Reply With QuoteBuilding tall and narrow doesn't take away as much sun as building short and fat. I can not understand why these people are so hellbent on height.
Well, at least they didn't cave on the height reduction for Miss Brooklyn.Originally Posted by New York Times
I can't believe I'm saying this, but that actually might be a good thing. More open space = less footprint of buildings on the site. I'm curious to know, however, how they intend to balance that, while reducing height. Maybe the majority of the apartment paring will occur at the shortened towers.The recommendations also called on the developer to reduce the height of two more buildings and to increase the amount of open space to 8 acres from 7 acres.
Broken record.Daniel Goldstein, a spokesman for Develop Don’t Destroy Brooklyn, called the reductions “insignificant.”
“Even if it was scaled back by 50 percent, it would still be one of the most dense residential complexes in the country,” he said. “Whether it’s 5 percent or 50 percent, it does not make any difference, as long as they continue to use eminent domain.”
Not likely. Where are you going to fit all those extra units? If you don't build up, you have to build out. I'd rather gain some more extra space and give up some sun, than vice versa.Councilman Bill DeBlasio of Park Slope, who calls himself a project supporter, said more changes were needed. “We need to go farther than what City Planning has called for,” he said. “I think we can reduce the height, while continuing to maintain the affordable housing component.”
Building tall and narrow doesn't take away as much sun as building short and fat. I can not understand why these people are so hellbent on height.
Well I'm relieved. 8% seems alot better than 28%.
NY Post
RATNER'S TALL ORDER OK'D
By RICH CALDER
September 26, 2006 -- Bruce Ratner's dream of building the tallest tower in Brooklyn won the backing of the city's Planning Commission yesterday, but the rest of his megadevelopment at Atlantic Yards would have to be scaled back by 8 percent.
City planners, during a meeting yesterday, raved about the Frank Gehry-designed, 620-foot-high "Miss Brooklyn" tower proposed for the intersection of Atlantic and Flatbush avenues.
But the commission members requested that Ratner reduce the size of several other towers in the project, including a high-rise proposed for Dean Street and Sixth Avenue that they said should be chopped from 428 feet to 240 feet.
The commission is expected to send a letter to the Empire State Development Corp. also requesting that two other buildings proposed for Atlantic Avenue be built at lower heights and that the 22-acre project include at least 8 acres of open space instead of the 7 acres called for by Ratner.
The EDSC, which is overseeing the project, could snub the Planning Commission's proposed changes with a two-thirds majority vote, but that's unlikely considering the city's financial backing for the plan.
rich.calder@nypost.com
That's just a RECOMMENDATION. If you asked the NIMBYs, they probably won't be satisfied unless it was closer 80% or even 100%.
Nothing over 3 stories and green spaces all around.
This will do the NIMBY's nicely. Just one floor and lots of green space. Notice how Ghery remains faithful to the initial designs by keeping Miss Brooklyn's wooden front stoop.
Last edited by kurokevin; September 26th, 2006 at 02:32 PM.
Chalk up the bombed out look for the "nostalgic" feel everyone is wanting these days.
These two statements are signs of extreme short sightedness and an obvious lack of understanding of what Brooklyn as well as New York City will be in the next 20 years.City Councilwoman Letitia James, who represents the neighborhood, said the reductions were “inadequate” and would only help to “further the Manhattanization of Brooklyn.”
“Even if it was scaled back by 50 percent, it would still be one of the most dense residential complexes in the country,” he said. “Whether it’s 5 percent or 50 percent, it does not make any difference, as long as they continue to use eminent domain.”
Time moves on you cannot hold back change in the name of nostalgia.
Great idea. Definitely a good second choice to the shrinking of Miss Brooklyn. They should have looked to have added more open space to at least 10 acres even if some of the other towers we given some more height. NIMBY shortsightedness again cost the are project some valuable green space.
Ms James, it's now the HongKongization of Manhattan and the Shanghaiization of Brooklyn. As for all those brownstones: that's the BackBayization of Park Slope.
NY1 News
City Planning Commission Votes To Decrease Size Of Atlantic Yards Project
September 27, 2006
The City Planning Commission voted unanimously Wednesday on recommendations to decrease the size of the Atlantic Yards project.
The project has sparked many protests in the past but Wednesday's vote went off with little fan fare. That does not mean everyone is happy with the plan.
"Because it is located at the intersection of three of the borough's major commercial thoroughfares, a level of density is appropriate," said City Planning Commission Chair Amanda Burden. "It will bring vitality, investment, energy and excitement to this great borough."
