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Thread: 9/11 memorials, museums?

  1. #16

    Default

    If my post is that much of a problem, I'm sure the Wired NY administrators or (as you boldly suggest) a court of law will take care of it.

    I'm sure that most people smart enough to find their way to this site will also be clever enough to Google both of our points and work things out for themselves.

  2. #17

    Default

    P.S. I ask that you don't send me any more threatening private messages and wish you the best of luck on that acting career you mentioned.

  3. #18

    Default Schadenfrau

    Dear Schadenfrau:

    No such messages were sent.

    I see that despite being presented with all the data, you still will not alter/edit your post. As far as crediting yourself with a "point", as if you have one, I find that amusing. You have no point Schadenfrau, only hostility. There is only EVIDENCE and FACT in my "point", which you have been presented with so no one takes your "point" seriously as all you have written is a lie.

    You were so inclined to post LIES about a beautiful museum that pays homage to September 11 victims yet you get angry when you are emailed a response in defense.

    If you were a social person you would have said you were sorry and admitted you stood corrected; Intelligent and social people, when presented with FACTS, acknowledge their mistakes and correct them.

    As far as your sarcastic well wishes to my acting career - I don't think you are sincere.

    This museum was inspired by & modeled after the Anne Frank House in Amsterdam, Holland.

    Why don't you go find a criminal and sink your teeth into them?
    Leave the good guys alone.

    (Aug. 28, 2005, ASSOCIATED PRESS STORY: "Anne Frank House Inspires New 9/11 Museum")

    GARY
    Last edited by FDNYHonoraryChief; March 17th, 2006 at 10:51 AM.

  4. #19

    Default

    Lastly, I can and will email you whenever I like,
    No, you won't.

    You have stated your argument. Any unwanted PMs, and you will be removed from this forum.

    If you have any further issues with Shadenfrau, get yourself an attorney.

  5. #20

    Default ZIPPY please Remove

    Zippy:

    Please REMOVE Schadenfraus posting calling the museum and myself a liar and a scam and at odds with the union who placed me into my official position. You are aware now that is is false and I ask you to remove it from your travel site.

    Her posting is not an ARGUMENT. IT IS SLANDER and YOU ARE ALLOWING IT TO HAPPEN

    I ask you to please REMOVE this posting. Please let me know of your decision.
    I would hope you would have issue with the derogatory posting of
    hers on March 7.

    GARY
    Last edited by FDNYHonoraryChief; March 17th, 2006 at 10:39 AM.

  6. #21

    Default

    Is there a rule on this forum about ad hominem attacks?

  7. #22

    Default Great 9/11 Museum

    I'm Amy and my family just visited New York and were lucky enough to visit Gary Suson's Ground Zero Museum Workshop. I work for a Police Department in Florida. This museum was the highlight of our New York Trip. I read these disturbing posts by schadenfrau and wish to offer my advice. I'm sorry - I cannot sit by and watch an injustice. Schadenfrau, perhaps you should have visited Mr. Suson's museum before making such horrid accusations that attack an innocent person's integrity. While we were in the museum, a survivor from the 71st floor of the South Tower was there as well as a Japanese couple from Tokyo who lost their son on 9-11 and they were all touched and moved by the museum and Mr. Suson's narrative. Your attack on this man is unwarranted, unecessary and unfair. That museum is a blessing to the city of New York, a blessing to tourists like us who have a need "to know" what happened during the "Recovery" and a blessing to the memory of all those poor people who died in September of 2001. You should be ashamed of trying to scare people away by posting horrible comments like you did. Gary Suson is creating a loving masterpiece and it has been made in an extremely respectable manner. Without it there would be nothing right now that exists for people to visit and mourn those lost souls. Shame on "schadenfrau" for writing what he/she did.

    Amy, 911 Dispatcher for a Police Department in FLORIDA

  8. #23

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ablarc
    Is there a rule on this forum about ad hominem attacks?
    Yes there is.

    Let's repeat the post in question:
    Gary Suson, the man who runs that museum, is generally considered a liar and a scam artist. He has long been at odds with the Uniformed Firefighters Association for claiming that he was the FDNY's "official photographer," when there is no such title.

    His "museum" is far from authorized.
    As a public figure, no one is allowed to regard Mr Suson as a liar and scam artist? This is what Mayor Bloomberg had to say, as rerported in the Downtown Express:
    http://www.downtownexpress.com/de_12...debatover.html
    “It’s a disgrace to be honest,” said Mayor Michael Bloomberg in a press conference prior to the museum’s opening. “You know, there are always some sick people that are trying to exploit other people’s tragedies, and I just don’t want to give them any more publicity.”
    Is Mike Bloomberg named in your suit?

