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Thread: 150 Greenwich Street - WTC Tower #4 - by Fumihiko Maki

  1. #1741


    Zippy you do more to shut down discussion than I ever could.

  2. #1742


    Have I ever told you not to express an opinion?

    Isn't that what you did in your last post?

  3. #1743
    Fearless Photog RoldanTTLB's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Broomfield, CO


    This conversation seems to turn pretty vicious pretty regularly for a building that is at its absolute worst a little staid. I would say this is actually a rather pleasant addition both at street level and to the skyline in general. I look forward to seeing how the setback makes the building more dynamic.

  4. #1744


    I agree, Roldan. This tower is nicer than I expected.

  5. #1745


    Quote Originally Posted by RoldanTTLB View Post
    This conversation seems to turn pretty vicious pretty regularly for a building that is at its absolute worst a little staid.
    That curtain wall has been meticulously detailed; unfortunately that sort of subtle detail is an attribute that is not readily discernible and so is not as universally appreciated as something like a bold or dynamic form factor - thus the 'boring box' or 'staid' condemnations.

    This is by far my favorite of the WTC buildings: design excellence in every sense of the term.

    To quote 'Steve Jobs' : "design in not just how the thing Looks, it is also how it Works". (That may be more or a paraphrase than a quote - but you get the point)

    Here is a description for that very well encapsulates the many architectural design merits of Tower 4 and it's "abstract sculptural presence".
    EXCERPT - According to Maki and Associates, the fundamental approach to 150 Greenwich Street is two-fold: a "minimalist" tower that achieves an abstract sculptural presence, quiet with dignity, on a site directly fronting the Memorial and a "podium" that becomes a catalyst in activating and enlivening the immediate urban environment at pedestrian street level as part of the redevelopment efforts of Downtown New York.
    Seen from a distance, "the tower presents a unique angular profile that is chiseled at the crown acknowledging the spiral composition formed by the group of four towers, in keeping with the World Trade Center Master Plan." The tower has floor to ceiling windows of composite glass "intended to achieve a mat metallic quality with a luminous sheen. It embraces an abstract quality with a unique materiality - minimal, light, cool in color and ephemeral, changing with the light of day."
    Last edited by infoshare; December 18th, 2011 at 10:39 AM.

  6. #1746


    This building was already built uptown on Madison Avenue in 1982!

    Even in 1982 the design was boring, there's little to nothing written about this project. In 2011 at the most watched and important site in the world its completely unacceptable.

  7. #1747


    The shape of the structure of WTC 4 and that madison ave. building are indeed similar, but the curtain walls are so very different that I find it difficult to even find comparisons beyond the fact that they both have a diagonal setback 4/5s of the way up. I still like both towers though, and they each reflect the decade in which they were built so well its incredible. Boxy towers belong in New York because they work so well in New York's trademark grid system. A box in China or the Middle East does indeed look out of place, but the box will never leave the city of New York.

  8. #1748
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    NYC - Downtown


    But 150 Greenwich / 4WTC isn't a rectangular box like the one on Madison seen above.

    Maki designed
    a series of varying shapes forming a base, a column and a crown. The base at street level actually has multiple exposures (10?) that incorporates the combined shapes of a rectangle and a parallelogram. That podium relates to the street and sets the stage for what rises above:

    The low and mid-rise sections on floors 7 through 46 provide a typical floor plate size of 44,560 rsf in the shape of a parallelogram echoing the configuration of the site ... The high-rise section from floors 48 to 63 provides a floor plate size of 34,893 rsf in the shape of a trapezoid, shaped and fluted to open toward the tip of Manhattan and triangulated from the lower floors to face 1 World Trade Center ... Seen from a distance, the tower presents a unique angular profile that is chiselled at the crown ...

    Two opposite corners of the tower on the southwest and northeast corners are articulated with dramatic indentations, allowing the building to appear slender and sharp from the outside ...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by lofter1; December 18th, 2011 at 02:26 PM.

  9. #1749

    - The facades are clad in a floor to ceiling glass assembly that sandwich perforated meshed metal material at the spandrel areas and portions immediately below the ceiling to provide shading on the interior and a certain lightness and transparency on the exterior.

    I have not yet noticed the metal mesh 'sandwiched' between the glass on any section of the curtain wall, and I have viewed from the building from the nearest street corner vantage point several times thus far: that may have been 'value engineered' or I need to take a closer look. I really like the way this building meets the sidewalk, it will integrate well with the pedestrian traffic on those crowded/narrow downtown streets; the original WTC buildings were famously lacking in that regard.

  10. #1750


    I'mna take a swing at this and say that that article was talking about the mechanical levels...

  11. #1751

  12. #1752


    ^and they have finally reached the setback... what floor is that again?

  13. #1753
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Richmond VA


    Taken several hours ago today. Cool reflection of WFC.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #1754
    Forum Veteran Tectonic's Avatar
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    May 2007
    New York City




  15. #1755
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    NYC - Downtown


    The cut away up top is now rising, and the those girders are visible from the plaza to the north of the Municipal Building.

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