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Thread: 150 Greenwich Street - WTC Tower #4 - by Fumihiko Maki

  1. #61
    The Dude Abides
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    Quote Originally Posted by lofter1 View Post
    and a more detailed image of the chamfered corner ...

    ***
    Hmm, I don't know about that one, lofter. The chamfer looks a little awkward there. I think it'd be better if it started from the base of the tower, not at some midway point. And it definitely needs to lose some real bulk - something that chamfering on its own can't accomplish.

  2. #62
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    I played around with the bottom-most point of the chamfered wedge to match the set back on the Rogers across the street -- and then another version to match the point on the SW corner of the Maki (this point is lower) where there is a small notch. I agree that the lower starting point is better ...

    I know my feeble scribblings aren't the answer -- and that it's a rather crude attempt to come up with a solution to the (IMO) oppressive bulk of what Maki has presented, but it really bothers me to look at how 4 WTC now exists ...

    So while watching Roddick v. Youzhny I'm creating my own reality

  3. #63

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    I think the renderings just make it look bulky. The building only has 1.8 msf of office space, slightly more than 7WTC and less than BOA.. However, I think this number just includes rentable office space and excludes mechanicals, retail, etc....so maybe it is a fat ass.

  4. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vengineer View Post


    Screencap of press release video from amny.com
    From here it looks a little more distinctive at the top. I find it interesting the way all of these towers hid the mechanical space at the top behind extended facades, just like the Freedom Tower. (well, except Fosters which has a clear roof)

  5. #65

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    ^Yeah, it does, but no one will ever see it from that perspecitve. That's a good thing for Foster's tower; not a flattering angle for viewing it.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by lofter1 View Post
    I know my feeble scribblings aren't the answer -- and that it's a rather crude attempt to come up with a solution to the (IMO) oppressive bulk of what Maki has presented, but it really bothers me to look at how 4 WTC now exists ...

    So while watching Roddick v. Youzhny I'm creating my own reality
    Keep it up, it's fascinating.

    Here's a thought from a non-architect. What if you maintain the building's floorplan at its top floor, and at the floor where you begin the chamfering, but scrap the sudden set-back in-between. In its place, put an asymetrical, spiraling transition. Perhaps following a line like the imaginary one in those silly sketches. This wouldn't be visible from the east, but it would make the tower appear to reach upward when viewed from the west.

  7. #67
    Forum Veteran TREPYE's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by NY Times
    Asked whether the authority had a hand in shaping the building’s minimalism, Kenneth J. Ringler Jr., the executive director, said: “We certainly were not involved in that. These are artists and these are their designs.”


    <double take> Artist?? Mr Maki hardly looks like an "artist" with this paltry design that he presented to us.

  8. #68

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    I am too disappointed with his initial design. I'm hoping the probable revisions will make it better. Even narrowing the design would have a positive impact, IMO.

  9. #69

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    Looks like there'll be an entrance to the concourse on Cortlandt St.


  10. #70

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    That looks more like it goes either to a lower level or the retail area than it looks like an entry to the office lobby. Perhaps its a subway entrance?

  11. #71
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    I'd guess that those are emergency stairwells. The stairs/escalators to the concourse level are in the Church st. Atrium and you can see another set of stairs in the office lobby, also appearing to lead down.

    However, there are already 3 sets of stairs, all exiting on the south side. The north stairs might well be another entrance to the concourse and upper retail levels.

  12. #72

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    ^
    Not in the building. Look in the middle of Cortlandt St.

  13. #73
    Disgruntled Optimist lofter1's Avatar
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    Methinks that stair / escalator ^^ is below grade, underneath Cortland.

    FDNY would have a hard time accessing anything along this stretch of Cortland with that in the middle of that street -- even if it is a pedestrian-only thoroughfare FDNY and other emergency vehicles will most likely be given full unimpeded access when the need arises.

  14. #74

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    I don't know what to make of this building, but I'm glad it's minimalist and not iconic, given its closeness to the Rogers building. I just wish it didn't look so fat.

    The PA may have had a major role in design requirements - the need to get in as much office space in the shortest tower.

    The large base also seems to show the PA's hand. They wanted an enclosed mall to maximize retail. They'll have it in Maki's atrium, and the city gets an open street. Might be a good compromise if well executed.

    From what I've seen so far, this tower and 3WTC have a much better street experience than the Foster tower.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZippyTheChimp View Post
    From what I've seen so far, this tower and 3WTC have a much better street experience than the Foster tower.
    I see what you're saying, but I think it's too early to say for certain. 3WTC is the only building whose retail/atrium will face onto Greenwich, so it'll always be most visible in the renderings; I also think that it will be the most successful of the distinct retail destinations. 4WTC's atrium faces onto Church, and we've seen a lot of renderings of the base. But we haven't seen any closeups of 2WTC's base at all, which also happens to open onto Church and, if I remember correctly, wraps around the Fulton Street side. In dimensional terms, all 3 buildings have more or less the same amount of retail, ~ 140,000 square feet. I'm thinking this, along with the double-height lobby of 2WTC and the numerous transit entrances, will make for an interesting street level. In the meantime, I'm hoping to see more renderings of the base.

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