    As for being at odds with the Uniformed Firefighters Association, this quote:
    The General Counsel for the Uniformed Firefighters Association, Michael Block, said he sent Suson a cease and desist notice two weeks ago, asking him to stop calling himself the official photographer, since “he has no right to say that.” The union doesn’t have an “official photographer,” and the only reason Suson is apparently making this claim is because he received a letter with a stamped signature of former union president Kevin Gallagher giving him the clearance to take photos at Ground Zero.
    The last I heard, the NY Post has not retracted their statements, so the issue is in doubt.

    As for the absurd claims you made in two PMs to me, stating
    You have given this woman a voice yet have threatened to take mine away.
    that is obviously not true. You have been given every opportunity to refute the information that Shadenfrau presented. I objected to your sending unwanted PMs and emails on this forum.

    I gathered the information on the ambiguity of your position on the internet. It seems there are others, correct or incorrect, who have a negative opinion of you.

    This forum is a vehicle for the free expression of ideas. Anyone visiting this thread would get both sides of the story, and are free to draw their own conclusions.

    If you disagree, you may contact Edward, the owner/administrator of this site, but I am not deleting anything.

  9. #24

    Default Response

    1.) I am not a "public figure"

    2.) You have quoted our awesome Mayor as saying something about ME personally and/or this Museum when he never did. I do not see quotation marks from the great Mayor ANYWHERE around my name or my museum. He refers to "Them" and "People" because he does not know who I am nor was he referncing ME. He was asked most likely a generalized question about exploitation. My name nor the museum does not appear in quotes from him. No other news source reported these alleged comments except one tabloid paper.

    3.) No, he is not being sued for anything.

    4.) Regarding the quote from Michael Block, please log onto this links:
    http://www.groundzeromuseumworkshop....s/villager.htm.
    This is the downtown expresses retraction upon receiving letters from the union officials from 2001-2002 (Recovery Period) confirming my "Official Status" which has been documented for four years by The Times, CNN, FOX and AP. Mr. Block also said he had no interest in fighting this.

    I have never claimed to be the 'official photographer' of the current fire unions, just the "Official Photographer at Ground Zero for the Uniformed Firefighters Association." It was a one-time title for while I shot there for them.

    My official title has also been confirmed by the Daily News and the New York Post (twice in 2002). Here is the NY Post's articles confirming my title: http://www.groundzeromuseumworkshop....ges/nypost.htm

    The only union officials that can speak with authority about what went on during my tenure as Official Photographer at Ground Zero are the officials that were in office during that period. Links are below to that effect.

    Log onto a letter to the Associated Press from Manhattan Trustee Rudy Sanfilippo who was the trustee from the Recovery Period. He appointed me "Official Photographer" which was signed off on by both Union Presidents. (You will have to click the arrow a few times to get to his page) Here it is: www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/lt.htm.

    Then log onto the New York Times article, who first broke the story in 2002 of my work:
    http://www.groundzeromuseumworkshop....es/nytimes.htm.

    Then you may view the world wide Associated Press article, also fact checked in August, 2005 at:
    http://www.abcnews.go.com/Entertainm...oryid?=1074686.

    Don't forget to review the letter of endorsement from the UFA and UFOA Presidents which was written solely for press/media when I was permitted to release the images in May of 2002: www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/ufa.htm.
    Michael Block was the same attorney for the union when these letters were drafted.

    Next, you should view the donations page at:
    www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/donors.htm

    Don't forget to log onto these 2 CNN Interviews from 2002, who also fact checked everything: www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/cnn.htm

    Then there is my Barnes & Noble book, whose lawyers fact checked everything before print. Here is alink to that book:
    http://www.search.barnesandnoble.com...sbnInquiry.asp
    userid=xl4UhtgBOR&isbn=0760738114&itm=1

    and lastly, view LowerManhattan.info who, upon learning of all this false information printed by a certain tabloid paper (whom you are quoting here as a reliable news source) deleted all that was taken from that article and this new article was posted on February 3, 2006:
    http://www.lowermanhattan.info/news/...zero_74140.asp

    Don't forget the NY Daily News article on my being appointed Honorary Chief by the FDNY Commissioner: http://www.nydailynews.com/front/sto...p-150035c.html
    (a very rare honor in the department and seldom given)

    ..please also view the MSNBC article at:
    www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9089680/from/RL.1/

    Who are the "Others" that have a negative opinion? Please specify who "others" are as it's too vague.