"The adverse impacts of this proposed project outweigh all of the social benefits. They include traffic mitigation. They include the displacement of a significant number of poor people and people of color," said Brooklyn City Councilmember Letitia James. "It will result in instant gentrification."
The panel has recommended that developer Bruce Ratner reduce the size of three towers, eliminate an estimated 382 apartments and add an acre of open space.
However, the proposed building known as "Miss Brooklyn" would not be scaled down, making it the tallest building in the borough.
Brooklyn Borough President Marty Markowitz says even with the changes, it will be impossible to make everyone happy.
"There are some groups that under any circumstance will never support this, either because they're against eminent domain, which will be very modestly used in this project, extremely modestly," he said. "There are those that are against major developments and they are not going to be swayed."
Critics say even a scaled down project is too big and, ultimately, the City Planning's recommendations won't matter because the project still needs approval from the state Public Authorities Control board, which includes Governor George Pataki, State Assembly Speaker Sheldon Silver and State Senate Majority Leader Joe Bruno.
"City Planning has no say in this project. It's a recommendation," said Daniel Goldstein of Develop-Don't Destroy Brooklyn. "I think that it's a sad day yesterday for city planning and urban planners in general, because what we have is a massive plan with no urban planning going on, just recommendations."
A spokesperson for Forest City Ratner says the company will work with the planning department to ensure the success of the project.
Copyright © 2006 NY1 News.
^
com‧pro‧mise ˈkɒm prəˌmaɪz
–noun
1. a settlement of differences by mutual concessions; an agreement reached by adjustment of conflicting or opposing claims, principles, etc., by reciprocal modification of demands.
2. the result of such a settlement.
3. something intermediate between different things
–verb
1. to make a compromise or compromises
2. to make a dishonorable or shameful concession
.
This is pathetic. The NIMBY's strike again.
Want cheaper rents? How about letting these developers build as much housing as they can among the space? As long as there isn't a sufficient amount of housing to sarisfy NYC's ppulation, rents will always be high.
Atlantic Yards Developer Accepts 8% Reduction in Project
By NICHOLAS CONFESSORE
Published: September 28, 2006
The developer of the Atlantic Yards project in Brooklyn said yesterday that the company would support changes proposed by the city planning commission earlier this week, including an 8 percent reduction in the project’s size, additional public space and changes to the designs of several buildings.
Those changes were discussed at Monday’s meeting of the planning commission and formally proposed in a letter to the developer, Forest City Ratner, released yesterday by Amanda M. Burden, the commission’s chairwoman.
Ms. Burden also said the developer would ensure that at least 30 percent of the apartments built during the project’s first phase will be below-market rental units. A total of 2,250 such rental units are planned for the project, which will have 8.7 million square feet. The developer, according to the letter, has also committed to building the remaining 70 percent during the second phase.
That commitment will be stipulated in housing and infrastructure subsidies that the city is negotiating with Forest City, which is also the development partner in building a new Midtown headquarters for The New York Times Company.
“From our perspective, we’re agreeing to their suggestions,” said James P. Stuckey, an executive vice president with Forest City. “We think their strategic cuts make sense from a planning point of view, and allow the affordable housing to get built.”
Because the developer has not disclosed financial projections, however, it is difficult to determine if further cuts would have made it impossible for the developer to include the full allotment of low-cost housing.
The company’s agreement was to some extent preordained: yesterday’s formal recommendations followed months of discussion. Moreover, the new reduction only brings the project back to the original size proposed in 2003. Critics and supporters of the project have called for it to be shrunk between a third and a half.
Ms. Burden yesterday defended the relatively modest reduction in scale, saying that the project, which would extend east from the intersection of Flatbush and Atlantic Avenues near Downtown Brooklyn, would be in an ideal location for a high-density development. “It is a transit hub,” she added. “It is at the crossroads of two wide avenues in Brooklyn. It can accommodate density, and density brings excitement, foot traffic, jobs.”
The developer will also adopt suggestions to maximize retail use of the street level, leave more room between the project’s residential buildings and widen entrances leading from surrounding streets into the project’s open space.
The Empire State Development Corporation, which is sponsoring the $4.5 billion residential, office and arena development, must still formally incorporate the new design guidelines into the general project plan, which it is likely to do. Under state law, the development corporation may reject the commission’s recommendations with a two-thirds vote of its board.
Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company
This sounds good and urban.The developer will also adopt suggestions to maximize retail use of the street level...
This sounds like it could lead to the same old "buildings in a park" that brought us the projects.leave more room between the project’s residential buildings...
This sounds spatially suburban. Pedestrians can find entrances without being hit over the head.and widen entrances leading from surrounding streets into the project’s open space.
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