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Thread: 400 Fifth Avenue @ 36th St - Setai Hotel and Condo - by Gwathmey Siegel & Associates

  1. #31
    Forum Veteran krulltime's Avatar
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    NYPOST: GIMME SHELTER


    This just in...

    A new luxury hotel condominium and retail complex will soon be rising on Fifth Avenue.

    We've learned that a major international developer based in Italy has just bought the property at 400 Fifth Ave. from Lehman Brothers to construct a 56-story building at the northwest corner of Fifth Avenue and 36th Street.

    The buyers, Bi & Di Real Estate SpA, outbid many of the city's top developers, with an offer of approximately $200 million.

    Lehman had already commissioned plans created for the project by Gwathmey Siegel, before they opted to put it on the market.

    Current plans for the complex, which will comprise 520,858 square feet, calls for over 145,000 square feet of hotel space and 323,000 square feet of residential property that will occupy floors 18 to 56. The group has already developed many resorts, offices and other such projects around the world. And this will be its first venture in the U.S.

    "We're now in the process of selecting a luxury hotel group that will complement the upscale residences," says real-estate mogul Howard Lorber. The chairman of Prudential Douglas Elliman and super-broker Dolly Lenz represented the buyers in the acquisition and will be exclusively marketing the property.


    Copyright 2006 NYP Holdings, Inc.

  2. #32
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    That's great news and a good location for a hotel. When was the last time a hotel opened on Fifth Ave?

  3. #33

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    Originally the development was spouse to include 404 fifth (the building on the s/w corner of 37th street) and it was suppose to be w whole block font development

    12 October 1998
    Crain's New York Business


    An investor group led by landlord Prince Management bought 404 Fifth Ave. from an affiliate of Murray Hill Properties Corp. for $16 million.
    The buyers were willing to pay a handsome $175 a square foot for the 91,000-square-foot Class B building because they already own two adjacent properties, 398 and 400 fifth. When added together, the three make up a development site where a 250,000-square-foot building could be constructed, says Ron Cohen, a senior managing director of Insignia/ESG Capital Advisors, who brokered the sale.
    The property, at the southwest corner of 37th Street, is zoned for residential, office, hotel or retail”..


    So why does int JOE CHETRIT sell (to the poeple that just bought it from TESSLER) 404 fifth to make way for a much larger development that will go on 5th Ave from 36th to 37th Street, so why don’t they tear 404 FIFTH AVENUE,

  4. #34

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    So why does int JOE CHETRIT sell 404 (to the poeple that just bought it 396,398,400 FIFTH.

  5. #35

  6. #36

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    the way the market is going on now i dont think that it will be built as condos, they will put an OFFICE building there instead, with maybe some part of it a hotel, and i just hope they can buy the last buildng (from CHETRIT) on the s/w corner of 5th & 37th Street, to make a whole block front development that will go along 5th Ave from 36th to 37th Street.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffpark
    i just hope they can buy the last buildng (from CHETRIT) on the s/w corner of 5th & 37th Street, to make a whole block front development that will go along 5th Ave from 36th to 37th Street.
    Why do you like whole block front developments so much? There are exceptions (ESB, TWC), but mosty I find them quite deadly (6th Avenue, Water Street).

  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby
    In the syntax of our esteemed colleague, JeffPark, this building looks kind of RETARDED (or at least MUNDANE).

  9. #39

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    I'm not sure whether I like the first design better or the second. At least with the initial proposal you wouldn't exactly know what to EXPECT of the finished product until you're physically right there, for the better or worse. But, in the syntax of Londonlawyer, I just know this new one will be all-around
    CRAP.

  10. #40
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    ^You guys definitely have the fonts down. Now you just gotta work on the grammar/sentence (de)construction a bit.

    I forgot that Gwathmey assumed design of this building. I rather liked the original SOM design. This one just looks deliberately awkward, yet it's still a box. Will this stretch of 5th ever get a well-designed building?

  11. #41
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    The really-retarded HSBC building on 5th / 40th (arch.: Eli Attia Architects ) -- which so awkwardly surrounds Republic Bank Building -- starts the bad-building stretch that we're stuck with from 42nd St. and on south to 34th:






  12. #42

    Default i like them

    I actually think both of these buildings, 320 Fifth and the HSBC building, are nice. What do you dislike about them?

    And for certain, they are better than what the government would come up with if granted the right to review. Historically preserved neighborhoods look good because most of the buildings in them, by definition, where built by the goodness of private interestes before the government got so involved with property rights this century. Private interests care about their property and make their buildings attractive because that increases their economic value. I don't see anything great about newer buildings that have been "government approved" in these places compared to the buildings going up around ESB.

    Just look at the Con Ed site to see what happens to beautiful building designs when the government gets involved.

  13. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by kznyc2k
    I'm not sure whether I like the first design better or the second. At least with the initial proposal you wouldn't exactly know what to EXPECT of the finished product until you're physically right there, for the better or worse. But, in the syntax of Londonlawyer, I just know this new one will be all-around
    CRAP.
    I'm afraid that I will get into the HABIT of writing like this and mistakenly submit papers to COURT with funny font.

    P.S.: Jeffpark -- Please take no offense. It's all in good fun like when people call me "the crapmeister," a nickname I happen to like.
    Last edited by londonlawyer; July 11th, 2006 at 11:20 PM.

  14. #44
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by investordude
    I actually think both of these buildings, 320 Fifth and the HSBC building, are nice. What do you dislike about them?
    The older Knox Building / Republic Bank is a beauty.

    The HSBC tower is IMO just an oddly-colored, awkward wall of staggered glass whose purpose seems to be to squeeze out every square inch of buildable space allowed under zoning. The 5th Avenue facade is typical 80's thin veneer of stone slabs.

    Perhaps with the technology available at the time this was as good as it could be -- I'm no architect [ ] but I can imagine a far better structure that would both enhance the Knox Building and sit better at what is essentially the SE corner of Bryant Park.

  15. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by antinimby
    Another Gwathmey-Siegel design that came at me from left field. This firm tries too hard but doesn’t have the sound design principles to make a design exciting and as a congruous whole. Here we have a box, no thought there. The façade is particularly disconcerting, the windows remind me of the Delorian or some other 1970’s space theme. My problem is not so much with the passé treatment as it is that the windows are sandwiched between Art Deco inspired limestone spandrels. Top it off with a Chanin-Building inspired top and you get the impression that Gwathmey-Siegel really has no idea what the hell they are doing. My impression is that they know what they’re doing but they have no direction or vision, instead they take elements and mix and match them, postmodernism truly at its worst. Following their most recent additions, I have lost all respect for Gwathmey-Siegel and they have become one of my least favorite firms in NYC.

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