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Thread: Atlantic Yards Development - Commercial, Residential, Retail, NBA Arena

  1. #2896
    Kings County Loyal BrooklynLove's Avatar
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    More empty cheerleading. Makes for entertaining reading but contains zero eplanation beyond the general comment that the economy is difficult right now. If the argument is that Ratner can't get it done then we'll see.

  2. #2897

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynLove View Post
    Do you fill out a customer service survey when you have complaints or when you have complements?
    What does this have to do with the price of fish?

    More empty cheerleading.
    LOL.

  3. #2898

    Default

    In response to the Newark jabber. It's city status has improved of late. There's actually a nice little art scene developing there. Go there for the Portoguese festival. That's pretty fun. Especially if you are fond of Brazilian girls and pig roasts (in whatever combination suites you).

    Sports teams don't need to be located in desirable places to succeed (re. Cleveland, Cincinatti, Nassau). Sports teams need highways, mass transit, a decent venue and a large population that is sympathetic to their sport. Newark has three of those things, and lately I don't think the Knicks have a choke hold on the New York fan base when it comes to Basketball.

    Brooklyn still makes the most sense though.

  4. #2899
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    Brooklyn makes sense at what cost? Both to taxpayers and ticket buyers?

    No doubt all of Ratner's projections were made on the financial situation pre-crash. All you have to do is look at Yankee Stadium with the swath of empty high-priced seats to know that those numbers no longer apply.

    Bottom line is that Ratner will probably come out just fine if he can finance the BK arena and get it built. It's the rest of us who might not fare so well.

  5. #2900

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    As a general rule, sports teams don't do much for a city not in need of revitalization, with an already well-established entertainment base. The money that a population has budgeted for entertainment would remain constant, but just be distributed differently among the various venues.

    A city such as Baltimore benefited from Camden Yards because it attracted much needed entertainment spending. Such is not the case in NY metro. Fans are just as likely to go to Jets and Giants games in the Meadowlands as to a stadium within the city. And there are Knicks, Rangers, Yankee and Met fans from outside the city.

    Contrary to what Marty Markowitz would have us believe, Brooklyn didn't collapse when the Dodgers left. He is just relating fan reaction during that era. People born later couldn't care less. Note the negative reaction of Met fans to the branding of Citifield as a Dodgers (Jackie Robinson) stadium that didn't display any Met history.

    Sports franchises use fan hysteria to force municipalities to finance new stadiums. It was even done at the so-called privately funded YS and Citifield, which still wound up costing taxpayers anywhere from 500 to 750 million dollars. Look at the St Louis Rams. For over 40 years they were branded with Los Angeles. It's still strange for me to think of them as anything but the LA Rams. Both Rams and Raider ownership (who were in LA from 1982-94) tried to extort new stadiums from the city, which refused, so they left for St Louis and Oakland.

    Despite the absence of NFL football from metro LA, the area hasn't collapsed.

  6. #2901

  7. #2902
    Jersey Patriot JCMAN320's Avatar
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    Default Bloomy Says No More

    http://www.brooklynpaper.com/stories...sh.html?comm=1

    Bloomy to Bruce: Enough already

    By Mike McLaughlin
    The Brooklyn Paper

    Mayor Bloomberg dealt Bruce Ratner a blow on Wednesday, saying that the city would not subsidize the Atlantic Yards project with additional public funds.

    The city has already pledged $230 million for infrastructure and land-acquisition costs at the embattled arena and skyscraper project — but Bloomberg dashed Ratner’s hopes for more.

    “We’ve done everything,” he said in response to a reporter’s question at his daily availability on Wednesday. “We’re going to have a tough time balancing our budget.”

    The mayor did add that the city needs the project, but said, “We’re not putting money in. We’re going to invest our money in better schools and in safer streets and in better parks and everything else.”

    The mayor’s thriftiness is bad news for Forest City Ratner, which in recent months had been lobbying for more taxpayer aid from the city and state to help revive construction on the $4-billion complex in Prospect Heights, where work has been stalled since December.

    But Ratner, speaking at a “topping out” ceremony at his 80 DeKalb Avenue project, claimed he will start the basketball arena this fall.

    “We don’t need anything more [from the city and state],” he said.

    Updated 04:09 pm, May, 21 2009: Story was updated to add a comment from Bruce Ratner obtained at Thursday morning's event at another of his buildings.
    2009 The Brooklyn Paper


    http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article...905219969/1006
    Last edited by JCMAN320; May 24th, 2009 at 03:22 AM.

  8. #2903
    Kings County Loyal BrooklynLove's Avatar
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    Great news - means less moaning from anti-AY sheep.

  9. #2904
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    Ratner also stated he would move ahead with "the arena" - not with the full development of that triangular component of the development. A stand alone arena is not what was proposed. We started with a rather beautiful glass structure by Gehry. It then became a big mess with that "Miss Brooklyn" thing. We lost almost all of the commercial space and suddenly it was residential buildings above an arena (yeah, everyone wants to live above an arena). If he's only building the arena, what design is he going to use?

    You can bet that the neighborhood that is being razed due to "blight" will be replaced with big ugly truck bays and mortar walls. The building will turn its back on the very area that Ratner claims he want to revitalize. It's a very "Joe Sitt : Coney Island" scenario.

    Brooklyn sure seems to get it absolutely wrong. We have the worst developers operating here and no checks and balances on their horrendous plans and behavior.

  10. #2905
    Kings County Loyal BrooklynLove's Avatar
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    Let's slow down a minute. What is the last OFFICIAL rendering of the arena we have seen?

  11. #2906

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    The brick one that supposedly paid homage to the area's history was speculated on by the Post:



    But I don't think there's been anything official since Ms. Brooklyn.

  12. #2907
    Incredible Sulk aural iNK's Avatar
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    Default

    Here are the most recent official renderings, from last year:






  13. #2908

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    ^ Insufficiently tall.

  14. #2909

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    ^
    ^
    Scrap heap comes to mind.

  15. #2910

    Default It doesn't matter any way...

    Bye-bye Frank Gehry. Hello Ellerbe Becket?

    Ratner says he is going to finance the Barclays Center arena and break ground for it this Summer or Fall, yet the developer doesn't know who is designing his arena, what it will look like and what it will cost. But it seems rather clear that it won't be a Frank Gehry arena, which will upset his arena sponsors, particulary Barclays Bank, and wreck the arena's financing model.
    BROOKLYN BOUND?:
    Sports Business Journal

    Don’t be surprised if Ellerbe Becket becomes the lead designer for Barclays Center, the Nets’ much-delayed arena project.

    Renowned civic architect Frank Gehry originally designed the building. Kansas City-based Ellerbe, designer for the two newest NBA arenas, in Charlotte and Memphis, has been consulting for the Nets for the past three years and is making adjustments to arena blueprints to see how it can be built at a lower cost.

    Team officials declined to confirm Ellerbe’s involvement or whether Gehry is still part of the project.

    Nets owner Bruce Ratner told the New York media May 15 that he expects construction to start this fall after what team officials call the final legal action against the Atlantic Yards development was dismissed in court. Ratner still needs to sell bonds to finance the project, another big hurdle to overcome.

    Ratner anticipates Barclays Center will carry a final price tag of about $800 million, about $150 million less than previous estimates.

    Ellerbe Becket principal Bill Crockett said, “Our work has been ongoing, and we have not been advised of what they will accept and when it will be released.”
    (Emphasis added.)

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