the governor is appealing the ruling.

    Parents were not appeased by Walcott’s confidence that their schools might soon be funded. Many parents questioned why the two schools made it onto the list in the first place. Both of the Downtown schools were part of a written agreement among the city, developers and the community to build high-rise residential towers on public land in exchange for the schools. The community agreed to higher and bulkier buildings in order to secure the schools.

    “Our city leaders are failing us,” said Eric Colby, a P.S. 234 parent. “The contract was fundamentally tied with the sale of the land. There’s an implied commitment for using the funds to build the schools.”

    Walcott said that the agreement, signed by Deputy Mayor Daniel Doctoroff and City Councilmember Alan Gerson, was always contingent on state funding. “Part of what we’re doing is making sure we get the state dollars that were part of that,” he said.

    The agreement promised $44 million of the Dept. of Ed. budget to build an Eastside school, contingent upon $25 million from the Lower Manhattan Development Corp. It made no mention of state funds.

    Schools Chancellor Joel Klein told Downtown Express a few weeks ago that the $44 million set aside for the Beekman school was shifted to other projects and the school was in doubt when he announced it last year. Silver accused Klein of “lying” and said if the chancellor doesn’t apologize, Bloomberg should consider asking for Klein’s resignation.

    Gerson, who attended Tuesday’s meeting, challenged Walcott’s characterization of the Sept. 2004 agreement he signed. “I was present at the negotiations and I can assure you that… there was never any mention of C.F.E. as a prerequisite and these were among the most detailed negotiations that I have been engaged in,” Gerson said.

    Parents also voiced concern about overcrowding at their schools. P.S. 234, the only elementary school for the neighborhood east of West St. to the East River and from Canal St. to the Battery, is at 120 percent capacity this year and is expected to grow more next year. The annex would cost $6.5 million and would have provided an additional six classrooms.

    The 630-seat Beekman School would siphon Eastside kids away from P.S. 234. The $65 million school is slated for a 75-story tower on Beekman St., which will break ground next month.

    When a P.S. 234 parent asked Walcott how schoolchildren should cope with losing their science room next year to crowding, Walcott, who oversees education issues for the mayor, was unaware of the problem. “If you are not aware that we have to remove a science lab next year, you have not done your homework,” heckled one audience member from the crowd.

    “If your plan to get the money released from the state doesn’t work out, we need to have a backup plan,” said Kathy Sussell, parent coordinator for P.S. 234.

    “We have been looking at contingency plans as far as options for neighborhoods throughout the city,” said Walcott, although he declined to comment to Downtown Express about what those contingency efforts might entail.


    Ronda@DowntownExpress.com

    Downtown Express is published by
    Community Media LLC.
    Downtown Express | 487 Greenwich St., Suite 6A | New York, NY 10013

  12. #702

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    Maybe we should open a 'is antinimby offensive' thread somewhere

  13. #703
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSpice
    antinimby - you're a sensitive one, aren't you? If you're so easily offended, why don't you just skip this topic and read another one?
    Lol. If you had read the previous posts carefully, you'd know that I wasn't the one with any sensitivity issues nor did I brought it about. I only replied to false accusations and insults, something I know you wouldn't have hesitated one second to do yourself.

    Both of the Downtown schools were part of a written agreement among the city, developers and the community to build high-rise residential towers on public land in exchange for the schools.
    I wasn't aware the Beekman lot was public land. Wasn't it owned by Pace University, a private university?

  14. #704
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    It was owned by NY Downtown Hospital. Is that owned by the NYCHHC?

  15. #705
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    Default Some related news

    Deal in Albany on Budget Gives New School Aid

    By DANNY HAKIM and JENNIFER MEDINA
    Published: March 29, 2006

    ALBANY, Wednesday, March 29 — Legislative leaders agreed Tuesday on a $112.4 billion budget that authorized $11.2 billion for school construction in New York City and included a broad tax-cut package that would send property tax rebate checks to homeowners across the state.

    The deal to provide the city with school construction money over several years through a complex bonding plan came in last-minute negotiations as the Assembly and the Senate raced toward a midnight deadline to print budget bills so they can pass a budget by the April 1 deadline for the second time in more than two decades. Even after midnight, there was some dispute over whether they had beaten the clock.

    The tax-cut plan was said to be worth $4.1 billion over the next two years. The plan calls for sending homeowners rebate checks averaging $400, and also includes a formula to provide school tax relief to New York City residents.

    The package also gives families child tax credits worth up to $330 for each child ages 4 to 17, eliminating the sales tax on clothing purchases of less than $110, eliminating the so-called marriage penalty that can make it more expensive for couples living together to marry, and reducing several taxes on businesses.

    But Gov. George E. Pataki has not said if he would sign off on the Legislature's budget agreement, which raises his $110.6 billion proposal to what Senate officials said would be $112.4 billion. The plan is also likely to draw criticism from budget watchdog groups concerned about the state's rising debt.

    The agreement on school construction aid for New York City comes after a court ordered the state last week to increase financing for city schools. The legal battle over education financing stems from a lawsuit brought by the Campaign for Fiscal Equity, a coalition of parent and community groups.

    Under the agreement in the Legislature, Albany would issue $2.6 billion in bonds through the state's dormitory authority, with New York City receiving $1.8 billion this year. That would allow the city to build the 21 schools that the mayor had threatened to shelve this year. The remaining $800 million would be distributed to other school districts.

    But the biggest victory for the city came in the form of an unusual plan to allow the city to borrow up to $9.4 billion through the New York City Transitional Finance Authority. The state's annual payments for school construction — which lawmakers said could total $4.7 billion — would be used instead to guarantee the new bonds, and the state would agree to provide enough future funding to keep the bonding program afloat.

    "This money to build new schools — if passed by both houses and signed into law by Governor Pataki — is a great deal for this and future generations of New York City schoolchildren," said Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg. "I think we can all look forward to starting years of new school construction projects across New York City very soon."

    Assembly Speaker Sheldon Silver said, "We will have, by this, complied entirely with the construction provision of the C.F.E. decision, in its entirety, by this authorization."

    The legislative plan would also increase spending on operating aid to schools by $1.1 billion in the coming fiscal year, with roughly $400 million going to New York City. But it comes nowhere near the $4.7 billion to $5.6 billion increase in assistance for New York City public schools that the courts have ordered spent over the next four years.

    "As far as we're concerned, they're out of compliance," said Geri D. Palast, the executive director of the Campaign for Fiscal Equity. "This is what the mayor had asked for all along, which shows that where there is a political will, at the end of the day, it happens. It is still nowhere near enough."

    Senator Frank Padavan, one of four Republicans from New York City who have been under pressure by the mayor and education advocates to increase school spending, said, "The city is getting everything in there but the kitchen sink, so the mayor should be extremely happy.

    "I don't think they can build or spend the money any faster than what they're getting," he added.

    Lawmakers in the Assembly were gratified that the agreement would guarantee the city a large annual sum apart from the normal formula for disbursing statewide school aid.

    To read the rest of the article, go here.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/29/ny.../29fiscal.html

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