    You have presented yourself in your last entry as a bonafide investigative journalist who has done research, yet in all the many articles on myself that exist in search engines you have managed ONLY to come up with false and damaging information from ONE SOURCE who you are aware has been called into question, but you are inferring to readers you are just posting an opinion. I have now provided you with information and data refuting and calling into question what you wrote, so I ask you to remove this.

    Thank You for your time. - GARY
    Last edited by FDNYHonoraryChief; March 17th, 2006 at 10:58 AM.

  10. #25

    Default

    I had no opinion (in fact never heard of) you or your museum, but as you post, I am developing one.

    Aside to the rest of the forum: In response to the third ridiculous PM that Mr Chief sent me, I related to him the legal opinion of my neighbor, who is an attorney and reviewed the posts. It's complex legalese, so I won't attempt ro reanslate:
    The guy is blowing smoke out of his ass.
    See you in court. I haven't worked out a defense, but I'm thinking maybe insanity (not mine, yours).

    Mr Chief, it's late and I'll be signing off. Feel free to continue your commentary. I never thought this thread would get so amusing.

  11. #26

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FDNYHonoraryChief
    Do your research. Then grow up and take responsibility. It is no weird coincidence that your name, translated in German means = "DAMAGE GIRL" : Schaden in German is: (TO DO DAMAGE; she who does damage)+ FRAU (GIRL) THUS "SCHADENFRAU".
    You have done damage.
    Mr. Suson, if you had done your research, you would realize that "Schadenfrau" translated into German means absolutely nothing.

    It's a play on the word schadenfreude, which has no direct English translation, but is generally perceived to be a sense of pleasure derived from the foibles and fumblings of others.

    Let me use the word in a sentence:

    "Watching Mr. Suson harm his reputation far worse than either the New York Post or I ever could gives me a sense of schadenfreude."

    If any damage has been done on this thread, I'd wager that the bulk of it came from Suson himself.

    Any tourist considering a visit to the Ground Zero Museum Workshop can now log on to this site to get an idea of the curator's temperament. Yet again, Wired New York provides an invaluable public service.

  12. #27
    Banned Member
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by shadenfrau
    Gary Suson, the man who runs that museum, is generally considered a liar and a scam artist. He has long been at odds with the Uniformed Firefighters Association for claiming that he was the FDNY's "official photographer," when there is no such title.

    His "museum" is far from authorized.
    I think that the statement, although strong, can find support as one sifts through the "proof" you provide about being the "official photographer for the UFA" at Ground Zero. The "liar and scam artist" allegation hold up as one looks at these articles for the "proof" you claim is inherent in them. There is nothing to suggest that the museum is "authorized," which isn't to say it might not have interest for folks looking for some vivid images and recollections of that day and the weeks of recovery. I am quite sure you have not been the victim of slander. You emphatically state that you are the official photographer and leverage that false statement to claim some greater credibility. Perhaps, you have drawn on target on yourslf with such a claim that some people are willing to take shots at.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    My official title has also been confirmed by the Daily News and the New York Post (twice in 2002). Here is the NY Post's articles confirming my title: http://www.groundzeromuseumworkshop....ges/nypost.htm
    Nowhere in the Page Six gossip column of the New York Post does it "confirm" your title. The gossip column doesn't assign you a title at all. To be "officially sanctioned" does not convey a title and as "sanction" can mean both "authorize" and "to support," there is nothing that can be gleaned from this report other than Page Six - a gossip column - is printing and allegation, not a fact. There is NOTHING in the article that independently corroborates your statements. A statement in a gossip column that a forward will be written by a Fire Chief is not corroboration and not confirmation of the official position of the FDNY or UFA.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    Log onto a letter to the Associated Press from Manhattan Trustee Rudy Sanfilippo who was the trustee from the Recovery Period. He appointed me "Official Photographer" which was signed off on by both Union Presidents. (You will have to click the arrow a few times to get to his page) Here it is: www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/lt.htm.
    I reviewed the testimonials to your museum, which I have neither visited nor ever heard of. Although they are rather glowing in their praise of your photography, every last one of those testimonials comes from RETIRED firemen. Mr. Sanfilippo served in his official capacity for two years and makes his statements as a layman. There is NO official statement from the UFA in your testimonials. There is no official statement from the FDNY. In short, there is nothing that corroborates your claims as nothing appears on letterhead here. That being said, you were obviously granted access to some intense scenes. Perhaps you should just let your work stand on its own merits as photojournalism rather than arguing it is somehow "official." I have the book "Above Hallowed Ground" with photos taken by the "official" NYPD helicopter photographer. The photos speak for themselves - his title is irrelevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    Then log onto the New York Times article, who first broke the story in 2002 of my work:
    http://www.groundzeromuseumworkshop....es/nytimes.htm.
    This article states you took your photographs "with permission" from the fire department. It does not state or corroborate that you were the "official photographer."

