View Poll Results: How do you rate One Liberty Plaza?

Voters
71. You may not vote on this poll
  • 10

    3 4.23%
  • 9

    5 7.04%
  • 8

    7 9.86%
  • 7

    10 14.08%
  • 6

    7 9.86%
  • 5

    5 7.04%
  • 4

    13 18.31%
  • 3

    9 12.68%
  • 2

    3 4.23%
  • 1

    9 12.68%
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Thread: One Liberty Plaza

  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by GVNY View Post
    Furthermore, I believe the spaces requested by contemporary businesses, such as Goldman Sachs, are completely outrageous and unnecessary. The long term use for their built purposes are dubious at best, and if a conversion to alternative uses were required, it would be impossible.
    While I don't dispute your point on conversion (im)possibilities, I don't find the space demands for today's tenants to be much beyond what it was 40 years ago. The trading floor bases might be a little bit fatter (and even then it's not by much), but it's hardly worse than what was going up during the era of postwar Park Ave and the XYZ buildings.

    Still, it doesn't make up for the fact that, by any measurement, they all occupy way too much space.

  2. #32
    The Dude Abides
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    In a vacuum, I guess this building's not bad. But in the skyline, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by kz1000ps View Post
    While I don't dispute your point on conversion (im)possibilities, I don't find the space demands for today's tenants to be much beyond what it was 40 years ago. The trading floor bases might be a little bit fatter (and even then it's not by much), but it's hardly worse than what was going up during the era of postwar Park Ave and the XYZ buildings.

    Still, it doesn't make up for the fact that, by any measurement, they all occupy way too much space.
    Isn't the point here that the Singer Building was most likely not designed for the needs of business today or in the 60's. I assume the building was cramped compared to One Liberty Plaza. Low ceilings, small offices etc would have made it hard to rent to class A tenants. Hence the reason they replaced it.

  4. #34

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    Although today we would consider it a jewel, for modern corporations a building like that was simply considered ugly and inappropriate.

    Even though the Chrysler was from the art-deco stone age, at least it had swagger.

    For the popular mentality at the time, research Hollywood films with themes based in the business world. Doris Day would not have been pictured working in a building like the Singer.

    ----

    Heck... even Singer swung:

    (this is quite brilliantly done BTW)

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=rwUXkAVjn84

    ---

    What the Singer Building represented:

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=YoQ-uM1xcc4

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by alonzo-ny View Post
    Your talking about big commercial offices taking up whole blocks in some cases, these are residential towers in a park. The comparison isnt relevant.
    If you are responding to my own statement, you have confused me. Who is talking about residential towers in a park? I certainly was not.

    I believe my comparison to still be very relevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by kz1000ps View Post
    While I don't dispute your point on conversion (im)possibilities, I don't find the space demands for today's tenants to be much beyond what it was 40 years ago.
    You are correct. When you look at some pre-World War towers it is readily apparent their bases are equally monstrously fat, and that is why I also included the bit about the 1916 codes into my post. For if those codes were in place today, the bulk that is Goldman would never have been approved or be in the process of erection (at least in its current spireless form). And that we ultimately agree on when you discuss the overall amount of unnecessary space. And of course, I am positive that I am preaching to the choir as I share this with you.
    Last edited by GVNY; February 13th, 2008 at 04:51 PM.

  6. #36

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    My mistake I had thought I was in the sixties demo thread, please disregard.

  7. #37
    The Dude Abides
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    Quote Originally Posted by GVNY View Post
    When you look at some pre-World War towers it is readily apparent their bases are equally monstrously fat, and that is why I also included the bit about the 1916 codes into my post. For if those codes were in place today, the bulk that is Goldman would never have been approved or be in the process of erection
    The codes have been modified several times since 1916 according to whichever prevailing notions ruled the day. One Liberty Plaza was but one in a host of buildings that made use of the plaza requirement/bonus feature put in place in 1961.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fabrizio View Post

    And it is the (deceptively) simple international style, especially in black, that works the most beautifully with classical limestone buildings.
    So, Fabrizio, what would be your positive spin for this?


  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by pianoman11686 View Post
    The codes have been modified several times since 1916 according to whichever prevailing notions ruled the day. One Liberty Plaza was but one in a host of buildings that made use of the plaza requirement/bonus feature put in place in 1961.
    By the time One Liberty Plaza was erected, the 1916 zoning codes were actually effectively discarded, having been manipulated multiple times with the rise of the International Style (Seagram, Lever, Chase Manhattan) and replaced with the FAR system we have in place today.

  10. #40
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    ^Correct.

  11. #41

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    Treype: There is no "spin" in my posts. Thank you.

    When you quote someone please provide context. In the same post I mention: "When I see these, those that are well done...".

    Obvious to anyone, I am not refering to ALL and EVERY or just any old building done in the International style.

    Got it?

  12. #42
    NYC Aficionado from Oz Merry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianac View Post
    Not much at all to shout about on this part of the street.
    How depressing. IMO, there is nothing of merit in this view except for the Transportation Building on the far left. One Liberty Plaza just makes it so much worse. I hate this building more than any other in NYC. The loss of the Singer Tower particularly, and the City Investing Building, which I think was wonderful, can never be forgiven, even if that monstrosity were to be removed by means either fair or foul. One point is too many so I didn't vote.

  13. #43
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    Perhaps "spin" was not the softest term, "silver linning" is prob a better term. Since you found a silver lining to one liberty replacing the Singer I was wondering if you ever found one for MGS replacing Penn.

  14. #44

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    9/10
    nice

  15. #45

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    Two buildings under construction at the same time, two takes on a common theme: not curtain wall, but exoskeleton:





    World Trade Center --also under construction at this time-- is another example.

    A bold idea, now largely abandoned. Alternatives cost less, so architects have had to make a fetish of saran-wrap skin of glass. Public goes along with whatever looks new.

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