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    Then you may view the world wide Associated Press article, also fact checked in August, 2005 at:
    http://www.abcnews.go.com/Entertainm...oryid?=1074686.
    This link leads to an "error" page at ABC News.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    Don't forget to review the letter of endorsement from the UFA and UFOA Presidents which was written solely for press/media when I was permitted to release the images in May of 2002: www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/ufa.htm.
    Michael Block was the same attorney for the union when these letters were drafted.
    The UFA letter, dated April 2002, cites you as being a "professional photographer enormously supportive of [UFA] members." It does not state you were the "Official Photographer at Ground Sero for the UFA" nor does it endorse your museum, which seems to be the misleading implication in the way it is linked on your site. It does state that your photos deserve attention, but seems to be more specifically written (from a legal standpoint) to ensure that you do not profit from the photos, stating without ambiguity that all proceeds from the exhibition and sale of photographs is to go to the noted charitable fund. Given that this is a letter that in fact supports the release of these photos it would seem that the UFA would sprecifically note that you were in fact the "Official Photographer" if you indeed were. It seems you weren't. You were only a photographer whose work they supported. So, again, your claim can be construed as a "lie" or "scam." And the use of this letter as an endorsement of a "museum" is certainly misleading.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    Next, you should view the donations page at:
    www.groundzeromuseumworkshop.com/donors.htm
    This page is very misleading. Although the list scrolls for an extended period, the actual list of "donors" is limited. For example, the Brian McSweeney fund is listed four or five times as is the FF Ralph Geidel Fund and the Widows and Orphans Fund. You listed each individual donation as opposed to listing donors. The donor list is short and the donation amounts do not exceed a couple of hundred dollars from each donor - at most. VERY MISLEADING. A lie? Probably not. A scam? Who knows. Misleading and casting shadows of doubt on your credibility? To some it might.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Suson
    and lastly, view LowerManhattan.info who, upon learning of all this false information printed by a certain tabloid paper (whom you are quoting here as a reliable news source) deleted all that was taken from that article and this new article was posted on February 3, 2006:
    http://www.lowermanhattan.info/news/...zero_74140.asp
    This is a disturbing post in that it is listed in the Lower Manhattan website "story archive," but carries no byline, print date, source, or copyright. It reads more like a press release. There is nothing, again, to substantiate the claims you are making and websites post information all the time - often without following generally accepted protocols. As a legal document or "proof," there is nothing in this article to support your claims. It is a press release (and a very good one).
    Last edited by BrooklynRider; March 17th, 2006 at 12:38 PM.

  13. #28

    Default

    You'll need to shell out a few dollars to read the entire text of these articles, but the free summaries should give you an idea of the content:

    http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/nypost/r...006&By=&Title=

    ETA a quote from the 08/31/05 article entitled, "9/11 Cam Scam; 'Official' Ground Zero Photog Is A Phony: FDNY":

    "Meanwhile, FDNY union officials are preparing to send a letter to Suson demanding he stop claiming he worked as its official photographer.

    On the exhibit's Web site, groundzeromuseumworkshop.- com, Suson says he is the 'official' photographer at Ground Zero for the Uniformed Firefighters Association.

    Suson says a 2002 joint 'letter of introduction' from the UFA and the Uniformed Fire Officers Association allows him to use the title "official," although the word appears nowhere in the letter.

    The FDNY and union officials said there is no such title, but one ex-union official said Suson was given it.

    Current union officials and the FDNY also charge Suson has not honored his pledge to donate thousands of dollars in proceeds from 9/11 artwork he sold."


    I checked the Better Business Bureau of New York website and was unable to find a listing for The Ground Zero Museum Workshop in its charity section:

    http://www.newyork.bbb.org/reports/c...s.aspx?pid=287
    Last edited by Schadenfrau; March 17th, 2006 at 12:11 PM. Reason: Further Information

  14. #29

    Default

    FDNYHonoraryChief is not going to respond - I have banned him from this forum because in his email he threatened to sue me. This is a universal policy on this website - any member threatening to sue me or moderators will be banned.

  15. #30

    Default

    I guess now we'll all have to wait until our inevitable court dates to find out if Suson plans on donating the proceeds from these myriad lawsuits to charity.

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